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Author Topic: Is Clifford Lane Lawless Actually Clifford "LANE"(last name Lane?)  (Read 21299 times)
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doubledecker
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« Reply #40 on: June 22, 2009, 02:04:01 AM »

so many of the lawless boys had no children, could it be a defective gene?  so they adopted.  william adopted a son.  john mack had none, ralph devere had none, george has only two so very well could be adopted, having only two children then was very unusual.  richard birdette on the other hand had a lot of kids. 

I am also told that none of the siblings of james webster lawless the father of george etc, had any kids.  now this is going on all through the generations, so what the heck is the reason?

keep in mind I am "TOLD" this, does not mean it is true, but I don't know why someone would lie.  but then again maybe they do not wish to claim certain family members?
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #41 on: June 22, 2009, 02:05:35 AM »

Check this out....
Snipped:
http://stevemorse.org/birthday/birthday2.php?auth=

1.   CONNIE   L   LAWLESS   67   Aug   6   1941   Tracy   CA

I think they have BOTH used this birth certificate....
Neither of them were born in Tracy, CA....right???

this is her birthdate, she was born in monterey
California Birth Index, 1905-1995
about Constance Lorene Harris
Name: Constance Lorene Harris
Birth Date: 6 Aug 1941
Gender: Female 
Mother's Maiden Name: Cooper 
Birth County: Monterey 
 

they must have moved up to wenatchee as her brothers say they went to school with LANE.
That's right...I thought she was born there!  I wonder what brought Connie to Wenatchee??
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Sister
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« Reply #42 on: June 22, 2009, 01:55:22 PM »

I have in my written notes that John Lawless (married to nee Shutt/Halliday) had 4 children.  I have no idea where I got that other than on one of these threads.
Good afternoon Monkeys.
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #43 on: June 22, 2009, 01:59:37 PM »

Hi Sister!!!
I have been going over the The Timothy Lawless thread with a fine tooth comb...there is SO much info packed on those pages!
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #44 on: June 22, 2009, 02:01:26 PM »

so many of the lawless boys had no children, could it be a defective gene?  so they adopted.  william adopted a son.  john mack had none, ralph devere had none, george has only two so very well could be adopted, having only two children then was very unusual.  richard birdette on the other hand had a lot of kids. 

I am also told that none of the siblings of james webster lawless the father of george etc, had any kids.  now this is going on all through the generations, so what the heck is the reason?

keep in mind I am "TOLD" this, does not mean it is true, but I don't know why someone would lie.  but then again maybe they do not wish to claim certain family members?

Minnie Lawless 1880 Census Data is attached.  The reference to the Nichols being household members is an error on the site.

Lines 37-42

It is not an error.  Her mom was Sarah A Nichols before she married Mack Lawless and they were living with Sarah's parents and siblings.

who is MACK lawless, is that john mack? or part of his line? do you know right off hand.

gee I am trying to do too many lines at once.  I will stick to timothy john for right now because I am seeing connections up in washington where the ccl lines are.  but I will make notes and toss out info or do lookups.

McNealy (Mack) A. Lawless
B. 16 Feb 1846 , Patrick Va
D. 12 Oct 1908, Peru, Miami, Ind.

Married 1846

Sarah Ann Nicholas daughter of George Nicholas and Mary Warner 1846, Patrick  Co, VA
B. 6 Jul 1842, Patrick County , VA
D. 27 Jan 1914, Peru, Miami, Ind.

These are Minnie's parents.

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Sister
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« Reply #45 on: June 22, 2009, 02:09:56 PM »

Hi there friend, yes, a lot about this "clan" has already been dug up by you great researchers.  It has often been said it is about at the Richard Birdette Lawless (uncle of CLL) that things get messed up.  The McNealy A. "Mack" Lawless you posted is listed on the geneology thread.  I have to go there a lot to keep up.  Back and forth I go!
 
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #46 on: June 22, 2009, 02:19:06 PM »

Hi there friend, yes, a lot about this "clan" has already been dug up by you great researchers.  It has often been said it is about at the Richard Birdette Lawless (uncle of CLL) that things get messed up.  The McNealy A. "Mack" Lawless you posted is listed on the geneology thread.  I have to go there a lot to keep up.  Back and forth I go!
 

Do you think the Canadian Lawless' are related to the Lawless' of Washigton or CLL himself?
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Sister
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« Reply #47 on: June 22, 2009, 02:35:14 PM »

Yes, I do.  If you look in the geneology thread have Canadian roots.  i.e. the grandmother of CLL, Nancy nee Hause Rowland has family in Canada, CLL's brother Ralph Devere Lawless (1902-1968) was born in New Brunswick Canada, etc.
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lonemonkey
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« Reply #48 on: June 22, 2009, 02:44:20 PM »

Yes, I do.  If you look in the geneology thread have Canadian roots.  i.e. the grandmother of CLL, Nancy nee Hause Rowland has family in Canada, CLL's brother Ralph Devere Lawless (1902-1968) was born in New Brunswick Canada, etc.

