Natalee Case Discussion #820 6/10/09 - 7/13/09

[texasmom]

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_58101.php

Google translation:

Aruba

Kitesurfing in the dark

15 Jun, 2009, 13:25 (GMT -04:00)



 
ORANGE CITY - Before an enthusiastic audience, last weekend to the beach at Fisherman's Hut had come, let Aruba's best kite surfers show their skills during the event Night Riders. It was the first time that such an event was held, complete with large lights on the water-oriented, food, drink and music including DJ Jeroen and Theo Sanders. The surfers themselves took everything from the closet. One by one they flew a few meters away from the public in the air. A few are persuaded kite with fluorescent lights, another was a spectator along on his back. The water had organizer Red Bull floating platforms and rails placed from or to be blown by the kite surfers, but they were hardly used.

[texasmom]

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/9729/5/

Papiamentu translation:

navy y guarda costa is practica cu fragata venezolano



monday, 15 june 2009 - 16:06

unidadnan of navy regal y guarda costa of antiyas y aruba is practicando the week here together cu venezuela in one practica bilateral “venhol” y practicanan of guarda costa “open eyes.” click read more for more info... during the “venhol”, have enfasis on practicanan maritime. so the barco hr.ms. van amstel (f-831) y the fragata venezolano general soublette (f-24) is practicando they competencianan on territory of maniobra, operacionnan of helicopter y defenza aereo. for haci the cooperacion more soepel, was have intercambio of oficialnan liaison. at the same instant is tumando lugar the practicanan of guarda costa “open eyes”. in this they're haci various maniobranan maritimo y aereo, caminda the kustwachtcutter jaguar y the botonan of patrol venezolano freedom (pc-14) y tripulacion (pg-409), is participa in various scenario. the enfasis is stay here on “search and rescue”. at the practicanan also owing to participa unidadnan of citro y sarfa. the unidad venezolano owing to arrive diahuebs afternoon curaçao y owing to ancra at nieuwe werf. come across

[texasmom]

What I gather is that someone else must have represented themselves at a function as being in the position that Eric "the Brute Boss" Brete holds.  I think that picture is from when he went off on Hero Brinkman.  He just wants to make sure everyone KNOWS "who's the boss" of protocol.

 

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/9726/5/




the unique person in the apparatus gubernamental cu have the funcion of boss of protocol is sr. eric brete

monday, 15 june 2009 - 14:17

ultimo time we can owing to constata cu frecuentemente several instancia gubernamental y another organisacion in comunidad - at instant cu they organisa one evento or actividad protocolar - is declara cu they owing to wordo asesora for her boss of protocol of gobierno. click read more for more info... among another this was the caso of the forum cu did take lugar diadomingo night at seaport conference center. sinembargo buscando more informacion we owing to comprende cu have cierto empleadonan publico cu is give they self the titulo of boss of protocol of gobierno, siendo cu this not t’asina. without doubt some, this is peca contra all the regulation y leynan existente cu is rigi the organisacion in the apparatus gubernamental. for less y evita cualkier confusion we wanted informa all comunidad cu the unique person cu have the funcion oficial of boss of protocol of gobierno is sr. eric brete y this by of 2001. is pesey let we all as give the good ehempel y respeta cada person for her funcion cu the is cubri. come across

[texasmom]

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/9728/5/#jc_allComments

Papiamentu translation:




ambassador dutch at washington close governor

monday, 15 june 2009 - 15:10 in cuadro of one visit of cortesia, governor fredis refunjol, owing to ricibi visit of the ambassador dutch at washington madam r. jones-bos.e ambassador was acompaña for ministro plenipotenciario of aruba at washington madam j.heronimo-croes.durante his estadia at aruba madam jones-bos in his calidad because; ambassador dutch at washington will sostene various meeting y will visit several instancia social, cultural, comercial. servicio informativo of gobierno. come across

[texasmom]

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/9724/5/

Papiamentu translation:



valero will descend plant mey mey of july

monday, 15 june 2009 - 13:28

according valero energy corp owing to tell monday, the will schuif the bahamento of plant temporario of the refineria at aruba for of end of june till cu mey mey of july. click read more for more info... according bill day, vocero of valero energy corp, now they're planeando for cuminza at comienzo y termina mey mey of july. then, as cu already we owing to anuncia end, for motibonan of crisis mundial, y despite cu decision did take lugar for descend plant already at end of the month here, this will bay take lugar mediano of july for one period of three month till cu so far. 24ora.com will stay pendiente of more news if provided that caso will bay have more cambio. come across

[Tamikosmom]

My prayer is that Kyle Kingman and Tim Miller do what is right and reveal the truth from their perspective in regards to the the happenings encompassing the trap ... a perspective that was initially very troubling to BOTH of them.

