Lively Case Discussion #488 7/6 - 7/7/2006

[mrs. red]

Hey y'all what's up??

and about the shoe... I know that y'all think I am probably crazy... but during the greta interview jvds smirks so hard at the questions about the shoes and then kinda rolls his feet and shows her his (old) shoes... I swear he was thinking ... you stupid lady... I am wearing the shoes...

I know I have nothing to go on regarding this but his facical expression just seemed too damn smug!

[ldstlou]

ldstlou wrote:

I don't know Tygergal...I am usually on the same wavelength as you (judge that good or bad!) haha but what would the shoe prove w/out body? Why would he think at the moment to save the shoe? Give me your scenario

If the shoe was covered with NH's blood, Joran has alot of splainin to do!

but at that moment...things would have been CRAZY!! what would make him think to pick it up?

I would think that the evidence may have been provided to the K2's during the 'Poolside Meetings' immediately after the 'bad thing happening'. Possibly even by PVDS as a guarantee to buy the K2's keeping quiet about the event.

hhhmmmmm...can't see papa sloot giving them anything...just blackmailing them. And why would he mention the change in shoe size if it were already accounted for? Why not bring up the threat in police car...they were obviously showing their cards to each other!!

[mrs. red]

AZsunny... glad things went well for you today!  ... I am reading back a little...

[thirdstrike]

I agree with this Big Hammer and also have wondered if this was not why the purchase of the Internet Café was also necessary to get those hard drives from where Deepak worked as well.  Would have made great distribution center for all kinds of things.  Definitely serial rapists keep trophies from photos to undergarments, etc. I think this may well have been at least half the motive.

And yes, the commercial endeavors are actors for the most part, at least in this country and if we don't count all those Soviet Bloc women being held against their will in for foreign arena.  But they do exist and Bangbus is mentioned in their tickle sites along with cars and money.  I am suggesting they promote it meaning these young punks are all too well aware of that venue.

They would not have the money nor means of making a commercial production but amateur they certainly could.

.

For the most part Anna, I agree with you.  Hell, probably 95% of what you just said above I agree with.  It's just that, I believe the filming of the act would have been in "honor" of sites like "Bangbus"...to pay homage, so to speak.  I don't believe they'd be used as anythign other then internal entertainment...meaning they may watch it alone (with the collective)...not with anyone outside their circles...

Also, the reason I say it no longer exists is for reasons I've already elaborated on in an earlier post.  It would have been at PVDS request (IMO) that the tape would have been destroyed to eliminate it incrimminating them later on (if found).  That's all I was tryoing to say.

Houdini, could you translate this in a more lucid way??  

[ldstlou]

ldstlou wrote:

I don't know Tygergal...I am usually on the same wavelength as you (judge that good or bad!) haha but what would the shoe prove w/out body? Why would he think at the moment to save the shoe? Give me your scenario

If the shoe was covered with NH's blood, Joran has alot of splainin to do!

but at that moment...things would have been CRAZY!! what would make him think to pick it up?

You bring up a good point.  Perhaps Satish was the one they told to pick up the evidence to get rid of it - Maybe he knows what kind of person Joran is, and decided to keep something as security.

I think that the movements of the 3 the next day would be very enlightening.  Where did they go - what did they do?  Who did they talk to?  Not just Joran(he was at school for a while- what about after school?)  What did Paulus do the next day?  

I think that someone does have something.  I'm not sure what, but it is obviously enough to keep their lips zipped.

you are right!! and weird no one has the info!! kept very quiet on the movements the next day!! Can't believe no one able to trace them or nothing leaked!! even more suspicious!!

[Anna]

.
I have always thought that the reason Joran changed his story from Deepak to Satish picking him up is that he and Satish wear the same size shoe a size 10.5.  Remember Joran had the whole world looking for his size 14 boats when it came out that the Dutch interrogator discovered Joran truly wore only a 10.5.

So what was that all about?  Well, if the shoe with blood on it belonged to Satish because it was 10.5 Joran with his 14's would be off the hook, right?  I'd even venture to guess Satish had a pair of shoes like that or very similar.  Maybe not, maybe only his size was correct.  Joran never lies without a pretty good reason.  

[Houdini]

Kimmy53 wrote:

You bring up a good point. Perhaps Satish was the one they told to pick up the evidence to get rid of it - Maybe he knows what kind of person Joran is, and decided to keep something as security.

