Natalee Case Discussion #804 3/1/09 - 3/6/09

[Tamikosmom]

Don't forget that there was more pipeline being discussed than the ones involving Venezuela as the Brazilian finds, possibly the largest in the region, were also a potential for the laying of a pipeline from the oil to the refinery at Aruba if Petrobras had purchased the Valero installation.  This might yet happen.

And I am not sure when Oduber first started talking about natural gas grid for all of Aruba with direct line to Venezuela.  Was a long time ago, however. 

This is my analogy in regards to Those opportunist going down there!It's like Charlie going into the Chocolate Factory..The business opportunities they could make,as well as the mapping of the ocean floor are priceless!VERY SIMPLE..JMOO

Keepthefaith ... In November, 2007 and December, 2007 ... I considered those who dared to undermine the intentions of the Persistence undertaking ... to be trolls.

Janet

+++++++

There would have been nothing wrong if the understanding from the getgo was that the Persistence undertaking was two fold ... mapping oil targets and keeping a watch out for a container that may hold Natalee Holloway's remains.  Hey ... Monkeys would have been rejoicing.  The family would have been thankful.

However ... it is the deceptive impression which was given that the endeavor was all about search for Natalee Holloway's remains.  Donations were solicited by TES and ... donors sacrificially donated to the cause as it was understood.

Then when all was said and done ... John Silvetti handed what may have been Natalee Holloway's remains over to the enemy ... the enemy who had prevented justice from prevailing since May 30, 2005.

Janet

+++++++

klaasen
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #702 12/7/2007
« Reply #281 on: December 07, 2007, 04:58:53 PM »

Quote from: jenna (RU)

... I believe that you are doing geophysical surveys for a commercial purpose. Morally, you must be justifying to yourself that Dave can use this for publicity purposes because you just by some fluke may possibly find the body of Natalee. I find your deception disgusting because certain people are using this as a fundraiser ...

Quote from: oceanexploration (RU)

... This search is funded by generosity and driven only by the desire to bring closure to the family ...

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2429.280

I would have once been considered a Troll!

Initially ... in Tamikosmom's book ... ANYBODY who undermine what I considered the honorable intentions of John Silvetti, Tim Trahan and Louis Schaefer were trolls.

I did feel that the crew of the Persistence were naive in regards to trust of the Arubans.  I truly believed that they did not understand the dynamics encompassing the perceived coverup that had prevented justice from prevailing for Natalee Holloway from the getgo and ... this did frustrate me.

However ... in the back of my mind I believed there was a preconceived plan in regards to a recovery process if Natalee Holloway's remain were located ... a plan that that would in all probability involve an FBI ******* and ... the crew of the Persistence.  In other words the chain of custody would not just involve the Arubans.  It was my believe that photos of the samples would be taken by both sides prior to the Arubans taking possession if that was the protocol.

Keepthefaith ... it was not until Kyle Kingman's own words were posted on the SM forum did it hit me that naivity was not where it in regards to John Silvetti ... it was deceptive.

IMO

Janet

++++++


PRIVATE EYE

private eye
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #737 2/29 -
« Reply #559 on: March 01, 2008, 04:08:07 PM »

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2662.msg358435#msg358435


private eye
 Discussion #742 3/10 -
« Reply #686 on: March 13, 2008, 06:38:07 PM »

... But sharing information with people who work for people who are directly orchestrating the cover up, Rudy, or the Dutch, is the most irresponsible investigating I can imagine. What kills this investigation is people having to come into it, wanting to apply basic investigatory protocols into place, and then having those channels sabotage the new evidence that the new players discover. Of course, as is happened everytime in this case, the new people eventually come to a point where the manipulation of the evidence is undeniable, but by then the fruits of their work are gone, and there is simply another member of the believers of the cover up group. What I pray that Kyle and the crew of the Persistence will determine, is that  regardless of how hard working the man that they are working with appears to work, his work belongs to Rudy, and Rudy belongs to the local dutch.

We are not hysterical, ignorant, paranoid people. We have seen the cover up in action, in broad daylight, with impunity, and if you disregard our warnings, you will become the next chump in a series of chumps, no matter how sophisticated your equipment, the level of your educational achievement, or the extent of your job skills and work history.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2689.msg364750#msg364750



DIALOGUE: KYLE KINGMAN - TAMIKOSMOM - PRIVATE EYE

Tamikosmom
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #744 3/19 -
« Reply #191 on: March 19, 2008, 07:59:59 PM »

Hi Kyle.  It's me ... Tamikosmom ... your worst nightmare.

