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Author Topic: Natalee Case Discussion #810 3/21/09 - 3/24/09  (Read 182419 times)
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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #440 on: March 23, 2009, 11:39:54 AM »

Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2008 23:34:44 -0500

CAPS TELLS DAVE HOLLOWAY

(I have paraphrased and have not quoted exactly so as to not violate posting the emails)

that there is a big carnival in aruba and he needs to come to Aruba because THEY will try to remove the body
out of the water. (I'm not sure who THEY is, Caps never says)

He goes on to say that Dave needs to arrange for pumps to drain a small pond and that Natalee's body
was deposited in the Monserat Pond.

He told the FBI but they did not respond to him.
Actually, Dave didn't respond either at first and lalasmom emailed dave asking him to respond to Caps.
Dave eventually does respond to Caps and then sends his contact in Aruba to speak with Caps.
Then John Silvetti meets with Caps.

Caps further tells Dave that from what he has observed about the Monserat pond, it's possible that Natalee
is still there. And, in fact, the water is murky and the water quite still and has a deep end with a ridge in the middle of the pond that will prevent the body from being able to move out.


What CAPS fails to understand is that a dead body gases will make a dead body rise like a balloon and if any dead body
was in a pond, and was not bolted down, it would rise up and float to the surface.



Thanks Kermit.

What Caps failed to comprehend was ... there were periods of time when that pond had been dry in the past and was once again dry in May, 2008.  Logic dictates that if Natalee Holloways remains had been placed in that pond ... they would have been discovered and retrieved long ago.

Janet

++++++



"Pond in February 2008"


"Pond in May 2008"


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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
jen3560
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« Reply #441 on: March 23, 2009, 11:56:11 AM »

Caps wrote in response to Persistence scanning the pond last year:

 

#2830 on: February 28, 2008, 12:33:01 AM
Yes,

At 9:00 will go over there to amke sure they do not mis a spot....The sneaker is there....where is the sneaker is the remains

 
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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #442 on: March 23, 2009, 11:57:11 AM »

Could it be that Natalee Holloway's remains were placed in the pond when it again filled up following May, 2008 when it was dry?

Could it be that the timing which was deemed right almost one year later was to prevent forensics from determining that the Natalee's remain had been at the bottom of the ocean floor (salt water) in a fish trap?

Could it be that the Aruba "powers that be" are taking advantage of a desperate father with a heartfelt desire for answers and ... a searcher with an ego along with his wonder dog to further the real finale to the great Aruban coverup?

Could it be that Tamikosmom is in real need of a cuppa of strong caffeinated Tim Horton coffee to clear the morning cobwebs and ... give her a buzz?

Could it be that green tea will not suffice?

GOOD MORNING ALL!

Janet
8:25 AM PT

Janet - if that is the case, surely the powers that be aren't stupid enough to think the effects of salt water could be simply erased from the remains?

Good Morning Jen.

Jen ... the answer is YES.  Think about it.  The Aruban "powers that be" have not been able to fool Beth Holloway.  She KNEW there has been a coverup from the getgo that has prevented justice from prevailing for her daughter.

However ... I am only speculating and when all is said and done I do not have a clue in regards to what it takes to eliminate the presence of salt water.  There could be a process.  Maybe a knowledgeable Monkey can fill us in.

Janet

++++++


The Jonesboro Sun
January 29, 2007


Twitty recalled the first days after her daughter's disappearance and the actions of the Aruban government.

"We did everything we could in looking for her.  There was a government coverup, and it has been documented," Twitty contended.

http://www.jonesborosun.com/story.php?ID=25809


'Scarborough Country' for Oct. 21st
updated 1:46 p.m. PT, Sun., Oct. 23, 2005


HOLLOWAY TWITTY: They never—they never wanted to implicate these three young men.

They never wanted to implicate them from the beginning. And there is a list of reasons, you know, why we know that is true.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/9796403/from/RL.2/


'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for December 1
updated 7:37 a.m. PT, Fri., Dec. 2, 2005


BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S MOTHER: Well, of course, it's very frustrating. You know, the entire investigation, that's all we've had is frustration coming out of the officials from Aruba.  You know, evidence—you know when evidence is gathered and lost or evidence is never gathered when it's supposed to be, just (INAUDIBLE) the primary residence of Paulus Van Der Sloot was never searched —I mean, you know, it just can't help but raise all the questions of—and leave us frustrated.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10295536/


'Rita Cosby Live & Direct' for Dec. 5th
updated 6:18 a.m. PT, Tues., Dec. 6, 2005


TWITTY: ... Remember, within the first 24 hours, we knew who the suspects were. We knew the persons that Natalee were taken from Carlos and Charlie‘s. We knew the license plate of the gray Honda they placed her in. We knew the condition that Natalee was in. We knew the behavior or the conduct in which they engaged in with Natalee.