I think that the movements of the 3 the next day would be very enlightening. Where did they go - what did they do? Who did they talk to? Not just Joran(he was at school for a while- what about after school?) What did Paulus do the next day?

I think that someone does have something. I'm not sure what, but it is obviously enough to keep their lips zipped.

Deepak and Satish are "second choice" for Joran.  Relegated to transportation for the "elite dutch friend".  No, I believe disposal was done by others on the second night of her disappearance.  Possibly the beach patrol under cover of darkness, using their uniforms and authority to keep tourists with prying eyes away.

But there is some evidence unaccounted for because all parties are worried about it.    JMHO

[ldstlou]

Hey y'all what's up??

and about the shoe... I know that y'all think I am probably crazy... but during the greta interview jvds smirks so hard at the questions about the shoes and then kinda rolls his feet and shows her his (old) shoes... I swear he was thinking ... you stupid lady... I am wearing the shoes...

I know I have nothing to go on regarding this but his facical expression just seemed too damn smug!

I agree Mrs Red...don't think he is worried about shoes at all!!

[Tylergal]

ldstlou wrote:

I don't know Tygergal...I am usually on the same wavelength as you (judge that good or bad!) haha but what would the shoe prove w/out body? Why would he think at the moment to save the shoe? Give me your scenario

If the shoe was covered with NH's blood, Joran has alot of splainin to do!

but at that moment...things would have been CRAZY!! what would make him think to pick it up?

Suppose all evidence was gathered up by the PIMPS and Satish was the one who was supposed to dispose of this and when he heard there was an investigation about, he went back and retrieved the shoe from where it was placed out of plain view.

[thirdstrike]

Hey y'all what's up??

and about the shoe... I know that y'all think I am probably crazy... but during the greta interview jvds smirks so hard at the questions about the shoes and then kinda rolls his feet and shows her his (old) shoes... I swear he was thinking ... you stupid lady... I am wearing the shoes...

I know I have nothing to go on regarding this but his facical expression just seemed too damn smug!

No, no Scarlett...I have actually thought the same thing ever since I watched that interview.  I remember saying (in here) the day after that part of the interview aired that to me, it seemed he was probably wearing the exact pair of shoes he had on the night in question.  He even kind of made it a point to state that the shoes he was displaying were the same ones (not same pair, but same style) he wore that night.  It's funny you bring that up...

BTW, how you doin' girl?  

[Tylergal]

American Pie

More than a movie or a "theory?"

IMO, the primary "purpose" of assault was the movie and the pictures.  It is in their recorded actions as cognition.  It is "what" they do.

I believe the video exists.  And they do save their videos:

1.  Satish popped the porn dvd in as they drove past LaCabana, and Natalee said she "had enough".
2.  NE reporter has beer w/ goon in Netherlands and he pops out PDA and shares porn: "Can I bite you?"
3.  The arrest of Freddie and charges sustained against him: the video recording of assault of 16 yr old girl who is slipping in and out of consciousness...
4.  After leaving Natalee on beach, what did goon do: he turned on computer to pick up soccer scores and watch porn.
5.  The event w/ Bailey and Alyse, a near exact rehearsal for the nite w/ Natalee, there is porn playing on the car's dvd (double screens), as recorded in the pictures we have all seen.

Do you believe all of these to be of "professional" level?  I don't, not at all.  And there is rumor that some have said a video of Natalee exists and they have seen, girls who local and Aruban.

It is, imo, not just serial killers who keep "trophies" -- serial rapists do as well.  And that is who these people are.  

If the video was uploaded live (for remote viewing), it is almost certain that a copy exists somewhere in cyberspace.  And I believe this is more than likely.

.

I agree with this Big Hammer and also have wondered if this was not why the purchase of the Internet Café was also necessary to get those hard drives from where Deepak worked as well.  Would have made great distribution center for all kinds of things.  Definitely serial rapists keep trophies from photos to undergarments, etc. I think this may well have been at least half the motive.

And yes, the commercial endeavors are actors for the most part, at least in this country and if we don't count all those Soviet Bloc women being held against their will in for foreign arena.  But they do exist and Bangbus is mentioned in their tickle sites along with cars and money.  I am suggesting they promote it meaning these young punks are all too well aware of that venue.

They would not have the money nor means of making a commercial production but amateur they certainly could.

.

