March 28, 2024, 10:56:35 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: NEW CHILD BOARD CREATED IN THE POLITICAL SECTION FOR THE 2016 ELECTION
 
   Home   Help Login Register  
Pages: 1   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: John Kerry  (Read 5291 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
LouiseVargas
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 2524



« on: November 01, 2006, 12:50:53 AM »

To John Kerry

I heard on FOX Tuesday morning that on Monday John Kerry spoke at Pasadena City College (my Alma Mater) and (paraphrased) told a group of college students they could either work hard in school or "get stuck in Iraq." Today there is a firestorm with many calling for Kerry's apology for saying "round about" that the troops are uneducated, etc. Kerry said it was just a botched joke gone wrong and he won't apologize as he was attacking Bush, not the troops. FOX pundits said he could just have said that in a press conference and the whole thing would be over.

In his defense, we all know Kerry graduated from Yale and instead of pursuing a business career, he volunteered to go to Viet Nam. A very noble endeavor. Not many would do that. And back in the day, we applauded his going to Congress and testifying. He is still to this day a genuine war hero and I believe he testified accurately as to what he saw.  We all believed in the idealism of our era. And in war, all conquerors go on killing sprees and rape women. PERIOD.

I know John Kerry did NOT mean what his words said. But, the world has changed and downgraded from the good intended nobility of the Camelot era. I'm feeling he is having a difficult time accepting that the Godly inspired ideals of "peace and love, make love not war" have not been able to override the forces from the dark side. I'm disappointed, too.

However, it is very important that a politician keep up with the times and be very careful what they are saying publicly, jokes or not. (Remember George Allen.)

John Kerry, I know you mean the best and that you really care about America. But for opening your mouth at the wrong time, you have lost my potential Democratic vote in 2008. Your timing is off. And God has not given you that particular gift.
Logged

Hope is everything. I see angels everywhere.
Red
Administrator
Monkey Junky
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 4993



WWW
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2006, 03:55:17 PM »

John Kerry, Lover Of the Military

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2006/10/31/john-kerry-lover-of-the-military-2/

“You know, education, if you make the most of it, if you study hard and you do your homework, and you make an effort to be smart, uh, you, you can do well. If you don’t, you get stuck in Iraq.”
Logged
Red
Administrator
Monkey Junky
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 4993



WWW
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2006, 03:57:07 PM »

Even Radio Icon Don IMUS Tells Senator Kerry … “Please Stop It, Stop Talking”

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2006/11/01/even-radio-icon-don-imus-tells-senator-kerry-please-stop-it-stop-talking/

Radio personality Don IMUS tells John Kerry … “Please stop it … stop talking. Go home get on the bike, go wind surfing, anything. Stop it … you are going to ruin this.”



John Kerry … Who is avoiding responsibility? Apologize and admit what you said was wrong, if you are man enough? You owe our military men and woman an apology. And after the first apology … you owe them another. Honestly, how difficult can it possibly be to admit you messed up and apologize to our military? What would make one not do such a thing?
Logged
Red
Administrator
Monkey Junky
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 4993



WWW
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2006, 04:24:14 PM »

LV,

I would actually say quite the opposite. I live in New England and have to put up with Kerry's comments all the time. He did not mis-speak.

The attitude  extremely liberal New England is that libs are better, more educated and pretty much superior to all others. For those that live and have suffered through the many Kerry stories they will understand the term ... "Do you know who I am?"

Kerry is in no way a Kennedy Democrat. In todays climate JFK would be a Republican.

You have to remember a couple things about Kerry. He is from a liberal state, he never has an opponent and he was campaigning for a CA gov candidate that many Dems think is off the reservation.

Kerry makes these types of comments like "i voted for it ..." and "You know, education, if you make the most of it, if you study hard and you do your homework, and you make an effort to be smart, uh, you, you can do well. If you don’t, you get stuck in Iraq.” because he never had to face ramifications for his actions.

Of course he did when he ran for President and that one of the reasons why he lost. Also, in this case ... it is the Democratic party that will pay for his foolish comments.

All close races in what are normally republican areas have just been affected. That's why TN Senate candidate Harold Ford Jr is screaming apologize you fool. Guess who has military bases in TN?

LV, having lived in predominately liberal areas I have come to learn a real important fact about people like Kerry. They say exactly what they mean and think either the MSM will not press the issue or they will just lie it away. They never think that anyone will question them. This is the Northeast liberal attitude of I know better than you.

The reason why I believe Kerry meant what he said regarding the troops is that this has been the liberal far left attitude of Democrats for quite some time. They have disdain for the military. Kerry served in the military, yet the military did not support him in the vote in 2004. There is a reason for that.

Northeast liberals do think others are stupid. They constantly put that forth. That is no secret.

