Lindsey Baum #3 7/28/09 - 8/26/09

[no rose colored glasses]

There is one question that is nagging at me. After Lindsey left Kara's home, am I understanding she went to another house to ask if she could sleep over there? Now, why, did she just not want to go home?

[Sister]

I for one, and maybe only one of a few, am sticking up for melissa baum and kara.  In the beginning I looked at kara to the point of probably knowing what color her undies are LOL  I mean I dug and dug and basically accused her of anything and everything.  What I did through email and asked her is horrendous, but I had my thoughts on her because lindsey left that house and there was no dog scent and she got nowhere etc.  I really thought at first someone from that house chased lindsey down and grabbed her and took her somewhere.  I had thought something awful had happened inside that house and lindsey ran out.  that was my first thought on this case... so I dug, and dug, and dug, I asked so many questions to locals.  And because kara doesn't know anyone there they all ragged on her and melissa... turns out these people are marilyn's friends and once I figured that out, I just acted like yah I believe you, tell me more.  oh they told me more alright, and every time they told me more the stories changed, always oh well marilyn says this or that, it was like this not that, well people who tell lies can't keep them straight.  and this last one about roger, if it was not so pathetic, it is hilarious. 

but it is all these lies and these friends of hers etc that has really hindered the search for lindsey, and that just p.... es.. me off to no end... I don't care if they don't like melissa or kara, heck why don't they just thump one another if that is the case, but to sway people into believing the very people who are trying the hardest to search for lindsey are the ones who are involved in her disappearance, that is off the charts.  and I notice these "caring" liars are not out there looking for this girl, why not?  do they know where she is?  and do they want no searching?  you just have to wonder.

but really what I wanted to say, if you are reading here melissa baum, or kara, I want you to know, we are backing you all the way, and we are going to figure out what the heck is really going on here.  and by any means we possibly have, we ARE going to help you.  I am sick of this. 

 

[love4ever]

DD

My speculations are just that ... speculations.  UNTIL ... the truth is revealed this wannabe detective will stand by her speculations and backup.

DD ... considering your words that it is rumored that Wayne Watnee has a "solid alibi" for the time that Lindsey Baum went missing ... until revealed otherwise .... I will no longer consider him a person of interest ... for now.

Considering mlachester's support base in McCleary ... considering her relationship with Lindsey ... considering the involvment of CPS, 911 and the small McCleary police force in alleged incidences ...  until revealed otherwise ... I will not regard her a person of interest.

DD ... I look forward to your revelation encompassing mlachester and Roger but ... until then ....

 

Janet

 

The thing about all this and that is for one, when you research and you find things that are official documents or not, it is then you get a feel for ones personality, as we see here. We are not professionals. Another thing is it is often times it is useful and intellectual to be objective to anothers research or possibility. The last thing is how can one make speculations about only what they have read in the media and research done by others, if one is so persistent in making speculations, then where is their own hours of research that they have found; that hasn't been posted by the media or other research sources? It would be great if the ones who focus on others research show us some of their own work that would be prove otherwise. I know that some of us spend hours and hours and dedication to these children and all involved. Research likes to further it's  progression and when they can not conclude on an area of research, they move on. However, they never forget the area of research in which they could not connect, but hope to find a missing link along the way, that will.

[love4ever]

 I do not believe in perfection in anyones home or of anothers , but I do believe that  manipulation or coercing of a child is ethically and immorally wrong., especially when done so because one vindictive parent wants to spite the other, and uses a child to do so. How sad is that?

[Tamikosmom]

There is one question that is nagging at me. After Lindsey left Kara's home, am I understanding she went to another house to ask if she could sleep over there? Now, why, did she just not want to go home?

According to LE ... Lindsey disappeared following the confirmed sighting shortly after 9:30 PM  at Maple and 5th .... within minutes of leaving Kara Kampen's residence between 9:15 PM and 9:30 PM ... within minutes of her home..

On August 2, 2005 ... there does not appear to be any official revelation to the contrary.

Janet

+++++++

MELISSA BAUM

Daily World – August 2, 2009-08-02

From the front step of her nearby home, Melissa Baum can almost see its intersection with Fifth Street where her 11-year-old daughter took her last known steps into oblivion.

