Haleigh Cummings #4 3/04/09 - 3/08/09

[lilymarie]

As for those insisting that Misty was outta the house? I'm curious what you are basing this on... Misty has denied this - the police surely asked her - she was polygraphed and ask that specific question.

As far as I know - she was in the house. As far as the police are concerned - she was in the house from everything I have seen and read. If she were gone - the police probably would have made a statement to that fact and possibly charged her with abandonment and / or neglect. Misty has not been charged or accused of anything to date.

The problem with forums is that someone can come on here and say just about anything and in the course of three threads - it can become a fact.

Having your own suspicions - is part of human nature. We are all suspicious of anyone when a child is missing, and we ask ourselves - how in the heck can a child be abducted while there is an adult in the SAME ROOM. Trust me - it has happened before and it will happen again.

I would juss caution that not everything is a dastardly on it's face value. Sometimes there are explanations and those explanation are not what WE always want to hear or expect.

There are also coincidence in every case I have ever seen. You need to be able to take some of the info and accept it at face value and not read too much in to it. You also need to not be bogged down by a coincidence that seems completely sinister.

jmo

IMO I think Misty was there. But even if she went to the neighbors for an hour or so, that doesn't make it all her fault or make her the monster that took Haleigh! I think what is so difficult in this case as well as some others, is we dont have much to go on. LE is so quiet, unlike the other case that is happening there in Florida. It is so frustrating and making many start to theorize the absolute.  I have to say that my gut instinct is that someone is going to be arrested, but the person will be innocent because LE has no hard evidence to go on and the public is demanding them to do something.

I'm not sure where you learned about child care, but a child/children shouldn't be left alone--ever.  It is so important that there are laws forbidding it. 

Please don't ever leave any children in your care alone "...for an hour or so."   

Better yet, please don't "care" for children at all if you think its ok to leave them alone for an hour or so.  For shame...

God help all the children. 

Again, I will prolly not be popular here - but come on. My parents put us to bed and went to our neighbor's homes all of the time. On my block - people put their kids to bed and we meet in the circle and have dinner/drinks and play bunco. We check on the tots often - very often - but they are in our homes (within sight) and we are outside. Its the social fabric of America. I feel many people here are so judgemental and have formed opinions based upon rumor. Ron and Misty are young people. Ron has a spotty record with LE. Misty - from what I can tell - there isn't anything on the record. Crystal - she was very far removed from the immediate situation - and really had NOTHING to gain. Again I guess I'm not here to be popular but I don't want to make enemies either.

[fatcatlurker]

I'm way, way behind but just wanted to mention a couple of things.

First, no crocs in the USA (unless I missed the memo), just alligators.  LE K9s tracking Haleigh to the water would not necessarily show that a gator took her. 

Funny no one is paying much attn to LE K9s tracking her (?) to the railroad tracks.  I heard the evening train come through while watching tv one evening...it was moving quite slowly and drowning out the reporter on the scene.

Thought I heard LE'd told RC that there was a trapdoor in the doublewide.  If that's so, I don't hang my hat on the door ajar issue.  Maybe perp came in door and exited through trapdoor.  I have no clue.

Foggy

Well, I guess we both get the memo tonight then.  

Cuz there are crocs in the USA, they live in Florida.  But they aren't in the area of Florida that my son thought, those are just gators in the St. Johns river.  The crocs (about 400-500) live in the Southernmost part of Florida.  

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/UW157

eek!  Shy of man my a$$.  I don't want to find out.

I don't want to be contrary - but Gators/Crocs? That would require us to believe that Haleigh - in the middle of a dark/chilly nite - opened a difficult door (two doors) - propped one open with a cinder block - and then made her way 1/4 of a mile to the banks of the river - and then encountered a gator - which left NO TRACE of her body - anywhere. Haleigh who was afraid of the dark - not a known sleep walker - just a tiny girl. IMHO - no. I'm just sayin'

You aren't required to believe anything you read on the net, let alone in here, k? 

The info that I included about gators in the St. Johns river and on the banks in Satsuma is just that.  They are there.  It's on the net, you can google 'gators in Satsuma Fl' and look for the recreational links provided there, where they describe the gators in that river. 

I'm not saying that Haleigh had an encounter with a gator.  We don't know, and there is no evidence of that. 

We don't know what happened to Haleigh, period. 

