Lively Case Discussion 541a 11/7 - 11/11/2006

[sharon]

It is self defense if it really happened the way Sander is explaining it.  I don't believe it happened that way.  I believe that Joran was showing off in front of his friends and wanted to be a tough guy and naturally he picked on the weak again and did harm.  I don't see Joran running to the police because some bum was bothering him.  There is another side to this story.  Why would would the cops bring up a story like this to Sander unless it is known on the island what Joran did.  Once again this is probably the reason Joran was seeking psychiatric help.

But where is Satish's statement about this?

He tell Joran in the police car conversation that he told the police about the 'choller'.

In which statement??

How much you want to bet that statement disappeared.

That's my guess, San. Along with Joran's. Along with the missing pages from Paulus. Along with Freddy's.

I guess if there are any more statements coming, klaas will give us a heads up.

[dkpen]

It's a sad day when everyone else has to do the Aruba police job and detective work on this case. Especially Beth and Dave having to do most of it on their own in Aruba.
ALE and Officials just don't care. It's how they keep their illusion of "One Happy Island".

[Peaches]

Wilhelmina Park Bridge:

It looks likes someone would get hurt falling off that bridge.

If that is a dry creek bed, somebody could get hurt.

[dkpen]

Wilhelmina Park Bridge:

It looks likes someone would get hurt falling off that bridge.

If that is a dry creek bed, somebody could get hurt.

I see water on the other side of the bridge and it looks to be pretty high. Would not be a far drop into the water if pushed over. IMO

Does not make it right though. If there are rocks below or logs, the bum could of hit its head or broke a bone ect. Kids don't think of those kinds of things until after they react.

[klaasend]

Excerpt from the police tape - posted by jehnifer on the SM front page:

About DeVries’ investigation of suspect throwing someone over a bridge…

D says to J: You know very well, you’re always trying to come between us.
J says to D: Then you’re going to start talking shit about the choller (drug addict).
J says to D: My friend, it was me that helped you with that shit / the matter of the choller.
D says to J: I said that too.
J says to D: I didn’t read that, I also read the declaration.
S says to J: The thing about the choller was from me.
D or S says to J: That’s what I just said.
D or S says to J: I also said that in my first declaration. I did that for myself.

[Peaches]

I must be goin over the edge.  I just looked at the pics posted by Carpe on the FP.  

I see a figure.  In a fetal position.  I've  looked at lots of his pics and never before have I really seen what I was supposed to see.  The pic I viewed, I  saw a figure but it wasn't what had been labeled on that pic.  Does that make sense?

I'm going to need a cocktail.  Soon.

[klaasend]

I must be goin over the edge.  I just looked at the pics posted by Carpe on the FP.  

I see a figure.  In a fetal position.  I've  looked at lots of his pics and never before have I really seen what I was supposed to see.  The pic I viewed, I  saw a figure but it wasn't what had been labeled on that pic.  Does that make sense?

I'm going to need a cocktail.  Soon.

Can you "right mouse click" and copy that link..paste it in here?  He has so many shots I wouldn't begin to know where to look.

[Peaches]

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g130/arubapictures1/?action=view&current=mmmm5i.png


You'll need to re-size this bad boy.

[klaasend]

http://s55.photobucket.com/albums/g130/arubapictures1/?action=view&current=mmmm5i.png


You'll need to re-size this bad boy.

Thanks Peaches.  I do know that a series of screen captures from this video has gone to the FBI for review.  I really don't see a body but I know many do.  To me it's more likely there is clothing and such in that bag, possibly evidence.  Again...I could very well be wrong and it is a body.

[friend of monkeys]

stupis q...from stupid monkey...who is Devries por favor??

tytyty

hi KLASS

  U Rock!

[Peaches]

I hear four woofers.  Must be chow time.

Nite all.

[klaasend]

stupis q...from stupid monkey...who is Devries por favor??

tytyty

hi KLASS

  U Rock!

