Natalee Case Discussion #803 2/25/09 - 3/1/09

[texasmom]

2NJ,
Cancun sounds like a lot of fun!  I hope you have a great trip, but we will miss you!   

I'm glad you are going to have this chance to rest and relax!   

[Tamikosmom]

2NJSons_Mom ... have a wonderful "warm" vacation.  I will miss ya.

Monkeys ... I got some packing to do myself.  Eight of us are climbing into our church's mini bus (seats 12) mid morning tomorrow and headed south to the Seattle for the weekend.  The Lion King production on Saturday evening will be the highlight.  We will be back on Sunday evening.

Have a great weekend all.

Janet
3:45 PM PT

Have a wonderful trip Janet, I'm finally back and now you'll be gone!  I will miss you!!!!   

Thank you Texasmom.

I have missed looking up and ... not seeing you there in the wings looking over us.

Hugs

Janet

[texasmom]

2NJSons_Mom ... have a wonderful "warm" vacation.  I will miss ya.

Monkeys ... I got some packing to do myself.  Eight of us are climbing into our church's mini bus (seats 12) mid morning tomorrow and headed south to the Seattle for the weekend.  The Lion King production on Saturday evening will be the highlight.  We will be back on Sunday evening.

Have a great weekend all.

Janet
3:45 PM PT

Have a wonderful trip Janet, I'm finally back and now you'll be gone!  I will miss you!!!!   

Thank you Texasmom.

I have missed looking up and ... not seeing you there in the wings looking over us.

Hugs

Janet

Thank you Janet, that means a lot to know I was missed.  I had a hard time concentrating in my classes, worrying about what was going on here!  But hopefully I passed all my tests, if not I will be repeating in online sessions!    

[AZLady]

I understand what Janet means.  We all want to discover that definitive link that says "aha!" and shows who covered up and lied and when.  Lifesong's timeline is helpful in helping us put events into relative perspective.  The research is necessary because even though only one relevant detail may be discovered amongst piles of documents, when these details are put together, they paint a picture.  It's the patterns that eventually merge to form a picture.

The things that still puzzle me: 
Tim Miller's association with Silvetti and Schaeffer.  Is this strictly professional?  Does Tim realize the business ethics of these men are slimy, to say the least. 
The Range Rover confessions of Joran are connected here, but seem contrived and inserted into the timeline of events for a reason I'm still trying to figure out.

[Kermit]

Dec. 18, 2007 Kyle said: "Just before Christmas they are contacted by a detective and his brother who gave them information that turned out to be the correct latitude
While we were searching shortly before Christmas, we were contacted by an Aruban detective who was involved in the Holloway case. He claimed that his brother had a vision about Natalee¢s body offshore and had coordinates.
He and his brother agreed to meet on the Persistence. The detective¢s brother gave what he thought were coordinates, but turned out to be a line of latitude. This latitude aligned with Arashi beach and came within a half mile of the fish trap.

On the next morning (December 19), I boarded The Persistence along with Louis Schaffer and Tim Miller and remained aboard for the next 24 hours
http://forensicthoughtprints.com/aruba/default.html

THE MEETING


Quote from: oceanexploration on November 20,2008 at 04:00:07 PM
BTW, this is certainly NOT John Silvetti.  I do not know this man.  He was with the Arubans who came on board for the Dec-30th meeting

Kyle said: "This occurred on Dec 30th when  the Arubans told us there wasn't anything of interest in the trap based on the visual-only inspection (Dateline and Tim Miller present).
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4153.new#new







Tim called Dave prior to the divers visual inspection of the cage.

From the 2/20 Dateline Transcript:

Dave Holloway: I got a phone call from Tim.
Chris Hansen: And what'd he say?
Dave Holloway: He told me, he said, "Dave, we found her."
Chris Hansen: "We found her?"
Dave Holloway: Yeah. I said, "Are you sure?"
and he said, "I’m 99.9 percent sure."
He said, "We hadn't gone down and dove under or anything.
But the photographs--"
he said, "I tell you, Dave." I-- he said, "That's what we're looking for.
And that's gotta-- that-- that's it."