I sincerely tried to spare you from my prying questions but ... I lack self discipline ... I am so nosy.

Were any members of the Persistence present when the Arubans took possessin of the contents of the cage/trap?  Were the contents itemized ... photos taken?  Was an authorized receipt obtained?

In other words ... was there an official chain of command that went from the Persistence to the Arubans or ... did the Persistence not have any control?

Janet

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2721.180


oceanexploration
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #744 3/19 -
« Reply #201 on: March 19, 2008, 08:21:47 PM »

Janet, you aren't even a bad dream, let alone a nightmare.  We had little option other than to have the Aruban dive division recover the samples and bring them back under their care.  Remember we are Americans working in Aruban waters, subject to their laws, invitation, and blessing.  Our hands are tied for the most part. I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it.    The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap.  From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography.  I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2721.200


b]private eye
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #746 4/4
« Reply #499 on: April 09, 2008, 12:39:50 AM »[/b]

If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. I am not sure if that was the protocol out of Aruba's waters though. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2769.msg372245;topicseen#msg372245

[hotping]

Check out this link.....It may have already been posted but there have be so many I'm not sure anymore  ......There are Two pages...


http://www.offshore-mag.com/display_article/327124/9/ARCHI/none/none/1/BPTT,-Superior-complete-Cashima,-Mango-subsea-lines/

[jen3560]

Check out this link.....It may have already been posted but there have be so many I'm not sure anymore  ......There are Two pages...


http://www.offshore-mag.com/display_article/327124/9/ARCHI/none/none/1/BPTT,-Superior-complete-Cashima,-Mango-subsea-lines/

Ah.  And the article was dated April 2008.    Funny timing there!

[hotping]

Check out this link.....It may have already been posted but there have be so many I'm not sure anymore  ......There are Two pages...


http://www.offshore-mag.com/display_article/327124/9/ARCHI/none/none/1/BPTT,-Superior-complete-Cashima,-Mango-subsea-lines/

Ah.  And the article was dated April 2008.    Funny timing there!

On this website I searched for articles containing Superior Offshore there are about 10 pages of various articles KTF Jen or Lifesong would be better able to tell if They have any interest in what is being looked for.....

http://www.offshore-mag.com/search/results.cfm?si=OS&collection=os&keywords=superior+international&x=40&y=4

[jen3560]

KTF - you asked earlier about the Achiever.

I cannot find it in the ship registry - either under Superior Achiever, or just Achiever.

[Tamikosmom]

Back to my own little hidey hole.  It is lonely but ... I am finally seeing "the trees for the forest" or ... is that "forest for the trees".

 

Anyways ... my DIL is giving me a couple of hours of her precious time this evening for cleaning up, editing and formatting.  She will in all probability be adding her two bits.  If all goes well ... I will share tomorrow what I have been working on.

Later

Janet
2:25 PM PT

[jen3560]

Check out this link.....It may have already been posted but there have be so many I'm not sure anymore  ......There are Two pages...


http://www.offshore-mag.com/display_article/327124/9/ARCHI/none/none/1/BPTT,-Superior-complete-Cashima,-Mango-subsea-lines/

Ah.  And the article was dated April 2008.    Funny timing there!

On this website I searched for articles containing Superior Offshore there are about 10 pages of various articles KTF Jen or Lifesong would be better able to tell if They have any interest in what is being looked for.....

http://www.offshore-mag.com/search/results.cfm?si=OS&collection=os&keywords=superior+international&x=40&y=4

Well this one jumped right out at me.

I know there was a question about the relation (if any) between the parties and Superior Energy Serives.  Looks like it!!

http://www.offshore-mag.com/pdf_temp/278133.pdf

[jen3560]

Back to my own little hidey hole.  It is lonely but ... I am finally seeing "the trees for the forest" or ... is that "forest for the trees".

 

Anyways ... my DIL is giving me a couple of hours of her precious time this evening for cleaning up, editing and formatting.  She will in all probability be adding her two bits.  If all goes well ... I will share tomorrow what I have been working on.

Later

Janet
2:25 PM PT

[hotping]

Check out this link.....It may have already been posted but there have be so many I'm not sure anymore  ......There are Two pages...


http://www.offshore-mag.com/display_article/327124/9/ARCHI/none/none/1/BPTT,-Superior-complete-Cashima,-Mango-subsea-lines/

Ah.  And the article was dated April 2008.    Funny timing there!

