Lindsey Baum #2 7/10/09 - 7/28/09

[pink angel]

There are laws though already on the books that are not being funded or properly enforced. You can make all the laws in the world but if they are not being enforced or funded, they are just words on a page.

----------------

I meant to add a paragraph here about how our president and congress can vote to send millions and millions to foreign countries for aide, spend billions and billions to bail out banks and car companies but can't spend millions to protect our most precious resources...our children, our future....it makes me sick and it makes me ANGRY!!!

[Tamikosmom]

I agree rebel.

There are laws though already on the books that are not being funded or properly enforced. You can make all the laws in the world but if they are not being enforced or funded, they are just words on a page.

Short of executing sex offenders or sticking them all on an island full of lions and tigers and deadly snakes surrounded by a giant moat full of killer sharks and pirahna to fend for themselves "lord of the fly" style...my perfect wish list would include:
     
Stricter mandatory sentencing. If you are sentenced to 10 years, you do 10 years. No exceptions, no good time.

Second strike law. If a child molester re-offends, he is sentenced for life, no exceptions.

First time offenders will be GPS tracked for five years after their release date.

Once released, if you fail to register with the National Registry, you get sent back to prison for five years. No exceptions. No "homeless" crap. You must have an verifiable address or you get sent back to jail.

If you violate your parole, you get sent back to jail. No excuses, no exceptions. One year min. each violation. Added on to your sentence if you violate because of being charged for something else. Such as a drug charge. You get two years for having pot and one year additional for the parole violation.

These are just a few of my wish list.

Pink Angel

I agree 100% except ... in Tamikosmom's world there would never be a second chance for any adult who sexually abuses a child when it is considered the victim is forced to deal with the after-effects of a predator's selfish sick desires for a lifetime.

Janet

[pink angel]

I agree rebel.

There are laws though already on the books that are not being funded or properly enforced. You can make all the laws in the world but if they are not being enforced or funded, they are just words on a page.

Short of executing sex offenders or sticking them all on an island full of lions and tigers and deadly snakes surrounded by a giant moat full of killer sharks and pirahna to fend for themselves "lord of the fly" style...my perfect wish list would include:
     
Stricter mandatory sentencing. If you are sentenced to 10 years, you do 10 years. No exceptions, no good time.

Second strike law. If a child molester re-offends, he is sentenced for life, no exceptions.

First time offenders will be GPS tracked for five years after their release date.

Once released, if you fail to register with the National Registry, you get sent back to prison for five years. No exceptions. No "homeless" crap. You must have an verifiable address or you get sent back to jail.

If you violate your parole, you get sent back to jail. No excuses, no exceptions. One year min. each violation. Added on to your sentence if you violate because of being charged for something else. Such as a drug charge. You get two years for having pot and one year additional for the parole violation.

These are just a few of my wish list.

Pink Angel

I agree 100% except ... in Tamikosmom's world there would never be a second chance for any adult who sexually abuses a child when it is considered the victim is forced to deal with the after-effects of a predator's selfish sick desires for a lifetime.

Janet

I agree in a perfect world, Janet.

We don't live in a perfect world though and people that hurt our children are being given TOO many chances by our screwed up system. So many lawmakers are all about "rehabilitation and treatment" for these monsters. Which is a bunch of CRAP!

If we have to give them a chance, let them have one. That's IT.

[sunshine12]

this case is so frustrating...i cannot believe that nothing has been found yet...i hope that the residents of mccleary and the surrounding areas are paying very close attention to any strange behavior by neighbors, family, and friends. 

[madibabe]

KR - They would not tell us who has or has not been searched. We have seriously gotten little more then the following three phrases "We'll look into that", "nothing new" and "this is unrelated to Lindsey's disappearance..."

The beehive may have been checked after JVK from WS went over there but I don't even know that for sure. We've honestly seen little of them (LE).

Thank you Kara.

