Irrigation Pond

[love4ever]

more of my old notes
_________________


Reported Suspicious Man/Car By Pond Be4 Sandra Found 4/10/09
okay I looked it up

4/1/09 press conference by police says the cadaver scent was found by the searchers to the NORTH of 205...

so--

4/1/09 cadaver scent found north of 205/Old River/Nothing found

"Cadaver dogs picked up a scent Sunday morning along a river north of Tracy, Sheneman said. Divers searched the water while others searched along the water line. He said there was no sign anyone had been there and nothing was found."

4/2/09 Johnny Williams thinks he saw man in boat w/sandra (where?)


4/3/09 Cadet Memory saw suspicious man in truck by pond where sandra was found

wow DD, "Cadaver dogs picked up a scent Sunday morning along a river north of Tracy"..oh my!

[doubledecker]

I have to wonder "why" the irrigation pond was chosen as the place of deposit for sandra's body.  It certainly was not deep and not a place that a body would stay hidden.  I personally believe there was never any intention for her to stay and be hidden away there.  I also wonder why choose Whitehall road, why write the note.  Why use your own suitcase, and then put it where it is obviously going to be found.  Why interject yourself into the case?  It was said melissa went to the police station and was acting like she thought she was "helping the police", until she figured out they suspected her.  There are killers who do this.  There are many criminals who will commit crimes or start fires and then show up and interject themself into the investigation.  There are also killers who write notes and taunt the police.  I always believe Melissa was reading other crime cases and following patterns of other killers she read about.  There are a lot of melissa's patterns that seem to fit other cases. 

I don't know if Melissa had read crime books, or read about them on the net, or what or who she was involved in, but I don't think she thought all of this up on her own. 

I think the intention was to go back to the pond and move the body, but for some reason that did not happen.  Somehow the whole pre-planned crime got all botched up.  I don't know what she thought she was doing by writing that note. 

[Tracygirl]

DD Johnny Williams did say where he saw her, I read it  somewhere, either the tracy press, the san joaquin hearld? He said he was driving back from stockton, so that would be on the 5 or the 205. What river crosses those freeways? I know you go on a bridge that passes over..oh man what is that river called? I have no idea I think. It is where the 120, the 5 and the 205 sort of meet up.

I will try to look for the article and post it.

[doubledecker]

I followed this case closely and have tons of news articles and notes.  I have all the links of the videos but they are no longer there. ugh.  but I copied as many articles as I could about everything.  They are all dated. 

on the photo of the truck I posted, in my notes I wrote this with the photo

this is the KIND OF TRUCK Cadet Memory said he saw on 4/3/09 with the suspicious man near the pond where sandra was found a week later.
this is also the area where the pond is... to your left of the photo where you see the pole things, that is the entrance to the pond just on the other side of those poles.

so if you go to the photo of the truck going down the road, and look to the left at the poles in the photo, the pond entrance is just on the other side of the poles.  I have pics of the whole area, let me find them.

[doubledecker]

DD Johnny Williams did say where he saw her, I read it  somewhere, either the tracy press, the san joaquin hearld? He said he was driving back from stockton, so that would be on the 5 or the 205. What river crosses those freeways? I know you go on a bridge that passes over..oh man what is that river called? I have no idea I think. It is where the 120, the 5 and the 205 sort of meet up.

I will try to look for the article and post it.

I'll look too, like I said, I copied so many articles.  maybe I have it. 

[Sister]

I have to wonder "why" the irrigation pond was chosen as the place of deposit for sandra's body.  It certainly was not deep and not a place that a body would stay hidden.  I personally believe there was never any intention for her to stay and be hidden away there.  I also wonder why choose Whitehall road, why write the note.  Why use your own suitcase, and then put it where it is obviously going to be found.  Why interject yourself into the case?  It was said melissa went to the police station and was acting like she thought she was "helping the police", until she figured out they suspected her.  There are killers who do this.  There are many criminals who will commit crimes or start fires and then show up and interject themself into the investigation.  There are also killers who write notes and taunt the police.  I always believe Melissa was reading other crime cases and following patterns of other killers she read about.  There are a lot of melissa's patterns that seem to fit other cases. 

I don't know if Melissa had read crime books, or read about them on the net, or what or who she was involved in, but I don't think she thought all of this up on her own. 

I think the intention was to go back to the pond and move the body, but for some reason that did not happen.  Somehow the whole pre-planned crime got all botched up.  I don't know what she thought she was doing by writing that note. 

DD, I agree.  I think it was to be a temporary location.  I still "feel" there is something significant about the suit-case.  I just don't know what it is.  It's late here, good night all -- go get 'em!!!
 

[doubledecker]

from my old notes
____________

Man Says He Knows Who Killed Sandra Cantu 4/9/09
Man Says He Knows Who Killed Sandra Cantu


By: Matthew Keys
Interview: Darsha Philips
FOX40 News

April 9, 2009

TRACY - Johnny Williams is sure he know who killed Sandra Cantu.

