Lively Case Discussion #535 10/22 - 10/23/2006

[robots]

jossy was here ?

               

Jossy was relayed thru Easy.

ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

thank you

[Buckeye]

See that focus was still on when we heard Joran picked up his father at the airport on 5/29/05:  I could also swear I recall Anita  on TV, perhaps from Holland or immediately upon her return saying 'we were at a family function in Holland'...can't find it though.  Found this interview, however:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160471,00.html

Partial quote:

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: He's very quiet. He's very shy. He doesn't like media coverage at all. And he's very much hurt by things that are happening. And as I look back — I mean, I came back from Holland Wednesday, and I was so surprised at seeing three young men — one kid, two men — involved, maybe, in the disappearance of a girl. Why did they let the boys go? Why didn't they interrogate immediately deep, see wherever any...

Satish Kalpoe was probably only a few months older than Joran.  Notice how Anita points out that her young sporter is a Kid and Satish is a man.  Joran was about two months shy of his 18th Birthday already drinking, gambling, drugging and smoking like a man.  What is the difference between Satish and Joran?  To me there is no difference they were both in high school and already criminals.

Back late.  Haven't read through...but I believe they emphasized this point to K2 and I also believe when Anita said "there were adults there" she was refering to K2... I believe it was a way to threaten K2 and keep them in line...IMO

[Carnut]

See that focus was still on when we heard Joran picked up his father at the airport on 5/29/05:  I could also swear I recall Anita  on TV, perhaps from Holland or immediately upon her return saying 'we were at a family function in Holland'...can't find it though.  Found this interview, however:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160471,00.html

Partial quote:

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: He's very quiet. He's very shy. He doesn't like media coverage at all. And he's very much hurt by things that are happening. And as I look back — I mean, I came back from Holland Wednesday, and I was so surprised at seeing three young men — one kid, two men — involved, maybe, in the disappearance of a girl. Why did they let the boys go? Why didn't they interrogate immediately deep, see wherever any...

Satish Kalpoe was probably only a few months older than Joran.  Notice how Anita points out that her young sporter is a Kid and Satish is a man.  Joran was about two months shy of his 18th Birthday already drinking, gambling, drugging and smoking like a man.  What is the difference between Satish and Joran?  To me there is no difference they were both in high school and already criminals.

Back late.  Haven't read through...but I believe they emphasized this point to K2 and I also believe when Anita said "there were adults there" she was refering to K2... I believe it was a way to threaten K2 and keep them in line...IMO

Yes it was obvious early on the differentiation and threatening of the K2's.

[Buckeye]

FROM PAULUS 6/23/05 STATEMENT:

There were long cues at the bank so I left without having made any transaction and went back to work. I left my workplace at approximately 15.00 hours. I arrived at the bank at approximately 15.30. I had gone to the C.M.B. bank that is situated in Noord.

Notice how Paulus specifically mentions which bank he went to.  When I go to the bank and I usually tell someone I just say I have to stop at the bank.  Paulus makes it a point to specifically mention which bank.

I bet this isn't even the bank Paulus went to.

Next statement also seems contradictory:

To your question whether I went to the bank without stopping
or going anywhere else, I can state the following. I at least cannot
remember having been anywhere else. I think I went directly to the bank.
At the bank I talked to Ruth DIJKHOFF. At the bank I deposited the
money that Joran said that he had won in the “Free Tournament in
the Holiday Inn” on the 29th of May 2005. It was approximately
500 Aruban guilders. Joran had given me 100 guilders because he
had taken over my place in the tournament. [/b]

Paulus is stating he deposited $ Joran 'said' he won on 5/29/05, which was approx. 500 Aruban guilders....then he says Joran gave him 100 guilders...which is it 500 or 100?  

He can't remember if it was the only stop, but he mentions talking to Ruth Dijkhoff, which he had no problem remembering, and it's another detail like mentioning what bank that just doesn't fit the question...

Well, in the Joe Taco filing...one of the MB affidavids estimates Joran lost ~$250 at the blackjack table....which was after the poker (that he supposedly won the money that PVDS supposedly deposited).  The bank was in Noord...maybe a reason that car was seen by racket clug or pond or house....hmmmm..

[robots]

for some reason PAULUS wants the world to think JORAN is a GREAT POKER PLAYER

he is a MURDERER not a poker player

[Buckeye]

Amanda PORTOCARRERO (maid) 7/28/2005 Statement:

born at Narino in Columbia on August 5,1976, of profession living maid (servant) and living Monserat xxxxxxxxx on Aruba. The woman A.Y.GRUESO PORTOCARRERO aforementioned explained:

- that she knows nothing of an illegal Colombian maid (servant) working at the VDS house.