I would assume that Tim Miller shared his concerns encompassing the trap with Dave Holloway while they were following up on the Nicaragua tip immediately following the December 30, 2007 visual dive.  When you consider that Tim Miller was 99.9% convinced that Natalee Holloway's remains were in that trap ... logic dictates that the topic would have had to come up .

This is the reason I cannot comprehend why Dave Holloway have put John Silvetti in touch with the "head of the Hotel Association" ... the enemy ... if he had been aware of Tim Miller's concerns or ... did Dave have faith in the Arubans to do the right thing ... the Aruban who had prevented justice from prevailing since May 30, 2005.

 
 
Janet

+++++++
 
KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

I requested all samples to be brought on board the Persistence for visual and top-side photographs. It was ignored by the project lead (John S.) who felt the Arubans would follow whatever they needed to do as far as proper protocol.

Kyle Kingman:  I suggested that we shouldn't take the Aruban Polis divers at their word and proceed with planning a recovery of the trap. Also, I proposed the trap site may not be pristine or the Polis may have already knew about it. This statement was backed up by several comments we heard, behavior we observed, and other things. Tim told me he thought I was right but didn't know what to do about

Kyle Kingman:  Tim Miller was never on the Persistence while I was not on board.  He stepped off on or about the 1st of Jan to follow up on the false lead in Costa Rica IIRC.


JOHN SILVETTI - IN HIS OWN WORDS

jdsurveyor1 Newbie Posts: 11
John Silvetti, the Persistence and the Search for Natalee «
Reply #13 on: April 03, 2008, 07:52:13 PM »

The important thing is to raise funds. It will require corporate support as well as private donations. Dave and Beth have been doing a great job getting the word out and while I was on the island, Dave put me in contact with the head of the Hotel Association who is working on raising a sizeable amount ...

http://blogsfornatalee.com/forum/index.php?topic=8476.msg334979#msg334979


BETH HOLLOWAY - IN HER OWN WORDS

Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 158:  . The Aruban Tourism Authority (ATA), the Aruba Hotel and Tourism Association (AHATA), the Aruba Trade and Industry Association and a scattering of island officials establish the Strategic Communications Task Force to combat the negative media. And to combat us.

[texasmom]

I guess if they just cruise on by Aruba in their yachts, the following may be true!

 

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/9722/6/



msnbc: aruba one of the destinacionan of more "safe" at world

monday, 15 june 2009 - 12:18

recientemente msnbc owing to make one reportahe on the destinacionan of more assure rond world. the medio of comunicacion is informa cu despite of the caso big of natalee holloway at aruba, the islands abc is one of the lugarnan of more assure for viaha. the stadisticanan is talk cla. level of crimen contra tourist is abow, instabilidad politico casi do not take lugar y the islands is situa mucho south for one horcan. aruba was the unique island cu the haja one "perfect score" in one the encuesta of turism of yacht. click read more for more detayes. for can owing to make the investigacion here msnbc owing to compila several dato of "u.s state department" encuanto crimen contra ciudadanonan mericano in exterior y also owing to analisa the ultimo relato of united nations. come across

[texasmom]

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/9714/18/

Papiamentu translation:

while cu gobierno is reforza reglanan of imigracion, ehecutivonan of valero is wash hand

monday, 15 june 2009 - 10:23

during the conferencia of prensa semanal of avp owing to elabora at one as very amplio for thing is deal the polemica of valero. is menciona cu at instant cu prijs of productonan follow lever on market internacional, bbo is cause cu the overall of the refineria cu have cu pay will aumenta. click read more for more info... the compania here all esunnan cu know of refineria, do you have to bay inverti in the refineria at aruba if do you wanted mantene for some year more. inversionnan is on 5 biyon. ehecutivonan of valero is come aruba y wanted inverti, but gobierno does not owing to sit at table. also they wanted owing to try of perhudica door of enforza the same reglanan cu they owing to impone of imigracion y is haci cu the refineria have to owing to canela several turn around y ehecutivonan is wash hand for thing tat rata aruba. this is one of the motibonan cu owing to place refineria for sale. today we can see cu owing to enter aruba thing owing to pronostica, cu are you see one nel oduber, first minister of aruba, is sit at merca is try of acusa everybody but is forget cu his maneho is cause of thing aruba is pasando in dje. we have one crisis economic, according sr. de meza, but mature is cu the gobierno here is place aruba in one situation precario cu is cause cu have one situation so. this is haci cu aruba is become onaantrekkelijk for inversionistanan big because not have stabilidad fiscal neither politico. come across

[Tamikosmom]

The following article implies that Tim Miller and Dave Holloway were involved from the getgo in the planning stages of the search in Aruban waters for the remains of Natalee Holloway.

