Natalee Case Discussion #820 6/10/09 - 7/13/09

[Blue Moon]

This is not perfect but I tried to do a transcript of what Tim Miller said:

Tim Miller on Dana Pretzer 6/17/09 About the Holloway Case

You know what we’re having a big fundraiser in July and Beth is actually coming to our fundraiser.  You know we’ve done so very very much work in Aruba.  And I was actually with John Silvetti that did the water search over there and Louis Schaefer who actually funded that thing last time I was with them just a couple of weeks ago and the Natalee Holloway case is one of them that we still have 140+ targets over there that we located with the sonar equipment, it’s one of those things that we do want to get over there and investigate every one of them with the ROV send it down some of that stuffs in 1100 feet of water.  And again it’s going to be an extremely expensive search upwards of a million and a half dollars and again there’s one irresponsible reporter out of Birmingham Alabama that reported that we already had that one and a half million dollars secured.  And it’s one of the things that just killed our donations..I mean just killed em.  We got emails and phone calls of people that had donated to us said how in the world can you spend one and a half million dollars on the Natalee Holloway case when we have all these missing persons cases over here.  Again it’s was not like that.   We don’t have ten cents secured for the Natalee Holloway case to go back to Aruba yet, it’s one of the things that Louis Schaefer is working on.  I know for a fact we will be back there someday.  I don’t think Fred Golba helped our relationship out over there in Aruba when he took his dog over there.  But I think we can mend all that stuff and move forward but I am certainly looking forward to the day when we get back over to Aruba continue that search and investigate every one of them objects that we’ve got out there in the sea.  See if we can pull off that miracle and get Natalee located.  Natalee is of course not priority right now and it’s because of funding and because of other cases we’ve got.  But I’m not going to say that she’s totally on the back burner neither. So you know it’s going to take another one of them miracles for Louis Schaefer to go ahead and generate the money and I know if anybody can do it it will be Louis Schaefer.  And when God blesses us with that then we’ll go over there and put every effort into seeing if by chance one of them objects is Natalee and we feel as though one of them are, we’ve just got to get the right one.

NBC.13

Natalee Holloway update: potential problems for search parties bound for Aruba
By Jen Hale
Reporter and weekend anchor
Published: March 25, 2009

Tensions are building between two search parties involved in the search for missing Mountain Brook teen Natalee Holloway.

Right now, private investigator Fred Golba is currently in Aruba, searching a retention pond.

Tim Miller and Texas EquuSearch are planning a deep water search on the ocean floor in the next few months.

They’ve raised $1.5 million dollars to go back to Aruba to finish a search that began last March, then stalled when funding ran out.

Underwater rovers will inspect suspicious containers on the ocean bottom that could hold Natalee’s remains.

“We still have 140 plus targets over there. We’re going to be bringing in a 360 ft boat from Trinidad,“ says Miller.

http://www.nbc13.com/vtm/news/local/article/natalee_holloway_update_potential_problems_for_search_parties_bound_for_aru/65265/


TEXAS EQUUSEARCH WEBSITE

Texas Equusearch Dispels Media Reports Concerning Natalle Holloway Case
Posted on 26. Mar, 2009 by Admin, TES in Featured Articles, Press Releases, TES News

Tim Miller of Texas EquuSearch is working hard to dispel media reports concerning the Natalee Holloway case.  Reports have surfaced today that Texas EquuSearch has collected $1.5 million to continue the search for Natalee, which is entirely untrue.

Also untrue is the report that Tim was traveling to Aruba with Fred Golba.  This has not been the first time that media has printed false reports regarding TES cases, to include the Caylee Anthony case.

This is the worst year financially for Texas EquuSearch since it began.  We are struggling on a daily basis to try to meet the needs of families across the country that are begging for help.  In these tough economic times, this false, irresponsible reporting could have a very negative impact on our ability to raise funds which go to serve families of the missing” said Miller.  “When the public hear that we have raised that large amount of money to dedicate to one search, they are not going to be willing to donate to our cause of finding missing people.  We are at a point of not being able to support the families that really need us, and when something like this happens, it is just devastating”. “We would not even attempt to raise that amount of money for just one case with so many families awaiting our help ...

http://texasequusearch.org/2009/03/hollowaycase/


EMAIL - JEN HALE

Subject: RE: NATALEE HOLLOWAY SEARCH
Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 23:43:48 -0400
From: JHale@wvtm.com
To:

Dear Janet,
 
I have indeed spoken with Tim about the announcement on his website. It is very odd --- as that information is exactly what he told me. I don't know if you are in the Birmingham area, but he did a phone interview with us where he laid out the search, the boat, the price tag and said it would all happen in the next few months. He told viewers that himself on our air. I am horribly sorry if that has hurt donations or caused large donors to pull back...which is why I have taken the article off of our website.  I have considered putting the whole phone interview on the internet to somehow vindicate myself so to speak, as I know people are upset ... but after speaking with Tim, he is convinced this whole thing has hurt donations, and I would never want to damage the chances of someone finding their loved one. I hope he will consider doing another interview and clarifying, but we'll just have to see how that turns out.
 