- that nobody told her that a maid said that she saw, in the early morning hours of Monday, May 30, 2005 clothing of Joran Van Der Sloot’s with white sand on/under them. [/list]

MARGARITHA WERLEMAN e.v. DIJKHOFF (MAID) 08/11/05 Statement:

I have worked ( 8 ) years at family Van Der Sloot. I work as from Monday up to and including Friday for them. I do not work on Saturday and Sunday at family Van Der Sloot. I work daily four (4) hours at family Van Der Sloot. With family VDS, I mean the parents of the detained man "Joran Van Der Sloot". (meaning the suspect "Joran Van Der Sloot"; observation JACOBS).

On your question if I can tell you specifically when I worked from Monday up to and including Friday at the family Van Der Sloot, I answer the following:
 
I work on Monday from

08.00 till 12.00.
I work on Tuesday from 13.30 till 17.30.
I work on Wednesday from 13.30 till 17.30.
I work on Thursday from 13.30 till 15.30
and I work on Friday from 13.30 till 17.30 at family Van Der Sloot
As you can see I work daily four (4) hours at family Van Der Sloot with exception of Thursday because then I work only two (2) hours. [/list]

This maids hours are different only on that Monday Morning.  Joran and Paulus were home.  Was she helping them clean the mess that Joran made.  Was there a different maid there helping?  I think this mail is one fat liar just like her employer.

I think that Amanda PORTOCARRERO is the missing maid.  They are trying to say she is the woman who heard another maid say she saw sand under Joran's clothes.  This is the actual missing maid.  JMO.

But, in the PVDS statement, Rita (the maid) was at the house (with Joran) on Monday at 16:30...hmmmm

[AZLady]

This is from Joran's statement given on June 14.  He is explaining what he did on Monday, May 31--the night after Natalee disappeared, just before Beth and Jug and friends arrived on the island.

My tennis lesson was between the hours of 18.00 pm and 19.00 pm. According to me I was not called by anyone during that time. I had also made no calls myself. Approximately 19.00 pm, I was ready with playing tennis. I showered in the clubhouse. After I had finised showering I got dressed. I do not remember what I put on that day. I was wearing a short trousers and a T-shirt. It looked pretty nice/proper. I also wore slippers. Then I called "Andre". I do not remember his phone number. Andre lives near the Marriot Hotel. We had agreed that we would meet at the Wyndham Hotel at approximately 20.00 pm to play poker. I had then also called Guido. Guido had told me that he had to go to work. He would come later and try to enter the tournament for half time. I had also called my father and asked if I could play poker at the Wyndham Casino. My father gave me permission.

Does anyone recall in Paulus' statement where he expressed surprise that Joran was not home when Beth and Jug arrived at his house?  Paulus did not know where Joran was and called his cell phone.  Paulus really, really has a lousy memory, doesn't he?  He could not recall that his son called him after his tennis lesson to tell him where he would be that night. Amazing, just amazing.

[klaasend]

This is from Joran's statement given on June 14.  He is explaining what he did on Monday, May 31--the night after Natalee disappeared, just before Beth and Jug and friends arrived on the island.

My tennis lesson was between the hours of 18.00 pm and 19.00 pm. According to me I was not called by anyone during that time. I had also made no calls myself. Approximately 19.00 pm, I was ready with playing tennis. I showered in the clubhouse. After I had finised showering I got dressed. I do not remember what I put on that day. I was wearing a short trousers and a T-shirt. It looked pretty nice/proper. I also wore slippers. Then I called "Andre". I do not remember his phone number. Andre lives near the Marriot Hotel. We had agreed that we would meet at the Wyndham Hotel at approximately 20.00 pm to play poker. I had then also called Guido. Guido had told me that he had to go to work. He would come later and try to enter the tournament for half time. I had also called my father and asked if I could play poker at the Wyndham Casino. My father gave me permission.

Does anyone recall in Paulus' statement where he expressed surprise that Joran was not home when Beth and Jug arrived at his house?  Paulus did not know where Joran was and called his cell phone.  Paulus really, really has a lousy memory, doesn't he?  He could not recall that his son called him after his tennis lesson to tell him where he would be that night. Amazing, just amazing.

May 31 is Tuesday, the day after Beth and Jug arrived.  Beth and Jug were at the Sloot home in the early morning hours of May 31, but they arrived in Aruba around 11pm May 30th.