Considering Dave Holloway and Tim Miller's indepth knowledge of the dynamics encompassing the Aruban coverup ... I cannot comprehend why these two men would be participants of such a huge undertaking without assurance that there would be an FBI presence if anything that appeared to be case related was discovered.  Allowing the enemy unchallenged sole possession does not make sense.

How many who sacrificially donated to the Persistence undertaking would have done so if they were aware that the the enemy would have full control of any find that deemed significant.  I know I would not.  Why?  Private Eye said it best ...

Janet

++++++++

THE BEGINNING -

From here to Aruba
BY JEFF MOORE, THE DAILY IBERIAN
Published/Last Modified on Thursday, November 29, 2007 12:37 PM CST

John Silvetti said his company became involved in the search after he was contacted by Louis Schaefer, chairman of Superior Offshore International. Schaefer had been approached by Texas Equusearch, a non-profit organization that has been searching for Holloway for more than two years.

Schaefer asked Silvetti if he could provide the survey personnel and the geophysical equipment required for the search. After spending a weekend with Schaefer and Pam and Dave Holloway, Silvetti agreed.

“It ripped my heart out to hear them say that right now all they’re looking for is to have a funeral in Alabama,” Silvetti said. “What do you say to someone like that?”

http://www.iberianet.com/articles/2007/11/29/news/news/news00.txt


NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S UNCLE - THE GAME WAS FIXED

private eye
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #746 4/4
« Reply #499 on: April 09, 2008, 12:39:50 AM »

If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. I am not sure if that was the protocol out of Aruba's waters though. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2769.msg372245;topicseen#msg372245


KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle Kingman:  15:46 I get done in the survey room backing up the ROV dive and head to the back deck to talk to the Polis divers and see what they sampled and see the Polis boat way in the distance heading away fast. John doesn't seem concerned at all, but I am very dissapointed, concerned, and burning inside because I have a feeling that I/we will never know what they took from the trap.

That evening I talked to John asking when we plan on recovering the trap. Previously this was part of the talks and plan, but this time he doesn't seem concerned about ever looking into the trap further.

After John verbally BASHED me about the trap for what I said to Tim Miller about the sand body-form and that I believed her skirt was under the sand, John pretty much committed himself to the belief the trap wasn't what we were after. This shocked me because it was exactly what we were looking for- a fish trap lost at sea with human remains...hmm.

[Tamikosmom]

I guess if they just cruise on by Aruba in their yachts, the following may be true!

 

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/9722/6/



msnbc: aruba one of the destinacionan of more "safe" at world

monday, 15 june 2009 - 12:18

recientemente msnbc owing to make one reportahe on the destinacionan of more assure rond world. the medio of comunicacion is informa cu despite of the caso big of natalee holloway at aruba, the islands abc is one of the lugarnan of more assure for viaha. the stadisticanan is talk cla. level of crimen contra tourist is abow, instabilidad politico casi do not take lugar y the islands is situa mucho south for one horcan. aruba was the unique island cu the haja one "perfect score" in one the encuesta of turism of yacht. click read more for more detayes. for can owing to make the investigacion here msnbc owing to compila several dato of "u.s state department" encuanto crimen contra ciudadanonan mericano in exterior y also owing to analisa the ultimo relato of united nations. come across

Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway

Pages 209/210:  Bad things happen everywhere.  But the difference we need to consider when something bad happens outside the country is the help available for the victims and their families.  When we leave these borders, we leave behind all the privileges and rights we're all accustomed to and often take for granted.  We have expectations that there will be a safety net of law-abiding official, no matter where we travel, or that our US embassy will come to our rescue.  But that's terribly naive ...

[Tamikosmom]

What frustrates me no end is that those who should have known better ... those who were well aware of the dynamics encompassing the Aruba coverup ... failed to impliment a plan necessary to protect Natalee Holloway's remains from being destroyed by the enemy.

The entire Persitence undertaking was for naught if the plan was to allow the Arubans unchallenged control.  Could it be that bringing Natalee Holloway home was never the objective.

Janet

+++++++


LOGIC DICTATES!

private eye
Discussion #742 3/10 -
« Reply #686 on: March 13, 2008, 06:38:07 PM »

... regardless of how hard working the man that they are working with appears to work, his work belongs to Rudy, and Rudy belongs to the local dutch.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2689.msg364750#msg364750


KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle Kingman - 06/13/08:  John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best.

