Natalee Case Discussion #822 7/28/09 - 8/13/09

[texasmom]

Hi, TM, Cajun Miracle and others. 

Had a storm come through here earlier....just thought Natalee's might need you to light her way.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5700.msg878415#msg878415

See you all, later.  Goodnight.   

Hi 2NJ!  You sure are getting your share of storms lately!  Thanks for the reminder about the candle links, I meant to do that earlier and got sidetracked.

Good night 2NJ!   

[cajun miracle]

Hi, TM, Cajun Miracle and others. 

Had a storm come through here earlier....just thought Natalee's might need you to light her way.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5700.msg878415#msg878415

See you all, later.  Goodnight.   

Stay safe/

[texasmom]

REMINDER:

From "Loving Natalee: The True Story of the Aruba Kidnapping and Its Aftermath" 

by Beth Holloway (paperback edition)


Pages 232-235

Epilogue

November 18, 2008

Dutch crime reporter Peter de Vries was apparently just getting started when he discovered those astonishing facts about Natalee’s case discussed in the previous chapter.  His investigation concluded with a remarkable taped confession from Joran van der Sloot himself.  Perhaps you saw the ABC News 20/20 special in 2008 on “The Disappearance of Natalee Holloway,” during which Joran’s confession was broadcast.  Joran was videotaped as he told an undercover informant that he was with Natalee when she experienced some kind of seizure and might have died.  He said he didn’t know what to do, so he decided to get rid of her body.  He confessed that he arranged for someone with a boat to dump her body at sea.

He said he wasn’t sure if she was still alive or not.

But Natalee had never had a seizure.  Never in her whole life.

So with this confession, now I know what happened to her.

Natalee was never in a crack house.  She was never in that jeep.  She was never in that restaurant or that pizza parlor.  She was never in a brothel or hidden away on a cruise ship.  She was never in all those awful places we searched day in and day out for months, hoping to find her.

When she was least able to defend herself, she was taken.  She was escorted out of Carlos ‘n Charlie’s by Joran and his friends and never seen again.  I believe she was given a date rape drug and overdosed, producing that “seizure” he tells about.  But we’ll never have the opportunity to find out what actually happened, because Joran van der Sloot said he called someone to dispose of her body.  He didn’t call for help for Natalee.  He didn’t try to get medical attention.  He just got rid of her.

Even with this confession, the Aruban authorities will not take action against the judge’s son.  There is nothing I can do to get justice for Natalee.  They just don’t do things like we do.  Their system isn’t like ours.

Since 2005 I’ve certainly learned a great deal about things I never wanted to learn.  Being a teacher, I found myself asking, “What can I teach others from our tragic lessons? What can I do for others who have done so much for us?”  That’s why I’m still focused on the two goals I talk about in the “Lessons” chapter.  Talking to students about personal safety and travel safety is still my primary goal, and I’m delighted that I’ve had the opportunity to visit numerous high school and college campuses to deliver my message---Natalee’s message.  I want to continue these safety presentations as well as make my Travel Ed Workshop available to travelers of all ages.  The Travel Ed Workshop is a pre-departure preparation workshop.  For more about these presentations, please contact info@traveledworkshop.com.

A number of years have passed since Natalee disappeared and I understand now how grief changes colors over time.  It never goes away---just changes, softening ever so slightly.  Natalee would be very proud of her brother, Matt, who is fulfilling his dream of becoming a professional pilot.  The solo flights he has made to visit his grandmother in Arkansas seem to give him the greatest sense of accomplishment.  He is majoring in aviation and business and will finish college soon.  I’ve gone back to teaching part time; having regained the capacity to meet the demands of my precious special needs preschoolers.  Mom and I still get together for family reunions at the lake.  The friends who stood by me are still standing by.  Sunny still helps me prepare for speaking engagements and travels with me around the country.  And on these trips I get to meet people who remember what our family endured---who remember Natalee—and their kind words of encouragement still give me great comfort.  Natalee would be a senior in college now, and I imagine she would be looking at medical schools—and they would be looking at her.  She had such big plans.  I feel the saddest when I think about everything she missed out on.

