Caylee Marie Anthony #114 3/06/09 - 3/12/09

[Blink34]

HOT DIGGITY.

Putting this on here for props to those that sent me letters to forward to SA's office:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/30/caseycaylee-anthony-case-why-we-so-care-how-team-baez-et-al-is-getting-paid/

And for those in the cage who support the notion that nobody gets to make a living off a dead baby.



B

Blink, Thank-you! Your words are spot on.  You not only write extremely well, you are pro-active too.  How awesome.  

A.

I'll second that, this is going to be interesting to see how this plays out.

Thanks chimps one and all..  The irony is, like all of you, I thought the hard part was finding her- who knew?

B

[Blink34]

HOT DIGGITY.

Putting this on here for props to those that sent me letters to forward to SA's office:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/30/caseycaylee-anthony-case-why-we-so-care-how-team-baez-et-al-is-getting-paid/

And for those in the cage who support the notion that nobody gets to make a living off a dead baby.

B

Blink, Thank-you! Your words are spot on.  You not only write extremely well, you are pro-active too.  How awesome.  

A.

I'll second that, this is going to be interesting to see how this plays out.

I agree.    It has seemed like all they care about is money.   I don't want any of them to get a dime.    Also, I'm glad that lady put those videos on Utube to prevent them from earning cash from them.    The whole thing makes me sick.

I wonder if they have questioned that ABC producer that was at the Ritz with the Anthonys -- seems to be that is an avenue to the truth, they also have to look toward NBC and finding out who contracted that TV movie that was reported in the making in California

They have no standing to do so actually, although she is subject to subpoena if only in a rebuttal situation, which I am NOT above, for the record. lol

[JuJu]

 

[Cappuccino]

HOT DIGGITY.

Putting this on here for props to those that sent me letters to forward to SA's office:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/30/caseycaylee-anthony-case-why-we-so-care-how-team-baez-et-al-is-getting-paid/

And for those in the cage who support the notion that nobody gets to make a living off a dead baby.

B

Blink, Thank-you! Your words are spot on.  You not only write extremely well, you are pro-active too.  How awesome.  

A.

I'll second that, this is going to be interesting to see how this plays out.

I agree.    It has seemed like all they care about is money.   I don't want any of them to get a dime.    Also, I'm glad that lady put those videos on Utube to prevent them from earning cash from them.    The whole thing makes me sick.

I wonder if they have questioned that ABC producer that was at the Ritz with the Anthonys -- seems to be that is an avenue to the truth, they also have to look toward NBC and finding out who contracted that TV movie that was reported in the making in California

They have no standing to do so actually, although she is subject to subpoena if only in a rebuttal situation, which I am NOT above, for the record. lol

Actually, I should have clarified they could under subpoena regardless.   And as for you, you may not be above that criteria but you are above the behavior of profitting or doing anything for ratings due to a precious baby's murder....hugh differential my dear friend 

[Blink34]

HOT DIGGITY.

Putting this on here for props to those that sent me letters to forward to SA's office:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/30/caseycaylee-anthony-case-why-we-so-care-how-team-baez-et-al-is-getting-paid/

And for those in the cage who support the notion that nobody gets to make a living off a dead baby.

B

blink...just read this...very well written and said...
it is sad that Casey Ho and her family are benefiting from the murder of this little child...
some attorneys on the talk shows have said that the defense does not have to provide who is paying her legal team..it could be the Queen of England blah blah blah...what do you know about this? is it true or no?

Well- good question, please dont mind my consolidated answer:

If nobody cares, or ever asks, and it's structure does not break the law so as to cause an ethical breach requiring an officer of the court to follow their ethical responsibility to report, possibly it is true.

In theory, hell no.

[Deenie]

totally trivial comment from me, im watching ng and couldnt pass it up. does anyone else find casey ordering red lipstick, no doubt for her next court appearance, repellent, idiotic, funny in an oh so sick way, and all tied up with a bow of exquisite irony?


what a waste, a huge waste... omg...of skin!

Well you can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig

  It makes me mad that you can even purchase red lipstick in jail. She could use some of her red licorice string, pour some water on it and rub it on your lips, they will be a pretty color red Casey.