“I feel like she’s right under my nose and I can’t find her,” she said.

http://**/articles/2009/08/02/local_news/doc4a75285b085b5140001671.txt

[Tamikosmom]

I do not believe in perfection in anyones home or of anothers , but I do believe that  manipulation or coercing of a child is ethically and immorally wrong., especially when done so because one vindictive parent wants to spite the other, and uses a child to do so. How sad is that?

I agree 100% if that is what happened in regards to mlachester.

However ... until there is any backup to the contrary ... I will stand by my contention that this woman has revealed the truth concerning her personal, first-hand  knowledge of the dynamics encompassing Lindsey's relationship with her mother and brother.  After all ... 911, CPS and the small McCleary LE were all a part of her allegations.  I contend that mlachester ... out of frustration ... is speaking out now and revealing what LE and CPS failed to take seriously at the time and ... could have possibly prevented whatever happened to Lindsey in the two block stretch following the confirmed sighting..

After DD reveals what she has been privy to behind the scenes ... my present position on the mlachester issue may change.  My speculations are based on what is now known.

Janet

 

[Sister]

other than from ML, is there another factual source that LE and CPS failed to do their jobs? And I am not being condescending . . . what factual source, like a report file, 911 tapes are in the public domain, file number, case number, case worker or source other than speculation.  This sure would help in the research.  I'm simply not finding it in any research.  In fact, what I am finding is not looking good for ML, but I won't put it out until it can be substantiated by one more factual source.

[no rose colored glasses]

other than from ML, is there another factual source that LE and CPS failed to do their jobs? And I am not being condescending . . . what factual source, like a report file, 911 tapes are in the public domain, file number, case number, case worker or source other than speculation.  This sure would help in the research.  I'm simply not finding it in any research.  In fact, what I am finding is not looking good for ML, but I won't put it out until it can be substantiated by one more factual source.

I can't wait to read all of this, because I also was believing Marilyn until I really looked into her eyes and saw craziness, nothing scientific just an observation.

[Tamikosmom]

other than from ML, is there another factual source that LE and CPS failed to do their jobs? And I am not being condescending . . . what factual source, like a report file, 911 tapes are in the public domain, file number, case number, case worker or source other than speculation.  This sure would help in the research.  I'm simply not finding it in any research.  In fact, what I am finding is not looking good for ML, but I won't put it out until it can be substantiated by one more factual source.

I can't wait to read all of this, because I also was believing Marilyn until I really looked into her eyes and saw craziness, nothing scientific just an observation.

no rose colored glasses

I would love to look into Marilyn's eyes.  Would you or another Monkey please provide a link.

Thank you.

Janet

[sherip]

I do not believe in perfection in anyones home or of anothers , but I do believe that  manipulation or coercing of a child is ethically and immorally wrong., especially when done so because one vindictive parent wants to spite the other, and uses a child to do so. How sad is that?

I agree 100% if that is what happened in regards to mlachester.

However ... until there is any backup to the contrary ... I will stand by my contention that this woman has revealed the truth concerning her personal, first-hand  knowledge of the dynamics encompassing Lindsey's relationship with her mother and brother.  After all ... 911, CPS and the small McCleary LE were all a part of her allegations.  I contend that mlachester ... out of frustration ... is speaking out now and revealing what LE and CPS failed to take seriously at the time and ... could have possibly prevented whatever happened to Lindsey in the two block stretch following the confirmed sighting..

After DD reveals what she has been privy to behind the scenes ... my present position on the mlachester issue may change.  My speculations are based on what is now known.

Janet

 

I have been searching thru previous posts with no luck trying to find where MLachaster wrote a piece talking about Lindsey and how she had tried to help her basically defending herself- does anyone know here that information can be found.  For some reason I thought she (ML) said that "she" was the one that sent Josh home after the fight between Lindsey and Josh - that she (ML) was at a friends house, and then on her way to work at the retirement home a little later she also was one of the 2 witnesses that saw Lindsey walking home from KaraK house.  I may be wrong but does anyone else remember that?   If that is true don't you think that she would have at least stopped the car and briefly talked to Lindsey, given the fact the she had less than an hour earlier "saved" Lindsey from her brother and at least ask her if she was OK?  If it was ML who sent Josh home then she is ultimately the person responsible for Lindsey being alone that night.  Her mother at that point thought she was with her brother.