On this website I searched for articles containing Superior Offshore there are about 10 pages of various articles KTF Jen or Lifesong would be better able to tell if They have any interest in what is being looked for.....

http://www.offshore-mag.com/search/results.cfm?si=OS&collection=os&keywords=superior+international&x=40&y=4

Well this one jumped right out at me.

I know there was a question about the relation (if any) between the parties and Superior Energy Serives.  Looks like it!!

http://www.offshore-mag.com/pdf_temp/278133.pdf

Yep...It jumped right out at Me Too.....I did not look at all of the articles but I hope there is more that are relevant.....

[jen3560]

Great digging monkeys!!

Have a great night!

[hotping]

Back to my own little hidey hole.  It is lonely but ... I am finally seeing "the trees for the forest" or ... is that "forest for the trees".

 

Anyways ... my DIL is giving me a couple of hours of her precious time this evening for cleaning up, editing and formatting.  She will in all probability be adding her two bits.  If all goes well ... I will share tomorrow what I have been working on.

Later

Janet
2:25 PM PT

Janet I Am looking forward to seeing whatever it is You and Your DIL or working on...... TIA 

[wreck]

Do you think jen's response to BFN will be copied and pasted???? ....................... I doubt it.

[Keepthefaith]

Back to my own little hidey hole.  It is lonely but ... I am finally seeing "the trees for the forest" or ... is that "forest for the trees".

 

Anyways ... my DIL is giving me a couple of hours of her precious time this evening for cleaning up, editing and formatting.  She will in all probability be adding her two bits.  If all goes well ... I will share tomorrow what I have been working on.

Later

Janet
2:25 PM PT

I'm not ignoring you janet! Trying to work as well as peruse the Monkey cage.Will read those articles Hotping when i get a chance!

[Anna]

Don't forget that there was more pipeline being discussed than the ones involving Venezuela as the Brazilian finds, possibly the largest in the region, were also a potential for the laying of a pipeline from the oil to the refinery at Aruba if Petrobras had purchased the Valero installation.  This might yet happen.

And I am not sure when Oduber first started talking about natural gas grid for all of Aruba with direct line to Venezuela.  Was a long time ago, however. 

This is my analogy in regards to Those opportunist going down there!It's like Charlie going into the Chocolate Factory..The business opportunities they could make,as well as the mapping of the ocean floor are priceless!VERY SIMPLE..JMOO

Keepthefaith ... In November, 2007 and December, 2007 ... I considered those who dared to undermine the intentions of the Persistence undertaking ... to be trolls.

Janet

+++++++

There would have been nothing wrong if the understanding from the getgo was that the Persistence undertaking was two fold ... mapping oil targets and keeping a watch out for a container that may hold Natalee Holloway's remains.  Hey ... Monkeys would have been rejoicing.  The family would have been thankful.

However ... it is the deceptive impression which was given that the endeavor was all about search for Natalee Holloway's remains.  Donations were solicited by TES and ... donors sacrificially donated to the cause as it was understood.

Then when all was said and done ... John Silvetti handed what may have been Natalee Holloway's remains over to the enemy ... the enemy who had prevented justice from prevailing since May 30, 2005.

Janet

+++++++

klaasen
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #702 12/7/2007
« Reply #281 on: December 07, 2007, 04:58:53 PM »

Quote from: jenna (RU)

... I believe that you are doing geophysical surveys for a commercial purpose. Morally, you must be justifying to yourself that Dave can use this for publicity purposes because you just by some fluke may possibly find the body of Natalee. I find your deception disgusting because certain people are using this as a fundraiser ...

Quote from: oceanexploration (RU)

... This search is funded by generosity and driven only by the desire to bring closure to the family ...

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2429.280

I would have once been considered a Troll!

Initially ... in Tamikosmom's book ... ANYBODY who undermine what I considered the honorable intentions of John Silvetti, Tim Trahan and Louis Schaefer were trolls.

I did feel that the crew of the Persistence were naive in regards to trust of the Arubans.  I truly believed that they did not understand the dynamics encompassing the perceived coverup that had prevented justice from prevailing for Natalee Holloway from the getgo and ... this did frustrate me.

However ... in the back of my mind I believed there was a preconceived plan in regards to a recovery process if Natalee Holloway's remain were located ... a plan that that would in all probability involve an FBI ******* and ... the crew of the Persistence.  In other words the chain of custody would not just involve the Arubans.  It was my believe that photos of the samples would be taken by both sides prior to the Arubans taking possession if that was the protocol.

Keepthefaith ... it was not until Kyle Kingman's own words were posted on the SM forum did it hit me that naivity was not where it in regards to John Silvetti ... it was deceptive.