In History of Cosmetics - RED Lips and Rosy cheeks were only worn by Single Women looking for a Mate to bear them children. Just like a female Baboon her Bottom becomes RADIANTLY RED when she is in Heat....it is a part of nature for a Woman to bear Red to gain a Males attention.
That is why it is today to be a very Bold statement for a Woman to Wear Red lipstick. It has been known within society's rule that Women who wear True Bright Red upon their lips are to be Risque .. and not respected .. Its history and will always be.
For any one that I offend that finds Red lipstick their favor - I am not pointing fingers - just what has been and is noted in the History of Cosmetics.

[Blink34]

HOT DIGGITY.

Putting this on here for props to those that sent me letters to forward to SA's office:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/30/caseycaylee-anthony-case-why-we-so-care-how-team-baez-et-al-is-getting-paid/

And for those in the cage who support the notion that nobody gets to make a living off a dead baby.

B

blink...just read this...very well written and said...
it is sad that Casey Ho and her family are benefiting from the murder of this little child...
some attorneys on the talk shows have said that the defense does not have to provide who is paying her legal team..it could be the Queen of England blah blah blah...what do you know about this? is it true or no?

It matters if an attorney is obtaining payment without his clien't written contractual agreement stating that images, materials etc can be used for his financial gain.  Also, his client cannot profit off of monies earned in connection to the case upon conviction of any felony so where would that money go otherwise, that should be in a contract as well.

I would bet that Casey Ho would give her consent don't you? He isn't doing this for free..he doesn't have that good of a practice or clientele to do that does he? he is a snake I think..

Actually consent is not an option, it is a waiver of any potential conflict that he would need. Ipso facto, imo, no way!

[Gypsy DD]

Let's account for he money, Baez!   

I don't care how Bozo frames it, in the end, Caylee herself is paying for the defense of her murderer.

At the very least, that fact needs exposure.

 

Well said CBB !!!  I have the same thoughts exactly. 

Poor little Caylee has become the cash cow of so many in this case....not one of the A's or their attorneys have any kind of conscience to allow this to go any further.  If CA nad GA really loved that child as they say they would have been helping the prosecution from day one.  Now suddenly they have feelings for Casey..please..I don't believe that for a minute..I think the entire family is so disfunctional and so inward looking..each to their own problems that they never, ever functioned as a family..they just went through the motions.

As far as the IM's between Tony and Casey...well I think that Casey had Tony right where she wanted him...a place to crash when she wanted to and a sex when she wanted.  She got to play Suzi Homemaker on the days she felt like it..and not on the days she didn't..the same way she approached everything and everyone in her life.  She did what she wanted, when she wanted, and if there was something in it for her.  Tony had no way of knowing her well enough yet to see what she was truly capable of..but Cindy and Geaorge and LEE all knew what she could and would do if push came to shove.  Even Lee gave Tony a little talking to about what she was really like..check and make sure you aren't missing money, valuable items..etc.  He knew Tony was no more then a one month stand.

As far as Casey saying in the IM's Tony couldn't come over due to the lateness of the hour and that she respected her parents and their home..I call BS on Casey.  She told him that because she thought that would suffice..and it did.  So she sensed he had or maybe he told her he and his sisters had respect for their parents and their home.

I t just disgusts me that anyone that comes in their wake this family seems to shoot their venom at them. 

Casey killed Caylee because she was in the way, not the cute little play toy she was before, her needs were not as easily met as an infants and the child could talk.  She had no more use for her..and what better way to start to get even with Cindy then to take Caylee out of her life.  Then I think she was getting ready to vanish across the border, live the beautiful life and not have to hear anything more about the family she left behind.

[Blink34]

"These videos have done more for the defense than anything for the last 6 months.."

I believe they meant well, but there is a reason you ask someone with a legal or law enforcement expertise their opinion before interjecting oneself into a murder case. I will say that I am very surprised that she mentioned WS as their is a "sticky" over there that states if you do things like this, your not to mention your an agent of Websleuths, etc.

I can only assume it was condoned if she mentioned it; let's try our best to be supportive to people's intentions in an effort to do the right thing.

I noticed Mark Klaas did not endorse WS or the submission.