And then not only that, Jane, within 72 hours, we knew that their first story was totally fabricated, that within the first 72 hours, I faced a room of 12 -- at least 12 detectives, Aruban and Dutch detectives, and a lead detective, Dennis Jacobs (ph), and they knew after we reviewed video footage from the Holiday Inn casino lobby that my daughter had never been brought back to the Holiday Inn. They knew that those suspects were fabricating a story from day one.

<snipped>

TWITTY: Well, Jane, something that the family knew—and we have to keep reminding everyone—after 72 hours -- 72 hours—we knew definitively that these suspects were not telling the truth. We knew that my daughter had never been brought back to the Holiday Inn. Of course we were becoming frustrated. Who wouldn‘t, at this point? You know, we—and what was so unbelievable about this, is they knew this information and still chose to pursue the two security guards on June the 5th.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10348437/
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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Keepthefaith
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« Reply #443 on: March 23, 2009, 12:04:48 PM »





THE POND HAS BEEN DRY BEFORE,SEARCHED BEFORE,SIDE-SCANNED SONARED...BUT NOTHING..WHY WOULD THERE NOW BE SOMETHING THERE??

I know, right? 

Still....why am I hoping this is it? 


Goodnight Hotping, TM, ArtColley and anyone else I've missed!


I hope it is for Dave and Beth..But also for Caps,Silvetti,Schaefer,as well as Kingman..This has the potential to be the catalyst to bring some to justice..That would be my hope!With what we at SM have been going over for quite sometime,if they find remains related to Natalee Holloway..I would hate to be anyone related to that witness!!JMOO

You got that right, my friend!


BUMP
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MOHANDAS GANDHI
Tamikosmom
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« Reply #444 on: March 23, 2009, 12:05:53 PM »

Caps wrote in response to Persistence scanning the pond last year:

 

#2830 on: February 28, 2008, 12:33:01 AM
Yes,

At 9:00 will go over there to amke sure they do not mis a spot....The sneaker is there....where is the sneaker is the remains

 

Could it be that Caps is Fred Golba are one?

 

Janet

+++++++

FRED GOLBA - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Chicopee Man Leading Search for Natalee Holloway
Posted: March 20, 2009 03:20 PM PDT
Updated: March 21, 2009 08:37 AM PDT


Golda plans to comb the Aruban pond for any signs of Natalee's remains or van der Sloot's sneaker.  He says, "I want to stick in my arm from my elbow to my shoulder and feel for bones and Joran's sneaker...If we can find that sneaker in there than that whole pond becomes a crime scene and changes the playing game."

http://www.abc40tv.com/Global/story.asp?S=10045093
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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Tamikosmom
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« Reply #445 on: March 23, 2009, 12:08:27 PM »

Time for my green tea and bagel.

BBL

Janet
9:10 AM
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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Keepthefaith
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« Reply #446 on: March 23, 2009, 12:09:49 PM »

Time for my green tea and bagel.

BBL

Janet
9:10 AM

The only thing i ask Janet...That you take your Hinky medicine with your Tea!
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MOHANDAS GANDHI
2NJSons_Mom
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« Reply #447 on: March 23, 2009, 12:10:32 PM »

Caps wrote in response to Persistence scanning the pond last year:

 

#2830 on: February 28, 2008, 12:33:01 AM
Yes,

At 9:00 will go over there to amke sure they do not mis a spot....The sneaker is there....where is the sneaker is the remains

 

Could it be that Caps is Fred Golba are one?

 

Janet

+++++++

FRED GOLBA - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Chicopee Man Leading Search for Natalee Holloway
Posted: March 20, 2009 03:20 PM PDT
Updated: March 21, 2009 08:37 AM PDT


Golda plans to comb the Aruban pond for any signs of Natalee's remains or van der Sloot's sneaker.  He says, "I want to stick in my arm from my elbow to my shoulder and feel for bones and Joran's sneaker...If we can find that sneaker in there than that whole pond becomes a crime scene and changes the playing game."

http://www.abc40tv.com/Global/story.asp?S=10045093


This is a sad thought, mixed with the comedy of errors that be.   