Thank you for your time and interest,
 
Warm Regards,
Jennifer Hale

HOLLOWAY: I identified myself and I was obviously stressed out at that moment. And the first thing he says "Well how much money you got?" It was like, like to (INAUDIBLE). My brothers looked around and couldn't believe it and then we finally settled down and went off in the back room.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,191377,00.html


HOW MUCH MONEY YOU GOT!


Aruba is draining the pockets of Dave Holloway as he listens to these Arubans with an agenda telling him his daughter's remains are in a pond and the witness saw Joran with mud on him. THEN Search the ocean some more!!!! WHAT FOR!

Common sense tells you that something was inside that one cage and no one bothered to get it except Arubans while Kyle ran off to sell the ROV images stateside!

So why go look at other cages? Makes no sense at all. But it will cost another million dollars to search the other 150 targets and hand over any evidence or bodies to the Arubans.

It is just another way for Arubans to drain the pockets of good American citizens asking for donations to hand over to a crew and it's owner that already showed they had no intention of doing the right thing and that was to make
sure that the ROV images and evidence was obtained and retained by U.S. Authorities and not Arubans!

Some one is paying these Arubans to sit on the boards and email Dave Holloway telling him he can get his daughter's remains if he pays more money and a select few American's are assisting them.

Oh Kermit, you are so on the money.  This is a "shakedown" and like you said it is all about draining money and putting Dave through the mill in the process.  I can only imagine who on that island is pulling this stunt.  May they rot in hell.

[jen3560]

O/T (well kinda)

http://www.gilligansisle.com/minnow.html

 

Now think about that connection for a minute, and all that it entails..................

Klein (Gesterkamp) bought the Gottenbos boat in 2005.

The Gottenbos boat that Natalee's family could never get an answer as to whether or not it was ever searched.

The Gottenbos boat that Sander put into play via his statement.

The Gottenbos boat that Joran put into play by his inclusion of Koen in his "alibi" for the night of the 30th.

The Gottenbos boat that scubajap (AKA Rosalie) went to such pains to insist had spun a prop and was out of commission on the night(s) in question - that Sander's statement contradicts.

The cell phone pings of Joran that put him at the dock in between the Mariott and the Holiday Inn the night of the 30th - when he said he was with Koen at the racquet club at that exact time (which he later admitted never happened).

The Gottenbos boat that many have ascertained as being the vehicle which disposed of Natalee's remains at sea.

The Freebird timeline that encompasses those beliefs and the supportive facts for them.

The Freebird timeline that Kyle told us was definitely looked at by Persistence before their search began.

The Freebird timeline that Kyle queried us on for more detail once the search began, and before they found the cage.

Now add in the SS Minnow (hee-hee) and his/her connection to Rosalie, his/her registration time at SM, and all of his/her actions AFTER Persistence was exposed.

Sorry that I can not provide the official proof, but I am quite sure that boat was search - but much later - not immediately as it should have been.

Hi Sleuth,

Can you give us a time frame on when it was searched?  And was it forensically searched?

TIA!

[jen3560]

Thank you Txmom.  That is my understanding as well.

Hi billb!

My understanding of the fundraiser in July that Beth is going to attend is a TES in general fundraiser, and not specifically for Natalee's search.  My understanding from Tim's statements on Dana's show is that Louis Schaefer is working on raising the funds for the second water search.  There wasn't a "we", or "they", from what I heard only him from my understanding.  It is all very confusing to me too, but I know that Beth has assisted TES in other searches for missing people, and I think that her cooperation with the July fundraiser is for the organization in general.  JMO

We don’t have ten cents secured for the Natalee Holloway case to go back to Aruba yet, it’s one of the things that Louis Schaefer is working on.

Natalee is of course not priority right now and it’s because of funding and because of other cases we’ve got.  But I’m not going to say that she’s totally on the back burner neither. So you know it’s going to take another one of them miracles for Louis Schaefer to go ahead and generate the money and I know if anybody can do it it will be Louis Schaefer.  And when God blesses us with that then we’ll go over there and put every effort into seeing if by chance one of them objects is Natalee and we feel as though one of them are, we’ve just got to get the right one.

