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Author Topic: Pastor Clifford LANE Lawless  (Read 58265 times)
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doubledecker
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« Reply #20 on: June 05, 2009, 12:25:10 AM »

there are no birth records for clifford lane lawless or any of the kids.   Monkey Devil!

the only place the dates are coming from is either estimated dates from marriage records or the street address sometimes list an approx age.  there are no birth records.  how crazy.  where the heck were they all born at?  there is no marriage record for connie and cll.

there is NOTHING.  what the heck.  whose kids are these?  where are there birth records?
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doubledecker
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« Reply #21 on: June 05, 2009, 12:31:35 AM »

hmmm, I have one other place I can go look LOL
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« Reply #22 on: June 05, 2009, 12:35:13 AM »

and what the heck is up with the national roofing company with CLL and connies sister which was started in 1958, 2 yrs before connie and cll are married.  Its listed at 812 Trinity street in manteca, in some older 2 bdrm house. sure!  LOL

and the you have the other lawless in grants pass who are on the lawless roofing company, but they have it in redding california LOL

something really crazy going on. 

I wonder where melissa's son's birth record is?  too many kids just popping up out of nowhere with no records.
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« Reply #23 on: June 05, 2009, 12:41:22 AM »

DD, I have searched and find no reference to Minnesota (sp).  Everything else from Maryland to Hawaii and Maine to Florida.
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« Reply #24 on: June 05, 2009, 12:47:11 AM »

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doubledecker
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« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2009, 12:48:13 AM »

keep an eye out for anything out of bailey county texas.
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« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2009, 12:51:16 AM »

ok, will do . . . tomorrow . . . oh, it is tomorrow.
Night for real this time.
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doubledecker
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« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2009, 01:08:38 AM »

yes I have to get to sleep also.  this stuff is just driving me nuts.  it worries me when you see so many kids and no birth records, especially with a family who likes to HIDE kids away.  ugh. 
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« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2009, 11:04:38 AM »

Here's what I have picked out this morning:  Mary E. Dodson, Lamar, TX (#17 Gen.)
Margaret Ann Peggy Sutton died in Texas (#44 Gen); children of Amos Lawless and Mary Collier, James died in Lufkin Texas, Arthur died in Panola County, Texas, Lenoard born in Dallas, Dewit Dommie Doyle D. D. born in Harrison Texas; brother of Amosn James Howard died in Panola County and his son Amos died in Panola.  Also, lots of these Lawless have that Canada connection (#51 Gen).  Also, Paul G., brother of CLL was born in Maryland, and uncle Ralph was born in Canada.
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« Reply #29 on: June 05, 2009, 12:31:23 PM »

Wonder if Josh Palmer is the father of MLH's other child?

Interesting...do the time lines match up? The Daughter is 5, so she was born in 2004. the boy is said to be 3? that would be 2006?

Very strange you can't find birth records. They have never lived in Canada and unless connie felt the urge to travel out of the country each time she was preggers I don't know what to think.

It is always possible I am missing them, but all 3 of them?  and the marriage record for connie and CLL also?  The chances are pretty slim I would miss them all.  And its not like I have not looked.  I've tried everything.  Either they were all born somewhere else, or they were born un other names, adotped and had name changes and so I don't know what name they were born under, or what?  what else can it be?  they are not who they say they are??  LOL

and CLL and connie were suppose to be married in modesto in 1960.  Modesto is in Stanislaus County.  there is nothing there, there is nothin anywhere.  Unless they were married in some state way the heck who knows where?  But why would the church website say they were married in Modesto if they were not? 

Now there is such a thing as a "Confidential Marriage".  California has a law that if you have lived together etc, you can get married without blood tests etc and your record is sealed.  Noone can got get your marriage record but the two people married and they have to go in person to the courthouse to get it.  I know this law was in affect in  am not sure they did.  I will have to look that up. 

We can find Cll living in San Jose, LIvermore, Tracy.  He is said by the church to have pastored churches in Modesto, Eureka, Mountain View, and a few other places I can't remember off the top of my head; but you can't find a record of his living in any of the other places?  why??  Is he there under another name? 

Just too many weird unexplainable situations in the lives of this family.  Granted, these databases are not error-free, however they are this messed up either.
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« Reply #30 on: June 05, 2009, 12:32:53 PM »

sorry for all the typos and leaving out part of the sentences ugh.  My screen keeps jumping all over the place when I type and I have no idea what is getting typed on there and what is not until after I post ugh.  If I try to scroll through to look at what I typed it automatically jumps to the very top of the post so I can't see it ugh

what I was meaning to type in the previous post is, the confidential marriage law was in affect in cali in the early 1970's, this I know for a fact, but I do not know if it was in affect in 1960.  I will go try to find the law and see when it started.

I guess it might also be possible CLL was in the military during the years the children were born and they were born out of country?  but still, where is the marriage license.  Either confidential or the officiating pastor never recorded it?  All possible and would explain things.  But do we just say oh well?  There are 3 children with birth records we can't find, there is no marriage record under their names, there is a daughter-in-law who HIDES children, there is another baby of Melissa popping up out of nowhere. It is also said by the family that Connie took in foster kids.  There is Melissa telling her x-husband she would take there daughter and hide her.  There is just way too much going on here for someone to not keep digging and get to the bottom of this mess.  I certainly hope some authorities are doing just that. 


