Lindsey Baum #3 7/28/09 - 8/26/09

[no rose colored glasses]

I sure wish we would get some info, any info, I'm afraid LE doesn't have anything.

I sure hope they have more than what we have.   

Karma and No Rose -- I think they have more than they are revealing.  Unlike Florida with its Sunshine Laws, this waiting patiently can become nerve racking.  I do, however, believe they have more, a lot more.  I don't think they are as incompetent as some have asserted, I think they are keeping things close to the chest.  JMHO  And I do know for a fact that some of the info obtained here from research has been shared with them.  I only wish there was more public support in the community to bring Linesey home.

Thanks for that info. I sure wish also there was more public support 

[KarmaRoundUp]

I sure wish we would get some info, any info, I'm afraid LE doesn't have anything.

I sure hope they have more than what we have.   

Karma and No Rose -- I think they have more than they are revealing.  Unlike Florida with its Sunshine Laws, this waiting patiently can become nerve racking.  I do, however, believe they have more, a lot more.  I don't think they are as incompetent as some have asserted, I think they are keeping things close to the chest.  JMHO  And I do know for a fact that some of the info obtained here from research has been shared with them.  I only wish there was more public support in the community to bring Linesey home.

I hope you are right.I'm not saying the LE are incompetent,I'm just not sure they have much to go on.I wonder if Melissa and KaraK know they have to try their hardest to keep Lindsey's name and face out there?They did have some woman from a search center place there in McCleary and I wonder what happened to her?Blonde lady,was at the last vigil.They should be holding vigils every week.

[no rose colored glasses]

Since they can't find a spot for a search center, maybe Melissa could out of her home?

[KarmaRoundUp]

I "found"a new image of Lindsey today,I wonder if we can get Brandi to make this into a nice tag.



                         

[KarmaRoundUp]

Since they can't find a spot for a search center, maybe Melissa could out of her home?

I agree,ah heck.....do it out of anyone's home or parking lot or trailor or something.It's been so dang long.

[no rose colored glasses]

Since they can't find a spot for a search center, maybe Melissa could out of her home?

I agree,ah heck.....do it out of anyone's home or parking lot or trailor or something.It's been so dang long.

That is such a cute pic of Lindsey, I just can't get over how she looks like one of the little girls in my neighborhood  There is no reason why, unless there is some law, that she couldn't run a search center out of her home.

[KarmaRoundUp]

Since they can't find a spot for a search center, maybe Melissa could out of her home?

I agree,ah heck.....do it out of anyone's home or parking lot or trailor or something.It's been so dang long.

That is such a cute pic of Lindsey, I just can't get over how she looks like one of the little girls in my neighborhood  There is no reason why, unless there is some law, that she couldn't run a search center out of her home.

She looks like a sweet little girl.There may be regulations or something but at "**"some of the locals there have been saying they see no missing fliers of Lindsey in the nearby towns.
If I lived close to them I would help them,print out fliers and take them to other towns.SO's like to move around a lot.

[Sister]

I sure wish we would get some info, any info, I'm afraid LE doesn't have anything.

I sure hope they have more than what we have.   

Karma and No Rose -- I think they have more than they are revealing.  Unlike Florida with its Sunshine Laws, this waiting patiently can become nerve racking.  I do, however, believe they have more, a lot more.  I don't think they are as incompetent as some have asserted, I think they are keeping things close to the chest.  JMHO  And I do know for a fact that some of the info obtained here from research has been shared with them.  I only wish there was more public support in the community to bring Linesey home.

I hope you are right.I'm not saying the LE are incompetent,I'm just not sure they have much to go on.I wonder if Melissa and KaraK know they have to try their hardest to keep Lindsey's name and face out there?They did have some woman from a search center place there in McCleary and I wonder what happened to her?Blonde lady,was at the last vigil.They should be holding vigils every week.

Karma, they had been provided a space with phone lines, etc. but it was taken back.  I don't think the Baums have the resouces to do posters, etc.  And it needs to be organized, etc.  It really is a pity, but, as we all know and are so sensitive to, a little girl's safe return can depend upon it.  Because of limited resources, I heard members of LE are volunteering their time and they do have a space about 10 miles away.

[Tamikosmom]

I "found"a new image of Lindsey today,I wonder if we can get Brandi to make this into a nice tag.



                         

Lindsey really is a sweetheart.  Melissa Baum was so blessed.