Well hmmmm...
I wonder if anyone has been a mid-wife in the Lawless family???
That could explain NO birth certificates
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« Reply #49 on: June 22, 2009, 03:11:06 PM »

Yes, I do.  If you look in the geneology thread have Canadian roots.  i.e. the grandmother of CLL, Nancy nee Hause Rowland has family in Canada, CLL's brother Ralph Devere Lawless (1902-1968) was born in New Brunswick Canada, etc.
[/uote]

not brother of CLL - uncle of CLL is Ralph Devere Lawless who is brother to Richard Birdette Lawless.
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doubledecker
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« Reply #50 on: June 22, 2009, 10:08:02 PM »

Yes, I do.  If you look in the geneology thread have Canadian roots.  i.e. the grandmother of CLL, Nancy nee Hause Rowland has family in Canada, CLL's brother Ralph Devere Lawless (1902-1968) was born in New Brunswick Canada, etc.


in one place Ralph Devere Lawless is listed as born in new Brunswick, Canada.  I think this came from a family member's genealogy page and was posted early on. 

then I found him on the 1910, 1920, & 1930 census as listed as born in washington. 

then I asked someone who KNOWS and they told me he was born in washington and is buried there.  So I believe he probably was born in washington.  this will be on the updated report.
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« Reply #51 on: June 23, 2009, 03:37:11 AM »

This is from the Texas thread

Name:  Clifton Lawless
Residence:  1992 - DE Berry, Texas
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« Reply #52 on: July 01, 2009, 01:16:34 AM »

Here's an fYI
in LM's geneology of Canada; a Rose Margaret Lawless married a John Lawlor (that last name has been used) and she worked in Virginia, husband in the service.  No wonder we can't find anyone.
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love4ever
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« Reply #53 on: July 05, 2009, 05:43:31 PM »

Hi sweet monkeys, been reading the threads, lots more work to research in conecrns to different surnames. I hope this finds all of you well. I have been busy with family and studies, been popping on and off reading but haven't had time to research. I will be back in a few, I have some things to do and then I am going to do some searchin. Before I go I wanted to post the list of names I found when I searched the the address for clover baptist church in Tracy. I found the surname Scott, I have done a little research but not enough. Searched in the states of Cali, Idaho and Washington. I think in Idaho the Clifford Scott court docs are ADA which means there might be a disability and so it is confidential? This Clifford was 77, but I lost my direction because of the need to be a mom at home..lol I also wonder with CLL being in the military, could he have become a disabled veteran? I will be back in a few to  do some more searching, hope all is well...

~~Love

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love4ever
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« Reply #54 on: July 05, 2009, 07:40:44 PM »

I searched for Connie L Scott above, for employment:


1. SCOTT, CONNIE L
NEW JERUSALEM CHRISTIAN CENTER..

no city or state listed,
found one in Tacoma


New Jerusalem Church Of God In Christ
1623 S 11th St
Tacoma, WA 98405
Phone : (253) 572-6785    

2. SCOTT, CONNIE L
JW FRAMES, INC

BREA, CA

Cited:

http://www.veromi.net/Summary.asp?fn=Connie+&mn=L&ln=Scott&city=wenatchee&state=WA&vw=Employment&Search=Employment&Input=Name&Image1.x=18&Image1.y=8
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love4ever
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« Reply #55 on: July 05, 2009, 07:57:40 PM »

I think there is something fishy going on here, I even thought it might be the Robersons new name. Just weird..I can't figure it out
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love4ever
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« Reply #56 on: July 07, 2009, 05:06:26 PM »


1931 - Clifford Lane Lawless born in August, currently age 77, tho some reports say 67

1941 - Connie L Harris born in August

1943 - Arthur DeWayne Harris (Connie's brother) born

1950 - Lane attended Brewster High School, on debate squad in Brewster WA 

1950s - Lane was in the US Navy, unknown which years

1958-1963? - Arthur attended three years at Landmark Baptist College in San Jose CA, earned a BA degree in Religious Studies from Sacramento Baptist College and Seminary in Sacramento CA, accredits most of his Bible education and indoctrination to his father, AA Harris

1960 - AA Harris pastored Eastside Missionary Baptist Church of East Wenatchee WA, unknown for how long he had pastored there

1960 - Lane was saved in Wenatchee WA in April; Lane was baptized by AA Harris in East Wenatchee WA on July 9; married Connie same day in Modesto CA, married by her father AA Harris

1961 - Brian Lane Lawless (son of Lane and Connie) born in April; unknown when his brother Brett was born

1963 - AA Harris (Connie's father) pastored the Douglas Street MBC of Omak WA, unknown for how long he had pastored there

1963 - Arthur ordained by his father AA Harris and began his pastorate work in May; was first pastor of Sovereign Grace MBC of Mountain View CA, unknown what year/s
 
