Caylee Marie Anthony #138 6/18/09 - 6/21/09

[Cappuccino]

I am working on looking at where the bones were found as compared to the other evidence right now, specifically the piece of duct tape that was in a T shape.  My theory is if it was found with feet and leg bones it is a strong possibility it was used to bind the feet. The same theory would apply if it was found with arm and hand bones.  In my mapping with other evidence I came across this and had a HOLY SMOLY moment.  Casey has numerous pictures with a lollipop in her mouth.  Someone had mentioned that lollipops are associated with a certain drug IIRC.  It is very suspcious to me that the lollipop stick was found amoung the black plastic of the garbage bags. 

Yes, ecstasy.   As far as the hyoid missing, it could be animal activity or yes strangulation.  They cannot state so because there is no way to ultimately prove it with what they had to examine & the fact that animal activity could also explain it.   However, it won't leave the jurors minds that it is a highly probability.   IMHO certain things, like the several layers of duct tape will exhibit a premeditated murder out of spite after a final fit of rage.

[Fanny Mae]

KC would never cover up anything for Cindy -she would be the first one to point the finger at her.  remember it was Ciindy who call 911 because she wanted Caylee back.  If Cindy had not called the police-we would never know about Caylee.I dont like Cindy but she had nothing to do with Caylee death.  The EVIL ONE DID IT !!! but  Cindy is responsible for letting KC get away with everything-now including murder of that poor child. I cant understand how George and Cindy go out in public and defend KC-Stay in the house lock the doors and pull down the shades-and Cry and mourn poor Caylee

ITA! If Cindy was convicted of a crime, Casey would have loved to move into that house, have access to that bank account and run up what is left on those charge cards!

I don't think there is any way in the world that Skanky would take a fall for Spindy. Spindy is not going to take a fall for Skanky either. Spindy will not go down without a huge fight, and in the end, more stuff will come tumbling out of the closet before she will allow that to happen to herself. George is pretty much a sitting duck, but I think his sense of self-preservation will come out too. GEORGE IS A MAN THAT KNOWS LOTS OF THINGS. He is not the benign creature that his personna projects, or at least he tries to project. He is wiley, and as evil as the rest, maybe more. They are all lower than any disgust I feel for them. 

[Miki Monkey]

some more definitions on the Grave Wax- every site I go to has s lightly different definition- none of these suggest a very cold climate, only a cool one- the water and bacteria seems to be the biggy...  I would say that conditions have to be perfect for this to happen...


As forensic pathologists and anthopologists know, a body that has been submerged in water or in wet soil for a long time may form a soaplike substance called adipocere, which may develop in the outer layer of fat after three months or more.... It is estimated to become "complete in adult bodies" after "a year to a year and a half...." Adipocere was once thought to be caused by the body's fat turning literally into soap; actually it is due to the decomposition of the fat into insoluble salts of fatty acids, producing a yellowish-white substance popularly known as "grave wax." It usually forms in the face and buttocks, but may affect any part of the body. Depending on the subsequent conditions, the body may eventually take on the leathery effect of mummification, or may in time decompose completely.... 
http://www.shanmonster.com/witch/vampire/adipocere.html

In some circumstances, external bacteria may combine with wet conditions to turn the body tissues into a soapy wax-like substance. This is a rare situation, called adipocere and usually only involves part of the body. It is more likely to occur under water.
http://dmmoyle.com/didig.htm

Grave wax, or adipocere, is a crumbly white, waxy substance that accumulates on those parts of the body that contain fat - the cheeks, breasts, abdomen and buttocks. It is the product of a chemical reaction in which fats react with water and hydrogen in the presence of bacterial enzymes, breaking down into fatty acids and soaps. Adipocere is resistant to bacteria and can protect a corpse, slowing further decomposition. Adipocere starts to form within a month after death and has been recorded on bodies that have been exhumed after 100 years. If a body is readily accessible to insects, adipocere is unlikely to form.
http://www.deathonline.net/decomposition/body_changes/grave_wax.htm

so the question is...

This is highly possible for caylee's remains to develop this... in the conditions her remains were left in the swampy, wooded, shadded area...

so here is the question...how did the adipovere get on a paper towel in ITs car... did she go back and check on her at some point...and literally wipe her hands of it all...  not I'm more confused

Yes, I've been mulling that one over for a while but can't think of any scenario that fits and sounds logical, need monkey brains on this one...

