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Author Topic: Natalee Case Discussion #805 3/6/09 - 3/9/09  (Read 148644 times)
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Keepthefaith
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« Reply #200 on: March 07, 2009, 06:07:04 PM »

When i get a chance i will have to read the timeline!Anything jump out to you as you go LifeSong??Getting ready to head out for dinner in a minute...
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« Reply #201 on: March 07, 2009, 06:16:21 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!
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Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.

http://www.nataleeholloway.smfnew.com/index.php
Lifesong
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« Reply #202 on: March 07, 2009, 06:23:49 PM »

When i get a chance i will have to read the timeline!Anything jump out to you as you go LifeSong??Getting ready to head out for dinner in a minute...


Its funny, KTF, with it divided into parts...I'm already well into the next revision before the last one goes up - so I haven't read the whole thing in a while.

Rob's hint peeked my curiousity...so I'll answer with this - alot going on in these 9 days:


Quote
02/20/2008NEW
Kyle Kingman posts as oceanexploration at BFN:  “…Personally, I have been off of the boat since a week ago Saturday to rest at home, have Christmas, new years, etc...  I will return to the Persistence tomorrow night…”

02/22/2008
E. Briesen sends a letter to Juan Manuel Trujillo in Madrid, Spain advising him of the appointment of MTBS as Project Manager of the redevelopment of Aruban harbor areas.

02/22/2008NEW
The Persistence blog maintained by Kyle Kingman:  “The Persistence is working in shallow waters today.”

02/22/08
The Dateline episode on the Persistence search is broadcast.

 Kyle Kingman: “Right before the Dateline special aired Tim [trahan] and Louis asked if I could go to ABC to try to sell the footage in an attempt to recoup some of the money invested in the search efforts. ABC was very interested, but decided to wait until the Dateline special aired. After the show they came back to me and declined to purchase it because they felt too much of the story was already told by Dateline. That ended any communication with ABC. About 6 executive producers saw the footage, but none were allowed copies or any pictures. Everything remained in my possesion.”

NEW
Kyle Kingman:  "I should clarify that the footage proceeds (if sold) wouldn't even have covered the cost of the project, but it would have helped.

NEW
Kyle Kingman"I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th.


02/24/2008
John Q. Kelly on Geraldo at Large (2/24/08) - “…I think they could arrest Joran Van der Sloot and prosecute him on a circumstantial case..”

02/26/2008
Press Release issued from Aruba’s Public Prosecutor’s Office (H. Mos) stating that the cloth found in the crab trap is not a match with Natalee’s blouse.

NEW
Months later, as the subject resurfaces in the Scared Monkeys Forum, poster Buckshot questions Kyle Kingman, a.k.a. oceanexploration
“ocean exploration,
(1) do you feel that the work done during the search was tampered with by locals and/or law enforcement that prevented a true and honest search as suggested by most monkeys?
(2) were samples eventually shipped off to the FBI? were they true samples or tampered samples?

 Kyle Kingman as oceanexploration, answers:  “Buckshot, in the event "what I feel" differs from "what I know to be provable and true", I'll have to obstain from answering your question directly.  I will say the FBI report to Mos which Mos publicly stated in verbatum, said exactly what the FBI were invited to accomplish.  The FBI report and therefore Mos's report was accurate regarding the samples.  As to what the samples were, I cannot comment because I in fact do not know what was sampled.”

SM poster, Buckshot, responds:  “…The monkeys seem to feel certain items (samples) were replaced when sent off to the FBI to be tested. We also have our doubts about certain people that helped you in the search.”

Kyle Kingman as oceanexploration answers:  “I share this "feeling" and believe the Monkeys have good reason to feel this way too…”

02/26/2008
  • Rob posts a picture of the cage:  “…I posted it the other day... no one seemed to care.”
  • JackB responds, asking Klaas to “POST THE PIC HERE”:  “It seems like it would be a good time.  I will stay on this place and go forward, hope to see it.  This is going to be a good morale thing. “
  • JackB adds that he just sent Klaas a couple of pictures:  “…One shows a skull in the cage.”
  • He further explains:  “There is a skull.  The equipment they are using is set up to block the wire and keep the contents in perspective.  They can do this because of the distance and the wire is so much smaller than the holes they surround and the skull.  It is a computer generated thing.  It is a color thing.  The skull is there.   Their computer is fast and furious and can do this by calculations in a speck of the time it takes me to clean something up by using other equipment not specifically made for what they are doing.”
  • Klaas posts the 6 pictures of the cage she rec’d in an anonymous email.  The same pictures Robin posted at BNH.