I wanted to communicate in this book how hope evolved in three distinct phases to see us through our tragedy.  In the first phase, we had the hope to find Natalee.  That dissolved, ebbed, as those early days passed.  But hope reappeared in the second phase: the hope to find out what happened to her.  With Joran’s taped confession I suppose we have that answer.  Finally, I guess you could say I’m still living in the third, sustaining phase: the hope that I can do something to help others avoid getting into a tragic situation.  Natalee could have been anyone.  Maybe your son or daughter.  Maybe you.  I’ll deliver Natalee’s story and message of personal safety for as long as I’m able.  If even just one life is saved, then I’ll know this mission was essential.  And if even just one young person thinks twice about his or her personal safety, then I’ll know it was successful.

Peter de Vries won an international Emmy Award in 2008 for his undercover investigation that yielded Joran’s confession.  Many speculate whether this will be the final work in Natalee’s case or not.

I still believe there’s more.

[texasmom]

This is an older article I came across tonight.  I found it interesting, thought someone else might also.

http://www.korps-politie-suriname.com/nieuws/nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/archief%20nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/2005/2005-08-nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/2005-08-nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal.htm

August 11, 2005

Starting Prosecutor Wouter Gerretschen:

'Task would be more appropriate and magistrates to enter must'

ORANGE CITY - After three years in Aruba working is Prosecutor Wouter Gerretschen went back to the Netherlands. The man who during criminal full of passion and sharpness are indictment was acknowledged that violent crime and vice by cutting him a lot. And then there's' integrity '. Anyone who doubts the integrity of the Public Prosecutor (OM) and Gerretschen itself, with him to the wrong address.
 
Currently, it is significant for depression, because the case of missing Natalee Holloway. Gerretschen looked at the matter from a distance, because he was not heavily involved.

"That is what other colleagues."

The pressure, both external and internal, was for him noticeable. "This missing matter is grown out of all proportions. The media attention was overwhelming. The organization feels that pressure, but should still continue to do its work. "

This pressure is independent of the Holloway case, more present than in the Netherlands.

"The island is so small that everyone everywhere to know and think. Even if it is the work of the OM is, "said the departing officers. "We take decisions based on the law. Sometimes people find something behind a decision that there is not. I know, at least for myself, my decisions come from purely legal considerations. Personal motives play no role. Indeed, when a matter close to the personal, then I myself obliged to transfer the case. "Gerretschen this in Aruba do not have, but in the Netherlands is over him.

Before Gerretschen came to Aruba, he worked in Arnhem in the Serious Crime Department. He was district officer in Roermond. When he was through the internal channels of the judicial vacancy for prosecutor in Aruba saw, he decided to respond. "I always want to gain work experience outside the Netherlands. The Netherlands Antilles and Aruba in this respect technical easy to switch to car. The system here is similar to that in the Netherlands. After a few weeks you will be working and you can participate. "
 
FRONTIER

Gerretschen had in Aruba, inter alia, the 'frontier' in his portfolio. Customs, Coast Guard, warda nos costa and the airport police. In addition, he was more district officer for San Nicolas and as prosecutor in charge of military affairs. "In the Netherlands you do not have such broad responsibility. I think that limit work very interesting. "At the same time he knows now that there are in Aruba. "Take smuggling. That is punishable in the Netherlands and there is heavy to lift. Here is just behind the law.

Last Four people drowned when the captain probably in too deep water to land continued.

The OM has no opportunities for that master to prosecute. That frustrates. "But Aruba does his best to legislation. According Gerretschen has recently been adapted zedenwet. "It is unfortunate that they are not more things from the Netherlands to take over. The Dutch legal system is now applied once. Aruba Why reinvent the wheel, while the Netherlands already running? "
 
POLICE

"The police in Aruba is working hard and do good work in cooperation with the OM." Gerretschen do not want to hear that this was not so. "They have limited resources and the Corps is also small in proportion. Of course they sometimes fall stabbing. Where work is indeed made mistakes. That's when nothing else. "Examples of cooperation are good enough, says Gerretschen.