This flyer is from the TES website:

http://texasequusearch.org/category/featured-articles/events/



This is the website of the location where the fundraiser will be held:

http://www.lancesturtleclub.net/
[/quote]

[jen3560]

HOLLOWAY: I identified myself and I was obviously stressed out at that moment. And the first thing he says "Well how much money you got?" It was like, like to (INAUDIBLE). My brothers looked around and couldn't believe it and then we finally settled down and went off in the back room.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,191377,00.html


HOW MUCH MONEY YOU GOT!


Aruba is draining the pockets of Dave Holloway as he listens to these Arubans with an agenda telling him his daughter's remains are in a pond and the witness saw Joran with mud on him. THEN Search the ocean some more!!!! WHAT FOR!

Common sense tells you that something was inside that one cage and no one bothered to get it except Arubans while Kyle ran off to sell the ROV images stateside!

So why go look at other cages? Makes no sense at all. But it will cost another million dollars to search the other 150 targets and hand over any evidence or bodies to the Arubans.

It is just another way for Arubans to drain the pockets of good American citizens asking for donations to hand over to a crew and it's owner that already showed they had no intention of doing the right thing and that was to make
sure that the ROV images and evidence was obtained and retained by U.S. Authorities and not Arubans!

Some one is paying these Arubans to sit on the boards and email Dave Holloway telling him he can get his daughter's remains if he pays more money and a select few American's are assisting them.

In addition to those common sense thoughts - how about these.

1 - Just WHAT WERE THEY DOING for 3 months in Aruba waters AFTER they already had the targets located?  Side scan sonar was completed within the first couple of weeks, and targets identified.  THE cage was the first ROV dive - and with good cause.

So.............after that ROV dive, if not exploring those other 150 targets with the ROV, WHAT WERE THEY DOING FOR 2.5 MORE MONTHS?????

Taking the advice of Dolphi Richardson - a member of the Aruban Dirty Police - to "look out in deeper waters" 

2 - Silvetti turned his back on THE cage, before the recovery dive took place.  And he got Tim Miller OFF THE BOAT before that could happen.

WHY??

As several good monkeys have pointed out - some answers need to be forthcoming from the Persistence crew and its benefactor.

How about an email to Tim Miller?  Short and sweet - include Kyle's ROV pictures from Jan 7th, and a few of his EXACT, NOT TAKEN OUT OF CONTEXT comments.

Asking Tim Miller to discuss this with John Silvetti AND KYLE - asking WHY there was no US law enforcement involved, WHY Silvetti gladly turned EVERYTHING (including inspection of the items recovered) over to the Arubans?

And how about an additional email to Tim detailing Schaefer's actions, and the class action suit, the SEC and IRS investigations - and now the filing against him for FRAUD.

Definitely NOT the actions of someone I would care to entrust with the safe recovery of my loved ones remains.

Oh - and one more question for Tim to ask Silvetti and Schaefer....................this forward momentum (started with a Dutch article quoting Silvetti ONLY about a new "search") wouldn't, by chance, have anything to do with the project offshore Aruba for which help wanted ads were placed in April for oil drilling/rigging vessels......................would it??

[Tamikosmom]

Tell us what you think, Debbie.

Okay... there was/is no conspiracy with the Persistence.  Louis, John, Tim and Dave are trying to get the funds to complete the search on the targets.... they are working together. 

Slam me, bash me, I don't care, but it is the truth.

Also... I think Klaas means SOUL, not sole.   

Considering Debbie's personal relationship with Dave and Robin Holloway as well as her connection with John Silvetti ... I believe her words.

When Kyle Kingsman's posts are considered regarding John Silvetti affording the enemy unchallenged possession of what may have been Natalee Holloway's remains ... inquiring minds want to know why Dave Holloway and Tim Miller are working together with Silvetti in the raising of funds for the purpose of investigating remaining targets.

Janet

+++++


ROBIN HOLLOWAY
December, 2007

Dave is currently on his way home to Meridian. Beth is on her way back also. They met with the KLPD and OM yesterday. I guess there is a miscommunication between interrogation and questioning. They had a lot of questions for Dave and Beth in efforts to help Natalee’s case and dispel a lot of nasty rumours. Also, Dave and Beth had a lot of questions for them too in regards to Natalee’s case. The meeting went well and they are working hard, but we don’t know what will happen next and pray this water search will turn up something.  As far as Julia, we have stayed in contact with her and she truly does care for Natalee and wants to know what happened to her as much as anyone else. Dave was able to meet with Mark for a little while last night while he was there and had a nice visit. It is good to know they are still there and willing to help. Please know they are still there too for Natalee ...

For now, waiting on Dave to get home and will watch the news or wait on that phone call to see what will happen next. It’s been a long two and a half years and never dreamed this much time would go by with no answers. Thanks to all of you for your continued support and for hanging in there with us. Thank you Debbie for coming to Meridian to hang out with the girls, Matt and me. I was a nervous wreck and glad you were able to make time for us this weekend. Brooke just got in from a playdate and was upset she didn’t get to say goodbye Sad I don’t think she realized you would be gone before she got home.