[Deenie]

I watched last night on TV a News type show - somewhat documentary about People who abuse children.  The show was Called - Predator ??  I tried to look it up - can't find it. Was on MSNBC Last night on Cable. It was a show about predators and more so about predators that are under the age of 18. A woman, MOM, was trying to Amend Megan's Law that Juvenile Sex offenders should be put on the SO Registry. 
Was stated on the topics - Some studies were mentioned that there is a majority of offenders that are people under the legal age. That many have offenses against other children and are not recorded - or have closed records for Public to never see. They are not put on the Sex Offender registry due to they are a Minor. Even though Charged with a Sex offense against another child. This Mother was trying to amend Megan's law - so that all offenders no matter their age were to be put upon the SO Registry.

Why do I bring this up? Because it makes me wonder "What is not Caught" by a Minors doing= THAT will never even get to the point of Legal secrecy .. But can be found out - -Yet will never Be founded by Public, Yet may be founded by Family.  And a Family can be sworn to make it a secret forever.

I have a Hard Time believing that Casey has Forever been a SAINT when it comes to her Pets or her childhood friends or even her own family  ... that there is nothing at all to be disclosed from Cindy or Lee.. of her/Casey's Past.

Casey did not become Murderer - Cold, Calculated, Slore over night ..Nor did her Pregnancy create her to become the Woman behind Bars today. She did Not Snap and Kill Caylee out of the Blue. She was not driven by PPD ... she planned it, she has a vendetta against Life - it is shown by her own personality in her pics, her fly by night Mothering ... I only love My Daughter (BABY) when Its Show Time. Not her having an Adult daughter -But totally Exploiting Caylee to pose in those pics as I see it-..with Kissy pouty Lips. Too many of Slores photo's with Men and Partying - match the same Posed faces of Caylee. Its disgraceful. It's not cute. Its not even funny in my mind - when it is done over and over and over - for every photo of them together.
I am sure if Slore could have Caylee raise her hand and spread her Fingers ... to the Camera that would come next if Caylee was still alive today.

That fact that Slore has a Shrine in her Bedroom - of Cut up and Cut apart photo's of Caylee when she was an Infant - is Strange to me as well. NO one would see them But Slore being that they were in her Bedroom inside her Parents room. Why would ONE cut them up and post them on a Wall and not put them in an Album or keep them safe - so that others could be able to see them ..enjoy them.
Going back to the Fact the Shrine was made Only of Infant photos --
I think that Slore got freaked out - that Caylee was gaining Vocabulary and Was Growing and Becoming a Toddler and was able to Communicate Words...
That Mommy's side Life was soon to be Found out -
From the Mouth of Babes as we call it ...

I think that Caylee was maturing and starting to talk and Slore said OH Nooo Your not taking me down. No Way and that all came to a head, Caylee maturing and her being above the ave 2 yr old as I see it, going to become a 3 yr old-
And at the same time that Cindy stated she was taking Caylee away ...

And Slore had it all Mind Play set in - and all it took was Time

Any one of us can see in Caylee's video's she was a very intelligent child and paid attention to her surroundings - even at a very young age. Caylee was reactive to her surrounding even before she could talk.

My Words
Anyone that Can Kill their Own Child - As a 22 yr old Mom
Has killed prior
Was not a Human - Victim was an Animal and more than likely a Pet
Jmo

Deenie,

8:00pm - 9:00pm, MSNBC (52)
Predator Next Door

The problems sexual offenders often face after they re released from prison are examined. Included: comments from victims and offenders.

Yep that was it - that is what I watched. Boo you know.

[crazybabyborg]

totally trivial comment from me, im watching ng and couldnt pass it up. does anyone else find casey ordering red lipstick, no doubt for her next court appearance, repellent, idiotic, funny in an oh so sick way, and all tied up with a bow of exquisite irony?


what a waste, a huge waste... omg...of skin!

Well you can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig

  It makes me mad that you can even purchase red lipstick in jail. She could use some of her red licorice string, pour some water on it and rub it on your lips, they will be a pretty color red Casey.

