Caylee Marie Anthony #127 4/25/09 - 5/01/09

[klaasend]

What went on in here last night is unacceptable!!    Most people come here to catch up on the case and discuss it without 40 pages of repetitive, nonstop off topic!! THIS IS NOT A CHAT ROOM!!! Take it to musing. Muffy, help me out here. You have a way with words 

NUT is right!  I know everyone is anxiously waiting on a doc dump in this case but that's no excuse.  Please remember the seriousness of the case and respect Caylee.  The Musing thread can be a "blast" at night, please make use of it.

[SunnyinTX]

Its kinda funny how both Cindy and Baez say there is not way Casey will take a plea deal... But little do they know... That will just seal her fate with the DP... WHAT IDIOTS!!! .... If Casey was my child, I would BEG her to take a plea deal... Who cares what the rest of the world thinks... She wouldn't be killed... These people are the biggest Morons ever!... For me, I'm glad they're so stupid, cuz I want Casey to get the DP... But for them... Why would they want that for her???

If she had half a lawyer he would have had her plead it down in the beginning. She could have plead it was an accident, and plead it down to manslaughter. She would have been out in 7 years max and back in her clubs.  STUPID BAEZ wanting to make a name for himself has now sacrificed her to get his face time.

Turbo you are so correct!!!  BOZO can join her parents in being responsible for either her death (I hope) or being in prison the rest of her life....this will be his legacy!!

[SunnyinTX]

I googled "what is ugly grieving" and it linked me to PTSD... please tell me that clown is not going for PTSD??

Was Casey suffering from PTSD when she searched her computer 3 months in advance of killing her daughter...NO
Was Casey suffering from PTSD when she told her brother that she was a spiteful B...NO
Was Casey suffering from PTSD when she changed her Zanny stories...NO
Was Casey suffering from PTSD when she told Amy that her car smelled because her father ran over squirrels...NO
Was Casey suffering from PTSD when she lied about a job she was fired from in 2006...NO
Was Casey suffering from PTSD when she was begging & manipulating her parents to bail her out...NO
Was Casey suffering from PTSD when she called 911 over 26 cents getting thrown at her house...NO
Was Casey suffering from PTSD when she erased things from her computer...NO

Hopefully the jury will think of these things logically when they deliberate - seems like a no brainer to me

PS  Judging by NG's episode tonight it appears we are getting the document dump.  I'm very curious now about these "surveillance photos" of Amscot - OMG please tell me they actually have her going back & forth to her car & not just the car itself being in the lot!  I'm very much looking forward to what Lenny, Rob & Tracey (esp her since we havent heard from her personally) said in their sworn statements.

Nite Nite monkeys!

I am so glad I decided to go back and read this morning....I didn't see NG and was going to ask if there was anything worth watching/hearing...this just spurred me to get excited!!

[trimmonthelake]

Its kinda funny how both Cindy and Baez say there is not way Casey will take a plea deal... But little do they know... That will just seal her fate with the DP... WHAT IDIOTS!!! .... If Casey was my child, I would BEG her to take a plea deal... Who cares what the rest of the world thinks... She wouldn't be killed... These people are the biggest Morons ever!... For me, I'm glad they're so stupid, cuz I want Casey to get the DP... But for them... Why would they want that for her???

If she had half a lawyer he would have had her plead it down in the beginning. She could have plead it was an accident, and plead it down to manslaughter. She would have been out in 7 years max and back in her clubs.  STUPID BAEZ wanting to make a name for himself has now sacrificed her to get his face time.

Turbo you are so correct!!!  BOZO can join her parents in being responsible for either her death (I hope) or being in prison the rest of her life....this will be his legacy!!

You got that right.He is a idiot.It's like he really believed her crap at some point.
What a putz.  A plea would have been the way to go.

[goodnmad]

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right. Right. Well, in this case, we`ve seen the state has all along -- they`ve turned things over to the defense. Maybe a week or two later, they`ve released it to the public. And just -- we just found out that the defense has gotten those Amscot photos, as well as some interviews from Leonard Padilla, his associates Rob Dick and Tracy McLaughlin (ph), as well as about 500 pages of other evidence that aren`t described in the paperwork.


What from the above mentioned are you most anxious to get your paws on?

Trimm -- Rob Dick and Tracy McLaughlin interviews for sure.

We've heard from LP *cough* a few times already. 

[joesamas mama]

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right. Right. Well, in this case, we`ve seen the state has all along -- they`ve turned things over to the defense. Maybe a week or two later, they`ve released it to the public. And just -- we just found out that the defense has gotten those Amscot photos, as well as some interviews from Leonard Padilla, his associates Rob Dick and Tracy McLaughlin (ph), as well as about 500 pages of other evidence that aren`t described in the paperwork.