[no rose colored glasses]

other than from ML, is there another factual source that LE and CPS failed to do their jobs? And I am not being condescending . . . what factual source, like a report file, 911 tapes are in the public domain, file number, case number, case worker or source other than speculation.  This sure would help in the research.  I'm simply not finding it in any research.  In fact, what I am finding is not looking good for ML, but I won't put it out until it can be substantiated by one more factual source.

I can't wait to read all of this, because I also was believing Marilyn until I really looked into her eyes and saw craziness, nothing scientific just an observation.

no rose colored glasses

I would love to look into Marilyn's eyes.  Would you or another Monkey please provide a link.

Thank you.

Janet

It was her myspace page, I don't recall what page that it was on, I'm sure someone here has it.

[Tamikosmom]

other than from ML, is there another factual source that LE and CPS failed to do their jobs? And I am not being condescending . . . what factual source, like a report file, 911 tapes are in the public domain, file number, case number, case worker or source other than speculation.  This sure would help in the research.  I'm simply not finding it in any research.  In fact, what I am finding is not looking good for ML, but I won't put it out until it can be substantiated by one more factual source.

So far no research has been revealed on the forum that mlachester's words are fabrications.  Until then I will consider mlachester as a person who has in the past had Lindsey's best interest at heart in regards to alleged abuse at the hands of her mother and brother and ... mlachester is presently speaking out in anger and frustration revealing a system that failed to protect a missing 10 year old little girl.

I would love to believe that Lindsey Baum had one advocate in her world that attempted to intervene on her behalf.  If DD's research reveals that mlachester was not that advocate ... then so be it.  I will concede.

Janet

++++++

Could it be the McCleary Law Enforcement is focusing attention away from Melissa and Josh as suspects in an attempt to shield the "powers that be" who disregarded Marilyn's attempt to get protection for Lindsey from both her Mother and brother?

No throwing bananas please.  Neighbour who makes delicious loaves with my brused and over-riped bananas has taken off this morning with hubby for a week's vacation.

 

Janet

++++++++

ACCORDING TO MLACHESTER:

Rob
Re: Lindsey Baum #3 7/28/09 -
« Reply #896 on: August 08, 2009, 04:29:38 PM »

As far as the abuse Lindsey went threw the MPD knows the FBI also knows.

They have the reports I help Lindsey file

Just as of this moring when the FBI was at my house I made a comment about the 911 calls and the call to CPS.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?action=post;quote=904672;topic=5790.880;num_replies=1162;sesc=28414912316d49a494791fe51542bb71


doubledecker
Re: Lindsey Baum #3 7/28/09 -
« Reply #976 on: Today at 12:34:07 AM »

this is to me from a friend of marilyns

... one time she called CPS on melissa baum when lindsey came over with welts from her calfs to her back.  she was horrified and i think a couple others saw this at her house.  the other incidents with Josh were chasing her with knife, shovel, choking, and at least one other attack against another individual (and here i forgot to write it down, i think it was a female but can't recall if it was an adult or child, but marilyn made the call).  she says he was very violent and went to Juvi many times!  hmm.  anyway, i don't think she's lying, that's a whole lot to be lying about, haha

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5790.msg904974#msg904974


mlachester:
To answer the questions everyone has asked, Yes I have talked to police and as far as things being unfounded its more of lazy work by cps and I don't know what the police were thinking. Since Lindsey has gone missing I have helped serch and put fliers up. I was called by the agents investigating and told them what I know. And this is no nick name everyone in McCleary knows who I am. Its no big secret she had came to my house to call 911 when her brother had done things to her. I hope lindsey is hiding and she finds a way to get to someone for help to tell them why. But as everyday gose by the fear gets worse.