The boat should be in Aruba depending on the weather between Thurs and Saturday. Will keep you updated.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2409.msg311317#msg311317


THE RECOVERY DIVE

KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle Kingman:  For Jan 7th, Eduardo wasn't on the boat, neither were any media, Tim Miller, or Tim Trahan.

Kyle Kingman: The Persistence had no divers on the 7th. Tim Trahan was our diver on the 30th-Dec, but he was out of the country at the time. The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat.

Kyle Kingman: The Persistence had no divers on the 7th. Tim Trahan was our diver on the 30th-Dec, but he was out of the country at the time. The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat.

Kyle Kingman: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th

Kyle Kingman:  The bags were deliberately placed there after the divers sampled the contents. The bags were removed just after the ROV got out of the way when the divers took the samples to their boat.... and took off.

Kyle Kingman: The fabric(s?) are not visible on either the Dec 29th or 30th dives. There is about an inch of sand over the fabrics. The fabrics are completely covered. The diver sampled the sand and found the fabric underneath the sand. He then bagged the blue fabric. If the other bag contains fabric, it was also in the sand. There was also something possibly recovered from far inside the trap. In the video the diver is inside the trap with just below his knees showing.

Kyle Kingman: In my opinion, the blue fabric is quite possibly Natalee's skirt. The divers found the denim where I suggested a week earlier (Dec 29th) to Tim Miller that there was likely Natalee's denim skirt under the sand. Also in my opinion, the deni-like fabric is a match in terms of color, quantity, and structure to Natalee's skirt. It's not a lot of denim folded in the bag, but then again her skirt was rather small.

Kyle Kingman: I get done in the survey room backing up the ROV dive and head to the back deck to talk to the Polis divers and see what they sampled and see the Polis boat way in the distance heading away fast. John doesn't seem concerned at all, but I am very dissapointed, concerned, and burning inside because I have a feeling that I/we will never know what they took from the trap. That evening I talked to John asking when we plan on recovering the trap. Previously this was part of the talks and plan, but this time he doesn't seem concerned about ever looking into the trap further. After John verbally BASHED me about the trap for what I said to Tim Miller about the sand body-form and that I believed her skirt was under the sand, John pretty much committed himself to the belief the trap wasn't what we were after. This shocked me because it was exactly what we were looking for- a fish trap lost at sea with human remains.

Kyle Kingman:  I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it. The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap. From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography. I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE.

Kyle Kingman:  John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best.

[Magnolia]

The only reason that I can think that Dave and Tim are still even speaking to
Scheafer and Silvetti, is the hope that they can possibably get the remains
found in the trap turned over to them. 

I still wonder where those remains are now.

[Tamikosmom]

The only reason that I can think that Dave and Tim are still even speaking to
Scheafer and Silvetti, is the hope that they can possibably get the remains
found in the trap turned over to them. 

I still wonder where those remains are now.

private eye
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #746 4/4
« Reply #499 on: April 09, 2008, 12:39:50 AM »

If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. I am not sure if that was the protocol out of Aruba's waters though. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2769.msg372245;topicseen#msg372245

[bastibro]

Last nights Dana Pretzer segment with Tim Miller - the part where Tim talks about Natalee and going back to search in Aruba:

Click on the picture below, the audio/video is in photobucket:

WOW Thanks Klaas, I didn`t hear it yet!

You mind if I load it up to YT??

[Keepthefaith]

Tell us what you think, Debbie.

Okay... there was/is no conspiracy with the Persistence.  Louis, John, Tim and Dave are trying to get the funds to complete the search on the targets.... they are working together. 

Slam me, bash me, I don't care, but it is the truth.

Also... I think Klaas means SOUL, not sole.   

Louis E. Schaefer has plenty of MONEY to fund the search without even blinking an eye Debbie...Why don't you ask the shareholders of Superior Offshore,and or feel free to look up all of Superior Offshores SEC filings online.Louis has BIG,BIG money that he took from people.....

I would venture to say from reading the SEC filings that Schaefer has anywhere between 100/200 million dollars...You really don't need to look far to get 1.5 million dollars now do you?If Schaefer's heart was in the right place the search woulda been done long ago!

[Keepthefaith]

Tell us what you think, Debbie.

Okay... there was/is no conspiracy with the Persistence.  Louis, John, Tim and Dave are trying to get the funds to complete the search on the targets.... they are working together. 

Slam me, bash me, I don't care, but it is the truth.

Also... I think Klaas means SOUL, not sole.   

Louis E. Schaefer has plenty of MONEY to fund the search without even blinking an eye Debbie...Why don't you ask the shareholders of Superior Offshore,and or feel free to look up all of Superior Offshores SEC filings online.Louis has BIG,BIG money that he took from people.....