Williams drove from Oakland Sunday afternoon to hand-deliver his lead to Tracy police during an afternoon press conference. Afterward, he told media that he believes he saw Sandra with a man on a boat the week prior.

Now, speaking exclusively to FOX40 News, Williams says he spotted the same man talking with media the day after Sandra Cantu's body was found.

FOX40 News won't show the man Williams accuses of murdering Sandra Cantu; however, Williams describes the man as being "heavyset with a thick moustache."

Authorities told FOX40 Thursday afternoon that they've investigated Williams' lead with no results.

Sandra Cantu's body was recovered from a sealed piece of black luggage found floating in an irrigation canal by farm workers on Monday afternoon.

On Tuesday, the pastor of a Baptist church near Sandra Cantu's home had been questioned by police in connection with Sandra's murder. Pastor Lane Lawless denies having any connection to Sandra's murder.

Prior to her body's recovery, Sandra Cantu's father agreed to and passed a polygraph test given by authorities.

Authorities continue to insist that, while nobody has been ruled out as a person of interest, that they do not have one specific suspect or a group of suspects in mind that they are focusing on.





http://www.fox40.com/pages/landing_sand ... eedID=2674

[doubledecker]

from my old notes, and this link still works with the video of johnny williams.

april 9 2009
Did Police Follow Up Lead Of Man In Boat With Girl?
Video With Johnny Williams talking about the police not following up on his tip.

http://cbs13.com/crime/tip.boat.sandra.2.977073.html

[love4ever]

Just making note:



Nieto, Juan
Last Known Address:    

950 SULTANA DR
TRACY, 95376
County:    SAN JOAQUIN
Zip Code 95376

Description
Date of Birth:    06-10-1971
Sex:    MALE
Height:    5'6"
Weight:    160
Eye Color:    BROWN
Hair Color:    BROWN
Ethnicity:    HISPANIC

Offenses 
LEWD OR LASCIVIOUS ACTS WITH CHILD UNDER 14 YEARS

Scars/Marks/Tattoos 
SCAR NOSE

Known Aliases
FRANCO, JUAN NEIDO
FRANCO N, JUAN
FRANCONIETO, JUAN
HERNANDEZ, JESUS MUNOZ
NIETO, JUAN FRANCO

Just comparing pictures and the things noted in the article...

Snipped:

http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090508/A_NEWS/905080394/-1/A_COMM04

Margarita Franco had concerns of her own that day. Her children have attended Delta Island Elementary School, a campus with mostly migrant children, and a place that parents call more than a school. It's a community center. But the Tracy Unified School District, facing severe budget shortfalls, had decided to close the school - among the smallest in attendance and the most expensive per pupil to operate.

So Margarita Franco and several other parents were on a bus, touring area charter schools. She was focused on the needs of her children and whether she and other parents might be able to start a charter school.


Jose Franco has worked on the farm for 11 years, providing for his family and trying to create a better future for them.

Jose Franco decided a half-hour before the public event to accept the money in private. He wanted to avoid media attention.

I know that we can take things the wrong way at times, but sometimes when you
hit a dead end then you have to find a different direction. So I am just looking around.
Maybe I shouldn't be thinking so much?? Please do tell if I am...

I also look at this story and think why would someone do that, they would be scared that if anyone else was involved they would be told on? So again just looking around..


~Love~

[Tracygirl]

DD I think we may all be thinking the same thing here. The pond is not a spot to hide a child in a suitcase. Lets pretend for a moment that fred williams had sandra and Johnny wiliams did really see her and the cadet did see williams at the pond. Where does this leave us? I think it leads us to the first thought everyone had, MH didnt act alone. If she didn't act alone, then who helped her?

Who are our players? it seems Williams could have, we don't know where CL was that day, MH mom, where was she? Was she up in Tracy yet to pick up MH's daughter who they say was leaving with her the next day? Seems like she would come up and visit with everyone right? Sort of a long drive to do a one day trip. MH dad, uncle, cousins, siblings I think were said to have been at their perspective homes. MH's dad was said to not have spoken to his daughter in a long time, why? is that true? Why say that? Where did that come from? Who said it?  MH's daughter? There has been conflicting reports, she was there, not there...Connie lawless? She was supposed to be at home, but there is confusion if that is right or not.

[Tracygirl]

Love there was talk that maybe he is not legal so that is why he was not wanting the attention. not sure if that is true or not.

My opinion is he doesn't have anything to do with this, he was just the unfortunate person to have found it. Who knows really but I don't think he or the dairy was a part of this. Lets say the suitcase was left there to later transport, why then would the pond be drained?

But if the case was left there to later transport, where would they be taking it? Was it a place to store it until they could get rid of it? Why didn't they just throw it in the river or a lake or put it out in the middle of no where,there is plenty of "no where" in Tracy.  So why store it to move?