02/26/2008
Dana Pretzer hosts Art Wood on his radio show. Concerning the Persistence search, Art says, “They've identified over 100 possible targets that could be Natalee on the ocean floor. They're trying to narrow that list to 30 or 40 more likely targets, they can dive on them however John has informed us that they have run out of money. Actually, if they can't come up with some donations within the next week to 10 days, they're going to be bringing the boat home.”

The donation drive begins here: 
"Without contributions Persistence is coming home."
"Everyone jump on greta wire quickly before she covers case asking her to tell people they need donations"
"I heard Jossy will be putting some full page ads in Diario requesting donations too."
"I do not understand the time frame"
"Tim Miller was on Greta...He did get to request donations so this search can continue"
"Greta asked Tim about needing donations and gave him a chance to give his website and phone number"
"I pray they find the funds they need to continue.  I believe in them"
"Is there a web link we can donate via PayPal?"

As the discussion over the original six pictures continues:
"I can see how Tim Miller would think he might have found something looking at this pic"
"Even in the other picture it looked like a body in the fetal position."
"That does look like a skull to me.
"those are awesome pics!"
"I understand now why Tim was convinced"
"It still looks like her to me"

And Tim Miller appears on Greta Van Sustern's FoxNews show, On The Record:
"Tim:  The report we got is the DNA that came back did not match Natalee's DNA and when we located that it looked like more than just a piece of cloth and I mean we, we felt as though we seen a skull in there. We got the Aruba authorities involved, they felt there was something in there, we dove on it and the thing is that's only 1 of over 170 targets out there we still have to investigate, so we've got a lot of work ahead of us."

02/27/2008NEW
The Persistence blog maintained by Kyle Kingman:  “Over the past several days, the Persistence has been working with the help of the Aruban police in shallow water.”

02/27/2008
Two members of the Persistence crew perform side scan sonar survey of the Montserrat pond.

 Kyle Kingman:  “I think it is highly unlikely and completely inconsistent with numerous testimonies and other evidence that the pond (or anything but the ocean) contains Natalee's remains.”

02/27/2008
Kyle Kingman learns that Robin Holloway has posted the screenshots rec’d from the FBI

02/28/2008
Is Joran van der Sloot in a Psychiatric Hospital in the Netherlands? – “According to yesterdays BonDia Aruba he is. Translation:  ORANJESTAD - Joran van der Sloot has spend the past week internally in a psychiatric Institute in the Netherlands. This was confirmed recently by his close family…”

02/28/2008
Kyle is unhappy that the pictures have leaked: "Don't you even think to consider for a second that we the search team, who found the trap, supervised it's sampling, recorded that video and others... are ensuring the situation is in proper hands and being taken care of appropriately and completely?"

02/28/2008
Kyle Kingman, again posting as oceanexplorer at SM, makes two references to having been away from the search.
•   “I'm getting caught up with the data collected while I've been off the boat.”
•   “I've personally been handling the matter* while I was on the east coast last week.“
[*Note: the matter = selling television rights to the search; See 02-14-08]

02/28/2008
Article by Cynthia Cisneros, Houston ABC affiliate, quotes Louis J. Schaefer:
•   “I've dedicated a million dollars, I've gone way above that," said Louis Schafer of Underwater Expeditions.
•   "I feel like it's time to ask for help from the American people that want to see this case solved." 
•   "By Friday, we will have surveyed the entire 50-square mile off Aruba," Schafer said.
•   "We have identified at least 60 of the targets. we have about 150 more targets to inspect."  "So we have completely mapped the ocean floor, we know every object that's there, we know every object that could be a container holding her in the sea,” he said.