Kyle: "The famous "thumbs down" - Tim Trahan said he could not conclusively see human skeletal remains.
Tim (along with myself) didn't expect an intact skeleton
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.740


Tim Miller: In my years of searching we have seen several bodies, skeletal remains--I have seen my own daughter's skeletal remains. I can’t help but believe at this moment that that is human remains in that crab trap. [/u]
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/4/



Tim Miller: It looked like a skull. Still looks like a skull.

TIM MILLER: We felt there was a skull in there.....
48 seconds:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CFkZzKBviM


[color=redKyle said: "After the 31st of Dec John changes his focus.
gets Tim Miller to leave the boat."


If john felt that the trap did not hold Natalee's body, then why would all the other original crew be gone less then a month (dive was on Dec 30th) to Jan 7th dive) and only John & Kyle on board now. Dolph Richardson told them to "continue to search in deeper waters"? If you honestly think she is still out there and you are being paid a million dollars to do a search, why wouldn't you keep your crew together to finish the job?
Hans Mos knew of Joran's confession about to be released by Peter deVries and therefore he knew the story that Joran had someone take her out in a boat and disposed of her. He was onboard the Persistence and saw stuff. The leak also that the Persistence found something. The fact that even the FBI mentioned "human remains were found."

John Q. Kelly knew because he said that the body is not retrievable to Greta when she asked: Concrete evidence?



Greta van Susteren: "HANS MOS IS A LIAR."

[cajun miracle]

I found all of these addresses around the Houston area for Timothy D.Trahan

Background Report for Timothy D. Trahan

LOCATIONS FOR TIMOTHY D. TRAHAN:
5 Addresses in Houston, TX
3 Addresses in Lake Arthur, LA
2 Addresses in Kaplan, LA
1 Address in League City, TX
 
 RELATIVES OF TIMOTHY TRAHAN:
Shelva Trahan  wife
 alias used Tim Trahan


 
 
COMPLETE REPORT INCLUDES (WHEN AVAILABLE):
 

Magnolia, Tim Trahan is a very common name in my area. Would his company have info. on him?

[cajun miracle]

I found all of these addresses around the Houston area for Timothy D.Trahan

Background Report for Timothy D. Trahan

LOCATIONS FOR TIMOTHY D. TRAHAN:
5 Addresses in Houston, TX
3 Addresses in Lake Arthur, LA
2 Addresses in Kaplan, LA
1 Address in League City, TX
 
 RELATIVES OF TIMOTHY TRAHAN:
Shelva Trahan  wife
 alias used Tim Trahan


 
 
COMPLETE REPORT INCLUDES (WHEN AVAILABLE):
 

I looked in my area phonebook and found 1 in Abbeville, LA. but not any in Kaplan, LA. Both of these small cities are near New Iberia, LA.

Cajun Miracle

[Tamikosmom]

I found all of these addresses around the Houston area for Timothy D.Trahan

Background Report for Timothy D. Trahan

LOCATIONS FOR TIMOTHY D. TRAHAN:
5 Addresses in Houston, TX
3 Addresses in Lake Arthur, LA
2 Addresses in Kaplan, LA
1 Address in League City, TX
 
 RELATIVES OF TIMOTHY TRAHAN:
Shelva Trahan  wife
 alias used Tim Trahan


 
 
COMPLETE REPORT INCLUDES (WHEN AVAILABLE):
 

Magnolia, Tim Trahan is a very common name in my area. Would his company have info. on him?

*******
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #707 12/22
« Reply #675 on: December 25, 2007, 04:46:49 AM »

SWLA Natives Search For Natalee Holloway
   
Prosecutors in the Natalee Holloway case said they will reopen the case "if new serious evidence were to be found." Searching for that evidence is a world renowned underwater search team, which includes two Southwest Louisiana natives. We spoke to one of them by satellite phone Sunday afternoon off the coast of Aruba.

"We're looking for a needle in a haystack, that's a big challenge in and of itself," said Tim Trahan. 

Lake Arthur native Tim Trahan is talking about his latest search. Trahan and Lake Charles native Louis Schaefer Jr. head up Underwater Expeditions around the world. Their latest assignment: the hunt for Natalee Holloway off the coast of Aruba.