He calls the murder of a man in Sabana Basora, the Technical Research, despite a lack of adequate resources for the breakthrough in the case and the wife provided the murder known. And in the case involving two small children were robbed and gagged, the search of Bubali the case very quickly.

Still sounds Gerretschen on a critical note. "The OM in Aruba provides in many cases and to a large extent the strategy of the investigation. The officer gives to the witness should be heard, or investigation to be conducted. The OM is not a specialist in this field. In the Netherlands, the tactical decision among the police themselves. On Aruba it is all too often in the OM, while the role of the OM I think a more appropriate toetsende and magistrates should be. "
 
EXTENSION TO
Wednesday is Gerretschen, together with his wife and children, flew back to Holland. He is a repatriation guarantee in Arnhem, but he will not go. The National Wood his new employer. "The National Prosecutor sends amongst other things, the National Recherche to. There are five units. One is located in Zwolle and area as smuggling and trafficking. Since I work. "Gerretschen has a lot of sense.

"Am I missing Aruba? In some areas very much. But the challenge of working in the Netherlands are all I see. "Gerretschen is followed by two new prosecutors. Dop Kruimel begin on September 1, Casper van der Schaft on November 1.

(Amigoe / myrtle the Rozario)

[texasmom]

Another interesting article considering what we know now.   

http://www.korps-politie-suriname.com/nieuws/nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/archief%20nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/2005/2005-08-nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/2005-08-nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal.htm

Google translation:

August 4, 2005

FBI center during proceedings Kalpoe and Van der Sloot

ORANGE CITY - The FBI, the documents and free access to Joran van der Sloot were yesterday afternoon at three short center court by his lawyers were instituted. The lawyers of the Kalpoe brothers had of themselves heard. They are against the pass and inappropriately access into the files. Judge Smith was from Curacao have come to the business deal.
 
The first appeal with Van der Sloot was about the involvement of the FBI in the investigation of Natalee Holloway. "The FBI is investigating a foreign power without in Aruba. The defense affected in the dark about the legal basis for involvement," said attorney Anthony Carlo opposite Amigoe. "It is not clear how far the involvement of the FBI is." Carlo said further that the defense has no view on the way to the study.

The documents were the subject of the second interim relief. The lawyers of Van der Sloot do not agree with the way they get the documents. According to Carlo, in the interest of the defense that this is done. "It is not clear whether the documents we receive are complete. Furthermore, we do not always timely."

The third appeal that was held Wednesday, had to do with the earlier decision that Van der Sloot from the Institute Korrektie Aruba (KIA) may be transferred to a police station in order to be interrogated.
 
In fact this was last week by defending a case brought and lost. Immediately started the interviews with Dutch experts involved. According to Carlo, the free access of the defense to his client is limited by the manner of questioning. "The KIA has a house rule that lawyers only during office hours free access to their clients.

Our client is hearing from the KIA transferred to a police station. Sometimes this hearing until after office hours and then we no longer have the opportunity to speak to him then, "said Carlo. He explained that Van der Sloot after the interviews directly back to the KIA and that he is not a possibility to his client at the police station to speak.
 
INSPECTION

For the lawyer Deepak Kalpoe, Rudi Oomen, was the basis for interim relief the fact that in his opinion only and inappropriately access to various parties is given in the file: "The rights of a defendant to be prejudiced." With 'several parties' lawyers also refers to the FBI. "They may have access to ad hoc file without that supervision, according to the rules set by law." According to Oomen, this is because the Holloway case is much pressure from various sides.

The lawyer Satish, Deepak's brother, had an appeal brought. Like Oomen put David Kock questioned how the FBI is involved in the investigation.

The Public Prosecutor (OM) believes that reliance on the FBI justified, because the FBI has expertise in Aruba is not present. The U.S. investigation is asked for advice and that is the OM allowed. About the law says that for the cooperation of the FBI is done on the basis of an agreement between the Kingdom and the United States.
 