http://www.king5.com/topstories/stories/NW_063009WAB-Mccleary-girl-search-LJ.1fc0b759.html?ocp=2#slcgm_comments_anchor


mlachester:
I am close to her and I know a lot more than the media or law enforcement are saying right now. As for Scanner, sorry if you don't like the truth but I have never been one to keep the truth in and she should of been taken the first time she called 911 from my house asking for help instead of put in a police car and taken back to her abuser!"

http://www.king5.com/topstories/stor...omments_anchor

[Sister]

Janet, I'm sorry if my question was misleading.  I wanted to know if you have a factual source other than ML?  I have read and re-read what others have put on the forum, I am merely asking if you have another factual source other than ML that LE and CPS have been negligent?  The research I do is based on facts and that is why I ask in this manner.  I've read the opinions, etc., and as interesting as they are, to "prove" something, there needs to be facts to be checked for accuracy.  But, hey, I know I'm preaching to the choir
 

[Tamikosmom]

sherip

If Melissa Baum was under the impression that Lindsey would be walking home with Josh ... that impression must have been erased the minute Josh walked into the house after being instructed to return home by the  "family friend" or ... did Josh not go straight home as instructed.  If not ... where was this young man between 9:15 PM and 9:30 PM following his sister's departure from Kara Kampen's residence.

Considering the strained relationship between Marilyn and Melissa ... I do not believe Marilyn was the person who instructed Josh to return home following the argument with his sister.  After all ... Melissa refers to this person as a "family friend".

Janet

++++++

ABC News - June 30, 2009

Baum said she last saw her daughter when Lindsey, along with her 12-year-old brother, Josh, headed out to Lindsey's friend's house in hopes she could get permission to spend the night at the Baum's house.

Baum said her children began squabbling over the use of Josh's bike on the way there and were stopped by a family friend who sent Josh home to end the argument. Lindsey continued on to her friend's house.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=7966924&page=1

[Tamikosmom]

Janet, I'm sorry if my question was misleading.  I wanted to know if you have a factual source other than ML?  I have read and re-read what others have put on the forum, I am merely asking if you have another factual source other than ML that LE and CPS have been negligent?  The research I do is based on facts and that is why I ask in this manner.  I've read the opinions, etc., and as interesting as they are, to "prove" something, there needs to be facts to be checked for accuracy.  But, hey, I know I'm preaching to the choir
 

Nope.  No inside information.  No skills to research public records.

 

Sister ... media sources is where it is at to a large extent.

Consider Mlachester did not attempt to hide her identity when commenting on the KOMO website and ... she involved 911, CPS as well as the small McCleary Police Department in her allegations ... I am giving her the benefit of the doubt that she is one person who did attempt to be an advocate for Lindsey Baum.

I could be wrong in my speculations regarding this woman and ... I am anticipating DD's revelation ... revelations that will contradics all the hope that I am at present embracing.

Until then ...

Janet.

[no rose colored glasses]

Well if Josh did go straight home, which I have no idea, you would think that Melissa would be wondering if Lindsey was going to walk home alone or spend the night. She could have made a phone call to Kara to find out.

[sherip]

Well if Josh did go straight home, which I have no idea, you would think that Melissa would be wondering if Lindsey was going to walk home alone or spend the night. She could have made a phone call to Kara to find out.

sherip

If Melissa Baum was under the impression that Lindsey would be walking home with Josh ... that impression must have been erased the minute Josh walked into the house after being instructed to return home by the  "family friend" or ... did Josh not go straight home as instructed.  If not ... where was this young man between 9:15 PM and 9:30 PM following his sister's departure from Kara Kampen's residence.

Considering the strained relationship between Marilyn and Melissa ... I do not believe Marilyn was the person who instructed Josh to return home following the argument with his sister.  After all ... Melissa refers to this person as a "family friend".

Janet

++++++

ABC News - June 30, 2009

Baum said she last saw her daughter when Lindsey, along with her 12-year-old brother, Josh, headed out to Lindsey's friend's house in hopes she could get permission to spend the night at the Baum's house.