[Tamikosmom]

JUSTICE FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY NEVER STOOD A CHANCE!!

[Tamikosmom]

Blue Moon!!!

Any updates?  I will go to the Prayer thread.

Janet

[texasmom]

Good Morning Monkeys

Behinds the scenes ... I am in the process of compiling with assistance a rather large document that questions the actions of the following persons who each has a connection to the Persistence endeavor ... who I sincerely believe ... intentionally or unintentionally ... played a role in the furthering the Aruban coverup agenda.

1.  John Silvetti
2.  Louis Schaefer
3.  Tim Trahan
4.  Kyle Kingman
5.  Tim Miller
6.  Dave Holloway
7.  Eduardo Mansur

Considering the lack of like-minded responses from Monkeys on THIS forum to my backup posts ... I have come to the conclusion that I am ... for the most part ... in the minority in regards to this topic being "fully" explored but ... I am compelled to following my heart.

It is my prayer that that one of the above listed persons will be the catalyst who will bring closure to the mother of Natalee Holloway by revealing the truth.

I will share when the document is completed.

Janet
10:55 AM PT

++++++++




Credit: Klaas

Janet,

I don't know what you expect us to do.  I cannot accuse Tim Miller nor most especially Dave Holloway of intentionally furthering the Aruban coverup.

My thought is that both were estatic that Louis Schaefer was willing to FUND the Persistence mission in the beginning.  The mere cost of such an undertaking would be overwhelming for anyone that hoped such a mission could be launched in search of a loved one.  Tim Miller knows better than anyone how many individual donations and even corporate donations it would take to make such a mission possible.  YES...somewhere along the way that changed and TES was used to raise funds for it. 

Dave Holloway nor Tim Miller OWNED THE PERSISTENCE, which left John Silvetti to make the decision on where the boat was docked; and other decisions regarding the boat....WHO WAS ON BOARD....AND THE ACTIVITIES OF THE CREW.

My thought is that both Dave Holloway and Tim Miller TRUSTED those they were working with on the endeavor, and BELIEVED that these men were dedicated to helping this family.  I don't believe that Tim Miller nor Dave Holloway would have ever EVEN IMAGINED that these men that THEY considered American Heroes would ever even consider doing anything that would compromise the ultimate goal....FINDING NATALEE AND BRINGING HER HOME.  Yes, Tim Miller SHOULD HAVE BEEN THERE when any samples were taken, I believe the timing of that was deliberate so that he wasn't there.

In MY OPINION at the point that Dave Holloway was informed that a large amount of money was needed or the mission would be over; he put John Silvetti in contact with the AHATA representative because he believed that with the prospect of Natalee's remains being found by the Persistence, AHATA should and would be willing to make a large contribution toward that effort.  Think about it...IF Natalee's remains had been recovered by the Persistence, and returned home where she belongs...IT WOULD HAVE BEEN MEGA HUGE NEWS!  Wouldn't AHATA want to be able to say that they made a large contribution to that effort?  There would still be the matter of NO JUSTICE FOR NATALEE, but her being returned home where she belongs...and AHATA helping make that possible would have been a very positive mark for AHATA in the minds of many Americans and people all over the world that have followed this case. 

Hindsight is always 20/20 Janet, and if Dave Holloway and Tim Miller are guilty of anything...it was TRUSTING THE WRONG PEOPLE TO DO THE RIGHT THING.  AGAIN.   

As far as the working relationship Tim Miller has with them now, I have no idea other than the possibilities I've stated previously which are pure speculation.

JMO

[texasmom]

I am retreating to the safety of my own private hidey hole. 

[MuffyBee]

I am retreating to the safety of my own private hidey hole. 

I liked your post Texasmom.  Is there room in your hidey hole for a bee?

[texasmom]

I am retreating to the safety of my own private hidey hole. 

I liked your post Texasmom.  Is there room in your hidey hole for a bee?

Thanks MuffyBee!  There's always room for you...as long as you leave your stinger here!   

Thank you for asking, it prevented me from making a post that I probably would have wanted to take back.

 

[Blue Moon]

Janet I posted an update last night in prayer thread.  Today is even better, tomorrow is on to a rehab center and then home from there.  Much better spirits today and can move her arm a little bit today.  One day at a time.

Janet, I just don't know what to say about Tim and Dave other than I honestly do not believe they had anything to do with this coverup except for the fact they were naive and being used.  Used by AHATA, Aruba, and the ALE and finally by the crew of the Persistence.  Dave, to me, is very naive and wanted with all his heart to believe these people in Aruba could and would help him find his baby girl.  They didn't and all I can hope for for him now is it has gone on too long and now is the time to stand strong and against this corrupt island and tell it like it is.  Aruba WILL NEVER give justice for Natalee. 