"It's taken a lot of turns and twists and we finally got the boat off from New Iberia and got it down to Aruba and we started the operation here," said Trahan.

Leaving New Iberia November 26th the R/V Persistence arrived in Aruba December 15th. On board are several experts in the case, including Tim Miller with Texas Equusearch. Acting on a tip, their search for the Alabama teen has taken them to the west point of the island.

"Tim had really felt strongly that the body was put in a crab trap or some kind of metal container and dropped into the ocean," said Trahan. 

Since their arrival, they've been mapping the bottom of the ocean floor with special sonars and high-tech computers for points of interest that could be metal objects. Their scans of have taken them from 60 to 950 feet below Aruba's waters.

"In searching for points of interest, we are making a grid, and when we get done with the whole grid we're going to utilize a remote controlled vehicle which will be going down to inspect each target of interest that we have through the whole grid," explained Trahan.

Sacrificing time away from family, the crew will work around the clock through Christmas and New Years in hopes of finding Natalee and bringing closure to her family... at no charge.

"Natalee's family were speechless for a little while it was a lot of tears from both sides, you know it's hard to meet a family that's lost a child and a lot of times we don't know what to say, but the only thing we could say is we are going to go over there and do the best we can and try to bring their daughter home," said Trahan. "They are very appreciative they call every day and thank us, thank us. It just feels good to do something you feel right about."

Other companies donating their services include J.D. Silvetti, Seatronics, Offshore Innovative Solutions, Pro Log Incorporated, Wilkens Weather Technologies and Agiosat.

A crew from Dateline NBC is also on board documenting the entire operation. Trahan says they don't know how long they'll be out there.

http://www.kplctv.com/Global/story.asp?S=7537588&nav=0nqx

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2470.msg321503;topicseen#msg321503

[Lifesong]

This is getting too weird for me.  I just posted that article yesterday (in this thread, no less) - but I had to chase it down through the link that Jen gave me. 

I'm not here to distract.  I started a Schaefer timeline for my own use - if folks continue to use the one that's up, then I'll continue to update it. 

I don't think KTF has done anything wrong.  He's the one who found the link to Legacy OffShore.  Did it prove anything about what happened in Aruba? No.  But it showed us all that Schaefer is dirtier than we'd thought.  I'm glad to know that.  I thought you were hard on him, Janet and I understand why it upset him.  I'm also certain you guys can work it out without me in the middle of it.

I'll stay out of the discussions in the future, I've never been here for the wrong reasons.

[texasmom]

http://awemainta.com/home/

2/27/2009 Awe Mainta Front Page

[Magnolia]

This is getting too weird for me.  I just posted that article yesterday (in this thread, no less) - but I had to chase it down through the link that Jen gave me. 

I'm not here to distract.  I started a Schaefer timeline for my own use - if folks continue to use the one that's up, then I'll continue to update it. 

I don't think KTF has done anything wrong.  He's the one who found the link to Legacy OffShore.  Did it prove anything about what happened in Aruba? No.  But it showed us all that Schaefer is dirtier than we'd thought.  I'm glad to know that.  I thought you were hard on him, Janet and I understand why it upset him.  I'm also certain you guys can work it out without me in the middle of it.

I'll stay out of the discussions in the future, I've never been here for the wrong reasons.

Lifesong,

Please don't be upset.  I think your timeline is amazing and it is such a big help to me.
I know that you have put a lot of work into it.
KeeptheFaith has done some wonderful research on the corporate side of things.  I
am amazed at some of the things that he has come up with
I really don't think anybody was trying to discourage your or KTF's research.
It is all soooooo important.

[Magnolia]

I found all of these addresses around the Houston area for Timothy D.Trahan

Background Report for Timothy D. Trahan

LOCATIONS FOR TIMOTHY D. TRAHAN:
5 Addresses in Houston, TX
3 Addresses in Lake Arthur, LA
2 Addresses in Kaplan, LA
1 Address in League City, TX
 
 RELATIVES OF TIMOTHY TRAHAN:
Shelva Trahan  wife
 alias used Tim Trahan


 
 
COMPLETE REPORT INCLUDES (WHEN AVAILABLE):
 

I looked in my area phonebook and found 1 in Abbeville, LA. but not any in Kaplan, LA. Both of these small cities are near New Iberia, LA.