Karma ... thank you for sharing.

Janet

[Wyks]

Hi Wyks!  Most don't know me and I rarely post but in answer to your MySpace question, LB may not have had mobile access through HER phone but if it says mobile it is.  She is probably using a phone belonging to someone with mobile web access.  I know of no other way to do this.  You might want to bring that to LE's attention as it seems to be a Mayberry type set up.  Pardon that, I know they are trying but as I understand it they only have a team of three.  I hope that was just somebody yuking it up.  DD please don't go, we count on your expertise in tracking things down for some of us computer illiterate (speaking only for myself).  You present different options backed by fact and that is appreciated and needed when rumors are running rampant.  I know we all have been guilty of passing on rumors accidentally when stated by a respected poster or speculation by media.  It is not malicious or intended and usually cleared up quickly.  Sometimes we forget that a high percentage of posts are in our opinion and to be thought provoking and to bounce ideas of each other.  Let's all be respectful and remember we are here only for Lindsey and to help her come home!  Ok, that is all my brain can muster up this morning and I'm rambling so off I go back in the corner, lurking, waiting to hear from all the beautiful, intelligent Monkey minds!  Have a wonderful day and think before anyone does anything in haste!

Thanks melisb, I'll give LE there a call, just in case they haven't noticed it.   

[sherip]

I "found"a new image of Lindsey today,I wonder if we can get Brandi to make this into a nice tag.



                         

I really like that photo of Lindsey, she looks so happy.  Is this photo ok for anyone to use for printing purposes?  I emailed the lindsey baum center today to ask if they would like a couple of really long plastic banners printed to hang from the overpass at the McCleary exit out on on the highway (I am waiting for a response) - I am hoping this is something that would appeal to them and that it is something that would be allowed by the State DOT or the Grays Harbor Co. Highway Dept.  I had to drive from Olympia to Aberdeen today and it occurred to me driving thru there that there is nothing visible alerting people who may not even know she is missing.

I also drove thru McCleary just to look and did not see any type of center or signs about Lindsey there either.  How heartbreaking for Melissa Baum, she must feel so helpless and alone right now, I cannot even imagine her pain over this.

I have a family member that has a banner business and I am willing to purchase a couple of them if they can be used and  I would like to put this photo of Lindsey on it if you dont mind.  Please let me know.  I sure wish I would have thought of this earlier.

Thanks

[no rose colored glasses]

I "found"a new image of Lindsey today,I wonder if we can get Brandi to make this into a nice tag.



                         

I really like that photo of Lindsey, she looks so happy.  Is this photo ok for anyone to use for printing purposes?  I emailed the lindsey baum center today to ask if they would like a couple of really long plastic banners printed to hang from the overpass at the McCleary exit out on on the highway (I am waiting for a response) - I am hoping this is something that would appeal to them and that it is something that would be allowed by the State DOT or the Grays Harbor Co. Highway Dept.  I had to drive from Olympia to Aberdeen today and it occurred to me driving thru there that there is nothing visible alerting people who may not even know she is missing.

I also drove thru McCleary just to look and did not see any type of center or signs about Lindsey there either.  How heartbreaking for Melissa Baum, she must feel so helpless and alone right now, I cannot even imagine her pain over this.

I have a family member that has a banner business and I am willing to purchase a couple of them if they can be used and  I would like to put this photo of Lindsey on it if you dont mind.  Please let me know.  I sure wish I would have thought of this earlier.

Thanks

That's wonderful    No signs of Lindsey anywhere 

[JessStar]

Does any Monkeys know if it illegal for the police interrogate a minor?

Janet

This is a very complex question because of the use of the term "interrogate."  That has a very specific meaning.  Let me answer your question this way.  Full Custodial Interrogation of a minor outside of the juvenile justice system is generally impermissible.  However, the police are certainly allowed to question a minor whom they believe may have committed a crime.  And if the child makes an admission against interest (i.e., a confession), it's just as binding as if an adult made it.  In other words, police may delay turning a juvenile over to juvenile authorities or to his/her family in order to ask the child some questions, but they cannot use delay or prolonged exploratory questioning to enhance the compulsion inherent in in-custody interrogations.  Of course, Miranda applies if the interrogation is custodial.

Does that answer your question?

[JessStar]

I "found"a new image of Lindsey today,I wonder if we can get Brandi to make this into a nice tag.