Baum said her children began squabbling over the use of Josh's bike on the way there and were stopped by a family friend who sent Josh home to end the argument. Lindsey continued on to her friend's house.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=7966924&page=1

*******************************************************************************


Thank you  Janet - I just found what I was looking for under KerraK postsand I was wrong about MLachester being person who saw Lindsey and sent Josh home.


(I dont know if I brought that forward correctly or not - Sorry if it is not correct format.)


Quote


I do not think this is MLaChester,I think Kara said it was or that this witness was heading to work at the BeeHive.
Maybe Kara can clear that up for us.
I have to go now but will watch the other videos tomorrow.
Have a good night you all.


Kera K says:
No that was not MLaChester who saw them. It was someone else. As for working at the Beehive - I am part of that confusion apparently the witness was also the one who broke up the fight but she does not work at the BeeHive.

The BeeHive thing I got confused with something someone else had said - so I apologize for that because that was not correct.

[Sister]

Janet, I'm sorry if my question was misleading.  I wanted to know if you have a factual source other than ML?  I have read and re-read what others have put on the forum, I am merely asking if you have another factual source other than ML that LE and CPS have been negligent?  The research I do is based on facts and that is why I ask in this manner.  I've read the opinions, etc., and as interesting as they are, to "prove" something, there needs to be facts to be checked for accuracy.  But, hey, I know I'm preaching to the choir
 

Nope.  No inside information.  No skills to research public records.
 
Sister ... media sources is where it is at to a large extent.
Consider Mlachester did not attempt to hide her identity when commenting on the KOMO website and ... she involved 911, CPS as well as the small McCleary Police Department in her allegations ... I am giving her the benefit of the doubt that she is one person who did attempt to be an advocate for Lindsey Baum.
I could be wrong in my speculations regarding this woman and ... I am anticipating DD's revelation ... revelations that will contradics all the hope that I am at present embracing.
Until then ...
Janet.

I understand, but I can't find any media sources that are calling LE and CPS negligent.  Anyway . . . some issues of domestic violence (not in relation to the Baums or the KK family) have been uncovered and even a photo of a boy (not Josh by the way) with what looks like a black eye or at least a bad cut over the eye.  That's why I was asking about factual sources -- don't want to put it out unless it can be substantiated.

[pink angel]

Regarding ML. There is nothing that she has said, that can be proven. It's all rumor. Where is her facts? Where is her proof?

I think she is full of BS myself. She obviously has a beef with Lindsey's mom and Josh and will say anything possible to discredit them. This alone is her self-serving motive, PAYBACK. Her son has been in fights with Josh. Wanna bet she also thought MB was the one who called animal control on her regarding her dogs? I think she's a vindictive crazy neighbor is all.

When it comes to a missing child or a crime and you have information or personal knowledge regarding a family or family issues, that may be useful to helping find her or may be useful in regards to the investigation, you go to police with your information, you don't go posting in on a comment section of a newspaper or you don't post it on a forum.

The police have said that Melissa Baum has passed a lie detector and they said they ruled all family members out as suspects. They rarely do this publicly. They rarely talk about if people pass lie detector tests and they rarely clear family members publicly.  They look at family first thing and they look at them HARD. FBI was involved at this time too.

When asked "are family members suspect". Police usually always answer "EVERYONE IS A SUSPECT". They rarely RULE OUT family members to the public. They did that here. To me that says they are confident that Melissa or Josh had no involvement in Lindsey becoming a missing person.   jmo

Police have ruled out all family members as suspects.
http://www.king5.com/localnews/stories/NW_063009WAB-Mccleary-girl-search-LJ.1fc0b759.html

[sherip]

Well if Josh did go straight home, which I have no idea, you would think that Melissa would be wondering if Lindsey was going to walk home alone or spend the night. She could have made a phone call to Kara to find out.

I thought that too.  I can't help but wonder who Josh may have talked to on his way home - especially if he was upset. According to Kara K - WW was only real friend that Josh had.  I dont' think that Josh had anything to do with Lindsey being gone directly but if he talked to anyone or anyone witnessed the arguement it would not be too far of a reach to think that there was a pretty good chance that Lindsey would be returning that direction for the bike in a very short time.