But we can sure discuss the possibilities in the meantime, and everyone is entitled to their own opinions here. 

I think the confusion comes in when some posters are not reading back on the thread?  I think I am old school and like to read everything before I go off half cocked with a post.  And I've noticed some newbies ask questions that could easily be answered if they just read back a couple pages.  Just what I'm noticing lately.

ok  - - - but  - - - nevermind. seriously?

yeah the discussion was started much further back and there other ways to get to the water, not so much that she walked there.  That's all.  I did not mean to point you out directly, as I saw some strange questions earlier that well nevermind...I just usually read back to see what the heck people are talking about and I think that was snipped to save space from a previous discussion. 

[lilymarie]

I'm way, way behind but just wanted to mention a couple of things.

First, no crocs in the USA (unless I missed the memo), just alligators.  LE K9s tracking Haleigh to the water would not necessarily show that a gator took her. 

Funny no one is paying much attn to LE K9s tracking her (?) to the railroad tracks.  I heard the evening train come through while watching tv one evening...it was moving quite slowly and drowning out the reporter on the scene.

Thought I heard LE'd told RC that there was a trapdoor in the doublewide.  If that's so, I don't hang my hat on the door ajar issue.  Maybe perp came in door and exited through trapdoor.  I have no clue.

Foggy

Well, I guess we both get the memo tonight then.  

Cuz there are crocs in the USA, they live in Florida.  But they aren't in the area of Florida that my son thought, those are just gators in the St. Johns river.  The crocs (about 400-500) live in the Southernmost part of Florida.  

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/UW157

eek!  Shy of man my a$$.  I don't want to find out.

I don't want to be contrary - but Gators/Crocs? That would require us to believe that Haleigh - in the middle of a dark/chilly nite - opened a difficult door (two doors) - propped one open with a cinder block - and then made her way 1/4 of a mile to the banks of the river - and then encountered a gator - which left NO TRACE of her body - anywhere. Haleigh who was afraid of the dark - not a known sleep walker - just a tiny girl. IMHO - no. I'm just sayin'

You aren't required to believe anything you read on the net, let alone in here, k? 

The info that I included about gators in the St. Johns river and on the banks in Satsuma is just that.  They are there.  It's on the net, you can google 'gators in Satsuma Fl' and look for the recreational links provided there, where they describe the gators in that river. 

I'm not saying that Haleigh had an encounter with a gator.  We don't know, and there is no evidence of that. 

We don't know what happened to Haleigh, period. 

But we can sure discuss the possibilities in the meantime, and everyone is entitled to their own opinions here. 

I think the confusion comes in when some posters are not reading back on the thread?  I think I am old school and like to read everything before I go off half cocked with a post.  And I've noticed some newbies ask questions that could easily be answered if they just read back a couple pages.  Just what I'm noticing lately.

Really?  I've been noticing that for about four years now.  Happens pretty often, actually.

"halfcocked"? whatever

[klaasend]

Blink - I joined WS before the SM forum was even here.  I could have stayed and continued posting at WS but I never felt "at home".  I chose to stay here for many reasons.

Thanks for your insight into the inner workings of WS. 

Now...let's remember that this thread is about Haleigh and get back to trying to find her!

[Anna]

Maybe someone was hiding in the abandoned car waiting for everybody to go to sleep.

Lots of possibilities but all speculation until there is some kind of break in this investigation.

[Wyks]

As for those insisting that Misty was outta the house? I'm curious what you are basing this on... Misty has denied this - the police surely asked her - she was polygraphed and ask that specific question.

As far as I know - she was in the house. As far as the police are concerned - she was in the house from everything I have seen and read. If she were gone - the police probably would have made a statement to that fact and possibly charged her with abandonment and / or neglect. Misty has not been charged or accused of anything to date.

The problem with forums is that someone can come on here and say just about anything and in the course of three threads - it can become a fact.

Having your own suspicions - is part of human nature. We are all suspicious of anyone when a child is missing, and we ask ourselves - how in the heck can a child be abducted while there is an adult in the SAME ROOM. Trust me - it has happened before and it will happen again.

I would juss caution that not everything is a dastardly on it's face value. Sometimes there are explanations and those explanation are not what WE always want to hear or expect.