In History of Cosmetics - RED Lips and Rosy cheeks were only worn by Single Women looking for a Mate to bear them children. Just like a female Baboon her Bottom becomes RADIANTLY RED when she is in Heat....it is a part of nature for a Woman to bear Red to gain a Males attention.
That is why it is today to be a very Bold statement for a Woman to Wear Red lipstick. It has been known within society's rule that Women who wear True Bright Red upon their lips are to be Risque .. and not respected .. Its history and will always be.
For any one that I offend that finds Red lipstick their favor - I am not pointing fingers - just what has been and is noted in the History of Cosmetics.

Wow! Thanks Deenie! I've learned something today, thanks to you! 

If it's like the baboon though, all I can say is that women aren't applying it in the right location.

 

[Babybear]

HOT DIGGITY.

Putting this on here for props to those that sent me letters to forward to SA's office:

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/01/30/caseycaylee-anthony-case-why-we-so-care-how-team-baez-et-al-is-getting-paid/

And for those in the cage who support the notion that nobody gets to make a living off a dead baby.

B

blink...just read this...very well written and said...
it is sad that Casey Ho and her family are benefiting from the murder of this little child...
some attorneys on the talk shows have said that the defense does not have to provide who is paying her legal team..it could be the Queen of England blah blah blah...what do you know about this? is it true or no?

It matters if an attorney is obtaining payment without his clien't written contractual agreement stating that images, materials etc can be used for his financial gain.  Also, his client cannot profit off of monies earned in connection to the case upon conviction of any felony so where would that money go otherwise, that should be in a contract as well.

I would bet that Casey Ho would give her consent don't you? He isn't doing this for free..he doesn't have that good of a practice or clientele to do that does he? he is a snake I think..

Actually consent is not an option, it is a waiver of any potential conflict that he would need. Ipso facto, imo, no way!

I find this interesting, Blink, and respect your knowledge of the law. If Casey were to give Baez a waiver for any potential conflict he should run into in selling the photos, etc. in order to finance her defense, isn't it unethical for him to engage in any act which could be construed as a conflict of interest even if the client waives her rights?  As an example of what I mean,  if someone should tell you it's OK to murder them, it is not OK and If you do, you will be prosecuted for it even though you had permission.  Does Casey have the right to waive her rights even to her own detriment and thereby give Baez permission to act unethically and perhaps in contravention of the law?

On another subject, the Son of Sam Law as written in NY was found Unconstitutional by the US Supreme Court as a violation of the First Amendment.  I know that a number of states have rewritten these laws to conform to First Amendment rights and they are written in such a way as to permit the victim or victim's survivors to file liens agains any monetary gain which the perpetrator achieves by selling rights for books, movies, etc. which deal with the crime.  Do you know the law in the state of the Florida?  It is further complicated in this instance by the fact that the victim's survivors are the parents of the alleged perpetrator and they support her.  In this case, if Florida law permits the filing of such a lien, who, if anyone,  would file it and who would benefit?

I always enjoy your legal opinions and your excellent writing.   

[katiekatie2u]

totally trivial comment from me, im watching ng and couldnt pass it up. does anyone else find casey ordering red lipstick, no doubt for her next court appearance, repellent, idiotic, funny in an oh so sick way, and all tied up with a bow of exquisite irony?


what a waste, a huge waste... omg...of skin!

Well you can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig

  It makes me mad that you can even purchase red lipstick in jail. She could use some of her red licorice string, pour some water on it and rub it on your lips, they will be a pretty color red Casey.

In History of Cosmetics - RED Lips and Rosy cheeks were only worn by Single Women looking for a Mate to bear them children. Just like a female Baboon her Bottom becomes RADIANTLY RED when she is in Heat....it is a part of nature for a Woman to bear Red to gain a Males attention.
That is why it is today to be a very Bold statement for a Woman to Wear Red lipstick. It has been known within society's rule that Women who wear True Bright Red upon their lips are to be Risque .. and not respected .. Its history and will always be.
For any one that I offend that finds Red lipstick their favor - I am not pointing fingers - just what has been and is noted in the History of Cosmetics.

well IMO!!!
that red lipstick and her actions only show her for what she is a cold cold wench!! The jury will rate her closely on her actions, demeanor, lack of emotion or any signs of grief!! which we all know she is only expressive when she's pissed and doesn't get what she wants like in that jail visit, where she raises her fist and  tells her parents that she is just as much a victim as cayleee.
the jury will carefuly scrutinize her  day after day!! I dont think her behaviour in court will show a different person. seems like  its not likely that she takes heed to instruction from anyone including her attorney. I am sure he has tried to coach her !!!  she just isnt doing what she dont want to do..
meet the real casey!!