What from the above mentioned are you most anxious to get your paws on?

LP interviews is what I want my greasy paws to get on!

[Dolce]

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right. Right. Well, in this case, we`ve seen the state has all along -- they`ve turned things over to the defense. Maybe a week or two later, they`ve released it to the public. And just -- we just found out that the defense has gotten those Amscot photos, as well as some interviews from Leonard Padilla, his associates Rob Dick and Tracy McLaughlin (ph), as well as about 500 pages of other evidence that aren`t described in the paperwork.


What from the above mentioned are you most anxious to get your paws on?

Trimm -- Rob Dick and Tracy McLaughlin interviews for sure.

We've heard from LP *cough* a few times already. 

I would like to just see the 500 other pages of info.   

[Cappuccino]

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right. Right. Well, in this case, we`ve seen the state has all along -- they`ve turned things over to the defense. Maybe a week or two later, they`ve released it to the public. And just -- we just found out that the defense has gotten those Amscot photos, as well as some interviews from Leonard Padilla, his associates Rob Dick and Tracy McLaughlin (ph), as well as about 500 pages of other evidence that aren`t described in the paperwork.


What from the above mentioned are you most anxious to get your paws on?

Tracey's sworn statement, we have not heard from her in detail personally, as well as the Amscot photos.

[Steel Monkey]

Any mental defect defense requires admission of guilt.

Not gonna happen!   

It seems the defense is putting forward a mental disorder to excuse her behavior in that 31 day period but not using it towards her guilt or innocence but rather that she was traumatized by a fictitious nanny or anyone they can claim to be "Zanny."   They are forgetting something key to the case, her computer searches up to 3 months in advance of Caylee's murder on how to make chloroform, neck breaking, household weapons, research on missing children & o yes a fake Zenaida myspace.

That courtroom is going to need to borrow an old trick from the Anthonys and have a water hose in there to clean the walls down from all the bunk and bull that will be thrown around in it.

If she had a mental disorder during the first 31 days, she must have had a reason to believe her precious Caylee was gone for good.

[Dolce]

Any mental defect defense requires admission of guilt.

Not gonna happen!   

It seems the defense is putting forward a mental disorder to excuse her behavior in that 31 day period but not using it towards her guilt or innocence but rather that she was traumatized by a fictitious nanny or anyone they can claim to be "Zanny."   They are forgetting something key to the case, her computer searches up to 3 months in advance of Caylee's murder on how to make chloroform, neck breaking, household weapons, research on missing children & o yes a fake Zenaida myspace.

That courtroom is going to need to borrow an old trick from the Anthonys and have a water hose in there to clean the walls down from all the bunk and bull that will be thrown around in it.

If she had a mental disorder during the first 31 days, she must have had a reason to believe her precious Caylee was gone for good.

That is exactly my take on it as well Steel.  In order to have any disorder she must first admit what the trigger was.

[SunnyinTX]

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0904/28/ng.01.html
Nancy Grace
GRACE: Straight out the Mark William, anchor and reporter standing by there in Orlando. Mark Williams, the photos -- discovery has already gone out to the defense. We are anticipating getting it, released to the media within hours. And in that discovery, are Amscot photos. What do you make of it?

MARK WILLIAMS, ANCHOR/REPORTER: Well, those new photos have emerged in the Casey Anthony affair. We have not seen the photos yet. We hope to get those a little bit later on. They were handed over to the defense. And they`re photos of the Amscot store where Casey`s car was found. Now, Nancy, could this show a new timeline of the case? Could it tighten up the timeline? And could it help pinpoint Casey`s location when little Caylee finally went missing?

GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. We are taking your calls live. Have secret surveillance photos emerged on tot mom`s car? Does it pinpoint the time little Caylee may have been disposed, discarded like trash out of that car trunk? That`s what police are hoping.

Straight out to Holly Hughes, former felony prosecutor out of Atlanta, Raymond Giudice, defense attorney, and renowned lawyer out of the Philadelphia jurisdiction Joe Lawless, also author of "Prosecutorial Misconduct." Welcome, attorneys. Give me your best shot. Holly Hughes, the police evidence suggests that, due to cell phone pinging, she circled, went around and around all over the place before she finally dumps that car at an Amscot. In the car, it`s chock full of personal items, begging, Steal me, take me, I`m a car, I`m dumped here, I`m abandoned at the Amscot. Is she trying to pin the murder on a would-be car thief?