And what is up with the clarkston/lewiston church where CLL was suppose to be and they never heard of him either? Was he there or not?  Or was he there under another name?

Then you have CLL and one brother born to his mother and no other children.  In the 1930's that is very uncommon for both the mother and the father to never have any more children when they divorce and marry someone else.  Then you have these big gaps of no children in related famlies where you are having children every year or two then blam, none for 7- 8 years, then start in again every two years, that is not normal either. 
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #31 on: June 05, 2009, 01:05:02 PM »

I can't find a cali birth record for joni lawless

the only cali birth record I find for a brett lawless is this one:
again some other mother out of fresno, either this is not him, or this is him and something is very wrong again.

California Birth Index, 1905-1995
about Brett E Lawless
Name: Brett E Lawless
Birth Date: 26 Jul 1966
Gender: Male 
Mother's Maiden Name: Hardin 
Birth County: Fresno 

let me try to find a marriage license for the right brett lawless and compare the birth dates, who did brett marry?
 

I do not think this Connie and Lane's son Brett...
His middle name is Arthur.

Snipped:
http://www.veromi.net/Summary.asp


1.    LAWLESS,�BRETT�ARTHUR (Age 45)
   Available(5)    Available    
LAKEWOOD,�CA
WHITTIER,�CA
BELLFLOWER,�CA    

Possible Relatives:

LAWLESS,�MARY�ELISABETH�(Age�45)� <----------------WIFE ?



   
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #32 on: June 05, 2009, 01:09:01 PM »


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lonemonkey
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« Reply #33 on: June 05, 2009, 01:40:08 PM »

Hey
WHY isn't Paul listed as Lane's brother in the ABOVE post??????
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #34 on: June 05, 2009, 01:44:07 PM »

there are no birth records for clifford lane lawless or any of the kids.   Monkey Devil!

the only place the dates are coming from is either estimated dates from marriage records or the street address sometimes list an approx age.  there are no birth records.  how crazy.  where the heck were they all born at?  there is no marriage record for connie and cll.

there is NOTHING.  what the heck.  whose kids are these?  where are there birth records?

This gives me a creepy feeling, Monkeys!
It would seem someone is/was a mid-wife...
Perhaps, this is why we cannot find birth records for MH's baby boy.
I don't think her medical bills were for a baby because if you are poor enough (on paper) the state will pay! And I believe she would qualify for Medi-Cal.
Now, a drug rehab. stay is more gray.  She could have been charged for that....
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doubledecker
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« Reply #35 on: June 05, 2009, 01:46:47 PM »

I can't find a cali birth record for joni lawless

the only cali birth record I find for a brett lawless is this one:
again some other mother out of fresno, either this is not him, or this is him and something is very wrong again.

California Birth Index, 1905-1995
about Brett E Lawless
Name: Brett E Lawless
Birth Date: 26 Jul 1966
Gender: Male 
Mother's Maiden Name: Hardin 
Birth County: Fresno 

let me try to find a marriage license for the right brett lawless and compare the birth dates, who did brett marry?
 

I do not think this Connie and Lane's son Brett...
His middle name is Arthur.

Snipped:
http://www.veromi.net/Summary.asp


1.    LAWLESS,�BRETT�ARTHUR (Age 45)
   Available(5)    Available    
LAKEWOOD,�CA
WHITTIER,�CA
BELLFLOWER,�CA    

Possible Relatives:

LAWLESS,�MARY�ELISABETH�(Age�45)� <----------------WIFE ?



   

correct, this is not the right brett. I looked up more on this one and had posted farther down after that post with docs to prove it is not the right one.  there is no records for the correct brett
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #36 on: June 05, 2009, 01:50:57 PM »

DoubleD
Do you think there is a possiblity that Lane assumed Paul's identity or vice versa?
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doubledecker
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« Reply #37 on: June 05, 2009, 01:54:31 PM »

Hey
WHY isn't Paul listed as Lane's brother in the ABOVE post??????

because I was only doing the "DIRECT LINE" down all the way through, not adding all the brothers and sisters of everyone.   ::MonkeyWink::DIRECT LINES follow straight through from just the mother and father down to the person you are ending up with, in this case melissa huckaby.  CLL is her direct line, but CLL's brother is not. 

Paul George lawless the brother of CLL should be in the other reports.  However, there are a lot of the people left out all the way through because at the time I did not have a lot of the other names yet.  I will try to go through them again and update the other reports with the new info. 
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #38 on: June 05, 2009, 01:57:00 PM »

Migration of the Lawless Family

___________________

george webster lawless was in Douglas County, Washington in 1917-1918
His wife Jesse Dicus was born there.
children of george webster lawless and jesse Dicus
Paul LAWLESS
born  24 Jan 1927 in Brewster,Okanogon,Washington
Clifford Lane Lawless(CLL) place of birth not known yet
he grew up in brewster. Was there in the 50's
He met his wife there
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #39 on: June 05, 2009, 01:59:09 PM »

I'm not convinced that the Pastor didn't fiddle with his identity and possibly took on his brother's life...So would he be Lane or Paul?
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