Natalee Case Discussion #816 4/16/09 - 4/22/09

[Bearlyhere]

I thought they did a really good job.  Some of the details were omitted but nothing that is important to telling the story accurately.  Some things are too difficult to explain in great detail in a two hour movie.

Beth made it very clear that she was on to Julia almost from the start which I did like very much.  I think it was the story told from the mother's perspective and I did like it very much.

And, yes, I am furious all over again.  The names of a few were changed but I think only those who were likely to cause legal problems if they could.  Or demand royalties.  Remember how greedy they are.

There will be several repeats and then I am sure it will go to regular Lifetime channel so it will be around for a very long time.

Going to be interesting to see how Aruba handles this.

Interesting to see how both Aruba and the US government handle this.

[Tamikosmom]

Hi Monkeys

We just gone home a short time ago.  Although we had a great day across the border in the state of Washington ... the highlight I expected never happened.  My son's American inlaws do not get the LMN channel.  The channels they thought I was referring to began with "Life" but ...

I have read some of the comments at the Lifetime website.  Apparently the consensus there is that Beth's production was an excellent movie and ... Tracy Pollan did an excellent job of portraying Beth.  I hope the movie come to one of my channels in the near future.

I will now catch up on what you all have been discussing.

Janet
8:50 PM PT

http://community.mylifetime.com/community/lmn/discussions/talk-about-natalee-holloway

[Anna]

Julia is like the Philistines looking to the letter of the law for justification for doing wrong.

There is no justification for what was done to Natalee Holloway with or without the law.

Apparently a total disregard for basic right and wrong is in play here. 
Regardless of a person's age or what their parent may or may not do, it is still very wrong to endanger the life of another under any circumstances.  Causing another person to disappear and likely being responsible for their death is wrong under ANY circumstances.  What part of that doesn't Aruba get yet?

Whatever was wrong with these people in the first place to try to justify this and defend the indefensible is STILL wrong with them!

[Sleuth]

<snip>
Funny, you mean it's not Aruba's duty to protect tourists who come to their Island?

If Aruba had actually abide by their own laws and not allowed JVDS in a casino and a bar, as Joran was under age, none of this would have ever happened. JVDS would never have met the Mountainbrook teens.

It was not the Alabama kids who were underage, it was Joran. Thus, because Aruba did not follow their own laws that they have in place, they are the ones who endangered tourists.

How come no one ever answers to the fact that underage kids (Arubans/Dutch) are allowed in establishments where by law they had no right to be?

Good points Red.

[Bearlyhere]

Although there were a number of inaccuracies in the setting (where Deepak was parked in relation to C&C, Sloot home, internet cafe, the scenery in the lighthouse area, etc., etc) and what happened,  I understand the need to embellish certain aspects in order to make it an interesting movie.

Overall, I think that it was a great movie. It established the main facts:
1.  Joran, Deepak and Satish were the last to be seen with Natalee.
2.  Joran lied over and over and over.
3.  Joran has no regard for others (car scene with Deepak/Satish, smirk at LE, etc.).
4.  Julia's mock friendship and support was just that - a charade.
5.  ALE is more interested in cornflakes than missing persons.
6.  Paulus sweats (good portrayal with the greasy-haired actor) and it displayed in multiple scenes his "in" with ALE (outside the Holiday Inn and outside the police station).
7.  Beth is unwavering in her hope and determination -as she says "hope means action".  Good depiction of her contined efforts to educate on safe travel.
8.  And...Natalee is still missing.

I was glad to see that it ended with a message from Beth regarding safe travel.

Thanks for the glass half-full version, Sleuth.  Good to see you, btw.

[Bearlyhere]

Lifesong.....
You go girl!...
Descriptive one liner links is definitely the way to get this story out to those who want to know more about what has transpired on the Natalee Holloway over the last 4 years. The descriptions themselves tell a story that are naturally expanded on through the links....
Thank you and SM Monkeys for all you do for Natalee.....