Totally agree, Anna, and it could have been the name "Steve" that was found on Deepak with the phone number and name of a cruise ship, was someone who was interested in buying these videos. I do recall that person was from Florida.  Tell me it ain't so that a cruise ship would be interested in wifi.  I think a cruise ship will do anything to make money, legal or illegal.

[Houdini]

Thirdstrike wrote:

For the most part Anna, I agree with you. Hell, probably 95% of what you just said above I agree with. It's just that, I believe the filming of the act would have been in "honor" of sites like "Bangbus"...to pay homage, so to speak. I don't believe they'd be used as anythign other then internal entertainment...meaning they may watch it alone (with the collective)...not with anyone outside their circles...

Also, the reason I say it no longer exists is for reasons I've already elaborated on in an earlier post. It would have been at PVDS request (IMO) that the tape would have been destroyed to eliminate it incrimminating them later on (if found). That's all I was tryoing to say.

Houdini, could you translate this in a more lucid way??

I'll try Third.

Anna

Third ain't buyin' the tape's still around story.

[Carnut]

.
I have always thought that the reason Joran changed his story from Deepak to Satish picking him up is that he and Satish wear the same size shoe a size 10.5.  Remember Joran had the whole world looking for his size 14 boats when it came out that the Dutch interrogator discovered Joran truly wore only a 10.5.

So what was that all about?  Well, if the shoe with blood on it belonged to Satish because it was 10.5 Joran with his 14's would be off the hook, right?  I'd even venture to guess Satish had a pair of shoes like that or very similar.  Maybe not, maybe only his size was correct.  Joran never lies without a pretty good reason.  

Nah, totally disagree, JVDS dosen't need a good reason to lie.

[justinsmama]

American Pie

More than a movie or a "theory?"

IMO, the primary "purpose" of assault was the movie and the pictures.  It is in their recorded actions as cognition.  It is "what" they do.

I believe the video exists.  And they do save their videos:

1.  Satish popped the porn dvd in as they drove past LaCabana, and Natalee said she "had enough".
2.  NE reporter has beer w/ goon in Netherlands and he pops out PDA and shares porn: "Can I bite you?"
3.  The arrest of Freddie and charges sustained against him: the video recording of assault of 16 yr old girl who is slipping in and out of consciousness...
4.  After leaving Natalee on beach, what did goon do: he turned on computer to pick up soccer scores and watch porn.
5.  The event w/ Bailey and Alyse, a near exact rehearsal for the nite w/ Natalee, there is porn playing on the car's dvd (double screens), as recorded in the pictures we have all seen.

Do you believe all of these to be of "professional" level?  I don't, not at all.  And there is rumor that some have said a video of Natalee exists and they have seen, girls who local and Aruban.

It is, imo, not just serial killers who keep "trophies" -- serial rapists do as well.  And that is who these people are.  

If the video was uploaded live (for remote viewing), it is almost certain that a copy exists somewhere in cyberspace.  And I believe this is more than likely.

.

Hammer, I think you and I are in total agreement here.  I am going to mention again the link I found to the sleeping bitches.  That to me speaks volumes about the level of their involvement in porno.

Tyler~ Will you email me that link, please?

Hi, monkeys!

[mrs. red]

Hey y'all what's up??

and about the shoe... I know that y'all think I am probably crazy... but during the greta interview jvds smirks so hard at the questions about the shoes and then kinda rolls his feet and shows her his (old) shoes... I swear he was thinking ... you stupid lady... I am wearing the shoes...

I know I have nothing to go on regarding this but his facical expression just seemed too damn smug!

No, no Scarlett...I have actually thought the same thing ever since I watched that interview.  I remember saying (in here) the day after that part of the interview aired that to me, it seemed he was probably wearing the exact pair of shoes he had on the night in question.  He even kind of made it a point to state that the shoes he was displaying were the same ones (not same pair, but same style) he wore that night.  It's funny you bring that up...

BTW, how you doin' girl?  

I'm good..... I think you and i are the only ones that think that... I wish we had a replay in the cage of that interview and the CA interview... that we could all watch at the same time...

[thirdstrike]

ldstlou wrote:

PLEASE!!! let me in on it!! BIG fan of pizza...struggle w/ the exersize part!!

haha..however...between my rehab project and protein diet..I have lost 10 lbs in 2 weeks!!

Pshaw.......10 lbs, 10 schmounds.  Thirdstrike can have you losing that in 2 HOURS.

His purpleness, is a fitness and exercise guru.

Although, Arlene Schiffer <sp> hasn't been able to speak on camera ever since Thirdstrike interrogated her.