I would venture to say from reading the SEC filings that Schaefer has anywhere between 100/200 million dollars...You really don't need to look far to get 1.5 million dollars now do you?If Schaefer's heart was in the right place the search woulda been done long ago!

Let's honestly ask ourselves.With Schaefer & Silvetti working in the BILLION DOLLAR OIL INDUSTRY,as well as working & having GREAT relationships with these BILLION DOLLAR COMPANIES.How long would it take them to get 1.5 MILLION DOLLARS IN DONATIONS from the companies for such a great cause,let alone a GLOBAL NEWS story which would be great publicity for your company Globally or maybe not??Me thinks if they wanted to raise the money it would take NO LONGER THEN A WEEK...JMOO

[klaasend]

Last nights Dana Pretzer segment with Tim Miller - the part where Tim talks about Natalee and going back to search in Aruba:

Click on the picture below, the audio/video is in photobucket:

WOW Thanks Klaas, I didn`t hear it yet!

You mind if I load it up to YT??

Bastibro - I posted it in an open forum, do with it what you want.  Or, you could download the podcast and put something together yourself.   

[jen3560]

I don't think he's going to answer any questions about the original search, like Klaas said "his pocketbook won't allow it". 

Non disclosure agreement.

But I noticed he's expecting Schaefer to fund the next trip too.  Not holding my breath.   

was it this post from kyle here at SM that is making you think there was a non-disclosure agreement txmom?

Reply #820 on: November 23, 2008, 02:46:34 PM
 
Kermit,

First, I have NEVER threatened you.  The only thing I said to you is that I do not want to be sued by releasing information into the public that I was specifically told by OUR FBI as confidential. When I'm told not to comment by our FBI, I listen. You clearly do not understand this.

I made a mistake trusting you with so much as a greeting.  It was a gross misjudgement in character on my part. 

We all want the truth out in it's entirety.  The truth will be told by Beth in her terms when SHE feels ready.  It's not up to you or I. If you want the truth, ask BETH, not me.  Your answers will come from her.   

As for me, I stand by Natalee.   I'm sorry Kermit, my answer is NO.  This is my last post at SM
 
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4159.msg554523#msg554523
===========

Or is my brain mush because it's Friday.........and I'm not remembering something?

And if there WAS a confidentiality agreement - it certainly wasn't with the FBI, We all know the FBI wouldn't file civil suit against someone  for releasing information in a criminal investigation - they'd get hit with criminal charges of tampering or some such thin.

And second - Why, if there was nothing in that cage, would the FBI have told Kyle the information he gave them was confidential and not to discuss it?



3 -

[texasmom]

I don't think he's going to answer any questions about the original search, like Klaas said "his pocketbook won't allow it". 

Non disclosure agreement.

But I noticed he's expecting Schaefer to fund the next trip too.  Not holding my breath.   

was it this post from kyle here at SM that is making you think there was a non-disclosure agreement txmom?

Reply #820 on: November 23, 2008, 02:46:34 PM
 
Kermit,

First, I have NEVER threatened you.  The only thing I said to you is that I do not want to be sued by releasing information into the public that I was specifically told by OUR FBI as confidential. When I'm told not to comment by our FBI, I listen. You clearly do not understand this.

I made a mistake trusting you with so much as a greeting.  It was a gross misjudgement in character on my part. 

We all want the truth out in it's entirety.  The truth will be told by Beth in her terms when SHE feels ready.  It's not up to you or I. If you want the truth, ask BETH, not me.  Your answers will come from her.   

As for me, I stand by Natalee.   I'm sorry Kermit, my answer is NO.  This is my last post at SM
 
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4159.msg554523#msg554523
===========

Or is my brain mush because it's Friday.........and I'm not remembering something?

And if there WAS a confidentiality agreement - it certainly wasn't with the FBI, We all know the FBI wouldn't file civil suit against someone  for releasing information in a criminal investigation - they'd get hit with criminal charges of tampering or some such thin.

And second - Why, if there was nothing in that cage, would the FBI have told Kyle the information he gave them was confidential and not to discuss it?



3 -

No, I don't think that was it Jen.  I'm still flipping pancakes for my sons and some of their friends.  I'll look, and hopefully post what made me think that ASAP!

[Tamikosmom]

Let's honestly ask ourselves.With Schaefer & Silvetti working in the BILLION DOLLAR OIL INDUSTRY,as well as working & having GREAT relationships with these BILLION DOLLAR COMPANIES.How long would it take them to get 1.5 MILLION DOLLARS IN DONATIONS from the companies for such a great cause,let alone a GLOBAL NEWS story which would be great publicity for your company Globally or maybe not??Me thinks if they wanted to raise the money it would take NO LONGER THEN A WEEK...JMOO

Keepthefaith

Bottom line IMO.