1.  Why did Melissa Baum not contact you until 10:25 PM?

2.  Why did Melissa Baum not contact 911 immediately following her conversation with you?

1) She very well may have tried to contact me before that. At the time I got her call I'd only shortly before that switched my phone back on because the battery was drained. At the time I actually talked to her I had 1 bar on my phone so it had not been on the charger very long. - And because I'm sure someone will wonder how I remember that it is because we almost immediately went out looking and during the first 30 minutes I had several short calls between me and Melissa just checking in making sure Lindsey hadn't shown up and then I had to drop my phone off at home and charge it because it was already going dead.

2) I can not tell you factually why or even if she waited 20 - 25 minutes to call them all I know is at the time she called me she was outside walking towards my house - so I would assume it was because she fully expected to see her walking up the street or she was still calling around to the other numbers on Lindsey's phone. - I've never seen any actual confirmation though that it was actually 10:50 either because in the time it took me to tell my old man what was going on, get my shoes and coat on and Scott to grab his keys and us to get to her house (a 2 minute drive) she was already waiting for the officer to show up. And I imagine it may have actually been slightly earlier then stated because the McCleary officer that Tacoma dispatch (i believe it was TD) called in had just got off duty and was at home and he lives outside of town and he was there at her house right about 11:00 pm.

Kara ... I live a 3 hour drive north of Seattle.  I noted that the sun had completely set by 9:50 PM in the days following Linsey's disappearance.

When I consider my grandchildren ... the time of night ... the lack of urgency prior to calling 911 ... I cannot make sense of the entire situation.

Janet

+++++++

I can't say anything about that except that at the time Lindsey left it was still light outside- actually it was about as light as the pics JVK posted. I am not the only one who keeps saying or has said that either, there is also the police who had no reason to lie about it, Melissa Baum, other residents and even "McCleary" (username) on web sleuths as well as others on the WS forums. If you've seen the pics over there you know at 9 it was still pretty light out.  10:15 was a different story though at that time it was dark. You would expect as we did that approximately a 7 minute walk would easily get her home before then. It is really not unusual to see good amount of light for a good hour or so after the sun starts to set which was around 9:15 or 9:20 or so this time of year. But then again today it was getting dark here by about 9pm.  Not to mention yet again that Lindsey is terrified of the dark and would have never walked out of my home alone if it would have been at all what she even considered dark - even if I would have told her to - she still would have asked to call her mom or asked for a ride home.

Stating that there was a lack of urgency really in my eyes is just your opinion and one that I suspect comes from the fact that you did not know Lindsey or Melissa but I have to respectfully disagree with that opinion- Here is a bit of background:

Lindsey was known to not always answer her phone and on more then one occasion try to talk someone into letting her stay over and notifying her mom was not a top priority so MB would find out when she showed up at ours or others homes looking for Lindsey or when she was calling around. She had every reason to suspect that Lindsey was actually inside a friends house which is exactly what I thought as well - knowing Lindsey.

- I know when I talked to Melissa she was very concerned and they were already out looking and were still calling around to Lindsey's friends homes. You don't know Lindsey though or her habits as her mother does. She was never outside after dark wandering around or walking the streets and if it was starting to get dark she always had someone with her and was on her way indoors. She never once left this house nor her mom's to my knowledge when it was dark out because she was terrified of the dark. If she stayed over here a little too late and it was dark outside or just in general if it was even evening and neither one of the girls were staying the night at each others houses she called her mom and she almost always came and picked her up (always if it was dark usually any other time) until their car broke down and after that before it got dark her bro would often show up to see if she was still here and walk home with her or my 3 oldest kids would walk her or sometimes she walked by herself (only if it was light out) but only once (without adult supervision) have I witnessed her outside after it was dark and at that time she was headed too my house and there were 3 of them together and they had to back track to a friends for something that was left behind otherwise they would have been here before dark. - Even then it was not even what I'd have considered dark - more dusky and my kids had their phone on them.

