Caylee Marie Anthony # 145 8/24/09 - 9/4/09

[Western Observr]

  I am so glad Padilla and company can talk!!  Great news!!  I am so mad about having searchers subject to inspection by defense, that is so wrong.  The STORM came and dumped all that water, and I am hoping after hearing all that happened and how Tim pulled out so the scene would not be damaged, the jurors will be smart enough to know how the wool is being pulled over their eyes.    The thankless Anthony's might be surprised by all the things Tim and the searchers could tell the jury about their behavior!!

I am also at a loss as to why the Judge would let the defense have Tony's phone conversations all the way to December.  There is absolutely no reason for that and it makes me so mad!!  What would they gain except to try and embarrass Tony for; revenge for Casey?  I don't get that ruling and I like many others hope Strickland will start getting his court in order and quit falling for the greiving grandparents and their arrogance.

Love it when you post, sirensong.

It makes me mad, too, but I wonder if this could end up working in Tony L.'s favor after all...   If Baez & Co. are trying to implicate Tony, as killer OR body-mover, his phone records will give them ZERO to go on... assuming there will be no pings to back up the theory that he was ever at the remains site in those months...

I agree that it looks vindictive of Casey, and SHAME on them all for doing this!  It's horrid of them, IMO.
 

They are just trying to throw out some sh** and see who it will stick to.
They already tried Jesse Grund...    all the brilliant dream team can now see that won't go.
So, to Plan B.
Let them focus on Tony Lazarro.
People with common sense have already seen his interviews, believed his version of events, saw that he was shocked at what happened,  listened to him as he tried to get more info by taping Lee Anthony,putting himself in jeopardy to do so,  assisted the Police every time they asked....
And then they have Casey's story......... OK-  so far we have... habitual liar, promiscuous, violently angry with her parents, theft from her immediate family, school dropout,  leads Police on a wild goose chase, photographed having a wonderful life, documented by all around her and by jail tapes as having absolutely no concern for anyone but herself...
So, who do you think a Jury will believe?

[Western Observr]

For those legal beagles out there....    the way the documents and evidence are released, is there a strict sequence, so that what came in first, goes to the defense in date order, until they get through working the next,or do they have the say so of what is released and when-    what I am getting at, is can they hang onto the most incriminating evidence (?fingerprints) until it suits them or do the Defense ask and get things as they want them
Finally, how long before the trial must the Defense have all the evidence to peruse?
I'm hoping they are tiring the Defense out with all these reams of paper and sometimes pretty mundane stuff, and then right at the last minute LE will say "Oh, by the way ( pulls the pin on a hand grenade,tosses it and runs off)  here are the duct tape fingerprint records  !!  Have a nice day

[A_News_Junkie_Monkey]

IIRC it was a phone call to Skanky's cell phone from Spindy's cell phone. Just my recollection.

Wasn't it the home phone?????  Now I have to go look. Grrrrrrrr

Hi, ANJ!  I "looked" myself, as you will see if you keep reading.  However, I was a very bad, lazy Monkey sleuth, and grabbed the first reference I found (which did say it was the home phone).  Maybe you will find something a little more definitive or credible!  While you are at it, could you figure out whether it was indeed a two-minute call, and WHAT DID THEY DISCUSS on that call?  In detail, please!  Inquiring minds want to know.

Yeah, I'm asking for too much, I know.   

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/1695097/HFTM-Casey-Anthony-Cell-Phone-Log-Analysis-June-15th-June-16th

7:45 am from Anthony home.