Tim Trahan is quoted in the same article:
"And we all feel, I'm speaking from everybody on the team, that she's in one of the targets we have not looked at yet," Tim Trahan of Underwater Expeditions said. "We can't stop. I go to sleep at night thinking we've located it, we just need to get to it."

02/29/08
Kyle Kingman in a discussion on the open SM form, is asked:   “Maybe Mr Schafer can sell the television rights to the remainder of the search to one of the networks so they can raise enough money to finish the search,  and possibly recoup his own money.  Any thoughts?”

Kyle Kingman posts this message in response:  “This is a very good idea.  We've been working on that for a couple weeks.  I've personally been handling the matter while I was on the east coast last week.  Unfortunately, the Dateline story aired along with Greta and scooped up the remainder of what the press felt was immediately worth reporting on.  I can't blame them.  It's business.  Definitely shot that down though.  Move on.  Deal with it. Stay the course.”

NEW
Kyle Kingman posts as oceanexporer at BFN:  “We've been dockside all day today getting caught up on a lot of work and loose ends while the weather is too rough offshore.  We're awaiting word about whether or not we'll continue sonar runs (which we've almost completed), get an ROV crew in soon, or mobilize a ROV boat at a later date once funded.  We'll see shortly.”

02/29/08
The first class action lawsuit against Superior Offshore Int’l is announced on behalf of shareholders who purchased stock between 4/20/07 and 1/09/08.

02/29/08
Air Force 2 is on Aruba.

02/29/08
Caps backs away from his Moko Pool/WhiteHouse Apts. theory (and with no evidence at all, suddenly has Natalee's body now decapitated to fit his theories):  "The problem with Moko pool is that if they dump the body in there, this acctiion leave Joran walking home. and not to the McDonnald. Now lets assume that what is said that the head was not part of the body no more, and that both places has been used. The Moko Pool which is right at the doorstep of the Whitehouse Apartment and there they could have dumb a peace of the body then drive Joran to the Monserat Pool and split leaving Joran alone.  Driving to the Monserat they will dump an other peace of the body. Split and leave Joran behind.  The Monserat pool will leave him walking to McDonald.  This will give both Simian and Shango Validity for their writtings."
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« Reply #203 on: March 07, 2009, 06:24:47 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!
Other than a Dutch article -- where is "another search" confirmed??
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Lifesong
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« Reply #204 on: March 07, 2009, 06:28:21 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!
Other than a Dutch article -- where is "another search" confirmed??

ONLY one Dutch article - that was then picked up in Aruba.

That, to me, is not confirmation. 
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"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use."  - Galileo
Keepthefaith
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« Reply #205 on: March 07, 2009, 06:36:26 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!
Other than a Dutch article -- where is "another search" confirmed??

Who really is asking that question is what i'd like to know?
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"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history."

MOHANDAS GANDHI
Keepthefaith
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« Reply #206 on: March 07, 2009, 06:39:54 PM »

I will return after dinner!Doing a little work for the Aruba port Authority??Maybe,maybe not!Will read a little more when i return!

KEEPTHEFAITH
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"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history."

MOHANDAS GANDHI
Blue Moon
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« Reply #207 on: March 07, 2009, 06:50:51 PM »

I can't follow any of this!

 

Need flow chart, somebody to draw me a picture.

I can't follow it either.  Driving me nuts here! 
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If you ask the wrong question, of course, you get the wrong answer. We find in design it’s much more important and difficult to ask the right question. Once you do that, the right answer becomes obvious.<br />Quote: Amory Lovins
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« Reply #208 on: March 07, 2009, 06:58:37 PM »

I can't follow any of this!

 

Need flow chart, somebody to draw me a picture.

I can't follow it either.  Driving me nuts here! 

Don`t worry, it`s not followable 
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never lift the pressure of evil island
Blue Moon
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« Reply #209 on: March 07, 2009, 07:00:02 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!
Other than a Dutch article -- where is "another search" confirmed??