I understand that a lot of things to some seem "hinky" and that is fine when a person reads something in print and you get little snip-its fed to you here or there and that is combined with personal opinion and it is about something as important as a missing child which immediately fills you with a sense of fear and suspicion, to me that is to be expected and not something I'd ever look down on someone for nor would I want anyone to look down on me for it but you have to understand that every situation including this one there are things that affect situations that can only be understood if you actually know the individual(s) the behaviors and the place even.

Now this is not to try and sway any opinions because everyone forms their own based on their own facts or judgments nor is it to be defensive in any way or anything but I see so many opinions (not just here - everywhere- but here seems to be the best place to share them without major attack) that I really just have to put mine out there as well. --Seriously as much as many would like to portray MB as a bad or neglectful mom - she was not. MB tried damn hard to give her kids everything that they needed and then most of what they wanted while still being parental - (and I really am not concerned with  what a friend of a friend says because we all know how that goes - its only as good as the side of the story that wasn't told), she worked hard, raised her kids alone for several years and did the best that she could with the circumstances that she was dealt (as many of us have). She had rules and such with her kids but she couldn't always enforce those because she had to work and with some things in life there is only so much you have control over. She took her kids to the park, to the beach, the movies, got them phones to help keep an eye on them, sold girl scout cookies, had family night, showed up for parent-teacher conferences, called her kids' friends and drove to their houses if Lindsey didn't check in, put them into sports etc and like every other mom out there - she wasn't perfect - I think at times like these many forget that no one is perfect and I've met great moms but I've never met one that was perfect or even close for that matter.

KARAK I just want to say I'm sorry if my post about parental guidance made you feel I was criticizing MB. I did not intend it to. I will tell you what I was actually feeling. I was thinking how sad it is when a little girl has to disappear for you to realize you should keep an eye on your children a little closer. That is what I was telling myself at the time about my parenting skills. I am not meaning to bash MB. I feel it could happen to any one of our children, day or night . It could be me in her place as i have and continue to make mistakes. It only takes a second. My family's thoughts and prayers are with her  and her family. When I think of her pain i cant imagine how crushed she is.  I am sorry for implying she did not supervise her children enough.  Its not what I meant.

[mamacrazy30]

while we debate who is a "good" person or a "bad" person, Lindsey is still missing...everyone is involved until proved otherwise...we are not a court of law...
it's a court of public opinion........

[madibabe]

Hey mamacrazy,
We know this! Everyone is doing all they can possible think of to help.

[rebelgirl901]

I agree rebel.

There are laws though already on the books that are not being funded or properly enforced. You can make all the laws in the world but if they are not being enforced or funded, they are just words on a page.

Short of executing sex offenders or sticking them all on an island full of lions and tigers and deadly snakes surrounded by a giant moat full of killer sharks and pirahna to fend for themselves "lord of the fly" style...my perfect wish list would include:
     
Stricter mandatory sentencing. If you are sentenced to 10 years, you do 10 years. No exceptions, no good time.

Second strike law. If a child molester re-offends, he is sentenced for life, no exceptions.

First time offenders will be GPS tracked for five years after their release date.

Once released, if you fail to register with the National Registry, you get sent back to prison for five years. No exceptions. No "homeless" crap. You must have an verifiable address or you get sent back to jail.

If you violate your parole, you get sent back to jail. No excuses, no exceptions. One year min. each violation. Added on to your sentence if you violate because of being charged for something else. Such as a drug charge. You get two years for having pot and one year additional for the parole violation.

These are just a few of my wish list.

That's a great list....I'm tired of repeat offenders....These people do not get rehabilitated..I agree with you that these laws need to be enforced and there should be harsher penalties for these scumbags.

[rebelgirl901]

I meant to add a paragraph here about how our president and congress can vote to send millions and millions to foreign countries for aide, spend billions and billions to bail out banks and car companies but can't spend millions to protect our most precious resources...our children, our future....it makes me sick and it makes me ANGRY!!!

I hear ya....Girl, don't even get me started on what I think of our current administration.  I'm so ANGRY I could spit nails.       They don't care about the people of this country PERIOD!