However, who looks stupid now? Kerry has created a November surprise that even Carl Rove could not have orchestrated. Kerry has effectively changed the news cycle and insulted the troops in a time of war. How foolish could one be? And Kerry tries to pass himself off as an intellectual. LOL.

Kerry's words let out the Far Left dirty little secret that they have tried to hide, disguise and lie about. They don't like the military. Not only do they not support the mission ... they do not support the troops. I am not referring to all Democrats. However, that is the present divide in the Democratic party. That is why democrats in the South could never relate to northern liberal Dems.

Southern Democrats are more republican than they are far left Dems. That is the truth.

There is a left wing bizaro element to it that is so far left its anarchist.
Logged
A's Fever
Monkey Junky Jr.
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 806



« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2006, 06:48:44 PM »

Okay, I am going to reveal myself as a political idiot.  I vote, but don't follow politics closely, and do not care for politics.  I'm a registered Democrat, but I will vote for the best candidate for office not necessarily along party lines.  I'm not a Kerry supporter or anti-Kerry.

Having said that, my question is, why is what Kerry said so wrong, and so controversial??

I may have said similar things to my own children.  Obviously, we want our children to do well in school so that they may have more choices.  Is it not documented that the military does a lot of recruiting of minorites and among the poor?  Because they have fewer choices, they often sign up to receive an education and good benefits.  Nothing wrong with that, however, if they did not have other options, they may indeed feel stuck.  

I don't see how this comment is disrespectful of the military.  Are we to naively believe that none of our troops feel stuck, or that they got in much deeper than they had planned when they enlisted (particularly among National Guard), or that their tours are longer than originally scheduled, or that they have to go back multiple times?  Of course they may feel stuck.  Who has a job that they don't feel stuck in from time to time?  So how is this disrespectful?
Logged
LouiseVargas
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 2524



« Reply #5 on: November 01, 2006, 10:18:55 PM »

Red,

I know very little about Northeastern, New England extremely Liberal Democrats.

Nevertheless, in the 60s, when young men (both Republicans and Democrats) were fleeing to Canada, when they were getting married to avoid the draft, when they stayed in school longer than they planned in order to get an exemption, there was a Northeastern, New England extremely highly educated Liberal Democrat (whose attitude according to you "is that libs are better, more educated and pretty much superior to all others") who would never be drafted, who VOLUNTEERED to go to Viet Nam.  His name is John Kerry.

I'm not going to ask about your military history as you were too young to be drafted in the Viet Nam era.  I'm not going to ask about your New England education either. I perceive you as being 40-ish and if that is too high an estimate, I apologize.  You were not old enough to understand what was going on in those days, Red.  I was. So were Cheney and Bush 43. You may have had to put up with Kerry stories in your adulthood, but I had to put up with stories about Cheney/Bush wherein Cheney got a deferment for staying in school and Bush's family pulled strings for him to have a shortened National Guard tour from 1968 to 1972. On the other hand, John Kerry volunteered and served as a Lieutenant in the United States Navy in Vietnam from 1966 to 1970.

My point is, Red, the New England extremely liberal and educated Democrat spent his four years fighting a war in Viet Nam and the conservative Republican (who was born in New England as well) spent his four years stateside. It is incongruous that GW did this considering his family's stellar background of war service ... not only Bush 41 but his family before him.

And if you have read A's Fever's post below yours, she made a damn fine point. "Are we to naively believe that none of our troops feel stuck, or that they got in much deeper than they had planned when they enlisted (particularly among National Guard), or that their tours are longer than originally scheduled, or that they have to go back multiple times? Of course they may feel stuck."

Red, when the Army became a volunteer force and was opened to include women, people signed up (in a time of NO WAR and none was on the horizon) for the purpose of receiving an education and good benefits later in life.  Even my daughter (who is 40 now and strongly feels she is a reincarnated Viet Nam soldier) considered enlisting as there were Army recruiters on every high school campus in Southern California.  Many of her friends signed up, male and female.  

I know for certain the military is desperate for recruits. Last year I saw a handsome young Hispanic soldier in uniform in the grocery store. I gave him a big hug and asked where he is stationed.  He said he served in Iraq but became a recruiter stateside. I asked, "How's it going?" He said, "Just terrible. No one wants to sign up. We have relaxed the standards as far down the scale as possible in order to get recruits. We are reduced to signing up guys on the street offering them a better life." I said, "I wish you the very best" while knowing that guys on the street are homeless and most likely alcoholics and drug addicts. And it is just as A's Fever said, they are recruiting the poor uneducated outcasts in society.

I post this with all due respect for your right to have your own opinion, just as I have a right to mine.
Logged

Hope is everything. I see angels everywhere.
LouiseVargas
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 2524



« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2006, 10:26:29 PM »

A's Fever,

I am standing on a chair applauding your post.