There are also coincidence in every case I have ever seen. You need to be able to take some of the info and accept it at face value and not read too much in to it. You also need to not be bogged down by a coincidence that seems completely sinister.

jmo

IMO I think Misty was there. But even if she went to the neighbors for an hour or so, that doesn't make it all her fault or make her the monster that took Haleigh! I think what is so difficult in this case as well as some others, is we dont have much to go on. LE is so quiet, unlike the other case that is happening there in Florida. It is so frustrating and making many start to theorize the absolute.  I have to say that my gut instinct is that someone is going to be arrested, but the person will be innocent because LE has no hard evidence to go on and the public is demanding them to do something.

I'm not sure where you learned about child care, but a child/children shouldn't be left alone--ever.  It is so important that there are laws forbidding it. 

Please don't ever leave any children in your care alone "...for an hour or so."   

Better yet, please don't "care" for children at all if you think its ok to leave them alone for an hour or so.  For shame...

God help all the children. 

 

Foggy, it sounds like you might want to take a deep breath or something.  If you don't agree with what someone posts, that's ok.  Yet there is no need to attack the poster or be rude. 

[islandmonkey]

Good Nite Monkeys..

Night JG~seems we are still on the same page

[klaasend]

STOP THE FIGHTING!  Nobody knows what happened to Haleigh...at this point almost anything is possible.

[Foggy Dew]

On NG the woman said the inside wooden door closed automatically, not that it had an automatic closer like the storm door.

It just tended to drift closed or almost closed when nothing holding it back but didn't actually close tightly.

Yeah, I think it closed automatically (drifted closed) because of a leveling issue.

Also something I noticed watching NG tonight is how close a mobile home is outside that back door. (side door, really.)

You'd think a perp would be worried the neighbors could see him go in or out.

A perfect line of vision is offered there from my perspective.

Re. storm door:  all one needs to do is remove pin from piston where it attaches to bracket on door frame to render it useless (aka self-closing)...no cinderblock necessary.

As re. neighbors?  Myself, I haven't heard that any are there (despite homes being close proximity).  Even if they are, no news that they are awake at night to witness comings and goings.  I haven't heard/read about dogs barking or anything like.  Sounds like a place tailor-made for a nocturnal abduction...not to mention an immature teen looking after two little ones at night. 

[klaasend]

Maybe someone was hiding in the abandoned car waiting for everybody to go to sleep.

Lots of possibilities but all speculation until there is some kind of break in this investigation.

Yep.  I was wondering if anyone lives on boats around there too.

[Anna]

Then there are posters who will come in and say they have fifteen minutes on lunch break and ask to be brought up to speed as they don't have time to read back, etc.

Have watched a thread go in absolute circles doing that, lol.


 

[islandmonkey]

Maybe someone was hiding in the abandoned car waiting for everybody to go to sleep.

Lots of possibilities but all speculation until there is some kind of break in this investigation.

Yep.  I was wondering if anyone lives on boats around there too.

Good point~around here they do.....but, those are the "rich" people, so I have no idea how easy it would be to hide a child on one for any length of time, but the scent tracked to the dock makes me wonder if that's how she was moved and not by car/truck.

[rana]

I'm way, way behind but just wanted to mention a couple of things.

First, no crocs in the USA (unless I missed the memo), just alligators.  LE K9s tracking Haleigh to the water would not necessarily show that a gator took her. 

Funny no one is paying much attn to LE K9s tracking her (?) to the railroad tracks.  I heard the evening train come through while watching tv one evening...it was moving quite slowly and drowning out the reporter on the scene.

Thought I heard LE'd told RC that there was a trapdoor in the doublewide.  If that's so, I don't hang my hat on the door ajar issue.  Maybe perp came in door and exited through trapdoor.  I have no clue.

Foggy

Well, I guess we both get the memo tonight then.  

Cuz there are crocs in the USA, they live in Florida.  But they aren't in the area of Florida that my son thought, those are just gators in the St. Johns river.  The crocs (about 400-500) live in the Southernmost part of Florida.  

http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/UW157

eek!  Shy of man my a$$.  I don't want to find out.

I don't want to be contrary - but Gators/Crocs? That would require us to believe that Haleigh - in the middle of a dark/chilly nite - opened a difficult door (two doors) - propped one open with a cinder block - and then made her way 1/4 of a mile to the banks of the river - and then encountered a gator - which left NO TRACE of her body - anywhere. Haleigh who was afraid of the dark - not a known sleep walker - just a tiny girl. IMHO - no. I'm just sayin'

You aren't required to believe anything you read on the net, let alone in here, k? 