[Fanny Mae]

I don't even recall seeing this name before.  Can someone refresh me as to who Rick Stone is please?

I believe when it came up before and was researched, he was a home inspector, or someone that comes into a residence to give an estimate on what the home may be worth. IIRC

[seemeatthebeach]

I don't even recall seeing this name before.  Can someone refresh me as to who Rick Stone is please?

IIRC he does house assessments, but I have to go back and read my notes to verify.

[Fanny Mae]

I don't even recall seeing this name before.  Can someone refresh me as to who Rick Stone is please?

I believe when it came up before and was researched, he was a home inspector, or someone that comes into a residence to give an estimate on what the home may be worth. IIRC

http://www.nachi.org/memberlist/featured/s.htm?PHPSESSID=d8bef5b4f9741419d3983244e1ce1280

[Cappuccino]

I don't even recall seeing this name before.  Can someone refresh me as to who Rick Stone is please?

His name & number appeared written on the backing of heart shaped stickers at the house

[Northern Rose]

Thank you all for the memory jolt.  I do remember the home inspection now.  Just forgot the specific name.

[Northern Rose]

To our male monkeys and Fathers everywhere

[no rose colored glasses]

some more definitions on the Grave Wax- every site I go to has s lightly different definition- none of these suggest a very cold climate, only a cool one- the water and bacteria seems to be the biggy...  I would say that conditions have to be perfect for this to happen...


As forensic pathologists and anthopologists know, a body that has been submerged in water or in wet soil for a long time may form a soaplike substance called adipocere, which may develop in the outer layer of fat after three months or more.... It is estimated to become "complete in adult bodies" after "a year to a year and a half...." Adipocere was once thought to be caused by the body's fat turning literally into soap; actually it is due to the decomposition of the fat into insoluble salts of fatty acids, producing a yellowish-white substance popularly known as "grave wax." It usually forms in the face and buttocks, but may affect any part of the body. Depending on the subsequent conditions, the body may eventually take on the leathery effect of mummification, or may in time decompose completely.... 
http://www.shanmonster.com/witch/vampire/adipocere.html

In some circumstances, external bacteria may combine with wet conditions to turn the body tissues into a soapy wax-like substance. This is a rare situation, called adipocere and usually only involves part of the body. It is more likely to occur under water.
http://dmmoyle.com/didig.htm

Grave wax, or adipocere, is a crumbly white, waxy substance that accumulates on those parts of the body that contain fat - the cheeks, breasts, abdomen and buttocks. It is the product of a chemical reaction in which fats react with water and hydrogen in the presence of bacterial enzymes, breaking down into fatty acids and soaps. Adipocere is resistant to bacteria and can protect a corpse, slowing further decomposition. Adipocere starts to form within a month after death and has been recorded on bodies that have been exhumed after 100 years. If a body is readily accessible to insects, adipocere is unlikely to form.
http://www.deathonline.net/decomposition/body_changes/grave_wax.htm

so the question is...

This is highly possible for caylee's remains to develop this... in the conditions her remains were left in the swampy, wooded, shadded area...

so here is the question...how did the adipovere get on a paper towel in ITs car... did she go back and check on her at some point...and literally wipe her hands of it all...  not I'm more confused

Yes, I've been mulling that one over for a while but can't think of any scenario that fits and sounds logical, need monkey brains on this one...

I'd like to know that also. But just because the article says that happens after a month, could it just have happened sooner? And when Casey got rid of Caylee's body she wiped her hands on the toweling?

[TURBOTHINK]

Blessed Sunday monkeys

If Casey wrapped this duct tape to stage a kidnap/murder she failed.   There is much too personal items in total to make that plausible, not even a nanny would have had certain items in possession due to previously caring for a child.   The biggest one that stands out to me is the heart shaped sticker - that is not something typically an abductor of any type would do.   Something of this nature is a sign of having been extremely personal with the victim or a serial killers "calling card" so to speak.  I truly believe that the backing where that heart shaped sticker originated from is in the possession of the State in evidence, straight out of Casey's room.  The evidence & what Casey did after the fact will also prove that she methodically attempted to blame "some other dudette or dude."