[Babybear]

"These videos have done more for the defense than anything for the last 6 months.."

I believe they meant well, but there is a reason you ask someone with a legal or law enforcement expertise their opinion before interjecting oneself into a murder case. I will say that I am very surprised that she mentioned WS as their is a "sticky" over there that states if you do things like this, your not to mention your an agent of Websleuths, etc.

I can only assume it was condoned if she mentioned it; let's try our best to be supportive to people's intentions in an effort to do the right thing.

I noticed Mark Klaas did not endorse WS or the submission.

IMO these videos, or at least those I have seen, put Casey in a favorable light as a mother. I do think, however, that putting these videos into the public arena before the Anthonys or Baez could sell them was a very clever move. I know that they were in a Facebook account, or My Space, whatever.  However, it is my understanding that they were deleted soon after Casey was out on bond and some members at Websleuths downloaded them to their own computers just in time. By putting them in the public venue, they are essentially making them worthless which I think is funny as heck.  And no, I do not think Casey was a good mother and even Cindy, in one of her more truthful moments, said that she was not, at least according to Lee. And to make it clear, I think Casey is guilty of murdering Caylee.   

 

[Deenie]

totally trivial comment from me, im watching ng and couldnt pass it up. does anyone else find casey ordering red lipstick, no doubt for her next court appearance, repellent, idiotic, funny in an oh so sick way, and all tied up with a bow of exquisite irony?


what a waste, a huge waste... omg...of skin!

Well you can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig

  It makes me mad that you can even purchase red lipstick in jail. She could use some of her red licorice string, pour some water on it and rub it on your lips, they will be a pretty color red Casey.

In History of Cosmetics - RED Lips and Rosy cheeks were only worn by Single Women looking for a Mate to bear them children. Just like a female Baboon her Bottom becomes RADIANTLY RED when she is in Heat....it is a part of nature for a Woman to bear Red to gain a Males attention.
That is why it is today to be a very Bold statement for a Woman to Wear Red lipstick. It has been known within society's rule that Women who wear True Bright Red upon their lips are to be Risque .. and not respected .. Its history and will always be.
For any one that I offend that finds Red lipstick their favor - I am not pointing fingers - just what has been and is noted in the History of Cosmetics.

Wow! Thanks Deenie! I've learned something today, thanks to you! 

If it's like the baboon though, all I can say is that women aren't applying it in the right location.

 

CBB you made Me Snort .. Your Always CBB oxox K

[Foggy Dew]

Hi All,

I'm 15 pages behind and am happily weary from helping friends out today.

When I came home I caught the last part of Caylee vid on re-run of NG.  Caylee is frightened there and boogied. 

Can anyone describe what came after the "quick cut" from when NG broadcast of the video ended?  But the look on Caylee's face was unmistakable to me--esp.  after having raised an always happy child.

I keep thinking I've felt the worse I can about Miss Caylee, and now this video.  I recognize that's its old news to some, but I'm on dial-up so never see them unless they are broadcast on tv(yes, my DH has an air card, but I haven't tried it yet).

I'll read backwards now. 

Foggy

[FL Beagle Mom]

Capp that was hysterical!!!!! 
does anyone know wo albatross234 is, she has a lot of you tube vids on the A's?

ya'll should go see this video


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Vf_dOtOMvw

that is hilarious!!!  

It's stupid to show up in court wearing red lipstick. she will look like a ho....well she IS a ho anyways.

i noticed she also ordered beef sticks. it's a shame that someone in jail for murder can get those kind of luxury foods.. my husband loves those but right now i cant afford to buy him any...   

[Foggy Dew]

totally trivial comment from me, im watching ng and couldnt pass it up. does anyone else find casey ordering red lipstick, no doubt for her next court appearance, repellent, idiotic, funny in an oh so sick way, and all tied up with a bow of exquisite irony?


what a waste, a huge waste... omg...of skin!

Well you can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig

  It makes me mad that you can even purchase red lipstick in jail. She could use some of her red licorice string, pour some water on it and rub it on your lips, they will be a pretty color red Casey.