HOLLY HUGHES, FORMER PROSECUTOR: Absolutely, Nancy. She`s trying to pin it on anybody but herself. We see her do that constantly. She tried to pin on it Jesse Grund. She tried to pin it on Zanny the nanny. She tries to pin it on people who don`t even exist. That`s what she was hoping. That`s why -- she might as well put a sign in the window that says, Steal me, because that`s what she was doing, leaving it there with everything. She wanted somebody to take it. That way she could claim, I don`t know anything about the decomposition, anything about the smell. Somebody else did this crime. It`s her modus operandi. We see her do it every day.

trim...a very personal thank you from a Monk that really appreciates you !!

[Cappuccino]

Any mental defect defense requires admission of guilt.

Not gonna happen!   

It seems the defense is putting forward a mental disorder to excuse her behavior in that 31 day period but not using it towards her guilt or innocence but rather that she was traumatized by a fictitious nanny or anyone they can claim to be "Zanny."   They are forgetting something key to the case, her computer searches up to 3 months in advance of Caylee's murder on how to make chloroform, neck breaking, household weapons, research on missing children & o yes a fake Zenaida myspace.

That courtroom is going to need to borrow an old trick from the Anthonys and have a water hose in there to clean the walls down from all the bunk and bull that will be thrown around in it.

If she had a mental disorder during the first 31 days, she must have had a reason to believe her precious Caylee was gone for good.

That is exactly my take on it as well Steel.  In order to have any disorder she must first admit what the trigger was.

They are they are claiming the "nanny abduction" triggered it.   They are portraying her as an innocent victim who has been charged wit a crime she didnt commit.

[Dolce]

They are they are claiming the "nanny abduction" triggered it.   They are portraying her as an innocent victim who has been charged wit a crime she didnt commit.

OMG that is even more ridiculous!!  They have to find a "nanny" to peg.  What are they going to do point to a chair where a mop in a wig is sitting???  Seriously, where did he get his law degree??

[SunnyinTX]

Does 'Ugly Coping' Explain Casey's Partying?
Baez Cites Case In Discussing Anthony Defense

POSTED: 10:19 pm EDT April 28, 2009
UPDATED: 5:24 am EDT April 29, 2009

ORLANDO, Fla. -- When Casey Anthony goes on trial for her life, many legal experts say the toughest part of defending her will be explaining her behavior after her 2-year-old daughter, Caylee, disappeared.

They are images of Anthony partying days after Caylee went missing. In surveillance, she is seen buying beer and bras with money investigators say she stole.

Casey Party
Casey Anthony, left, in photo at party. The date it was taken is unknown.
How does Anthony explain her lack of concern, grief or remorse?

"She has a very compelling reason for her actions," her attorney Jose Baez said in an exclusive interview with WESH 2 reporter Bob Kealing.
Baez, however, did refer to a case that could provide insight into his defense.

In 2002, Cynthia Sommer lost her husband, Todd, a healthy Marine stationed in San Diego.

Sommer's attorney Allen Bloom said Todd Sommer was “originally evaluated to have died by natural causes, a sudden cardiac arrest from an arrhythmia of the heart.”

Two months after her husband died, friends told investigators Sommer bought breast implants with the insurance money, started partying and sleeping around.

Cynthia Sommer was charged with murder. Her attorney argued that Sommer's apparent lack of remorse was a condition known as "ugly coping." The phrase was coined by a Columbia University behaviorist to describe people who appear to grieve abnormally.

According to Cynthia Sommer's attorney, prosecutors were willing to overlook problems with their evidence, because they mistook her so-called ugly coping as evidence she had no remorse and was guilty of murder.

Sommer's attorney finally proved her husband's death was not motivated by her greed. After two years Cynthia Sommer walked out of prison.


Baez declined to be more specific.

"As much as I'd like to say it, that's as much as I can say right now," Baez said.

Anthony is charged with first-degree murder in connection with the death of her Caylee, whose remains were found in Orange County woods not far from her family home.


http://www.wesh.com/news/19317898/detail.html

Cynthia no longer loved her husband and he conveniently died....she rejoiced and went out and did all the things  she wanted to do...ugly coping my foot.....

Every time BOZO says "She has a very compelling reason for her actions," her attorney Jose Baez said ...I want to jump on his face and stomp him.......I DETEST that piece of CHIT!!

[goodnmad]

They are they are claiming the "nanny abduction" triggered it.   They are portraying her as an innocent victim who has been charged wit a crime she didnt commit.

OMG that is even more ridiculous!!  They have to find a "nanny" to peg.  What are they going to do point to a chair where a mop in a wig is sitting???  Seriously, where did he get his law degree??