[love4ever]

If the neighbour's observation is credible ... the implication is that Lindsey Baum went missing within five minutes of arriving home.  Lindsey was only two blocks from her home at the time she was observed walking on Maple Street near Fifth Street.

Think about it.

NOBODY other than Kara Kampen and Scott Williams had any knowledge where Lindsey would be in that short timeframe.  Scott Williams has taken and passed a polygraph.  Melissa Baum has taken and passed a polygraph.

If Lindsey was abducted ... the short timeframe dictates that it would have been a crime of opportunity ... not a plan.

However ... the silence ... encompassing both Josh Baum and Wayne Watne ... is deafening.

Janet

++++++

IN THE PROCESS OF ELIMINATION

JOSH BAUM

I am not accusing Josh Baum of being involved in Lindsey’s disappearance but ... when the argument which occurred minutes earlier between Lindsey and her brother is considered as well as other underlying dynamics encompassing the brother/sister relationship … it is my contention that unless questioned and ruled out Josh Baum cannot be disregarded as a person of interest who may have connected with his sister as she walked the final two blocks home or … following her arrival at home.

Lindsey Baum:  Facebook Entry

TWILIGHT FREAK is happy that her brother is going to juvi tomorrow.Mood: happ at 14:10 17 Jun view more

Lindsey Baum is happy that her brother is going to juvie tomorrow.
Mood: Happ at 14:10 17 June

http://www.myspace.com/477760045


Melissa Baum:  Physical Confrontation

KING 5 News – July 2, 2009

If a stranger kidnapped 10-year-old Lindsey Baum, her mother says the girl would have put up a fight

“She has very long fingernails,” said Melissa Baum. “Her brother is proof enough of that.”

http://www.king5.com/topstories/stories/NW_070209WAB-mccleary-KS.67b0a9.html


Melissa Baum:  Heated Argument?

ABC News - June 30, 2009

Baum said she last saw her daughter when Lindsey, along with her 12-year-old brother, Josh, headed out to Lindsey's friend's house in hopes she could get permission to spend the night at the Baum's house.

Baum said her children began squabbling over the use of Josh's bike on the way there and were stopped by a family friend who sent Josh home to end the argument. Lindsey continued on to her friend's house.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=7966924&page=1


Residents of McCleary Speak Out

mlachester 1 day ago wrote:

To answer the questions everyone has asked, Yes I have talked to police and as far as things being unfounded its more of lazy work by cps and I don't know what the police were thinking. Since Lindsey has gone missing I have helped serch and put fliers up. I was called by the agents investigating and told them what I know. And this is no nick name everyone in McCleary knows who I am. Its no big secret she had came to my house to call 911 when her brother had done things to her. I hope lindsey is hiding and she finds a way to get to someone for help to tell them why. But as everyday gose by the fear gets worse.

http://www.king5.com/topstories/stories/NW_063009WAB-Mccleary-girl-search-LJ.1fc0b759.html?ocp=2#slcgm_comments_anchor

Credit: Northern Rose


mlachester 2 hours ago wrote:

I am close to her and I know a lot more than the media or law enforcement are saying right now. … Sorry if you don't like the truth but I have never been one to keep the truth in and she should of been taken the first time she called 911 from my house asking for help instead of put in a police car and taken back to her abuser!"

http://www.king5.com/topstories/stor...omments_anchor

Credit: Northern Rose


mamahead 13 hours ago wrote:
 
Lindsey has been afraid of her brother for a very long time. He has threatned her many times. Where is she? And why is the mother not crazy with sadness or emotion. Show us some tears. The friend that Lindsey was last with shows more emotion than the mother. And why was the brother begging for money for fireworks at his little sisters candlelight vigil?

http://www.king5.com/topstories/stories/NW_070609WAB-missing-mccleary-girl-SW.14c01624.html

Credit: Northern Rose


KaraK
Re: Lindsey Baum, 10y missing from McCleary, WA 6/26/09
« Reply #1762 on: July 09, 2009, 12:42:02 AM »

*** Does Lindsey's brother have a standing reputation in the community ??

Yes, not a real good one - with the kids at least. I have not met anyone who claims to be his friend.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5541.msg870856#msg870856

Kara Kampen – Mother of Lindsey’s friend Michaela.