According to Kyle Kingman's own words ... it appears that justice for Natalee Holloway was never John Silvetti's intentions.  Was there a mutually beneficial agreement with the enemy to further the Aruban coverup that had prevented justice from prevailing since May 30, 2005?

Kyle Kingman and Tim Miller were troubled with what all that they observed and heard on board the Persistence in regards in regards to the happenings encompassing the trap.  Nevertheless ... both these men remained silence while continuing a professional relationship with John Silvetti.

Janet

++++++++

1.  SOMETHING IS NOT RIGHT!

KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle Kingman:  I know Tim believed me and was convinced 100% which is why he went and told Dave that we found Natalee on Dec 29th. John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis to arrange the next dive -Dec 30th's which was the visual-only dive.

On the night of the 30th (I believe this was Tim's last night on the Persistence) I approached Tim and proposed some ideas to him. I suggested that we shouldn't take the Aruban Polis divers at their word and proceed with planning a recovery of the trap. Also, I proposed the trap site may not be pristine or the Polis may have already knew about it. This statement was backed up by several comments we heard, behavior we observed, and other things. Tim told me he thought I was right but didn't know what to do about it.

I hadn't slept in 48 hours. I crashed for a few hours rest and by the time I got up Dateline and Tim Miller had left the boat. That is when John assumed full control over the remainder of the project and had us searching in the deepest portions of our search area …


2.  JOHN SILVETTI

KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle Kingman:  John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best.


3.  KYLE KINGMAN

KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle Kingman: Sorry for dissapearing for so long. I've been traveling quite a bit to a few places, then to Norway, and am now in Cairo for about 5 weeks. I'll be headed to Lafayette when I get done in Egypt and will be in close contact with John then. I'll provide an update when I'm able. I hope you're all well.


Kingman Geophysical Solutions
Tuesday, July 15, 2008
Ormen Lange Excavation -North Sea, Norway

Ormen Lange deep sea pipeline excavation monitoring. Working in conjunction with Oceaneering, SRD, and Fugro Norway on board the Island Valiant. Magnum working class ROV and high-resolution multibeam sonar. StatoilHydro, AGR Drilling.

Posted by Kyle Kingman
http://geosolutions.blogspot.com/2008/07/ormen-lange-excavation-north-sea-norway.html


The Travels and Thoughts of Kyle Kingman
Through Skøyen Station - Norway, 12-July 2008
 
I called Knut Landstad, who was my point of contact in Oslo to let him know I was leaving the airport ...

The offshore project manager, John told me ....

Posted by Kyle Kingman

http://kylekingman.blogspot.com/2008/08/through-skyen-station-norway-12-july.html


The Travels and Thoughts of Kyle Kingman
Ulsteinvik to Cairo- 24-July

It’s 0200 hrs local time. Walking off the plane… “At least it’s not as hot as UAE”, I think to myself. “Please God; let my driver be waiting for me”. I was contacted about 12 hours earlier in Norway by a Dutch agent who needed me in Cairo ASAP and they were not afraid to pay a high price to get me here. All I know is there was to be a driver waiting for me. I don’t know who the client is, what the job is, what I’m doing in Egypt, or if I will even be staying in Egypt ...

Posted by Kyle Kingman

http://kylekingman.blogspot.com/2008/08/ulsteinvik-to-cairo-24-july.html


4.  TIM MILLER

TES - Donations

THE SEARCH FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY

Kyle Kingman – 02/15/08:  Although we have searched and ruled out an extensive portion of the original planned search area, a substantial portion of the high-probability area yet remains to be explored. Now, following a publicly confirmed admission that Natalee Holloway was disposed at sea, we are confident that completing the focused search area will bring closure. We therefore formally invite and request anyone who this humanitarian effort has touched to get involved and to help support the remaining search efforts. Donations are being handled by Texas Equusearch, a 501 (c) (3) nonprofit organization. Please come beside those who have already given so much to help ensure a proper funeral in Alabama for Natalee Holloway. Please make all donations marked as: "Holloway search".