Maybe they could borrow the actress who played "Maria Fernandez" on SVU last night. 

She looks like a 10. 

[trimmonthelake]

Jane Valez Mitchell   for those that missed it.    (warning:long post)
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0904/28/ijvm.01.html



Tonight the shocking toll the trial of Casey Anthony could take and it`s not what you think. The prosecution announced they would seek the death penalty against Casey charged with the brutal murder of her own precious daughter Caylee, but the cost of that decision is a lot more than emotional.

It will tack on years, manpower and an estimated $1 million in tax dollars, but it doesn`t stop there. Casey has built a dream defense team and taxpayers may wind up putting some of her bills, too.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSE BAEZ, CASEY ANTHONY ATTORNEY: Will it affect the trial? Yes. It may delay it. It may -- it certainly will make the costs to the taxpayers in the state of Florida at least triple.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Triple?

What Baez fails to mention he could have Casey declared indigent. That would allow him to charge the state for her lawyer fees and expert witness costs; all those expert witnesses.

Meantime, Florida taxpayers already paying Roy Kronk`s legal fees, the meter reader who found little Caylee`s remains was on the job when he made that gruesome discovery therefore Orange County agreed to pay $10,000 for Kronk`s attorney and just yesterday, county officials agreed to an additional $2,000 plus dollars.

Some taxpayers are up in arms about paying all these costs wondering why would Kronk need an attorney in the first place. Well, because this case has become a three-ring circus with every volunteer private eye and bounty hunter coming out of the woodwork to lend a hand, but only costing taxpayers more money.

When will the insanity end and justice for little Caylee prevail?

So many ISSUES.

Back to my expert panel: the fabulous Jayne Weintraub, criminal defense attorney and Beth Karas, correspondent for TRU TV.

Beth, many people wondering why Roy Kronk of all people needs an attorney. Does every person in a case like this, every single person need a lawyer?

BETH KARAS, TRU TV CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely not. It is very unusual for a witness I don`t care how important the witness is, to have an attorney. You might in a big case need a PR person. It`s my understanding that the first $10,000 is really to deal with the media. But do you need an attorney to deal with the media, you need a PR person.

The $2,500 recently approved by the county is for an attorney to represent him at the deposition. Again, if he`s going to be truthful in his answers there`s no reason why he really needs an attorney, but the county has agreed to pay for it.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, every one of these big cases I`ve covered is just everybody gets sucked in and everybody gets an attorney and even the attorneys get attorneys.

I`ve actually seen that happen.

Just seeking the death penalty in the case against Casey Anthony could cost taxpayers an additional $1 million. A change of venue could cost a lot more than that.

The investigation into Caylee`s disappearance itself, reported to have cost tens of thousands of dollars. If Jose Baez has Casey declared indigent, this question to Jayne Weintraub, could taxpayers wind up paying for her expert witnesses and other fees, too? How does that work?

JAYNE WEINTRAUB, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well what -- you have to petition and fill out certain applications and she`ll be treated just like every other defendant that is indigent that can`t afford the expert witnesses and the attorneys according to the rules and regulations.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: So why doesn`t every poor person just hire the most famous attorney they can think of?


WEINTRAUB: She will not be entitled to a $5 million lawyer. She will be entitled to a lawyer to be paid according to the state fees unless there are exceptional circumstances which there very well might be here.

Normally in death penalty cases there are certain roots and the JAC in Florida would determine that amount of money. But as far as Roy Kronk is concerned, I`ve got to tell you Jane, Florida bar rules prevent -- prevent witnesses from being paid.

Can you imagine if the defense paid for a witness` lawyer and to pay a witness $10,000 like the county agreed? The witness would be charged with witness tampering and obstruction. The defense could never get away with it.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: They`re not paying him, they`re paying for a lawyer.

Well, I tell you what, many Floridians are furious about paying for Roy Kronk`s attorney.

WEINTRAUB: They should be. I`m one of them.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And here`s why the guy may need one.

Listen to what Leonard Padilla, the bounty hunter, told Nancy Grace about Kronk back in January.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, NANCY GRACE SHOW HOST: What`s your theory? How is Kronk somehow part of a conspiracy? Go ahead and tell me.

LEONARD PADILLA, BOUNTY HUNTER: Well, we know that the defense is the one that`s benefiting by the confusion right now as to the finding of the body and how it was found.

How did somebody get word to Kronk to get out there? I think he was the end of a daisy chain that started with Casey and two or three people in the middle there and -- I mean, he says he saw something white out there.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Beth Karas, the reason why this guy needs a lawyer is because Leonard Padilla is saying he`s the end of a daisy chain. And that is a quite a wild statement given that this guy -- the cops say he was a good Samaritan who did a good job and had a good gut and found the body.