Yes, here is the convo Desi..........
"hello - Tony is that you?"
"No, it is you dominating mother. GET you lazy non working and scheming azz up and go look for a job."
"Can I take the JC Penny card with me today?"
"Sure, SWEETHEART"
"Mom, don't worry, I ABSOLUTELY will change my life today."
"Good, then this is DAY ONE."
"Yes, just don't tell dad and CMA."
"CMA?"
"Duh - yes, cover my azzs"
"Oh I will my little shamrock."
"Bye"
"Bye"

[A_News_Junkie_Monkey]

For those legal beagles out there....    the way the documents and evidence are released, is there a strict sequence, so that what came in first, goes to the defense in date order, until they get through working the next,or do they have the say so of what is released and when-    what I am getting at, is can they hang onto the most incriminating evidence (?fingerprints) until it suits them or do the Defense ask and get things as they want them
Finally, how long before the trial must the Defense have all the evidence to peruse?
I'm hoping they are tiring the Defense out with all these reams of paper and sometimes pretty mundane stuff, and then right at the last minute LE will say "Oh, by the way ( pulls the pin on a hand grenade,tosses it and runs off)  here are the duct tape fingerprint records  !!  Have a nice day

There is no rhyme or reason to how or when doc's are released to us - at least not a pattern for every case!  (I do think State is holding and feeding us as they want us the public to get it)
JB could and does already have things we won't see till trial.
Does this answer your question or make it more confusing? 

[Fanny Mae]

It's an archived post from WS, back in November. 
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-71683-p-2.html
Can't vouch for the accuracy (and yes, I'm being a very lazy sleuther today, sorry!) 

I bolded the part about the 7:45 a.m. phone call.  According to this, it was from the A's land line, and lasted two minutes.

If that's true, so much for the "Casey just locating her cell phone" theory -- that would only take a second! 

Also, I saw another reference (pleeeeeease don't make me go find the link!  lol)  that says we have the activity from Casey's cell phone that day beginning at 7:30 a.m. -- which means she already had her phone in her possession by 7:45 and would not be trying to locate it anyway.  Oh well.  My bad.
 

Crazy stuff, as usual.  Why does everything have to be so confusing!!   

(Back to catching up....)

I am going by the seat of my pants here, as I have none of my documents anymore. I went over the phone ping, and cell phone imformation for way too long. My recollectionj was that the phone call was made by Spindy from her cell phone to Skanky. I you say different, I will defer to you. I have been proven wrong many time.

[Desdemona]

They are just trying to throw out some sh** and see who it will stick to.
They already tried Jesse Grund...    all the brilliant dream team can now see that won't go.
So, to Plan B.
Let them focus on Tony Lazarro.
People with common sense have already seen his interviews, believed his version of events, saw that he was shocked at what happened,  listened to him as he tried to get more info by taping Lee Anthony,putting himself in jeopardy to do so,  assisted the Police every time they asked....
And then they have Casey's story......... OK-  so far we have... habitual liar, promiscuous, violently angry with her parents, theft from her immediate family, school dropout,  leads Police on a wild goose chase, photographed having a wonderful life, documented by all around her and by jail tapes as having absolutely no concern for anyone but herself...
So, who do you think a Jury will believe?

Excellent post, Western!  ::Monkey Applause::  (<-- I know, not a Monk smiley, but maybe some creative smiley-maker will see the need at some point?)

Thank you for reminding us how "futile" (!) the defense's plan may ultimately prove to be when the rubber meets the road; great perspective. 

And answering your question (bolded by me above,) -- I think and will continue to hope that a jury will believe the TRUTH!    

[Desdemona]

IIRC it was a phone call to Skanky's cell phone from Spindy's cell phone. Just my recollection.

Wasn't it the home phone?????  Now I have to go look. Grrrrrrrr

Hi, ANJ!  I "looked" myself, as you will see if you keep reading.  However, I was a very bad, lazy Monkey sleuth, and grabbed the first reference I found (which did say it was the home phone).  Maybe you will find something a little more definitive or credible!  While you are at it, could you figure out whether it was indeed a two-minute call, and WHAT DID THEY DISCUSS on that call?  In detail, please!  Inquiring minds want to know.

Yeah, I'm asking for too much, I know.   

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/1695097/HFTM-Casey-Anthony-Cell-Phone-Log-Analysis-June-15th-June-16th

7:45 am from Anthony home.