Good day, everyone. 

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jen3560
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« Reply #448 on: March 23, 2009, 12:10:42 PM »

Well, I know we have the actual sonar images Kyle captured and alalyzed of this pond Feb 2008. 

While none of us are analysts, he did share those with us, along with his analysis (junk).

So it will be very, very interesting indeed to see what (if anything) is come up with out of this pond.

We've got the sonar images of the bottom of that pond as of February 2008, showing what was there, versus what wasn't there.

So if something is "found" in that pond, in my mind there are only two possible scenarios:

1 - Kyle missed it in his analysis of the side sonar images .
2 - It was placed into the pond some time after February 2008.

I'm personally negating option #1, as Kyle has successfullly performed on "dozens" of projects with John Silvetti, as per his online resume - and I really don't think Silvetti would repeatedly engage someone to operate and analyze ROV info, if they had failed him on any projects.
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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #449 on: March 23, 2009, 12:13:21 PM »


All I can say ... if Fred Golba and his canine locate any remains in that pond tomorrow ... I will rejoice on one hand ... Natalee Holloway can at long last come home but ... on the other I will know in my heart that those remains had been planted.

<snipped>


BUMPED
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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Keepthefaith
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« Reply #450 on: March 23, 2009, 12:14:35 PM »

Well, I know we have the actual sonar images Kyle captured and alalyzed of this pond Feb 2008. 

While none of us are analysts, he did share those with us, along with his analysis (junk).

So it will be very, very interesting indeed to see what (if anything) is come up with out of this pond.

We've got the sonar images of the bottom of that pond as of February 2008, showing what was there, versus what wasn't there.

So if something is "found" in that pond, in my mind there are only two possible scenarios:

1 - Kyle missed it in his analysis of the side sonar images .
2 - It was placed into the pond some time after February 2008.

I'm personally negating option #1, as Kyle has successfullly performed on "dozens" of projects with John Silvetti, as per his online resume - and I really don't think Silvetti would repeatedly engage someone to operate and analyze ROV info, if they had failed him on any projects.

I don't hesitate to choose #2..I do hope they find something with what we know!The FBI would have a field day with a certain,few people,shall we say...
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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #451 on: March 23, 2009, 12:18:10 PM »

Well, I know we have the actual sonar images Kyle captured and alalyzed of this pond Feb 2008. 

While none of us are analysts, he did share those with us, along with his analysis (junk).

So it will be very, very interesting indeed to see what (if anything) is come up with out of this pond.

We've got the sonar images of the bottom of that pond as of February 2008, showing what was there, versus what wasn't there.

So if something is "found" in that pond, in my mind there are only two possible scenarios:

1 - Kyle missed it in his analysis of the side sonar images .
2 - It was placed into the pond some time after February 2008.

I'm personally negating option #1, as Kyle has successfullly performed on "dozens" of projects with John Silvetti, as per his online resume - and I really don't think Silvetti would repeatedly engage someone to operate and analyze ROV info, if they had failed him on any projects.

Jen ... you are forgetting that the pond was dry in May, 2008.  No sonar scan required ... only the naked eye.

Lifesongs submission gives the drift and ... there are some images of the pond in May, 2008 on this thread posted by Klaas that leaves no doubt.

Janet

+++++


"Pond in February 2008"


"Pond in May 2008"


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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
jen3560
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« Reply #452 on: March 23, 2009, 12:18:25 PM »


All I can say ... if Fred Golba and his canine locate any remains in that pond tomorrow ... I will rejoice on one hand ... Natalee Holloway can at long last come home but ... on the other I will know in my heart that those remains had been planted.

<snipped>


BUMPED

  rendeer
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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #453 on: March 23, 2009, 12:27:25 PM »

Janet - Starting with these Glenda posted today:

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4717.msg731826#msg731826


And the old pics from before.  This is the same area:










Jen ... I do not believe that Kyle Kingman missed anything in his sonar scanning in February.  He claimed the conditions for the scanning were good.  The water was low.

It makes sense that anything Natalee Holloway related that was missed would have been discovered and retrieved in May, 2008 when the pond dried.  It makes sense that anything Natalee Holloway related would have been discovered in the previous three years when the pond was dry.