I have seen no confirmation of a new search either.  AND Kermit said Beth is fully aware of all this.  I don't think she said Dave but I am sure Dave is aware also.
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If you ask the wrong question, of course, you get the wrong answer. We find in design it’s much more important and difficult to ask the right question. Once you do that, the right answer becomes obvious.<br />Quote: Amory Lovins
Blue Moon
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« Reply #210 on: March 07, 2009, 07:00:57 PM »


A new revision of the timeline is up.


Part 1 is here.

Part 2 is here

Part 3 is here.

Part 4 is here.

Klaas, could you or one of theAmazingMods remove the previous revisions?  TIA!



Lifesong,  Amazing work.  You are awesome.  This makes it easier for me to follow what happened here. 
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If you ask the wrong question, of course, you get the wrong answer. We find in design it’s much more important and difficult to ask the right question. Once you do that, the right answer becomes obvious.<br />Quote: Amory Lovins
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All Prayers Will Be Answered in Time!


« Reply #211 on: March 07, 2009, 07:04:59 PM »

Interesting.....

http://www.offshore-mag.com/pdf_temp/50728.pdf

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In God We Trust!
Prayers Will Bring Natalee Home!
May 2010 Bring Natalee Home to Rest In Peace!
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« Reply #212 on: March 07, 2009, 07:06:21 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!

The only thing I've seen about a new search is that Dutch article.  Nothing else saying anything about a search.  I'll ask Red again to see if he's heard anything.  It's almost as though the Dutch article was some sort of ruse.
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johan555
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hay welkom here !!!


« Reply #213 on: March 07, 2009, 07:06:27 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!
Other than a Dutch article -- where is "another search" confirmed??

I have seen no confirmation of a new search either.  AND Kermit said Beth is fully aware of all this.  I don't think she said Dave but I am sure Dave is aware also.

kermit said this Дейв имеет информацию > that means Dave heeft de informatie.
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Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.

http://www.nataleeholloway.smfnew.com/index.php
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« Reply #214 on: March 07, 2009, 07:07:18 PM »

Lifesong - excellent work!  I think I've deleted the old ones properly.
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johan555
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hay welkom here !!!


« Reply #215 on: March 07, 2009, 07:08:00 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!
Other than a Dutch article -- where is "another search" confirmed??

I have seen no confirmation of a new search either.  AND Kermit said Beth is fully aware of all this.  I don't think she said Dave but I am sure Dave is aware also.

kermit said this Дейв имеет информацию > that means Dave heeft de informatie.

and that means :    Dave has the information
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Wanneer domme mensen domme dingen beweren, dan moet je ze niet corrigeren, maar glimlachend gelijk geven.

http://www.nataleeholloway.smfnew.com/index.php
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« Reply #216 on: March 07, 2009, 07:12:21 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!

What you are saying is that Dave doesn't believe what was posted because if he did why waste money in a new search.
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Blue Moon
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« Reply #217 on: March 07, 2009, 07:12:31 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!
Other than a Dutch article -- where is "another search" confirmed??

I have seen no confirmation of a new search either.  AND Kermit said Beth is fully aware of all this.  I don't think she said Dave but I am sure Dave is aware also.

kermit said this Дейв имеет информацию > that means Dave heeft de informatie.

Well sorry then.  Guess I forgot how to read Greek?  Missed it. My Bad. 
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If you ask the wrong question, of course, you get the wrong answer. We find in design it’s much more important and difficult to ask the right question. Once you do that, the right answer becomes obvious.<br />Quote: Amory Lovins
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« Reply #218 on: March 07, 2009, 07:13:11 PM »

What I do not understand
Why a new search in Aruba ?
Kermit has given new evidence and all the new information to the family
(she told me here that Dave has all the information )
Can Kermit give  me an answer?
thank you!

Other than a Dutch article -- where is "another search" confirmed??

I have seen no confirmation of a new search either.  AND Kermit said Beth is fully aware of all this.  I don't think she said Dave but I am sure Dave is aware also.

kermit said this Дейв имеет информацию > that means Dave heeft de informatie.

and that means :    Dave has the information

LOL I used Google translation and . . you`re not kidding 
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texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #219 on: March 07, 2009, 07:24:02 PM »


I was just there earlier today!   
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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