In History of Cosmetics - RED Lips and Rosy cheeks were only worn by Single Women looking for a Mate to bear them children. Just like a female Baboon her Bottom becomes RADIANTLY RED when she is in Heat....it is a part of nature for a Woman to bear Red to gain a Males attention.
That is why it is today to be a very Bold statement for a Woman to Wear Red lipstick. It has been known within society's rule that Women who wear True Bright Red upon their lips are to be Risque .. and not respected .. Its history and will always be.
For any one that I offend that finds Red lipstick their favor - I am not pointing fingers - just what has been and is noted in the History of Cosmetics.

Wow! Thanks Deenie! I've learned something today, thanks to you! 

If it's like the baboon though, all I can say is that women aren't applying it in the right location.

 

CBB you made Me Snort .. Your Always CBB oxox K

Oh my!  Wouldn't you know that CBB's reply'd be the first thing I noticed.    Hey, CBB, can you imagine the size of a lipstick to cover one's derriere to signal an invitation (so to speak  )?

Thanks for the giggle.

Foggy

[Searching]

In Re: the Caylee video that was posted..... If you look, she was letting everyone know how excited she was that NG had called her and she would be on, now she is upset because her words are biting her in the butt....  http://momtective.wordpress.com/2009/03/10/in-response-to-jvm/

The fleas jumping on the Anthony dog just never end do they.

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momtective momtective is online now
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: In Texas but pretty darn close to Louisiana.
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2009.03.09 Bob Kealing WESH RE:The videos of Caylee eve ed. news & Momtective on NG
I wrote to Bob Kealing about the videos and here is a portion of his response:


If you watch this afternoon I plan to help set the record straight from your point of view based on statements from your website. I'll probably also be back on Issues tonight doing the same.

Thanks for your input. And I promise not to insult you or address your considerable knowledge of this case with sarcasm. I'd ask for the same respect from you.

Best,
Bob

[Deenie]

totally trivial comment from me, im watching ng and couldnt pass it up. does anyone else find casey ordering red lipstick, no doubt for her next court appearance, repellent, idiotic, funny in an oh so sick way, and all tied up with a bow of exquisite irony?


what a waste, a huge waste... omg...of skin!

Well you can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig

  It makes me mad that you can even purchase red lipstick in jail. She could use some of her red licorice string, pour some water on it and rub it on your lips, they will be a pretty color red Casey.

In History of Cosmetics - RED Lips and Rosy cheeks were only worn by Single Women looking for a Mate to bear them children. Just like a female Baboon her Bottom becomes RADIANTLY RED when she is in Heat....it is a part of nature for a Woman to bear Red to gain a Males attention.
That is why it is today to be a very Bold statement for a Woman to Wear Red lipstick. It has been known within society's rule that Women who wear True Bright Red upon their lips are to be Risque .. and not respected .. Its history and will always be.
For any one that I offend that finds Red lipstick their favor - I am not pointing fingers - just what has been and is noted in the History of Cosmetics.

well IMO!!!
that red lipstick and her actions only show her for what she is a cold cold wench!! The jury will rate her closely on her actions, demeanor, lack of emotion or any signs of grief!! which we all know she is only expressive when she's pissed and doesn't get what she wants like in that jail visit, where she raises her fist and  tells her parents that she is just as much a victim as cayleee.
the jury will carefuly scrutinize her  day after day!! I dont think her behaviour in court will show a different person. seems like  its not likely that she takes heed to instruction from anyone including her attorney. I am sure he has tried to coach her !!!  she just isnt doing what she dont want to do..
meet the real casey!!

Katie Katie Katie ...stop ...
Your Fine and I read what your wrote - Your a very Strong Monkey in Opinion but you have to remember we are all On Caylee's side ... I am offering you a purple feeling ..calm it down a bit k. We are all On Caylee's Side Including YOU, we are Here and Yes YOU can State All Your SLORE opinions and Your Feelings against Casey and all that are involved. But what I need YOU to do as a Monkey is give your heart a little Peace .. because Your Upset .. I can see it and feel it in your words. You have to remember Katie Katie -We are all a part of Caylee's Mission for Justice ...but we never want to see a Monkey in stress nor pain over it. Caylee would not want it either