IMO

Janet

++++++


PRIVATE EYE

private eye
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #737 2/29 -
« Reply #559 on: March 01, 2008, 04:08:07 PM »

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2662.msg358435#msg358435


private eye
 Discussion #742 3/10 -
« Reply #686 on: March 13, 2008, 06:38:07 PM »

... But sharing information with people who work for people who are directly orchestrating the cover up, Rudy, or the Dutch, is the most irresponsible investigating I can imagine. What kills this investigation is people having to come into it, wanting to apply basic investigatory protocols into place, and then having those channels sabotage the new evidence that the new players discover. Of course, as is happened everytime in this case, the new people eventually come to a point where the manipulation of the evidence is undeniable, but by then the fruits of their work are gone, and there is simply another member of the believers of the cover up group. What I pray that Kyle and the crew of the Persistence will determine, is that  regardless of how hard working the man that they are working with appears to work, his work belongs to Rudy, and Rudy belongs to the local dutch.

We are not hysterical, ignorant, paranoid people. We have seen the cover up in action, in broad daylight, with impunity, and if you disregard our warnings, you will become the next chump in a series of chumps, no matter how sophisticated your equipment, the level of your educational achievement, or the extent of your job skills and work history.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2689.msg364750#msg364750



DIALOGUE: KYLE KINGMAN - TAMIKOSMOM - PRIVATE EYE

Tamikosmom
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #744 3/19 -
« Reply #191 on: March 19, 2008, 07:59:59 PM »

Hi Kyle.  It's me ... Tamikosmom ... your worst nightmare.

I sincerely tried to spare you from my prying questions but ... I lack self discipline ... I am so nosy.

Were any members of the Persistence present when the Arubans took possessin of the contents of the cage/trap?  Were the contents itemized ... photos taken?  Was an authorized receipt obtained?

In other words ... was there an official chain of command that went from the Persistence to the Arubans or ... did the Persistence not have any control?

Janet

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2721.180


oceanexploration
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #744 3/19 -
« Reply #201 on: March 19, 2008, 08:21:47 PM »

Janet, you aren't even a bad dream, let alone a nightmare.  We had little option other than to have the Aruban dive division recover the samples and bring them back under their care.  Remember we are Americans working in Aruban waters, subject to their laws, invitation, and blessing.  Our hands are tied for the most part. I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it.    The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap.  From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography.  I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2721.200


b]private eye
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #746 4/4
« Reply #499 on: April 09, 2008, 12:39:50 AM »[/b]

If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. I am not sure if that was the protocol out of Aruba's waters though. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2769.msg372245;topicseen#msg372245

BUMP  BUMP BUMPITY BUMP BUMP BUMP!

And this is the brother of Beth Holloway speaking. 

I do hope Bastibro will bother to read his words.

[Blue Moon]

Do you think jen's response to BFN will be copied and pasted???? ....................... I doubt it.

No, according to the head of that blog THEY do not copy and paste.  What do you think?

[wreck]

Do you think jen's response to BFN will be copied and pasted???? ....................... I doubt it.

No, according to the head of that blog THEY do not copy and paste.  What do you think?

   Well, do you think any of them will actually READ it at SM??

[hotping]

Back to my own little hidey hole.  It is lonely but ... I am finally seeing "the trees for the forest" or ... is that "forest for the trees".

 

Anyways ... my DIL is giving me a couple of hours of her precious time this evening for cleaning up, editing and formatting.  She will in all probability be adding her two bits.  If all goes well ... I will share tomorrow what I have been working on.

Later

Janet
2:25 PM PT

I'm not ignoring you janet! Trying to work as well as peruse the Monkey cage.Will read those articles Hotping when i get a chance!

Thanks KTF...I need all the help I can get.... I sure don't want to miss anything important....in other words two heads are better than one....  BTW I Love Your Avi!   

[Blue Moon]

Do you think jen's response to BFN will be copied and pasted???? ....................... I doubt it.

No, according to the head of that blog THEY do not copy and paste.  What do you think?

   Well, do you think any of them will actually READ it at SM??

No doubt about it.  They now have all the CnG group (formerly SM) posting there.

[Blue Moon]

Blonde,
Haven't seen you lately.  How's things with you?  Hope o.k.

[Keepthefaith]

Do you think jen's response to BFN will be copied and pasted???? ....................... I doubt it.

No, according to the head of that blog THEY do not copy and paste.  What do you think?

   Well, do you think any of them will actually READ it at SM??

No doubt about it.  They now have all the CnG group (formerly SM) posting there.

cNg posting at BFN?? WoW..How disappointing!