While the defense will try to throw anyone under the bus for this heinous crime, the facts will just not support it.  Previous computer searches on Casey's puter, cell pings, alibis of others at work, etc. will show that.  I do not believe any of the Anthonys knew Casey killed Caylee prior to 7/15, as much as I despise them the facts just do not support that either.  George was at work the night of the 15th, Cindy left for work between 7-8AM the next morning.  Yes, they feared the worse but that is obvious by Cindy calling Casey's friends & her myspace blog.  Cindy & George are carrying enormous guilt for knowing that things were out of control with no constructive remedy attempted, Cindy mainly because she knows the huge fight she had with Casey the evening of the 15th was the final trigger of what Casey ultimately did.  They failed to protect Caylee.   I watched their body language in court, it was an act on cue.  They were laughing before George spoke, when George blubbered at the podium he was quick to recover with contempt when he was questioned by the media outlet attorney.  George seemed rather miffed seated afterwards and even shunned Cindy's consoling at one point (approx 14 mins into hearing) before he stormed out -- to me he realized that their media bliss Cindy has insisted on slammed them in the face hard.  Their attorney bold face lied to the judge that all they talked about in these appearances were their fraud of a foundation in Caylee's name.   The fact that this defense team prayed on the Anthonys success to get this sealed is very telling as well, the reason Bozo didnt file a motion is because it would have made his client look all the more guilty requesting it be sealed.  He protested too hard while stating they were not worried about the autopsy report, this motion brought by the Anthonys was evidence that they all discussed at great length how to deal with the facts in the autopsy report & no doubt in my mind George lied to the judge that they had not read the report, you bet they did.  Their purpose Friday was not to save themselves from further grief, but to save Casey & also still give them a millimeter of room to be able to claim Caylee was missing so they can attempt to get their foundation off the ground.  The autopsy took away almost all doubt that Caylee was placed in the woods other than very shortly after her murder & links items having come directly from their home/by Casey placing them there.  They cannot even give their grandchild her dignity in death by not using her for their gain & to protect the monster they spawned.  The fact that George brought Caylee's picture as a prop, exhibits the staging...to coin my common phrase I use it was just too muckin fuch to be genuine.   Excuse this crudeness but it comes from the depth of extreme angst, yea George Happy Father's Day you miserable excuse of a man.

 

[TURBOTHINK]

I am working on looking at where the bones were found as compared to the other evidence right now, specifically the piece of duct tape that was in a T shape.  My theory is if it was found with feet and leg bones it is a strong possibility it was used to bind the feet. The same theory would apply if it was found with arm and hand bones.  In my mapping with other evidence I came across this and had a HOLY SMOLY moment.  Casey has numerous pictures with a lollipop in her mouth.  Someone had mentioned that lollipops are associated with a certain drug IIRC.  It is very suspcious to me that the lollipop stick was found amoung the black plastic of the garbage bags. 

Yes, ecstasy.   As far as the hyoid missing, it could be animal activity or yes strangulation.  They cannot state so because there is no way to ultimately prove it with what they had to examine & the fact that animal activity could also explain it.   However, it won't leave the jurors minds that it is a highly probability.   IMHO certain things, like the several layers of duct tape will exhibit a premeditated murder out of spite after a final fit of rage.

The reason ecstacy users always have suckers is because it causes the jaw to clinch very tightly.Jaw clenching and "clamping" is a common side-effect of ecstasy and many people get relief by chewing gum continuously or sucking on lollipops.

[Gypsy DD]

some more definitions on the Grave Wax- every site I go to has s lightly different definition- none of these suggest a very cold climate, only a cool one- the water and bacteria seems to be the biggy...  I would say that conditions have to be perfect for this to happen...


As forensic pathologists and anthopologists know, a body that has been submerged in water or in wet soil for a long time may form a soaplike substance called adipocere, which may develop in the outer layer of fat after three months or more.... It is estimated to become "complete in adult bodies" after "a year to a year and a half...." Adipocere was once thought to be caused by the body's fat turning literally into soap; actually it is due to the decomposition of the fat into insoluble salts of fatty acids, producing a yellowish-white substance popularly known as "grave wax." It usually forms in the face and buttocks, but may affect any part of the body. Depending on the subsequent conditions, the body may eventually take on the leathery effect of mummification, or may in time decompose completely.... 
http://www.shanmonster.com/witch/vampire/adipocere.html