Cajun Miracle

Hi Cajun,
I found those from Zaba search.  At the time we were looking into which Tim Trahan was which.
I just thought they might be helpful in the PO Box search.

[texasmom]

11/21/07 - Re-arrests based on "new evidence" resulting from Dutch 'cold-case' investigators

11/29/07 - Lazlo @ RU posts:  "No one from the OM has claimed the new evidence was Joran talking to Kalpoes, but Joran talking to a friend. IMO"

11/30/07 - Persistence leaves Louisiana
12/01/07 - Kalpoes released, no charges, no new evidence
12/07/07 - Joran ordered released, no charges, no new evidence
12/15/07 - Persistence arrives late; was delayed by storm
12/20/07 - Caplocks registers
12/??/07 - "Shortly before Christmas" - ALE Detective/brother meet with Persistence crew
12/22/07 - Persistence crew builds a 'local material trap' to test the sensing equipment
12/25/07 - TRAP FOUND
12/29/07 - ROV dive
12/30/07 - Meeting on the Persistence
12/30/07 - Trahan dive (we've only seen the one done for the Dateline camera)
01/07/08 - TRAP CLEANED OUT BY ONLY ALE DIVERS
01/10/08 - 1st day of taping the Range Rover confessions w/Patrick

<snip>

Edit to add 11-29 hinkiness

Looking good Lifesong!  Your timeline is a Godsend to me.

Janet
______

Ockham's Razor
You must never fail to adopt the simplest idea as your working hypothesis. If necessity demands, you can dump it later when you have more data, but only because it is no longer the simplest idea" or "entities should not be multiplied beyond necessity

Thanks, Janet, I am familiar with Ockham's Razor.

I apologize if I've upset you, hasn't been my intention.

Lifesong ... NOBODY has upset me.

I was just sharing that I was have a difficult time comprehending where all this research is going to fit into the Natalee Holloway case and ... that seem to upset Keepthefaith. It was never my intention to offend or undermine all his research or the research of others regarding the topic.   I just wanted to understand.  Lifesong ... I wished I had said nothing.

Janet.

I don't think Janet meant to upset anyone, or to suggest that the research should stop. 

I hope everyone will chalk it up to a misunderstanding, and carry on.

No one has done anything wrong, and light is being shed on some very shady business practices IMO.

I appreciate all of the time and effort by everyone here, to shed light on any and all aspects/people involved in this case; and the Persistence mission.

 

[Tamikosmom]

Lifesong ... NOBODY has upset me.

I was just sharing that I was have a difficult time comprehending where all this research is going to fit into the Natalee Holloway case and ... that seem to upset Keepthefaith.  It was never my intention to offend or undermine all his research or the research of others regarding the topic.  I just wanted to understand.  Lifesong ... I wished I had said nothing.

Janet.

BUMPED

[2NJSons_Mom]

I agree.  Lifesong, KeeptheFaith, or anyone who does research should continue. 

We do not know where this all may lead, but it has been an interesting turn.

Don't get discouraged.  It's for Natalee. 

[Kermit]

This is getting too weird for me.  I just posted that article yesterday (in this thread, no less) - but I had to chase it down through the link that Jen gave me. 

I'm not here to distract.  I started a Schaefer timeline for my own use - if folks continue to use the one that's up, then I'll continue to update it. 

I don't think KTF has done anything wrong.  He's the one who found the link to Legacy OffShore.  Did it prove anything about what happened in Aruba? No.  But it showed us all that Schaefer is dirtier than we'd thought.  I'm glad to know that.  I thought you were hard on him, Janet and I understand why it upset him.  I'm also certain you guys can work it out without me in the middle of it.

I'll stay out of the discussions in the future, I've never been here for the wrong reasons.