Janet

+++++



"Pond in February 2008"


"Pond in May 2008"


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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
nonesuche
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« Reply #454 on: March 23, 2009, 12:28:07 PM »

This is frustrating, my local noon news just covered the story, short but they did.

It seems this is a "new recently discovered witness" who has "only now come forward" and they showed the exact photo of Montserat that is being shown here? "The family has hired a new expert Fred Golba who is the top expert in his field of finding bodies".

kermit - it it's true it was Lala's advancing CAPS was to be believed to Dave, she had best hope something is found in that pond. I don't think she will be able to backpedal and recover from it, if it's not.

I continue to hope they do find her but I also find it exceptionally hard to believe her body was always there.



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I continue to stand with the girl.
crazybabyborg
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« Reply #455 on: March 23, 2009, 12:31:43 PM »

Hi all! I'm going to ask a pretty stupid question............... won't be my first or last..   

Since Aruba is an island, is it possible that ponds in Aruba get filled with water that become brackish so that there is a salt content?
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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #456 on: March 23, 2009, 12:32:04 PM »

Time for my green tea and bagel.

BBL

Janet
9:10 AM

The only thing i ask Janet...That you take your Hinky medicine with your Tea!

No Hinky Tea required ... my Hinky Meter already register is on RED.

 

Bagel and Tea getting cold ... gotta go.

Janet
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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
Keepthefaith
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« Reply #457 on: March 23, 2009, 12:35:55 PM »

Time for my green tea and bagel.

BBL

Janet
9:10 AM

The only thing i ask Janet...That you take your Hinky medicine with your Tea!

No Hinky Tea required ... my Hinky Meter already register is on RED.

 

Bagel and Tea getting cold ... gotta go.

Janet

YES,THE HINKY METER IS BOUNCING OFF THE CHARTS...
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"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history."

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Lifesong
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« Reply #458 on: March 23, 2009, 12:37:09 PM »

Caps wrote in response to Persistence scanning the pond last year:

 

#2830 on: February 28, 2008, 12:33:01 AM
Yes,

At 9:00 will go over there to amke sure they do not mis a spot....The sneaker is there....where is the sneaker is the remains

 

Could it be that Caps is Fred Golba are one?

 

Janet

+++++++

FRED GOLBA - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Chicopee Man Leading Search for Natalee Holloway
Posted: March 20, 2009 03:20 PM PDT
Updated: March 21, 2009 08:37 AM PDT


Golda plans to comb the Aruban pond for any signs of Natalee's remains or van der Sloot's sneaker.  He says, "I want to stick in my arm from my elbow to my shoulder and feel for bones and Joran's sneaker...If we can find that sneaker in there than that whole pond becomes a crime scene and changes the playing game."

http://www.abc40tv.com/Global/story.asp?S=10045093


This is a sad thought, mixed with the comedy of errors that be.   

Good day, everyone. 



Well, I've waited what - 3 days?

I have to say it...even if it is inappropriate.

Is Golba really missing a forearm?

Because if he is, rather than stick that arm into the mud from the elbow to the shoulder to feel around for stuff, wouldn't it make more sense to use the other arm?

Just sayin...

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jen3560
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« Reply #459 on: March 23, 2009, 12:40:53 PM »

Caps wrote in response to Persistence scanning the pond last year:

 

#2830 on: February 28, 2008, 12:33:01 AM
Yes,

At 9:00 will go over there to amke sure they do not mis a spot....The sneaker is there....where is the sneaker is the remains

 

Could it be that Caps is Fred Golba are one?

 

Janet

+++++++

FRED GOLBA - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Chicopee Man Leading Search for Natalee Holloway
Posted: March 20, 2009 03:20 PM PDT
Updated: March 21, 2009 08:37 AM PDT


Golda plans to comb the Aruban pond for any signs of Natalee's remains or van der Sloot's sneaker.  He says, "I want to stick in my arm from my elbow to my shoulder and feel for bones and Joran's sneaker...If we can find that sneaker in there than that whole pond becomes a crime scene and changes the playing game."

http://www.abc40tv.com/Global/story.asp?S=10045093


This is a sad thought, mixed with the comedy of errors that be.   

Good day, everyone. 



Well, I've waited what - 3 days?

I have to say it...even if it is inappropriate.

Is Golba really missing a forearm?

Because if he is, rather than stick that arm into the mud from the elbow to the shoulder to feel around for stuff, wouldn't it make more sense to use the other arm?

Just sayin...



 
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