In some circumstances, external bacteria may combine with wet conditions to turn the body tissues into a soapy wax-like substance. This is a rare situation, called adipocere and usually only involves part of the body. It is more likely to occur under water.
http://dmmoyle.com/didig.htm

Grave wax, or adipocere, is a crumbly white, waxy substance that accumulates on those parts of the body that contain fat - the cheeks, breasts, abdomen and buttocks. It is the product of a chemical reaction in which fats react with water and hydrogen in the presence of bacterial enzymes, breaking down into fatty acids and soaps. Adipocere is resistant to bacteria and can protect a corpse, slowing further decomposition. Adipocere starts to form within a month after death and has been recorded on bodies that have been exhumed after 100 years. If a body is readily accessible to insects, adipocere is unlikely to form.
http://www.deathonline.net/decomposition/body_changes/grave_wax.htm

so the question is...

This is highly possible for caylee's remains to develop this... in the conditions her remains were left in the swampy, wooded, shadded area...

so here is the question...how did the adipovere get on a paper towel in ITs car... did she go back and check on her at some point...and literally wipe her hands of it all...  not I'm more confused

Yes, I've been mulling that one over for a while but can't think of any scenario that fits and sounds logical, need monkey brains on this one...

I am still trying to figure out how the grave wax formed in June in Florida..and if she wiped her hands on the paper towel after partially cleaning the trunk..why did she leave the trash bag in there so long..why didn't she throw it in a dumpster somewhere....her logic defies reason.

[cece]

Cindy Anthony declares WAR
by:  justfoolinaround2
June 20, 2009:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/2MAmw1p5Avc&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/2MAmw1p5Avc&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1</a>

 

[Gypsy DD]

The trash bag being left in the car I was talking about was from TonE's..so this was left there to possibly set up TonE?   Any other person would have gotten rid of that trash bag as well..rather then place it in their trunk.

Also..we know the pizza was ordered by TonE's roomate..or that was speculated ...but..were there any receipts in that trash bag with dates?  If the date was two weeks after Caylee's death date..then I would say she kept the paper towels for a while in the trunk..took the trash bag, with trash in it, from TonE's at a later date to try to set them up.  There has to be some reason she didn't just throw that into a dumpster somewhere.

[tupelohoney]

The trash bag being left in the car I was talking about was from TonE's..so this was left there to possibly set up TonE?   Any other person would have gotten rid of that trash bag as well..rather then place it in their trunk.

Also..we know the pizza was ordered by TonE's roomate..or that was speculated ...but..were there any receipts in that trash bag with dates?  If the date was two weeks after Caylee's death date..then I would say she kept the paper towels for a while in the trunk..took the trash bag, with trash in it, from TonE's at a later date to try to set them up.  There has to be some reason she didn't just throw that into a dumpster somewhere.

Maybe she too thought it could be used to explain the smell!

[Nut44x4]

Cindy Anthony declares WAR
by:  justfoolinaround2
June 20, 2009:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/2MAmw1p5Avc&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/2MAmw1p5Avc&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1</a>

 

NOW......THAT is some funny shit!!  lmaoo

[Nut44x4]

  hope I don't get in trouble 4 that. Can't help it...that was funny cece 

[cece]

hope I don't get in trouble 4 that. Can't help it...that was funny cece 

 

I hope you don't get in trouble too Nut!  Then we both will.

I thought we could use a light moment since we have been discussing such a depressing subject.  Sorry to get off topic.  The discussion has been great & very helpful in understanding things.

[Fanny Mae]

After carefully reading the autopsy reports and letting it all sink in, it is certain that by the time Caylee was reported missing on July 15, she had already decomposed to a skeleton. Which means that on the night of June 20 when Casey was dancing in the hot body contest, Caylee's remains were already in the swamp with animals and insect feasting on her.

 I think June 18 was the date that Caylee was left in the swamp. Because of so many pieces of her bones were not found with the skull, (the original decomposition site).Many were found in groups when they were still articulated together. I don't think if she was dumped on June 24, which was when I always thought it was done. She would have been much closer to the skeleton stage especially in the hot trunk of Casey's car. I don't think the plastic bags would have held that much decomposition for that long.

It was stated in the autopsy reports that total skeletonization of her body would have taken two weeks in the heat and humidity. It hurts my heart to write these words.....