I am full of questions aren't I? lol. 

[doubledecker]

it also seems to me the suitcase should have risen in that pond.  was it anchored down?  there are cases where bodies rise to the surface when they have been anchored down with very heavy weights and in much deeper water.  HOw did she toss that suitcase out there anyway.  I probably could but where at was it tossed.  how would someone tossing it out in the pond even know if it would sink?  what if it didn't?

how do you know that pond is even out there in the first place?  if hardly anyone ever goes down that road, why would you just out of the blue go down that road and find the pond?  was this done in bright daylight ?  how would you see it at night to end up there? 

why would you not go put her in the delta mendota canal, like everyone else does?  or at least the river?  that pond is the craziest place in the world to put sandra in a suitcase. 

in the news you notice they say the note named two streets and the "word whitehall".  well the name of the street is whitehall.  so did she have 2 other streets names besides whitehall?  I posted over on THE NOTE thread about the note.

why do they say THE WORD whitehall.  was the note cyrptic?

[doubledecker]

Love there was talk that maybe he is not legal so that is why he was not wanting the attention. not sure if that is true or not.

My opinion is he doesn't have anything to do with this, he was just the unfortunate person to have found it. Who knows really but I don't think he or the dairy was a part of this. Lets say the suitcase was left there to later transport, why then would the pond be drained?

But if the case was left there to later transport, where would they be taking it? Was it a place to store it until they could get rid of it? Why didn't they just throw it in the river or a lake or put it out in the middle of no where,there is plenty of "no where" in Tracy.  So why store it to move?

I am full of questions aren't I? lol. 

we need to be full of questions because there is more to her METHOD than meets the eye, IMO.  I honestly believe everything was done for a reason, misspelling suitcase, the note, whitehall, etc.  why write a note in the first place.  And why didn't the police just go out there and find it if it gave specific locationns... makes you wonder if it was not a note with cryptic clues... and if so, why?  what was she doing that for? 

[doubledecker]

I had wondered if she had sandra's body out at the OLD RIVER where the cadaver dogs hit, before sandra was put in the pond.  if so, why was she moving her around? then giving clues...did she want to send the police on a wildgoose chase? then move her, then give another clue?  maybe she just wanted to watch them chase all over the place? if she really wanted to hide sandra's body for good she would have put her somewhere else, left her there and never wrote a note.  in the phone interview she seemed to think she was being a great help to the police.  what a weirdo. 

[Sister]

white hall as in the one as the church -- a white building?  A hall is usually was you call the outbuilding.

[doubledecker]

I just had a thought, maybe there was some other little girl who resembled sandra who was out in a boat with fred williams.  Melissa drugged another little girl, how do we know she didn't drug MANY or where did she really take these children.  maybe if johnny williams really saw fred out with some little girl, he took her back because he knew someone had seen him.  lots of maybes and what-ifs, but hey, you have to wonder. 

I also belive that note he wrote was for melissa from him.  but he worded it the way he did so no one would know he was talking to melissa himself.  just a thought.

[love4ever]

Love there was talk that maybe he is not legal so that is why he was not wanting the attention. not sure if that is true or not.

My opinion is he doesn't have anything to do with this, he was just the unfortunate person to have found it. Who knows really but I don't think he or the dairy was a part of this. Lets say the suitcase was left there to later transport, why then would the pond be drained?

But if the case was left there to later transport, where would they be taking it? Was it a place to store it until they could get rid of it? Why didn't they just throw it in the river or a lake or put it out in the middle of no where,there is plenty of "no where" in Tracy.  So why store it to move?

I am full of questions aren't I? lol. 

I have questions too Tracy Girl as you can see..lol..

I am thinking it was done in a panic maybe, I do not see anyone dumping it and then later going back to transport it. They would have left too many traces if they did that. And I wonder why they didn't throw it in the river like you and DD said? It is a very strange location to dispose of evidence.

And I understand about what you are saying about Franco, I just am looking at every one involved, putting it out there for feedback. It seems in this case anything is possible. And damn, I wish i could have been there to Help Sandra. It is so sad, so very sad..

~Love~

[doubledecker]

white hall as in the one as the church -- a white building?  A hall is usually was you call the outbuilding.

I had thought the white hall was also refering to the church.  I just did not want to get into all of my cryptic thoughts but if you mention it, yes, I think it could be just that.  It might also be a clue to some other crime. 

also whitehall is a street in westminster, connected to jack the ripper.  and westminster is also the town her mother lived in and the highschool her mother went to.  See I believe she was giving cryptic clues and then sitting back and watching the police.  This kind of behavior happens a lot with serial killers. 

[Tracygirl]

DD Why am I thinking I remember reading when the note was first talked about, it said Whitehall but the other street was said to be incorrect? Does anyone remember that? This is important. If it was the name of the two streets where the ponds are at, they would have just said both names.

[Sister]

So sick!!
Justice for our voiceless victims!!!!!!!!