Lifesong,

Please don't go or stop.
I read your work and everyone's and I think your timeline is very valuable.
I don't' know what has upset you, but I hope the research/posts continue.

[Tamikosmom]

I want to make it perfectly clear that I am not undermining all the hard work that you all have put into researching this topic.  I am only say that it is "ME" that is confused/lost in regards to where all this is going ... how it is going to tie in.

In other words ... "MY" problem.

Hugs.

Janet

BUMPED

[Tamikosmom]

Wow Janet.Really don't know what to tell you in regards to the last post!

 

Keepthefaith .. I did not expect a response.  The bottom line is that I am slow at comprehending the purpose of all this research.  The learning process for me has always dictated baby steps.  Too much info at once is too distracting.

Hey ... I will continue to read Lovesong's timeline and ... in time a light will go off in my noggin and ... I will be one with you all.

Keep on keeping on.  I am not going anywhere.

Justice for Natalee Holloway!!

Janet

BUMPED

[Magnolia]

11/21/07 - Re-arrests based on "new evidence" resulting from Dutch 'cold-case' investigators

11/29/07 - Lazlo @ RU posts:  "No one from the OM has claimed the new evidence was Joran talking to Kalpoes, but Joran talking to a friend. IMO"

11/30/07 - Persistence leaves Louisiana
12/01/07 - Kalpoes released, no charges, no new evidence
12/07/07 - Joran ordered released, no charges, no new evidence
12/15/07 - Persistence arrives late; was delayed by storm
12/20/07 - Caplocks registers
12/??/07 - "Shortly before Christmas" - ALE Detective/brother meet with Persistence crew
12/22/07 - Persistence crew builds a 'local material trap' to test the sensing equipment
12/25/07 - TRAP FOUND
12/29/07 - ROV dive
12/30/07 - Meeting on the Persistence
12/30/07 - Trahan dive (we've only seen the one done for the Dateline camera)
01/07/08 - TRAP CLEANED OUT BY ONLY ALE DIVERS
01/10/08 - 1st day of taping the Range Rover confessions w/Patrick

<snip>

Edit to add 11-29 hinkiness

Looking good Lifesong!  Your timeline is a Godsend to me.

Janet
______

Ockham's Razor
You must never fail to adopt the simplest idea as your working hypothesis. If necessity demands, you can dump it later when you have more data, but only because it is no longer the simplest idea" or "entities should not be multiplied beyond necessity

Thanks, Janet, I am familiar with Ockham's Razor.

I apologize if I've upset you, hasn't been my intention.

Lifesong ... NOBODY has upset me.

I was just sharing that I was have a difficult time comprehending where all this research is going to fit into the Natalee Holloway case and ... that seem to upset Keepthefaith. It was never my intention to offend or undermine all his research or the research of others regarding the topic.   I just wanted to understand.  Lifesong ... I wished I had said nothing.

Janet.

I don't think Janet meant to upset anyone, or to suggest that the research should stop. 

I hope everyone will chalk it up to a misunderstanding, and carry on.

No one has done anything wrong, and light is being shed on some very shady business practices IMO.

I appreciate all of the time and effort by everyone here, to shed light on any and all aspects/people involved in this case; and the Persistence mission.

 

Lifesong and Keepthefaith......Janet used to scare me really bad. 

I have become braver and I am not so afraid anymore.

I understand her more.

[Kermit]

Lifesong ... NOBODY has upset me.

I was just sharing that I was have a difficult time comprehending where all this research is going to fit into the Natalee Holloway case and ... that seem to upset Keepthefaith.  It was never my intention to offend or undermine all his research or the research of others regarding the topic.  I just wanted to understand.  Lifesong ... I wished I had said nothing.

Janet.

BUMPED

YES YES YES - do not be upset anyone.
I know it is confusing to follow and sometimes others will question it, but honestly, I think we can come up with a comprehensive kind of follow the dots when we've got it all pieced together.

Janet is just voicing her don't know what is going on is all.
That's okay too.
Gosh, even I get lost in all the different aspects, but trust me on this - when the story makes itself known then you'll understand.

It takes time and research the way you all have been doing and you're all doing a great job.

Don't stop.