Tamikosmom is the brains behind this operation, billb! 

It was she who put out the reminder earlier this week that we may have visitors to the site this evening that are interested in learning more about the case and what's happened since the time period in the movie.

As you can see from her posts I'm bringing over...Tamikosmom knows where it's at!

Thanks to both of you, you did a great job.  I am speechless (but fortunately my fingers still work).   

[texasmom]

Posted at RU.  I see Renfro hasn't changed.  She must not have liked the way she was portrayed in the movie:

So it's the mom's fault if they maintain a dangerous island. There, Renfro has finally told the truth! Tourists are at fault who visit her island for they "decided" to go swim with the sharks by just visiting there as tourists.

See, the US how the powers in Aruba really feel about our tourism?

Funny, you mean it's not Aruba's duty to protect tourists who come to their Island?

If Aruba had actually abide by their own laws and not allowed JVDS in a casino and a bar, as Joran was under age, none of this would have ever happened. JVDS would never have met the Mountainbrook teens.

It was not the Alabama kids who were underage, it was Joran. Thus, because Aruba did not follow their own laws that they have in place, they are the ones who endangered tourists.

How come no one ever answers to the fact that underage kids (Arubans/Dutch) are allowed in establishments where by law they had no right to be?

AMEN!   

[Sleuth]

Good to see you also, Bearlyhere.

[Bearlyhere]

Posted at RU.  I see Renfro hasn't changed.  She must not have liked the way she was portrayed in the movie:

So it's the mom's fault if they maintain a dangereous island. There, Renfro has finally told the truth! Tourists are at fault who visit her island for they "decided" to go swim with the sharks by just visiting there as tourists.

See, the US how the powers in Aruba really feel about our tourism?

As Sharon says:

AVOID ARUBA AS IF YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT, IT DOES!!!

Hi Sis!

That message from Renfro is enough to scare any Mom from ever sending their child, even as an adult to that island.  I wonder how many pairs of shoes she is missing from sticking her foot in her mouth. 

At the risk of starting the shoe insanity all over again, maybe that is where Joran lost his shoe!!!

 

[Tamikosmom]

Lifesong

You came through with flying colors.  Somehow I knew you would.

I felt so bad and frustrated that I was not available today to assist you in compiling that presentation.  It needs to be posted on a thread of its own so it does not get lost and ... can be utilized at another time.

Thank you so much.

Hugs

Janet

[hotping]

Hello Monkeys and Guests 


I just returned from My trip less than an hour ago and I have read Your comments about the movie...I plan to watch it when it repeats at 1100pm central time.....On Dishnetwork it will also repeat tomorrow morning at 1100AM..... 


Might I add that I saw Julia's post that Klaas brought over from RU...All I can say is


JULIA YOU ARE AN IDIOT and IT IS NO WONDER YOU CHOOSE TO LIVE ON ARUBA...YOU FIT IN PERFECTLY WITH THE REST OF THE IDIOTS ON THAT FRIGGING ISLAND!

Hi Sis!!!

 

Hi Bearly....Good To See Ya!  I'm about to watch the 1100pm repeat of the movie.....See Ya Later! 

[Bearlyhere]

Posted at RU.  I see Renfro hasn't changed.  She must not have liked the way she was portrayed in the movie:

So it's the mom's fault if they maintain a dangerous island. There, Renfro has finally told the truth! Tourists are at fault who visit her island for they "decided" to go swim with the sharks by just visiting there as tourists.

See, the US how the powers in Aruba really feel about our tourism?

Funny, you mean it's not Aruba's duty to protect tourists who come to their Island?

If Aruba had actually abide by their own laws and not allowed JVDS in a casino and a bar, as Joran was under age, none of this would have ever happened. JVDS would never have met the Mountainbrook teens.

It was not the Alabama kids who were underage, it was Joran. Thus, because Aruba did not follow their own laws that they have in place, they are the ones who endangered tourists.