KaraK
Re: Lindsey Baum, 10y missing from McCleary, WA 6/26/09
« Reply #1602 on: July 08, 2009, 01:51:08 AM »

Lindsey's brother has a temper but to seriously hurt her I do not think so -  I've seen them fight and argue numerous times and know he gets mad for a minute and then he's over it. They both are a bit temperamental but he especially thinks highly of Lindsey and nothing in me since she's gone missing made me think he was any way involved. - Now that is just my gut feeling topped with the lack of any form of transportation.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5541.msg869280;topicseen#msg869280

Kara Kampen – Mother of Lindsey’s friend Michaela.


KaraK
Re: Lindsey Baum, 10y missing from McCleary, WA 6/26/09
« Reply #1809 on: July 09, 2009, 04:33:45 AM »

Josh had gotten into so many spats that honestly were in a large part things he did not start but because he was the oldest he was the one who got in trouble. I've set down kids I've never met before to have a talk with them because I heard that they were antagonizing him to see if he'd blow up.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5541.msg871164;topicseen#msg871164

Kara Kampen – Mother of Lindsey’s friend Michael.


KaraK
Re: Lindsey Baum, 10y missing from McCleary, WA 6/26/09
« Reply #1795 on: July 09, 2009, 03:13:01 AM »

I am no Dr and I never dug but he does take medication for some condition - more mental than physical. He is not what kids would call "cool" and strikes you as being younger than he actually is if you talk to him. He came over a few times and we'd talk about something and he'd start jabbering about something completely off topic - when we were all out looking for Lindsey I was trying to talk to him about where we'd already looked and he just wanted to know if my son could come over the next day. So I guess you could say unfocused.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5541.msg871046;topicseen#msg871046

Kara Kampen – Mother of Lindsey’s friend Michaela


WAYNE WATNE

I am not accusing Wayne Watne of being a participant in the disappearance of Lindsey Baum but … considering the location of his residence in relation to the Baum residence ... considering Wayne Watne’s connection to both Josh and Lindsey ... is it possible there was an encounter with Lindsey at approximately 9:30 PM on the evening of June 26, 2009?

Wayne Watne - Residential Address

400 S 3RD ST
MCCLEARY, WA 98557-9658
GRAYS HARBOR COUNTY
(05/2008-05/2008)
Credit: doubledecker




Credit: doubledecker


The Daily World – July 1, 2009

Lindsey was in Girl Scouts. She went to church at the Evergreen Christian Center in McCleary, an offshoot of a larger church in west Olympia.
 http://**/articles/2009/07/01/local_news/doc4a4ba94721f78989072462.txt


The Daily World – July 1, 2009

Wayne Watne of Evergreen Christian Community in Olympia and two other local ministers said prayers for Lindsey’s return. Watne took speakers from the assembled crowd. Friends of the family stepped up, taking turns expressing their hope and their pain.
http://**/articles/2009/07/01/local_news/doc4a4baa38c6082474655699


KaraK
Re: Lindsey Baum, 10y missing from McCleary, WA 6/26/09
« Reply #1245 on: July 05, 2009, 11:23:14 PM »

Josh does not have any regular friends that I am aware of but I will ask around but I know Wayne Watne tries to help out there by taking him fishing and there may be other adults and such that have stepped in to provide friendship as well. Most of the time that I see Josh he is hanging out with Lindsey and my 10 and 11 yr old.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5541.msg865772#msg865772


Examiner - July 1, 2009

Lindsey’s Girl Scout troop leader, Becky Spalding said, “I had to tell her to be quiet because she was laughing all the time. It’s very unbelievable. You see this on the news, but you never know anyone who it’s happened to.”