                         

What a cute picture of Lindsey.  I pray she's okay.  I hate this. . . .

[JessStar]

I sure wish we would get some info, any info, I'm afraid LE doesn't have anything.

I sure hope they have more than what we have.   

Karma and No Rose -- I think they have more than they are revealing.  Unlike Florida with its Sunshine Laws, this waiting patiently can become nerve racking.  I do, however, believe they have more, a lot more.  I don't think they are as incompetent as some have asserted, I think they are keeping things close to the chest.  JMHO  And I do know for a fact that some of the info obtained here from research has been shared with them.  I only wish there was more public support in the community to bring Linesey home.

I hope you are right.I'm not saying the LE are incompetent,I'm just not sure they have much to go on.I wonder if Melissa and KaraK know they have to try their hardest to keep Lindsey's name and face out there?They did have some woman from a search center place there in McCleary and I wonder what happened to her?Blonde lady,was at the last vigil.They should be holding vigils every week.

Karma, they had been provided a space with phone lines, etc. but it was taken back.  I don't think the Baums have the resouces to do posters, etc.  And it needs to be organized, etc.  It really is a pity, but, as we all know and are so sensitive to, a little girl's safe return can depend upon it.  Because of limited resources, I heard members of LE are volunteering their time and they do have a space about 10 miles away.

I've been thinking a lot about how we can help.  The problem is, I still haven't come up with a plan.  This is a town of 1500.  Posters aren't going to do much unless they extend out to the outlying areas.  Everyone already knows about the case in McCleary.  The word needs to travel beyond McCleary.  But where?  And how do we accomplish that when we have a town full of people that don't want to help?  One thing that may be quick, easy and cheap is to find out if there are any public access channels on the local cable networks.  You know, the channels that announce upcoming community events and such, and see if they're running Lindsey's photo and reward message.  They may even be willing to donate space.  That will reach into many diverse households, and anyone that channel surfs (which most people do) will come across it eventually.

[JessStar]

Does any Monkeys know if it illegal for the police interrogate a minor?

Janet

This is a very complex question because of the use of the term "interrogate."  That has a very specific meaning.  Let me answer your question this way.  Full Custodial Interrogation of a minor outside of the juvenile justice system is generally impermissible.  However, the police are certainly allowed to question a minor whom they believe may have committed a crime.  And if the child makes an admission against interest (i.e., a confession), it's just as binding as if an adult made it.  In other words, police may delay turning a juvenile over to juvenile authorities or to his/her family in order to ask the child some questions, but they cannot use delay or prolonged exploratory questioning to enhance the compulsion inherent in in-custody interrogations.  Of course, Miranda applies if the interrogation is custodial.

Does that answer your question?

You know what, let me add something to my own post!  To be admissible as substantive evidence a juvenile's confession must be preceded by advice of constitutional rights and a warning of the possible consequences of any admission, including the possibility that the child may be tried as an adult.  Once the child has been properly admonished with regard to all of the above, the police may interrogate the child, provided the child knowingly and voluntarily waives his rights.
Whether there is such a waiver depends on a number of factors such as the age, intelligence and experience of the juvenile. Whether a proper warning is given and whether there is an intelligent waiver is a factual matter for the court to decide in each case.

[Wyks]

Does any Monkeys know if it illegal for the police interrogate a minor?

Janet

In most places it seems to be illegal, yes.  Supposedly, police need permission from the parent/guardian of a minor before that minor can be questioned/interrogated by the police, and that is supposedly to be done in the presence of the parent/guardian. 

Yep all that sounds real good.  Uh hmmm. 

Because in the real world, some police DO question/interrogate minors without their parent/guardian's permission and presence.  I know that because it happened to my family. 

Two of my three sons and their friends got themselves into some major trouble with the police sev. years ago.  The police came charging into our home, my sons and their friends were there, some were minors, some weren't. 

While I was trying to find out from one officer what the heck was going on, what had happened, why were they there..... several of the other officers had split my sons and their friends up, taking each of them in opposite directions around our house.  My mind was working overtime trying to figure out which of my son's friends were minors and where in my yard the officer had taken each one.  Had to zoom around to each and say "uh no way, NO questioning this kid until/unless you call the parent".  At the same time, making sure the police hadn't gotten to my own sons yet without me being right there.  It was utter madness!! 