In none of the brief court ruling is made. Judge Smith gave no deadline to decide which he will do. But as Carlo Oomen do not expect this will last long.

(Amigoe)

[texasmom]

Truth & Justice for Natalee!

[hotping]

Thanks TM and Good Night! 

[texasmom]

Thanks TM and Good Night! 

You're welcome!  Good night Hotping, see you later!   

[texasmom]

Recently when we were discussing Taco Stein, Anna mentioned the incident about a judicial official with child pornography on his computer.  I think this article mentions what she was remembering then.

I'm sure Taco Stein will be relieved that we know for sure who that was now.   

http://www.korps-politie-suriname.com/nieuws/nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/archief%20nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/2005/2005-05-nieuwsbronnen-internationaal/2005-05-nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal.htm

Google translation:

May 12, 2005

Taco Stein new chief officer in St. Maarten
 

Philipsburg - With the publication of the name of Taco Stein as new chief prosecutor in St. Maarten is all rumors about the possible arrival of the discredited hit officer Joost Tonino an end. Second officer from the Netherlands Justice in the Windward Island will strengthen Dikran Sarian.
 
The two newcomers to replace the now retired Cor Merx, the number of officers on St. Maarten in four, Johan de Vrieze and Paul Mooij remain highly likely. The Vrieze denied yet again that there never has been that Tonino would. "He has never applied and was never in the picture for the post here."

The Amigoe reported three weeks ago that the arrival of Tonino case. The officer who last year was negative in the news by a laptop with important information to the Justice coarse dirt to seem themselves in an untenable position to have maneuvered now child pornography on the same computer showed it.
 
Following a number of publications in other newspapers asked former Secretary of State Edgar Lynch today Erno Labega (DP, St. Maarten) - also in charge of Justice - for clarification. The Vrieze angry at the fact that he was never informed to verify accuracy.

The new prosecutors will arrive in August or September. At this time the prosecution seeks the appointment of an environmental expert Paul Mooij years. Attorney General Dick Piar confirms that. "Given the developments in St. Maarten, we think the need for an additional prosecutor to have." (Amigoe)



http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joost_Tonino

Google translation:

Joost Tonino

Joost Tonino (1966) until 12 October 2004 an English officer of justice. He laid down his work after he had been discredited, after a broadcast of Peter R. de Vries. In this broadcast was revealed that Tonino his private computer on the street was put down due to a computer. After a taxi driver had picked up this computer and had returned to Peter R. de Vries found this information confidential and child pornography to. De Vries said that "far-reaching love" could be found, and information on investigations of Tonino. The computer was actually succeed with sledgehammer by the prosecution destroyed.

On 2 June 2006 by the Court in The Hague decided that Tonino not need to be prosecuted for possession of child pornography on his computer, after the foundation Child Right tried to ensure that the public prosecutor would prosecute Tonino still, despite the earlier decision of Justice not to do so. According to research Tonino had just downloaded the material from "normal" sex websites without much effort to do [1].

This affair Tonino worked in the prosecutor in Amsterdam, where he high-profile fraud cases accounted for. As a result of negative publicity around his person, he left it to Amsterdam and left it to the functional position.

In May 2008 it became known that the OM Tonino had left. Since May 13, 2008 he enrolled as a lawyer in Amsterdam.

Another article about the incident here:

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=nl&u=http://www.klokkenluideronline.nl/artikel/276/joost-tonino-definitief-op-zijspoor.html&ei=pQ2BSuf0HqGBtwetwsXMCg&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=3&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3D%2522Joost%2BTonino%2522%26hl%3Den

[texasmom]

Good to see you ArtColley! 

[texasmom]

Recently when we were discussing Taco Stein, Anna mentioned the incident about a judicial official with child pornography on his computer.  I think this article mentions what she was remembering then.

I'm sure Taco Stein will be relieved that we know for sure who that was now.   

http://www.korps-politie-suriname.com/nieuws/nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/archief%20nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal/2005/2005-05-nieuwsbronnen-internationaal/2005-05-nieuwsbronnen%20internationaal.htm

Google translation:

May 12, 2005

Taco Stein new chief officer in St. Maarten
 

Philipsburg - With the publication of the name of Taco Stein as new chief prosecutor in St. Maarten is all rumors about the possible arrival of the discredited hit officer Joost Tonino an end. Second officer from the Netherlands Justice in the Windward Island will strengthen Dikran Sarian.
 