How come no one ever answers to the fact that underage kids (Arubans/Dutch) are allowed in establishments where by law they had no right to be?

That, Red, is the bottom line.

 

[spooky112483]

just noticed they're going to re air the movie right now.

[Anna]

Not only is Aruba saying they have no responsibility to protect tourist but that when something happens they will blame you for being there in the first place.

Isn't that always the criminal mentality?  The victim shouldn't have been there where I could get to them?

But I have never seen that mindset the official stance by an entire government before.  At least not one of Western civilization standards.  It's really a very primitive and barbaric way to view things, survival of the fittest and law of the jungle.

They sure don't post that line of thought on the tourist brochures.
All the rest of the kids returned just fine.  Only the one who crossed paths with Joran van der Sloot did not.

[Bearlyhere]

Two things I thought was interesting in the scene where the "friend" took Natalee out to sea:
1.  The type of boat that was used in the movie was like the local fishing boat or the dingy for the Tattoo (did you see the depiction of it anchored out in the water?) and not the Gottonbos type boat. 
2.  And here is the tear-jerker part...they depicted Joran seeing her fingers still moving after she was placed in the boat (to coincide with the taping where he said he was not sure if she was alive). 

What showed Joran's true character:
1.  #2 above
2.  When he got into Deepak's car and smirked when he said he was leaving her at the beach.

OMG

 

[Anna]

just noticed they're going to re air the movie right now.

Spooky,


It's so good to see you!

Thanks for the heads up.

Will watch it again.

[Sleuth]

Two other things I thought were interesting:

1.  They showed the map with the triangulation...
2.  They did NOT show any pond scenes, pond witness, panty-boy, etc.

[Bearlyhere]

just noticed they're going to re air the movie right now.

Thanks, Spooky.  Good to see you.

[Lifesong]

2009

DAVE HOLLOWAY’S SEARCH OF THE MONTSERAT POND


Based on the testimony of a new witness in Aruba, Dave Holloway sent a search dog and his handler to again search the same Montserat Pond that had been sonar-scanned by the Persistence team.
________
 
Fox News 

Dave Holloway said a witness last year alleged that he saw the only remaining suspect, Joran van der Sloot, coming out of the brackish pond in northwest Aruba with only one sneaker on after Natalee's disappearance. He said the witness has passed a polygraph test.


Fox News 

Before he left for Aruba on Friday, Golba told Fox 25 television in Boston that he planned to stick his hands into the pond's muddy bottom and feel around for "bones and his sneaker" while his tracking dog searches the marshy scrubland.


Meridian Star

Dave Holloway, the father of missing teenager Natalee Holloway who disappeared four years ago while on a senior trip to Aruba, said Tuesday morning he really doesn't think his daughter's body will be found during this latest search.

But he didn't want to spend the rest of his life wondering, "what if" either.

"The guy whose claims prompted this latest search at the pond has been bugging me for some time," said Holloway of Meridian. "He is convinced he saw something and he passed not one but two polygraph tests conducted by reputable technicians. Now, I'm not really sure just how accurate polygraph tests are but I kept thinking, 'what if he is right.' I just couldn't see any reason why he would lie about what he believed he saw."

The latest search is centered around a water run-off retaining pond on the island. Aruban police say previous searches of the marshy area have turned up nothing. Holloway admitted all indications have pointed to the ocean as to where his daughter's body is likely located. But the little bit of doubt placed in his head by this "witness" gave Holloway pause.

"I've been looking for nearly four years and I intend to consider all the evidence and pursue every lead," said Holloway.

"I told the prosecutor I didn't have a great deal of confidence in this latest search," said Holloway. "But the pond is scheduled to be dredged soon and I was concerned if she is there then the dredging may destroy any hopes of finding her. The bottom line is you never know and I didn't want to say later on that, 'maybe I should have at least tried.'"

[Sleuth]

Lifesong - just wanted to say, excellent, excellent work on the timeline.  You've also gotten very proficient at the links.