One officer told me that the parent/guardian didn't need to be involved *unless* they actually needed to take that minor in for questioning.  That 'this type' of questioning was fine.  Still and all, those kids were each being raked over the coals for what they knew.  "This type" of questioning was still interrogation, IMO. 

The officers allowed most of the kids to leave, arresting two of my sons, and three of their friends.  The parents of those three kids were not notified of anything until AFTER the police had questioned them at length, handcuffed them, put in the back of the patrol cars and taken them to the station.  The officers had my phone, I couldn't make a call to those parents myself.  All I could do was to stand by and watch this all unfold, wondering what the heck happened to the supposed rights of a parent/guardian to be present and permission given FIRST. 

My middle son, (who as it turns out was not involved), was 18 at the time, and has a cognitive disability.  I know that police *can be* very tricky during questioning, and this son is very literal in his thinking.  The only thing that the police that day listened to me on is that they HAD to be careful in their questioning of him, that I would be standing right there, and I'd sue their asses if they made one step out of line with him, considering the fact that he has this disability.  (I was beyond pissed off by that point)  hehe...  To their credit, the officers did question him carefully.  To my middle son's credit, he knew nothing, he wasn't involved. 

I later asked an attorney why the police had been allowed to question the minors in the way they had, with no permission from the minors parent/guardian.  And could those parents press charges, complain, whatever.  The attorney said nope, it really wouldn't matter that much to the judge. 

A long drawn-out reply to your question, sorry.  My point is this:  it seems to me that there are rules made to be broken, at the discretion of the officers.  Maybe I'm a bit jaded.  But I've seen it happen, and it seemed to me that the last thing on the mind of the officers was to contact any parent. 

IMO, along with everything else we need to be teaching our kids to not answer any questions until their parent has been contacted and is standing there in person.   JMO.     

[Tamikosmom]

Does any Monkeys know if it illegal for the police interrogate a minor?

Janet

This is a very complex question because of the use of the term "interrogate."  That has a very specific meaning.  Let me answer your question this way.  Full Custodial Interrogation of a minor outside of the juvenile justice system is generally impermissible.  However, the police are certainly allowed to question a minor whom they believe may have committed a crime.  And if the child makes an admission against interest (i.e., a confession), it's just as binding as if an adult made it.  In other words, police may delay turning a juvenile over to juvenile authorities or to his/her family in order to ask the child some questions, but they cannot use delay or prolonged exploratory questioning to enhance the compulsion inherent in in-custody interrogations.  Of course, Miranda applies if the interrogation is custodial.

Does that answer your question?

No entirely.

JessStar ... I will be the devil's advocate.

When it is considered that a child may not fully comprehend the legal ramifications encompassing a confession during a police interrogation/questioning in the course of an investigation ... something does not seem right.

Would a child not be required under the law to have legal representation appointed if questioned/interrogated when it is considered that during the course of that questioning/interrogation his/her words may implicate him/her in a crime.

JessStar ... thank you for your response.

Janet

[KarmaRoundUp]

I sure wish we would get some info, any info, I'm afraid LE doesn't have anything.

I sure hope they have more than what we have.   

Karma and No Rose -- I think they have more than they are revealing.  Unlike Florida with its Sunshine Laws, this waiting patiently can become nerve racking.  I do, however, believe they have more, a lot more.  I don't think they are as incompetent as some have asserted, I think they are keeping things close to the chest.  JMHO  And I do know for a fact that some of the info obtained here from research has been shared with them.  I only wish there was more public support in the community to bring Linesey home.

I hope you are right.I'm not saying the LE are incompetent,I'm just not sure they have much to go on.I wonder if Melissa and KaraK know they have to try their hardest to keep Lindsey's name and face out there?They did have some woman from a search center place there in McCleary and I wonder what happened to her?Blonde lady,was at the last vigil.They should be holding vigils every week.

Karma, they had been provided a space with phone lines, etc. but it was taken back.  I don't think the Baums have the resouces to do posters, etc.  And it needs to be organized, etc.  It really is a pity, but, as we all know and are so sensitive to, a little girl's safe return can depend upon it.  Because of limited resources, I heard members of LE are volunteering their time and they do have a space about 10 miles away.

Yes,I heard about the place they had then lost.Wasn't there a lady in town just for this reason....to help them set up a search center?Last I heard they were trying to set one up in another town near McCleary.I just can't believe that there is not a building(UAW/VFW hall,Community Center hall,Churches?)there in McCleary that they can use.

[pink angel]