The two newcomers to replace the now retired Cor Merx, the number of officers on St. Maarten in four, Johan de Vrieze and Paul Mooij remain highly likely. The Vrieze denied yet again that there never has been that Tonino would. "He has never applied and was never in the picture for the post here."

The Amigoe reported three weeks ago that the arrival of Tonino case. The officer who last year was negative in the news by a laptop with important information to the Justice coarse dirt to seem themselves in an untenable position to have maneuvered now child pornography on the same computer showed it.
 
Following a number of publications in other newspapers asked former Secretary of State Edgar Lynch today Erno Labega (DP, St. Maarten) - also in charge of Justice - for clarification. The Vrieze angry at the fact that he was never informed to verify accuracy.

The new prosecutors will arrive in August or September. At this time the prosecution seeks the appointment of an environmental expert Paul Mooij years. Attorney General Dick Piar confirms that. "Given the developments in St. Maarten, we think the need for an additional prosecutor to have." (Amigoe)



http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joost_Tonino

Google translation:

Joost Tonino

Joost Tonino (1966) until 12 October 2004 an English officer of justice. He laid down his work after he had been discredited, after a broadcast of Peter R. de Vries. In this broadcast was revealed that Tonino his private computer on the street was put down due to a computer. After a taxi driver had picked up this computer and had returned to Peter R. de Vries found this information confidential and child pornography to. De Vries said that "far-reaching love" could be found, and information on investigations of Tonino. The computer was actually succeed with sledgehammer by the prosecution destroyed.

On 2 June 2006 by the Court in The Hague decided that Tonino not need to be prosecuted for possession of child pornography on his computer, after the foundation Child Right tried to ensure that the public prosecutor would prosecute Tonino still, despite the earlier decision of Justice not to do so. According to research Tonino had just downloaded the material from "normal" sex websites without much effort to do [1].

This affair Tonino worked in the prosecutor in Amsterdam, where he high-profile fraud cases accounted for. As a result of negative publicity around his person, he left it to Amsterdam and left it to the functional position.

In May 2008 it became known that the OM Tonino had left. Since May 13, 2008 he enrolled as a lawyer in Amsterdam.

Another article about the incident here:

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=nl&u=http://www.klokkenluideronline.nl/artikel/276/joost-tonino-definitief-op-zijspoor.html&ei=pQ2BSuf0HqGBtwetwsXMCg&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=3&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3D%2522Joost%2BTonino%2522%26hl%3Den

Another interesting continuation of this story combined with others.   

http://arubanboycott.blogspot.com/2008/07/paulus-web-of-his-pedophile-network.html

Original link for that story: 

http://www.klokkenluideronline.nl/artikel/811/justitie-orgieen-en-chantage-op-antillen.html

[texasmom]

Since billb's not here, I'll go ahead and say it...Paulus is your perp.

That evil will surface again, it's just a matter of time.  Tick Tock Aruba.

JMO

[texasmom]

Truth & Justice for Natalee!

[hotping]

Since billb's not here, I'll go ahead and say it...Paulus is your perp.
That evil will surface again, it's just a matter of time.  Tick Tock Aruba.

JMO

You got that right..but even if Joran tried to tell the truth no one would believe Him...JMO...

Couldn't sleep but I'm going to try again....You should get some sleep TM! 

[jen3560]

TxMom - Thank you for posting that Epilogue from Beth last night.

[Anna]

TxMom,

Aha!  You found our child porn culprit.  Thanks for the clarification and correct identification of the person as Joost Tonino.

I do still find it very interesting that he was not prosecuted at all for his possession of child pornography.  Apparently, much like Joran, this was just an arbitrary decision on the part of "justice" or the prosecutor.