Wayne Watne, a member of the Evergreen Christian Community Church and representative of Harvest Vision Ministries said prayers for Lindsey’s return.

http://www.examiner.com/x-1168-Crime-Examiner~y2009m7d1-Emotional-vigil-held-for-missing-Washington-girl-Lindsey-Baum

When I read all of this it made me ill, I dont like any of this...

[Edward]

Tamiksomom..
Logic Dictates.. Nice job on that compilation.

[Northern Rose]

Reader comment:

BUTTERFLYWINGS 8 hours ago wrote:
we need to know more about the situation that happened in tumwater on wednesday. this might be a break. 3 men tried to lure a young girl. they were driving a pick-up truck. the men chased this girl and she got away thank God.

http://www.king5.com/localnews/south/stories/NW_071509WAB-lindsey-baum-family-TP.43f9a323.html

[no rose colored glasses]

Reader comment:

BUTTERFLYWINGS 8 hours ago wrote:
we need to know more about the situation that happened in tumwater on wednesday. this might be a break. 3 men tried to lure a young girl. they were driving a pick-up truck. the men chased this girl and she got away thank God.

http://www.king5.com/localnews/south/stories/NW_071509WAB-lindsey-baum-family-TP.43f9a323.html

I have been wondering about this myself, but I really think that Lindsey knew the person, but anything is possible.

[Tamikosmom]

Reader comment:

BUTTERFLYWINGS 8 hours ago wrote:
we need to know more about the situation that happened in tumwater on wednesday. this might be a break. 3 men tried to lure a young girl. they were driving a pick-up truck. the men chased this girl and she got away thank God.

http://www.king5.com/localnews/south/stories/NW_071509WAB-lindsey-baum-family-TP.43f9a323.html

I have been wondering about this myself, but I really think that Lindsey knew the person, but anything is possible.

... and so does the FBI.

Good Morning Monkeys!

Janet
7:55 AM PT

+++++

FBI: Stranger not likely behind girl's disappearance
Story Published: Jul 1, 2009 at 7:35 PM PDT
Story Updated: Jul 2, 2009 at 1:09 PM PDT

Experts with the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children say if the girl was abducted, it most likely wasn't by a stranger who was hiding in the bushes.

"From what knowledge we have and the information that I have that it's someone that she possibly knows, somebody that is in the area," said Henry Schmidt with the organization.

The FBI now wants neighbors to think about anyone who may have been in the area Friday night. They also want to hear about anyone suddenly engaging in strange behavior, such as not showing up for work, selling their car for no reason or changing their appearance.

"We're certainly not looking for a witch hunt or anything of that sort, but the bottom line is we have a missing girl. And so anyone who is in this area is going to be someone we want to talk to," said Ron Twersky, FBI assistant special agent in charge.

http://www.komonews.com/news/49651607.html

[pink angel]

http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng&gi=FLB

Lighting a candle and saying a prayer for Lindsey to come home.

[Tamikosmom]

LINDSEY BAUM
MISSING FROM McCLEARY WASHINGTON

http://www.lindseybaum.com/

[mamacrazy30]

Hey mamacrazy,
We know this! Everyone is doing all they can possible think of to help.

i wasn't trying to be snippy and i'm sorry....my point was we are on Lindsey's side...no one else....when she is found is when we can apologize to whomever for whatever....it's about Lindsey now.

[Tamikosmom]

I pray that the silence in the media in regards to the Lindsey Baum case does not imply the case is being allowed to go cold.  Hopefully, stuff is going on behind the scenes that will provide the truth encompassing the events that took place within the last two blocks of of this little girl's journey home.

Janet
8:30 PM PT

[sunshine12]

apparently searchers today were searching the woods that connect to part of the offroading park where the caretaker was fired a week ago and his computer confiscated..apparently the man's daughter was friends w/lindsay..has anyone else heard this?

[no rose colored glasses]

apparently searchers today were searching the woods that connect to part of the offroading park where the caretaker was fired a week ago and his computer confiscated..apparently the man's daughter was friends w/lindsay..has anyone else heard this?

No, I have not very interesting.