He's an investigator in the Netherlands that has his own show.  He's working on the Natalee Holloway case right now and is currently in Aruba digging up information.  

http://www.peterrdevries.nl/

[Shizaru]

Bolded portion added to the TL:

According to message board posts by Aruban reporter/Joran supporter "Glenda", sometime on Saturday a girl later identified as Natalee by the FBI is captured on tape at a jewelry store in the Wyndham hotel, arguing with an unidentified male. Reportedly, the male wanted to purchase an item of jewelry, she insisted on purchasing it herself, they then took their argument outside the store. A civil filing by Joran's lawyer Joe Tacopina states as fact that the girl on the tape is Natalee. However according to a reliable personal source, as of the time this tape's existence was first made public in April 2006, Aruban polis had not recieved any information from the FBI regarding an identification of Natalee on the tape. Nor did polis have a copy of the tape, which allegedly was given directly to an FBI agent staying in the hotel, by the store manager (Tacopina 4/25/06 civil filing, "Glenda" 6/14, 7/11 postings).

Also klaasend I have updated the TL again

Besides adding another dozen or so entries I have moved some things around, for example the information from Natalee's friends' affadavits is now located under the entry for civil filing date

[dkpen]

I wish Devries would look into Amy Bradley's case as well. Look closely at Steve Croes connection and his relationship to BlueOrchid member "Yellow", and why he was on the cruiseship and Curacao.

[Shizaru]

Roger or whatever his name is reopening with Shizaru as the mod.
That could get interesting. Medley is so excited ! ! Does she tend to gush or am I just strange ?

It's my understanding that SHIZARU is taking over the forum completely as Administrator.  I don't think Roger is going to be involved at all.

Just tech support.

[klaasend]

Bolded portion added to the TL:

According to message board posts by Aruban reporter/Joran supporter "Glenda", sometime on Saturday a girl later identified as Natalee by the FBI is captured on tape at a jewelry store in the Wyndham hotel, arguing with an unidentified male. Reportedly, the male wanted to purchase an item of jewelry, she insisted on purchasing it herself, they then took their argument outside the store. A civil filing by Joran's lawyer Joe Tacopina states as fact that the girl on the tape is Natalee. However according to a reliable personal source, as of the time this tape's existence was first made public in April 2006, Aruban polis had not recieved any information from the FBI regarding an identification of Natalee on the tape. Nor did polis have a copy of the tape, which allegedly was given directly to an FBI agent staying in the hotel, by the store manager (Tacopina 4/25/06 civil filing, "Glenda" 6/14, 7/11 postings).

Also klaasend I have updated the TL again

Besides adding another dozen or so entries I have moved some things around, for example the information from Natalee's friends' affadavits is now located under the entry for civil filing date

Shizaru - thanks, I'll take care of it right away!

[klaasend]

I wish Devries would look into Amy Bradley's case as well. Look closely at Steve Croes connection and his relationship to BlueOrchid member "Yellow", and why he was on the cruiseship and Curacao.

DKPen - there is a link to contact De Vries at his website.  Why don't you contact him with your wishes?

[LilPuma]

It's a sad day when everyone else has to do the Aruba police job and detective work on this case. Especially Beth and Dave having to do most of it on their own in Aruba.
ALE and Officials just don't care. It's how they keep their illusion of "One Happy Island".

I'm hoping that de Vries' investigation will put a bit of pressure on the Dutch investigators to really dig so they're not embarrassed by a reporter coming up with things that they didn't.

[dkpen]

I wish Devries would look into Amy Bradley's case as well. Look closely at Steve Croes connection and his relationship to BlueOrchid member "Yellow", and why he was on the cruiseship and Curacao.

DKPen - there is a link to contact De Vries at his website.  Why don't you contact him with your wishes?

His site is in Dutch. I can't understand any of it. Much less know how to read which button to push to email him. LOL

[Ono]

The Queen looks like a very classy lady--chic ensemble and all.  She certainly stands out in the Aruban crowd who, aside from a few stuffed suits, do not appear to have dressed for the occasion.  I've always been told that the way you present yourself shows your respect for the people in your company.

I agree.. she does look like a classy lady and I would bet she has heretofore not been adequately informed as to exactly what REALLY has been going on in Aruba under the radar since the eighties....AND/OR, maybe she is NOW beginning to get clued in, in private ??? Remember when  Dr. Robert A. Schuller  (Chrystal Cathedral) told Beth several weeks ago that the Dutch ambassador was one of his closest friends ?????