Applause applause.
 Applause applause.
Applause applause.

Three cheers for you!
Logged

Hope is everything. I see angels everywhere.
Carnut
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 3882


« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2006, 02:21:49 AM »

Yes Louise, John Kerry did volunteer to serve in the U.S. Military and do his duty during the Vietnam War.

And in a JFK esque way, he commanded what was similar in concept to the WWII PT Boat.

As an officer Kerry only served a 6mo term of duty in theater.

There were some who served with Kerry who complained he was an elitist and somewhat selfserving in his claims for injuries while there, but at least he did do his duty.

But, since his return and during his career Kerry did nothing but disparage the men and officers who continued to serve in the war.

After his discharge from active duty Kerry was totally self serving in his anti war agenda and career path for office when he testified of all the 'wrong doing' and bad actions of men at war, in a way many vets consider an insult.

It was kinda obvious in Kerry's recent remarks that his thinking continues to be that 'rich and smart' boys got out of Vietnam while the lower class had to serve. Kinda shows a bit of 60's think and elitist attitude.

Yes, Kerry did do the JFK thing and did serve, while other elected officials got education deferments and 'rich guy' assignments and others Rhodes Scholarships.

Whatever moral fortitude Kerry has is not in question, his attitude is what concerns us most.
Logged
Dihannah1
Monkey All Star Jr.
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5264


God watch over our children and keep them safe.


« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2006, 11:55:08 AM »

Without going into great detail, as most of my views of Kerry have been mentioned above already.  I will say one thing,  Kerry is an idiot and I am a Democrat who because of him, voted Republican!   I cannot stand him, he makes me sick!  I won't even buy Heinz ketchup now, even if it's on sale.

And though I know some will jump on this, I actually did like Clinton and his policies, as I said, I was a registered Democrat.
But, the dems. have gotten so out of touch and become far too liberal for me now.

Maybe I am getting a little more conservative with age, or is it knowledgable? I used to be like A Fever, always voted, but didn't really follow politics until last 4 elections.  

LV,  we usually are on the same page, but we definately see opposite on this.  I still love to read your posts and comments for all your glorious knowledge!  We agree at least 95% of the time!  Wink   With Love!
Logged

God has FINAL Judgement!<br />
A's Fever
Monkey Junky Jr.
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 806



« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2006, 12:15:54 PM »

Quote from: "LouiseVargas"
A's Fever,

I am standing on a chair applauding your post.

Applause applause.
 Applause applause.
Applause applause.

Three cheers for you!



Thanks LV   Embarassed  Embarassed

I am still waiting for someone to explain why the remark was disparaging toward troops.  I don't get it.  If anything, it would seem to be a criticism of the administration that has us stuck over there, with no clear exit strategy and no clear progress being made.

This is what I hate about politics today.  Somebody makes a comment, it is perceived as politically incorrect, and then the spin machines go into action - both pro and anti. Much righteous rhetoric, hair-pulling and teeth-gnashing.  I'd like to see more honest, open debates about the war and administration policies than this kind of thing, which shamefully passes for politcal debate these days.  JMHO
Logged
Carnut
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 3882


« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2006, 05:12:08 PM »

The Response

Logged
LouiseVargas
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 2524



« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2006, 09:28:16 PM »

George, I was not going to mention other highly educated New England Democrats but since you mentioned JFK, he is another one whose family had a distinguished record of war service to our country. On the other hand, Bush 41, a highly educated New England Republican, and his entire family, have a distinguished record of war service to our country. So it does not boil down to Democrats and Republicans and liberalism or conservatism.

But back to Kerry, I believe his testimony to all the wrong doing and bad actions of men at war was the truth of what he saw and experienced.  Any war brings out the absolute worst in people when they are under heavy stress, to put it mildly.  An example of this is the My Lai massacre which was committed by US soldiers on hundreds of unarmed Vietnamese civilians, mostly women and children, on March 16, 1968, in the hamlet of My Lai, during the Vietnam War. It prompted widespread outrage around the world and reduced American support at home for the war in Vietnam.

Cheney got an education deferment but he was no scholar. Yet you site Bill Clinton (even though you did not mention his name) because his Rhodes Scholarship exempted him. Each year approximately a thousand endorsed candidates compete for the 32 U.S. Rhodes Scholarships and you are dissing him for being chosen for this prestigious award? He was not a rich boy, just an exceptional brainiac. And most people of his high intelligence will not ever be sent to war.

And that's what Kerry was saying, even though is a jerk.
Logged

Hope is everything. I see angels everywhere.
mrs. red
Monkey All Star Jr.
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 9318



WWW
« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2006, 10:00:06 PM »

I am a statistics kind of girl... I admit it. Years of marketing prior to the legal field will do that to you....

did y'all know???

in the military population -

 99% are high school graduates...

in the general population -

74% are high school graduates....