All I can say at the moment is I am here foremost for Natalee and I pray a hero will rescue her and bring her home to her family.  I will stand beside Beth through it all for that very reason.  There has to be one honest person on that island who will do the right thing for Natalee and her family but I do know who that person/persons are not-AHATA, the Dutch elite, Julia R., Mark P., and so on and so on.  Precious time was wasted by believing in these scrums.  They did not care for Natalee and they really did not care for Natalee's mother--she told it like it is.  They did not like that.

Tim Miller will allow people to use him and vice versus if it helps him bring one more son/daughter/mother/father home to their families.  In my heart I believe Tim knew what he saw and that will forever haunt him just as finding the remains of his daughter did.  He knew then, he knows now.  JMO

[Tamikosmom]

Monkeys

I am a believer in Kyle Kingman's own words that exposed John Silvetti's participation with the Arubans in the finale to the coverup agenda that has prevented justice for Natalee Holloway from prevailing since the morning of May 30, 2005.

When I scan the OIL & GAS PIPELINE INFO Thread ... it is obvious that Monkeys believe that the John Silvetti betrayal must be researched and exposed in the the name of justice of Natalee Holloway.  Although I feel completely out of the loop in this effort ... I support it 100% nevertheless.

On the other hand ... I am a believer that those who are personally aware of the John Silvetti betrayal ... but choose to remain silent while continuing a professional relationship with Silvetti ... are also participants in the Aruban coverup.

Justice for Natalee Holloway will always be my focus and ... those who deter this objective will not be given a free pass no matter who they are ... Kyle Kingman or Tim Miller.

Janet

++++++


Kyle Kingman:
1.  Internet posts reveal that Kyle was troubled by the events encompassing the contents of the trap
2.  Kyle backtracks
3.  Kyle has an on-going professional relationship with John Silvetti (Norway/Egypt).


Tim Miller:
1.  According to Kyle Kingman's own words it is revealed that Tim Miller was troubled by the events encompassing the contents of the trap
2.  Tim is silent.
3.  Tim has an on-going professional relationship with John Silvetti (TES).


KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle Kingman:   On the night of the 30th (I believe this was Tim's last night on the Persistence) I approached Tim and proposed some ideas to him. I suggested that we shouldn't take the Aruban Polis divers at their word and proceed with planning a recovery of the trap. Also, I proposed the trap site may not be pristine or the Polis may have already knew about it. This statement was backed up by several comments we heard, behavior we observed, and other things. Tim told me he thought I was right but didn't know what to do about it

[MuffyBee]

I am retreating to the safety of my own private hidey hole. 

I liked your post Texasmom.  Is there room in your hidey hole for a bee?

Thanks MuffyBee!  There's always room for you...as long as you leave your stinger here!   

Thank you for asking, it prevented me from making a post that I probably would have wanted to take back.

 

Rant warning:

Texasmom, neither you nor I should want to take back what is in our hearts.  I don't know all the details of what went on during certain times on the Persistence.  Unless a person was there, they wouldn't know.  In my heart and mind, there is absolutely no comparison of Tim Miller and Kyle as men.  So there is no reason to lump them together.  I keep reading about the silence of Tim Miller because Janet sent him an email and he hasn't answered it.  I don't know why he hasn't answered it. He may or may not have even gotten it.   But Tim Miller is not accountable to answer emails from people he doesn't even know about a very tender subject.  Because he doesn't answer Janet does not make him guilty of anything in any way, shape or form of anything.  I have even seen it posted that maybe Tim Miller would have acted differently if it had been HIS daughter missing instead of Natalee.  I think that's just wrong.  Tim Miller's record stands for itself.  It hasn't been about personal financial gain for him nor being famous.  Far from it.  No one gets a free pass, but on the other hand I don't think anyone should smear Tim Miller's name and efforts here.  If one of my loved ones went missing, I would hope Tim Miller and TES would come to my aid.  No free pass, not wrong to ask questions, but very wrong to make ASS-umptions and keep repeating them over and over, when I don't see evidence.  Some may have suspicions but I don't see tangible evidence of Tim Miller purposefully doing wrong.  I am tired of seeing Tim Miller hung out here to dry.  What is it? An ego problem because Tim hasn't answered an email?  Who are you that Tim MUST answer to your email or faith your wrath and your assumptions?  I stand with the girl.  And I stand with Tim Miller.  Muffy