To learn more about Texas Equusearch and to help support the search for Natalee Holloway, check out:

http://www.texasequusearch.org/donate.html

Texas EquuSearch Office:
4013 FM 517, Suite B
Dickinson, Texas 77539
P. O. Box 395, Dickinson, Texas 77539

Office: (281) 309-9500
Fax: (281) 534-6719
Toll Free: (877) 270-9500
Email:
donate@texasequusearch.org

Posted by Kyle Kingman
http://nholloway.blogspot.com/2008/02/support-effort.html


TES - Resources and Manpower

December 09, 2008

Tim Miller and John Silvetti from the Silvetti Group out of Louisiana, will be in Yankeetown, Florida to search for the two men missing since their plane lost radar contact with officials. Darien Peckham and Zachary Schlitt were headed to Vandenberg Airport, Tampa, Florida and never reached their destination. We will post more details regarding this search at a later date.
 
http://www.texasequusearch.org/


December 12, 2008

Texas EquuSearch was successful in locating the A&M Student, Chase Bergfeld. Our hearts and prayers go out to the family and friends of this young man. TES would like to thank John Silvetti and the Silvetti group from Louisiana and Dennis and Tammy Watters and also the Texas Parks and Wildlife personnel for their roles in helping Texas EquuSearch locate A&M Student, Chase Bergfeld.

http://texasequusearch.org/2009/01/bergfeld-chase-richland-chambers-reservoir-tx-missing-121308/


February 22, 2009

As of 10:15 pm, Texas EquuSearch has been joined in the search for Dr. Zella by the Silvetti Group and Legacy Offshore Divers & Construction Company, both out of Louisiana. We will continue searching tonight, as long as possible.

http://texasequusearch.org/2009/02/search-for-missing-kayaker-in-seabrook-tx-tes-needs-searchers/


February 24, 2009

On Monday, five different groups were using sonar equipment to scan the bottom of Clear Lake — League City, Nassau Bay, the Montgomery County Constable’s office and The Silvetti Group and Legacy Offshore Divers & Construction Co., both of Louisiana, Black said. Equusearch said the sonar teams and divers will work through most of Monday night.

“The winds have not let up on us to allow us to do anything much until now,” Black said Monday afternoon.

The search will continue on Tuesday beginning at 8 a.m. Volunteers are needed and encouraged to visit the command center located at the Clear Lake Park boat ramp on NASA Parkway in Seabrook.

At about 10:15 p.m. Sunday, the search team was joined by The Silvetti Group and Legacy arrived with divers, who began searching shortly thereafter and continued diving until about 5 a.m. Monday.

http://www.hcnonline.com/articles/2009/02/24/bay_area_citizen/news/2kayak26.txt

[Tamikosmom]

Kermit
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 -
« Reply #544 on: December 19, 2008, 06:52:12 PM »

PERHAPS KYLE VIOLATED THE COPYRIGHT HIMSELF

Kyle said: "She [BETH] needs to know exactly what we found in the proper timing. The way to do that would be through Tim Trahan and I. I can arrange any meeting with him. He represents the owner and the rights to the data, in this case, Louis S. I have everything but I don't want to go around him for chain of custody reasons, professional courtesy, and friendship."
 
The next step:

I will soon propose a meeting with Beth and other family members, myself, Tim Trahan, Peter DeVries, and whomever else necessary to go over the ROV video, contents, and case status. I would like a couple people very familiar with the case documents also present to help connect dots during the meeting. I would prefer meeting towards the end of April or mid-May to allow adequate time for things to shake themselves out if is going to. If necessary, I have an ABC (20/20) and CBS (early show) film crew ready and willing to take part in such a meeting should it require press coverage. I've already had a meeting with ABC about this and they are "definitely interested" at the executive level. We met in mid-Feb about this already. The question becomes timing, who needs to be there, and whether or not it's covered by the press. I prefer not, but it may be useful. DeVries doesn't need to be there in my opinion but he's good for ratings and helps ABC be cooperative if needed.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4246.msg592533;topicseen#msg592533

[Magnolia]

Thank you Txmom.  That is my understanding as well.

Hi billb!

My understanding of the fundraiser in July that Beth is going to attend is a TES in general fundraiser, and not specifically for Natalee's search.  My understanding from Tim's statements on Dana's show is that Louis Schaefer is working on raising the funds for the second water search.  There wasn't a "we", or "they", from what I heard only him from my understanding.  It is all very confusing to me too, but I know that Beth has assisted TES in other searches for missing people, and I think that her cooperation with the July fundraiser is for the organization in general.  JMO

We don’t have ten cents secured for the Natalee Holloway case to go back to Aruba yet, it’s one of the things that Louis Schaefer is working on.

Natalee is of course not priority right now and it’s because of funding and because of other cases we’ve got.  But I’m not going to say that she’s totally on the back burner neither. So you know it’s going to take another one of them miracles for Louis Schaefer to go ahead and generate the money and I know if anybody can do it it will be Louis Schaefer.  And when God blesses us with that then we’ll go over there and put every effort into seeing if by chance one of them objects is Natalee and we feel as though one of them are, we’ve just got to get the right one.

This flyer is from the TES website:

http://texasequusearch.org/category/featured-articles/events/



This is the website of the location where the fundraiser will be held:

http://www.lancesturtleclub.net/

[/quote]
















I'll bet Debbie is really busy correcting the spelling in that flyer.  Maybe she will email Tim her corrections.