Now I realize he is talking college... but you gotta finish high school first - I have met more people with college educations in the military, including my father.  My former Sunday School teacher was from RI with an ivy league education and enlisted, my office manager's husband is retired military and he has a college degree, my best friend's two younger brothers both have degrees from college and enlisted not once but twice.

I completely disagree that only stupid people join the military.... I think that those that volunteer have more heart, guts, and common sense than a lot of those that did go to some of our schools based on random people I have met from the top schools and enlisted people I have talked to recently while traveling.  

I applaud every single one of these kids... and thank GOD that they have the bravery and heart to volunteer... and I have a HUGE issue with John Kerry and his statement.... John Kerry should be beyond ashamed.

Just my $.02
Logged

To accomplish great things we must not only act but also dream, not only plan but also believe.
Author: Anatole
LouiseVargas
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 2524



« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2006, 10:24:35 PM »

Dihannah,

I agree with you 100% that Kerry is an idiot. His political career is totally finished. I cannot stand him either. I also hesitate when I see Heinz ketchup. Fortunately, I don't use much ketchup.

I stopped voting a long time ago because I was so disillusioned. But I came back to vote for Clinton. I also was at the polls early (across the street from me in the elementary school auditorium) to vote for Arnold Schwarzennegger, a Republican.

After Bush won his first election, I was disgusted over the Florida voting fraud. However, after September 11, I thought he was Godlike. I fought with my Armenian neighbors that he went into Iraq for the right reasons while they disputed my opinion. I intended to vote Republican when he was up for a second term. After the WMD debacle, I went back to vote for Kerry. There was another incident of election fraud. Much as I loved Bush 41, he was at one time the head of the CIA and he knows how to pull strings. Almost like Paulus Van der Sloot, he would do anything to benefit his son, GW 43.

Anyway, I stand side by side with you on the Kerry issue. However I just felt a perverse need to defend him because of everything that happened in the 60s which changed the world. And that's an entire other long subject.

WITH LOVE
Logged

Hope is everything. I see angels everywhere.
LouiseVargas
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 2524



« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2006, 11:27:12 PM »

A's Fever,

Yes, John Kerry said his comment was not directed at the troops ... he was aiming to criticize the Bush administration's Iraq policy and their lack of a clear exit strategy and that no clear progress is being made.  'Tis true.  Not to mention they didn't put enough boots on the ground even when the Generals said they needed more.

The politics of today are the nastiest I've ever seen and I saw Kerry's comment catching fire like the Esperanza fire in SoCal. The media are like arsonists, too. A little bad spin, and one is finished.  And the horrible things they resort to saying. Same with Mark Foley only his fire burns brighter.

The main political problem today is that no one can run for office unless they are squeaky clean. This leaves out 90% of the people who have the most to offer. There are no enlightened minds in the government.  Like a corporation, you tow the line or else get out like Colin Powell.  

I'm don't want to vote for anyone. CA will remain the same. Arnold will be re-elected, as well as the Senators and Reps.
Logged

Hope is everything. I see angels everywhere.
A's Fever
Monkey Junky Jr.
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 806



« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2006, 01:56:45 AM »

I appreciate your thoughtful and positive comments Louise.  

I took another look at Kerry's remarks, and I feel that, given the location, context and verbiage, the comments were directed at Bush and in no way insulted the troops.  He did not call anyone stupid, or imply it, in my opinion, and this whole thing has been blown out of proportion.  It also diverts our attention from those issues that we will be voting on next week.  Clearly my views are in the minority here, and I do appreciate the freedom to express them.

As I said in an earlier post, I am not a political person and the dialogue here, in the political forum, reminds me why I don't get involved in politics.  I am overwhelmed by the strong emotions demonstrated and do not feel comfortable posting with my limited political knowledge (meaning - I'm in over my head on this forum  Embarassed ).  

My final observation on this issue is that reason, logic and careful consideration of the issues, not emotion, should be our guide when voting next week or at any time.  I truly hope that we can all cool down and apply ourselves to the serious issues at hand.
Logged
GreatOwl
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 1427



« Reply #16 on: November 05, 2006, 11:27:24 PM »

Logged

"May you have the hindsight to know where you've been,
 the foresight to know where you're going and
 the insight to know when you've gone too far."
LouiseVargas
Monkey Junky
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 2524



« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2006, 01:28:43 AM »

Excellent post, Great Owl. Exactly the same thing I'm trying to impart.
Logged

Hope is everything. I see angels everywhere.
Pages: 1   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Use of this web site in any manner signifies unconditional acceptance, without exception, of our terms of use.
Powered by SMF 1.1.13 | SMF © 2006-2011, Simple Machines LLC
 
Page created in 6.447 seconds with 19 queries.