Yes, here is the convo Desi..........
"hello - Tony is that you?"
"No, it is you dominating mother. GET you lazy non working and scheming azz up and go look for a job."
"Can I take the JC Penny card with me today?"
"Sure, SWEETHEART"
"Mom, don't worry, I ABSOLUTELY will change my life today."
"Good, then this is DAY ONE."
"Yes, just don't tell dad and CMA."
"CMA?"
"Duh - yes, cover my azzs"
"Oh I will my little shamrock."
"Bye"
"Bye"

Wow, ANJ, you don't mess around!  Thank you for the link that I was too lazy to look for.  WTG.

However, regarding that very interesting call "transcript" you posted --   

Methinks I need to be a little more careful what I ask for!  Um, highly amusing but I'm going to have to request that you disclose your source on that one!

   

[Western Observr]

For those legal beagles out there....    the way the documents and evidence are released, is there a strict sequence, so that what came in first, goes to the defense in date order, until they get through working the next,or do they have the say so of what is released and when-    what I am getting at, is can they hang onto the most incriminating evidence (?fingerprints) until it suits them or do the Defense ask and get things as they want them
Finally, how long before the trial must the Defense have all the evidence to peruse?
I'm hoping they are tiring the Defense out with all these reams of paper and sometimes pretty mundane stuff, and then right at the last minute LE will say "Oh, by the way ( pulls the pin on a hand grenade,tosses it and runs off)  here are the duct tape fingerprint records  !!  Have a nice day

There is no rhyme or reason to how or when doc's are released to us - at least not a pattern for every case!  (I do think State is holding and feeding us as they want us the public to get it)
JB could and does already have things we won't see till trial.
Does this answer your question or make it more confusing? 

Yes, thank you it does.  We hear so much on TV about Florida's sunshine law but it obviously has some limits. Not sure who decides what is released and what is not, and when.

[Desdemona]

I am going by the seat of my pants here, as I have none of my documents anymore. I went over the phone ping, and cell phone imformation for way too long. My recollectionj was that the phone call was made by Spindy from her cell phone to Skanky. I you say different, I will defer to you. I have been proven wrong many time.

Hey, Fanny -- I finally got caught up, and now you seem to be gone.  But just in case you peek in,

I too have been proven wrong many a time.  Emphasis on the "MANY."  Heck, I tend to post my recollection and then realize later I was wrong -- and have to go back and correct my own posts!  As you well know, I am sure.  I'm probably known for my endless boo-boo's here.

And yet, I still tend to rely on the old "seat of the pants" myself.  Ah well, we must be human or something.  And besides, it takes too much time and trouble to hunt down all the details in this massive, confusing case.  Discussions would never go anywhere if we had to locate proof and cite resources for every single assertion!

ANJ did the legwork on this one, and I thank her for her trouble.
(Though I remain somewhat skeptical of the "transcript" she found of that call!)   

[Desdemona]

 

O/T on the Hasanni Campbell case, sorry if you all already heard this news:

Hasanni's "foster parents" have been arrested for murder. 
Authorities searching their home and the Pick A Part property for his remains....

Poor baby.  God Bless Hasanni. 

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5911.msg924997#msg924997

[mamacrazy30]

I am going by the seat of my pants here, as I have none of my documents anymore. I went over the phone ping, and cell phone imformation for way too long. My recollectionj was that the phone call was made by Spindy from her cell phone to Skanky. I you say different, I will defer to you. I have been proven wrong many time.

Hey, Fanny -- I finally got caught up, and now you seem to be gone.  But just in case you peek in,

I too have been proven wrong many a time.  Emphasis on the "MANY."  Heck, I tend to post my recollection and then realize later I was wrong -- and have to go back and correct my own posts!  As you well know, I am sure.  I'm probably known for my endless boo-boo's here.

And yet, I still tend to rely on the old "seat of the pants" myself.  Ah well, we must be human or something.  And besides, it takes too much time and trouble to hunt down all the details in this massive, confusing case.  Discussions would never go anywhere if we had to locate proof and cite resources for every single assertion!