The info that I included about gators in the St. Johns river and on the banks in Satsuma is just that.  They are there.  It's on the net, you can google 'gators in Satsuma Fl' and look for the recreational links provided there, where they describe the gators in that river. 

I'm not saying that Haleigh had an encounter with a gator.  We don't know, and there is no evidence of that. 

We don't know what happened to Haleigh, period. 

But we can sure discuss the possibilities in the meantime, and everyone is entitled to their own opinions here. 

Wyks, in case you're in my head or I'm in yours, I just got the warm fuzzies. HUGS.

Also, welcome Lilymarie! To add to your list, Haleigh had a near-drowning incident in the canal (I believe it was) a couple of years ago; So even tho we've seen her happy in the pool in photos - in the pix she had an adult with her, it was day, and I think she had "swimmies" on. Additionally, the temp was in the 50's at 7 PM, so I'm guessing it was colder later.  It seems sort of unlikely to me too that she was able - or would even want to - wander out by herself in the middle of the night; but I guess it's not impossible tho.

 

 

[leslee]

Thank you Klaas,

The floor plan is just a guess.

I see I missed putting a wall line at the door of the F/AC which could be the water heater instead.

I just did this without looking at the mobile pictures that were posted here... need to go back and look. The roof vents and vents in the walls will tell me where the water heater is.

Am tired, maybe won't go back and look. Thanks everyone!

Thank you IBE, Klaas and Wyks....I do NOT get NG so I am so grateful for all your hard work describing and laying it out for me. Something I can not shake is that 2/9 was a Full Moon... where there skylights in the trailer and/or a lot of windows? If it wasn't that dark out it should have been easy to move around by the light of the full moon.....not too mention it brings out all the crazies

[islandmonkey]

STOP THE FIGHTING!  Nobody knows what happened to Haleigh...at this point almost anything is possible.

That's the D@mn truth I'm working on going thru every freaking transcript to see what the FBI profilers are saying, just because we have nothing else to go on at this point and no one is cleared yet.

[leslee]

Maybe someone was hiding in the abandoned car waiting for everybody to go to sleep.

Lots of possibilities but all speculation until there is some kind of break in this investigation.

Yep.  I was wondering if anyone lives on boats around there too.

Good point~around here they do.....but, those are the "rich" people, so I have no idea how easy it would be to hide a child on one for any length of time, but the scent tracked to the dock makes me wonder if that's how she was moved and not by car/truck.

St Johns is not a deep river FWIW I doubt it would support the weight of a houseboat without grounding it.

[Anna]

Maybe someone was hiding in the abandoned car waiting for everybody to go to sleep.

Lots of possibilities but all speculation until there is some kind of break in this investigation.

Yep.  I was wondering if anyone lives on boats around there too.

I think the river is pretty shallow but remember all those boats near the dumpster, many with covers?  Could just hide in one of those until dark, too.  Dressed in black or camo, hard to see, etc.

Too many possibilities at this point in time.

[fatcatlurker]

Then there are posters who will come in and say they have fifteen minutes on lunch break and ask to be brought up to speed as they don't have time to read back, etc.

Have watched a thread go in absolute circles doing that, lol.


 

yes and I've noticed that this site is different in the respect that some like me (yikes) like to post mini novels.  Makes it even harder if you don't get the beginning and the snipping of the posts start.  It drives me insane when trying to gather all the facts in one place, cause everything is so spread out when someone comes in w/questions answered 3 days ago.  And don't get me started on links! ha ha

[islandmonkey]

Maybe someone was hiding in the abandoned car waiting for everybody to go to sleep.

Lots of possibilities but all speculation until there is some kind of break in this investigation.

Yep.  I was wondering if anyone lives on boats around there too.

Good point~around here they do.....but, those are the "rich" people, so I have no idea how easy it would be to hide a child on one for any length of time, but the scent tracked to the dock makes me wonder if that's how she was moved and not by car/truck.

St Johns is not a deep river FWIW I doubt it would support the weight of a houseboat without grounding it.

I was thinking more along the lines of a jon boat.......they are all over the place there,

[Anna]

I had locks put on the crawl spaces under my house after that man in my area removed a floor vent and just sawed the opening a little larger to get into a house and was waiting on a woman when she came home one night.