I am ready!! get me skinny again!!

All kidding aside...find something you love to do (of a physical nature), and have fun doing it.  Part of the problem with sticking to an excercise program is it's perception of being "work".  And, we all know how people dislike "work"...

I know it's not revolutionary advice.  But, it'll work..

[mrs. red]

American Pie

More than a movie or a "theory?"

IMO, the primary "purpose" of assault was the movie and the pictures.  It is in their recorded actions as cognition.  It is "what" they do.

I believe the video exists.  And they do save their videos:

1.  Satish popped the porn dvd in as they drove past LaCabana, and Natalee said she "had enough".
2.  NE reporter has beer w/ goon in Netherlands and he pops out PDA and shares porn: "Can I bite you?"
3.  The arrest of Freddie and charges sustained against him: the video recording of assault of 16 yr old girl who is slipping in and out of consciousness...
4.  After leaving Natalee on beach, what did goon do: he turned on computer to pick up soccer scores and watch porn.
5.  The event w/ Bailey and Alyse, a near exact rehearsal for the nite w/ Natalee, there is porn playing on the car's dvd (double screens), as recorded in the pictures we have all seen.

Do you believe all of these to be of "professional" level?  I don't, not at all.  And there is rumor that some have said a video of Natalee exists and they have seen, girls who local and Aruban.

It is, imo, not just serial killers who keep "trophies" -- serial rapists do as well.  And that is who these people are.  

If the video was uploaded live (for remote viewing), it is almost certain that a copy exists somewhere in cyberspace.  And I believe this is more than likely.

.

Hammer, I think you and I are in total agreement here.  I am going to mention again the link I found to the sleeping bitches.  That to me speaks volumes about the level of their involvement in porno.

Tyler~ Will you email me that link, please?

Hi, monkeys!

Oh I never saw that link... WOW!!!

[Carnut]

Thirdstrike wrote:

For the most part Anna, I agree with you. Hell, probably 95% of what you just said above I agree with. It's just that, I believe the filming of the act would have been in "honor" of sites like "Bangbus"...to pay homage, so to speak. I don't believe they'd be used as anythign other then internal entertainment...meaning they may watch it alone (with the collective)...not with anyone outside their circles...

Also, the reason I say it no longer exists is for reasons I've already elaborated on in an earlier post. It would have been at PVDS request (IMO) that the tape would have been destroyed to eliminate it incrimminating them later on (if found). That's all I was tryoing to say.

Houdini, could you translate this in a more lucid way??

I'll try Third.

Anna

Third ain't buyin' the tape's still around story.

I don't buy the tape deal either.

[thirdstrike]

Thirdstrike wrote:

For the most part Anna, I agree with you. Hell, probably 95% of what you just said above I agree with. It's just that, I believe the filming of the act would have been in "honor" of sites like "Bangbus"...to pay homage, so to speak. I don't believe they'd be used as anythign other then internal entertainment...meaning they may watch it alone (with the collective)...not with anyone outside their circles...

Also, the reason I say it no longer exists is for reasons I've already elaborated on in an earlier post. It would have been at PVDS request (IMO) that the tape would have been destroyed to eliminate it incrimminating them later on (if found). That's all I was tryoing to say.

Houdini, could you translate this in a more lucid way??

I'll try Third.

Anna

Third ain't buyin' the tape's still around story.

I don't buy the tape deal either.

I do think it's quite possible they did exist at one time.  But, I'd bet dollars to donuts that they don't anymore...

How was that Houdini?  Clear enough, or in need of translation??

[Tylergal]

Thirdstrike wrote:

For the most part Anna, I agree with you. Hell, probably 95% of what you just said above I agree with. It's just that, I believe the filming of the act would have been in "honor" of sites like "Bangbus"...to pay homage, so to speak. I don't believe they'd be used as anythign other then internal entertainment...meaning they may watch it alone (with the collective)...not with anyone outside their circles...

Also, the reason I say it no longer exists is for reasons I've already elaborated on in an earlier post. It would have been at PVDS request (IMO) that the tape would have been destroyed to eliminate it incrimminating them later on (if found). That's all I was tryoing to say.

Houdini, could you translate this in a more lucid way??

I'll try Third.

Anna

Third ain't buyin' the tape's still around story.

I don't buy the tape deal either.

Like ALE, you give too much leeway and allow the crooks a free reign to prowl and kill again.