[Leslie]

AZLady:  Paul explains exactly how he felt about Joran being away from the house at 2:30 am , Tuesday, May 31, 2005:

PVDS: "I then went to Joran's apartment and to my surprise and to my anger he was not in his apartment. I then called him on his mobile phone. He immediately answered his phone. I asked him where he was and the told me he was at the “Wyndham”. That he was at the “Wyndham” did not surprise me at that moment. He was supposed to be playing in the “Free tournament” there. That could also be a clue that I indeed did not see him after I had dropped him off at the “Raquet Club”.
---

[Buckeye]

Scroll to page 100.  Whatley statement....can't cut and paste.

According to Whatley, Van Der Sloot was helping Ruth McVeigh trying to win $100 at the card table.  Whatley and McVeigh told Van Der Sloot they were going to CAC.  Van Der Sloot told Whatley and McVeigh "CAC sucks" on Sunday Night.  They told Van Der Sloot Sunday was the MBHS students' last night in Aruba. Van Der Sloot left the card table after losing approximately $250. [/b]

http://www.xs4all.nl/~dugo/doc3.pdf

[AZLady]

Klaasend, I think I have the date wrong then.  Joran is describing what he did the evening before Beth and Jug arrived.  My point is that Paulus acts surprised that Joran is not home and calls him to see where he is.  Something doesn't jell here, and Paulus is conviently using a poor memory to cover up.

[klaasend]

Klaasend, I think I have the date wrong then.  Joran is describing what he did the evening before Beth and Jug arrived.  My point is that Paulus acts surprised that Joran is not home and calls him to see where he is.  Something doesn't jell here, and Paulus is conviently using a poor memory to cover up.

Yes, if you meant the evening of May 30th then I completely agree.

[AZLady]

Buckeye, according to witnesses, Joran loses money at the casino, but according to Paulus he wins money and gives it to Paulus to deposit.  This is a game Paulus and Joran play at the casino.  Play and lose, play and win, it doesn't matter because Paulus will make his large cash deposits the next day, regardless.

[Buckeye]

From Crioyo, and old FP poster (from Aruba, I believe in Holland) when asked about Dutch media.  This was several months ago.

Television there’s Peter R. de Vries who’s a detective who risks his life seeking out criminals and
airs it on tv in his show. Uses secret camera’s, listening devices etc etc.
http://www.peterrdevries.nl/

Let's hope he has some "secret" people tapping the perps/pimps...

[Buckeye]

Buckeye, according to witnesses, Joran loses money at the casino, but according to Paulus he wins money and gives it to Paulus to deposit.  This is a game Paulus and Joran play at the casino.  Play and lose, play and win, it doesn't matter because Paulus will make his large cash deposits the next day, regardless.

Yep...I would think the depositors (launderers) would know their favorite banker by heart.  I'm sure there's a share of the nonwinnings.  Maybe the call to Guido wasn't to verify Joran won but a request to say he did, to excuse the driving around the bank/Noord.  Too bad other people saw Joran loose his winnings......

[AZLady]

Money laundering is a tricky business in that it requires complicity on the parts of the casino cage workers, the casino dealers, the money runners, and the bank tellers, just to mention a few.  However, money laundering seems to be such a blatantly practiced business in Aruba that I don't think they bothered to cover their tracks too well.  I would guess that someone like de Vries and his investigative team might uncover this sort of business fairly easily.  After all, we can see it and we aren't even on that God-forsaken island!

[AZLady]

Groningen, Netherlands, has been visiting us for some time now.  Hi to the Netherlands!  

[SunFreak2]

Klaasend, I think I have the date wrong then.  Joran is describing what he did the evening before Beth and Jug arrived.  My point is that Paulus acts surprised that Joran is not home and calls him to see where he is.  Something doesn't jell here, and Paulus is conviently using a poor memory to cover up.

Their whole defense is built on a card-house of lies.  We just need one person to pull a card and the house of cards (lies) comes tumbling down.
Beth & Dave may have to up the ante on the reward.

[igsigs]

Television there’s Peter R. de Vries who’s a detective who risks his life seeking out criminals and
airs it on tv in his show. Uses secret camera’s, listening devices etc etc.
http://www.peterrdevries.nl/

Let's hope he has some "secret" people tapping the perps/pimps...

I'd like to know if this guy has ever phone tapped the police, or politicians. That is what has to be done here.

[klaasend]

Looking at the de Vries website, looks like his next show will be November 26th if I'm reading it correctly:

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/