ANJ did the legwork on this one, and I thank her for her trouble.
(Though I remain somewhat skeptical of the "transcript" she found of that call!)  

::MonkeyApplause::

[tupelohoney]

For those legal beagles out there....    the way the documents and evidence are released, is there a strict sequence, so that what came in first, goes to the defense in date order, until they get through working the next,or do they have the say so of what is released and when-    what I am getting at, is can they hang onto the most incriminating evidence (?fingerprints) until it suits them or do the Defense ask and get things as they want them
Finally, how long before the trial must the Defense have all the evidence to peruse?
I'm hoping they are tiring the Defense out with all these reams of paper and sometimes pretty mundane stuff, and then right at the last minute LE will say "Oh, by the way ( pulls the pin on a hand grenade,tosses it and runs off)  here are the duct tape fingerprint records  !!  Have a nice day

There is no rhyme or reason to how or when doc's are released to us - at least not a pattern for every case!  (I do think State is holding and feeding us as they want us the public to get it)
JB could and does already have things we won't see till trial.
Does this answer your question or make it more confusing? 

Yes, thank you it does.  We hear so much on TV about Florida's sunshine law but it obviously has some limits. Not sure who decides what is released and what is not, and when.

I watched the Michael King trial this week, he was accused and found guilty today of kidnapping, raping and killing Denise Amber Lee. Anyway, I learned that the judge has the final say so on what docs can be released to the public once the state releases them to the defense.

[Desdemona]

For those legal beagles out there....    the way the documents and evidence are released, is there a strict sequence, so that what came in first, goes to the defense in date order, until they get through working the next,or do they have the say so of what is released and when-    what I am getting at, is can they hang onto the most incriminating evidence (?fingerprints) until it suits them or do the Defense ask and get things as they want them
Finally, how long before the trial must the Defense have all the evidence to peruse?
I'm hoping they are tiring the Defense out with all these reams of paper and sometimes pretty mundane stuff, and then right at the last minute LE will say "Oh, by the way ( pulls the pin on a hand grenade,tosses it and runs off)  here are the duct tape fingerprint records  !!  Have a nice day

There is no rhyme or reason to how or when doc's are released to us - at least not a pattern for every case!  (I do think State is holding and feeding us as they want us the public to get it)
JB could and does already have things we won't see till trial.
Does this answer your question or make it more confusing? 

Yes, thank you it does.  We hear so much on TV about Florida's sunshine law but it obviously has some limits. Not sure who decides what is released and what is not, and when.

I watched the Michael King trial this week, he was accused and found guilty today of kidnapping, raping and killing Denise Amber Lee. Anyway, I learned that the judge has the final say so on what docs can be released to the public once the state releases them to the defense.

Wow, Tupelo.  This is good news, but what a sad case it is.  I remember weeping when I first read what happened to her.  She was still nursing her youngest when this scum abducted her from her own home, leaving the kids alone together in a crib... assaulted her and killed her.  This is another glaring case where things can never be made right, not even by justice being served ---  but things would be ever so much more WRONG if it were not.  Thanks so much for posting this news, as I had not heard.
-----
And thank you for the detail on the question at hand, about the Sunshine Law releases ... the judge is the deciding factor, then.  Interesting.
-----
And also, I wanted to say thank you for posting (several pages back) that explanation of why ALyon would be moving to dismiss on grounds that there's not enough evidence for a murder charge -- when it's obvious to a brick wall that there certainly is.  Based on the info you posted, it looks like they HAVE to do this, or they won't be able to appeal her inevitable (IMO) guilty verdict. 
-----
Thank you for that and for all the useful links you are always posting.  Tupelo, you rock.   