1971 - Lane was called to the ministry on April 6 and ordained August 20 (four months later) by the Winton MBC

1971-1972 (?) - Lane pastored Beacon MBC of Redding CA

1973-1974 - Lane pastored Grace MBC of Gardena CA, all the other pastors at Grace MBC had been there for several years, yet Lane was there only one year

1974 - Landmark MBC of Salinas CA authorized mission work in Mountain View CA which resulted in the formation of the Sovereign Grace MBC of Mountain View CA; Arthur was their first pastor

1975 - Lane sent out by Salinas MBC of Salinas CA to do mission work in Eureka CA

1975 - Lane pastored Sovereign Grace MBC of Mountain View CA

1976 - Lane living in San Jose CA

1978? to present - Arthur pastor of Alisal Baptist Church of Salinas CA for over 31 years, Dean of the Alisal Baptist Institute Theological Seminary, distributes monthly sunday school literature to various churches of like faith

1979 - Lane living in San Jose CA

1981 - Melissa Chantel Lawless (Lane and Connie's daughter) born in February in Orange County CA

1981 - Lane lived in Salinas CA while receiving his theological education from the Alisal Baptist Institute Theological Seminary, received BA degree in religious studies; (by the way, Lane's education received ten years after he was ordained and had already pastored at least three churches)

1981 to present - Lane pastor of Clover Road Baptist Church of Tracy CA; along with Eastside MBC Stockton CA, the Airport MBC of Modesto CA authorized mission work in Tracy CA establishing Victory MBC, which was built on property donated to the church, first pastor James Taylor to 1957-1970, second pastor Charles Scott 1970-1981; Victory MBC then approached Lane and Sovereign Grace MBC of Mountain View CA to request that he consider a pastorate in Tracy, due to pastor Scott failing health; Victory and Sovereign Grace voted to merge, with the members of Victory joining Sovereign Grace, donating their property and assests to the Sovereign Grace Church. The name of the church was then changed to Clover Road Baptist Church.

1982 - Lane lived in Livermore CA and made the one-and-a-half hour commute to Salinas when he taught and preached at the Alisal Baptist Institute Theological Seminary

1983 - Connie living in Tracy CA

1985 - Connie living in Tracy CA

mid 1980s - Lane pastor of First Church of God in Clarkston WA (as stated by current pastor of that church); in the mid-'80s there were allegations of child abuse and/or molestation somehow connected to the First Church of God; Lane was questioned regarding the allegations, but not charged

mid 1980s - Lane supposedly questioned about alleged child abuse in mid-80s at Warner Alliance Church in Lewiston, Idaho, but not charged; church currently pastored by same man who is also current pastor of First Church of God in Clarkston WA; the two churches are just across the river from each other, connected by a bridge

1989 - AA Harris (Connie's father) died in November

1990 - Connie living in Livermore CA

1992 to present - Lane and Connie purchase home at # 57 in MHP in Nov, across the street and down a few homes from where Sandra Cantu lived with her mom, grandparents and siblings before her March 27 disappearance

2006 - Connie elected to San Joaquin Valley's Republican Central Committee and lost a re-election bid in 2008; calls herself a "Children's Issues Advisor";
reportedly is a caregiver, takes in foster care children
 
-----------------------------------------------------

links for above info:

history
http://www.clover-road-baptist-church.com/church1.html

bio
http://www.alisalbaptistchurch.org/pastor.php

article
http://m.thecalifornian.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090408/NEWS01/904080301/-1/WAP&template=wapart

Lane pastored WA church in mid-1980s
http://www.kron4.com/News/ArticleView/tabid/298/smid/1126/ArticleID/1182/reftab/36/t/FBI-Visits-Washington-State-Church-Where-Huckaby-s-Grandfather-Was-Once-the-Pastor/Default.aspx

Yearbook
http://www.abaptist.org/Yearbook/california.htm

Schedule
http://www.fmbcbellflower.org/groupschedule.html



Hi sweet monkeys, been reading the threads, lots more work to research in conecrns to different surnames. I hope this finds all of you well. I have been busy with family and studies, been popping on and off reading but haven't had time to research. I will be back in a few, I have some things to do and then I am going to do some searchin. Before I go I wanted to post the list of names I found when I searched the the address for clover baptist church in Tracy. I found the surname Scott, I have done a little research but not enough. Searched in the states of Cali, Idaho and Washington. I think in Idaho the Clifford Scott court docs are ADA which means there might be a disability and so it is confidential? This Clifford was 77, but I lost my direction because of the need to be a mom at home..lol I also wonder with CLL being in the military, could he have become a disabled veteran? I will be back in a few to  do some more searching, hope all is well...

~~Love




This must be the names in relation to the second pastor Charles Scott 1970-1981 of the Victory MBC...who we also see  resided in Wenatchee, Washington at one time..
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