[texasmom]

I don't think he's going to answer any questions about the original search, like Klaas said "his pocketbook won't allow it". 

Non disclosure agreement.

But I noticed he's expecting Schaefer to fund the next trip too.  Not holding my breath.   

was it this post from kyle here at SM that is making you think there was a non-disclosure agreement txmom?

Reply #820 on: November 23, 2008, 02:46:34 PM
 
Kermit,

First, I have NEVER threatened you.  The only thing I said to you is that I do not want to be sued by releasing information into the public that I was specifically told by OUR FBI as confidential. When I'm told not to comment by our FBI, I listen. You clearly do not understand this.

I made a mistake trusting you with so much as a greeting.  It was a gross misjudgement in character on my part. 

We all want the truth out in it's entirety.  The truth will be told by Beth in her terms when SHE feels ready.  It's not up to you or I. If you want the truth, ask BETH, not me.  Your answers will come from her.   

As for me, I stand by Natalee.   I'm sorry Kermit, my answer is NO.  This is my last post at SM
 
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4159.msg554523#msg554523
===========

Or is my brain mush because it's Friday.........and I'm not remembering something?

And if there WAS a confidentiality agreement - it certainly wasn't with the FBI, We all know the FBI wouldn't file civil suit against someone  for releasing information in a criminal investigation - they'd get hit with criminal charges of tampering or some such thin.

And second - Why, if there was nothing in that cage, would the FBI have told Kyle the information he gave them was confidential and not to discuss it?



3 -

No, I don't think that was it Jen.  I'm still flipping pancakes for my sons and some of their friends.  I'll look, and hopefully post what made me think that ASAP!

I've found this post by ldstlou so far, I know that this alone is not what I based my opinion on; I'm still looking.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4269.msg602628#msg602628

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #787 12/24/08 -
« Reply #290 on: December 29, 2008, 10:29:03 PM »

Two...Kyle had a confidentiality agreement with the ship he was on...the Persitence...which is standard, and one with the Freebirds which Kermit agreed to when she joined. Is his career affected by what Kermit did? Absolutely!!! Did he try and cover up the finding of Natalee? No!! And just like Beth and Dave and Jug walked away from Aruba feeling as though "something went wrong" so did Kyle. And it was because of that feeling he joined the Freebirds and openly discussed with other members his concerns.

[Tamikosmom]

Big fundraiser in July with Beth seems headed in the right direction...But needing a miracle from louis s is less than encouraging...My advice to Tim is if he wants God's blessing for future searches......go public to explain what he said during the dateline tappings......It means something, or it doesn't........explanation is required if I am going to donate again.....

My position exactly.

I am though donating to charities that take a stand that accountability should not be expected.  In other words ... I am expected to "trust".

If it had not been for Kyle Kingman's own words ... we all would be in the dark in regards to John Silvetti affording sole possession of what may have been Natalee Holloway's remains to the enemy ... the enemy who has had a coverup agenda that has prevented justice from prevailing for Natalee Holloway since May 30, 2005.

Janet

[Tamikosmom]

CONFIDENTIALITY AGREEMENT


KYLE KINGMAN - EMAIL TO JUG TWITTY AND IDSTLOU

ldstlou
Re: The Cage « Reply #157 on: March 19, 2009, 12:25:09 pm »

The last posts are taken from the e-mail that Kyle sent to Jug and I in December

Kyle Kingman:  I didn't threaten any of them. I said that I personally didn't want to get sued for breaking a confidentiality agreement with information ending up on the Internet. Them pushing it all out put me at risk legally and jeopardized my relationship with John (which is now destroyed over this). Also, this information did not belong posted on the Internet in the first place. It was a huge naive misjudgement on my part to trust this group enough to share it in confidence.

http://goldmonkey.org/index.php?topic=980.msg12191#msg12191


KYLE KINGMAN - EMAIL TO KERMIT

Kermit
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 -
« Reply #540 on: December 19, 2008, 06:15:18 PM »

Kyle sent me this today[/b]

Kermit,
 
You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB.  Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted.  Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly.  You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum.  The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case.

I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding:
I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired.

I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record.  Birmingham is not the office in charge.
 
The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee.
 
I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed.
 
I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited.   I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet.  Kermit doesn't matter".

So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case.  I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top.
 
Sincerely,
 Kyle

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4246.msg592482;topicseen#msg592482

[texasmom]

Jen,
I've got some other things I need to do.  It seems like there was a discussion about why other crew members haven't come forward with any questions regarding the search; and maybe that's another area where an agreement for all crew members may have been mentioned.  I will look more later.

It's a beautiful day here today!