I am not so sure there is any such thing as a "normal" porn site but that's just me.  Don't have an appreciation for the exploitation of others by such.  It's a form of slavery but I don't think even The Netherlands had a law against child porn until international attention was brought to that fact in the 1990's.

People who exploit the vulnerable among us make me want to vomit!

[Kermit]

Since billb's not here, I'll go ahead and say it...Paulus is your perp.

That evil will surface again, it's just a matter of time.  Tick Tock Aruba.

JMO

OFFSHORE BANKING: IF you wanted to set up a business in Aruba you would need to set up a bank account You would send the documents to Aruba and you'd need an attorney to do the paperwork basically to approve you. Because you are not doing it in person you would go to what is called an Apostille.

You get an Apostille at the CENTRAL BUREAU LEGAL AND GENERAL AFFAIRS
http://offshoresimple.com/apostille.htm#aruba

WHERE PAULUS WORKED in 2004 - 2005 he said in his interview.

Now, remember that paulus van der Sloot worked at

8. "in 1990 Paul van der Sloot was offered a job at the "Central Bureau of Legal and General Affairs on Aruba."
PROFESSIONAL OFFSHORE INCORPORATION AND OFFSHORE BANKING SERVICES SINCE 1995.



Q. What is an Apostille?

An Apostille is a form of verification issued by Competent Authority in the country verifying the signature and sealof a notary or other public officer, so that the document bearing his/her signature and seal can take effect in countries which have ratified the Hauge Convention for the Abolition of Consular Legtalistation of 1961. It is normally possible to obtain the Apostille on a same day or next day basis.
http://offshoresimple.com/apostille.htm


Paulus was friends with all the judges, he also was working at the "Central Bureau of Legal and General Affairs on Aruba."
Paulus said in an interview:[/b]

"Before this happened I was in the middle of a change. In 2004-2005 I worked I Den Bosch as a judge in training concerning civil cases.


Netherlands has five higher courts. They are: Amsterdam, The Hague, Arnhem, Leeuwarden and Den Bosch.


So Paulus was working for one of the 5 higher courts and doing contracts for the Central Bureau of Legal & General Affairs on Aruba - the place that people who want to set up a business must go to in order to get their bank account/business set up in Aruba with OFFSHORE BANKING.


OFFSHORE BANKING - money laundering experts!
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4995.20

[Kermit]

oceanexploration
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #740 3/5 -
« Reply #404 on: Today at 02:03:59 PM »

We met with Patrick while in Aruba. He said that he believed Paulus was Daury, but wouldn't come straight out and say it as if he were nervous about being recorded. I'm uncertain why he's being cryptic about it.
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2673.400


« Riehl World View Interview Coming | Main | Posted Without Comment »
Friday, June 17, 2005
Interview With Van der Sloot Friend

DAN RIEHL: What did he do for a living, I've heard he's a judge.

Her: Yes, he judges, sometimes. But not always. I'm not sure what he did before. He traveled a lot, on business, I think.

TJ: Some of this information we have, we are not going to expose right now. I can tell you that from the information we have, Paul Van der Sloot was directly involved with the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.
(Court TV Interview with TJ Ward, David Wright from the National Enquirer and CATHERINE CRIER Sept 26, 2005)


Joran bijna een jaar o

ud - samen met rijn ouders op de bank in Arnhem
TRANSLATED:
Joran almost a year old - with rijn parents on the bank in Arnhem
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4995.40


OFFSHORE BANKING: IF you wanted to set up a business in Aruba you would need to set up a bank account You would send the documents to Aruba and you'd need an attorney to do the paperwork basically to approve you. Because you are not doing it in person you would go to what is called an Apostille.

You get an Apostille at the CENTRAL BUREAU LEGAL AND GENERAL AFFAIRS
http://offshoresimple.com/apostille.htm#aruba

WHERE PAULUS WORKED in 2004 - 2005 he said in his interview.

Now, remember that paulus van der Sloot worked at

8. "in 1990 Paul van der Sloot was offered a job at the "Central Bureau of Legal and General Affairs on Aruba."

[Kermit]

[Kermit]

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