WEINTRAUB: And he cooperated that`s why he needs 12,500 for a lawyer?

KARAS: I was in Orlando when the body was found and I was at the press conferences when the sheriff`s department was saying they have no reason to suspect any wrongdoing on the part of Roy Kronk and they really don`t.

The state attorney`s office stands by him as far as I understand. I understand because of the media attention on this case that he did need some help perhaps. He took another job within the county as a result. He didn`t want to be out reading meters at this point because some people feel he knows more than he is saying.

But -- and I heard the sheriff`s spokesperson say that they have no reason to believe anyone going...

WEINTRAUB: That`s what the sheriff said, he also -- they also haven`t charged the cops that was lying under oath, crane with any offense for lying under oath...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Well, you know what guys? This is why people aren`t Good Samaritans because look what happens, you`re a Good Samaritan and you find the body and then...

WEINTRAUB: I`m not so sure this guy is a Good Samaritan.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Oh please.

WEINTRAUB: Oh please, selling his story to "Good Morning America."

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Look, I`m going to give Beth the last word on that because she was there.

KARAS: Well, I have no reason to believe, it was very strange, but I didn`t have any reason to believe once the sheriff`s department said that they were standing by him. They are thorough...

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Ok.

KARAS: They are good down there in Orlando, I must say.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: I want to thank you Beth Karas, always, I`m a big fan and Jayne, stay right there.

[trimmonthelake]

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Right. Right. Well, in this case, we`ve seen the state has all along -- they`ve turned things over to the defense. Maybe a week or two later, they`ve released it to the public. And just -- we just found out that the defense has gotten those Amscot photos, as well as some interviews from Leonard Padilla, his associates Rob Dick and Tracy McLaughlin (ph), as well as about 500 pages of other evidence that aren`t described in the paperwork.


What from the above mentioned are you most anxious to get your paws on?

Trimm -- Rob Dick and Tracy McLaughlin interviews for sure.

We've heard from LP *cough* a few times already. 

Oh me too.Tracy was right there in the house.You know she has some info.

[SunnyinTX]

This is no where near the Summers case.  I read about that case and saw the Dateline episode.

Here is how it's different
1.  The smell of death in a car
2.  Not reporting your child as missing
3.  Imaginary people
4.  Forensic evidence
5.  Skank is a murdering slore

How can a mother feel behave this way. 

In my early teens, a good friend of mine was killed in a car accident.  Her mother grieved for years after her death.  She would have panic attacks when she went into a store.  It was sad and heartbreaking.  She would see one of us (her daughters friends) and begin to cry.  I just do not believe a mother would grieve the way skank has behaved.

BTW, BJ...Just as you are disputing the junk science of the Oakridge lab, you are citing a theory known as Ugly Grieving?  How can this be...where is the analytical research and studies done on this.  It is not in the DSM IV as a classifiable diagnosis, oh wait it is...It's called being a sociopath.  you should check into it, we all think your client is one.

Good post, and also wanted to note, how can he claim this psychological "phenominon" when he made it very clear previously that his client was in good mental condition and did not need to undergo any sort of testing or monitoring?  The DP attorney tried to get him to option for it, and JB came out with a resounding "no way"!
Why the back pettle?  No way it will work.  JMO

Good Morning D+2...not Just Your Opinion.......plenty of us are right there with ya!!

[Blink34]

They are they are claiming the "nanny abduction" triggered it.   They are portraying her as an innocent victim who has been charged wit a crime she didnt commit.

OMG that is even more ridiculous!!  They have to find a "nanny" to peg.  What are they going to do point to a chair where a mop in a wig is sitting???  Seriously, where did he get his law degree??

I actually think they are going to abandon the Nanny issue altogether. And George will win a spelling bee.
(Blink pats +2 in Momma Dolce's tummy)

[SunnyinTX]

Good morning!    Today''s gotta be doc dump day

Well so much for Bozo's latest stab at a defense for Casey!   Look at the Wesh2 poll results so far...bwahahaaa

Do you think the "ugly coping" defense could explain Casey Anthony's behavior after her daughter Caylee went missing?
Choice  Votes  Percentage of 236 Votes 
Yes 8 3%
No 220 93%
Maybe 8 3%
Thank you for participating in our survey.

http://www.wesh.com/news/19317898/detail.html

I wonder how Joy managed to wrangle up 7 friends to help her vote. 

hahahahahahaha...she has some nuts who post with her doesn't she?
I think this poll is very telling....