[tupelohoney]

For those legal beagles out there....    the way the documents and evidence are released, is there a strict sequence, so that what came in first, goes to the defense in date order, until they get through working the next,or do they have the say so of what is released and when-    what I am getting at, is can they hang onto the most incriminating evidence (?fingerprints) until it suits them or do the Defense ask and get things as they want them
Finally, how long before the trial must the Defense have all the evidence to peruse?
I'm hoping they are tiring the Defense out with all these reams of paper and sometimes pretty mundane stuff, and then right at the last minute LE will say "Oh, by the way ( pulls the pin on a hand grenade,tosses it and runs off)  here are the duct tape fingerprint records  !!  Have a nice day

There is no rhyme or reason to how or when doc's are released to us - at least not a pattern for every case!  (I do think State is holding and feeding us as they want us the public to get it)
JB could and does already have things we won't see till trial.
Does this answer your question or make it more confusing? 

Yes, thank you it does.  We hear so much on TV about Florida's sunshine law but it obviously has some limits. Not sure who decides what is released and what is not, and when.

I watched the Michael King trial this week, he was accused and found guilty today of kidnapping, raping and killing Denise Amber Lee. Anyway, I learned that the judge has the final say so on what docs can be released to the public once the state releases them to the defense.

Wow, Tupelo.  This is good news, but what a sad case it is.  I remember weeping when I first read what happened to her.  She was still nursing her youngest when this scum abducted her from her own home, leaving the kids alone together in a crib... assaulted her and killed her.  This is another glaring case where things can never be made right, not even by justice being served ---  but things would be ever so much more WRONG if it were not.  Thanks so much for posting this news, as I had not heard.
-----
And thank you for the detail on the question at hand, about the Sunshine Law releases ... the judge is the deciding factor, then.  Interesting.
-----
And also, I wanted to say thank you for posting (several pages back) that explanation of why ALyon would be moving to dismiss on grounds that there's not enough evidence for a murder charge -- when it's obvious to a brick wall that there certainly is.  Based on the info you posted, it looks like they HAVE to do this, or they won't be able to appeal her inevitable (IMO) guilty verdict. 
-----
Thank you for that and for all the useful links you are always posting.  Tupelo, you rock.   

I really wasn't sure if that article applied or not, which is why I posted it. I wanted feedback, but I think it is a necessary step that has to be made too. I just thought Lyon was stalling, but it looks as if she is just doing her job.

[Desdemona]

Tupelo >>     Like I said, you rock.  (Nice to share a cage w/you... seems like you're never here when I am, and vice versa, any more.)

(Sorry for O/T.)

[Desdemona]

Monkeys, I apologize if I'm overdoing the posting this evening.  I don't often have the chance these days to stay in the cage after catching up with the reading here...

I did have two more things I would like to mention.  And then I'll say goodnight and see you next time I have the opportunity to hang around for a bit.  First:

Back on page 31 there is a link to the TES membership application form. 
Here is the actual .pdf document.
http://texasequusearch.org//TESForms/TESApplicationpdf.pdf

Our attention was directed to the paragraph in RED at the end of the document, and it was suggested that it contained a protection (presumably now moot) for the privacy of a TES searcher's personal information.  It reads:

"I agree to Texas Equusearch conducting a complete background check if applicable. I agree that no information with regard to searches will be released to any member of the news media, made public in any way or used for personal use of any kind. I agree all information, paperwork, or equipment issued, etc. are the property of Texas Equusearch. I will
take no photographs or video on any Texas Equusearch sanctioned search or event, without the permission of Texas Equusearch supervisory personnel. I understand that any tip or information of any kind pertaining to a potential criminal case must be reported and that removal of anything from a search area may be considered interfering with a criminal investigation, a prosecutable offense. I agree to hold Texas Equusearch harmless with regard to any personal injury or injury/theft of horses, dogs or personal property while volunteering for Texas Equusearch. By my signature below I accept these terms. Membership is a privilege that may be denied or revoked at any time."

This is complex legalistic language, but I have read this several times, and I am not seeing that it contains any guarantees intended to protect the privacy of the member.  Rather, ICBW, but I interpret this to be a statement by the undersigned member/potential searcher, promising to keep any information gained by the member/searcher, in the process of participating in a TES search, private --  IOW, the searcher is promising not to disclose what they may see or hear during the search, to the media or anyone else. And also to hold TES harmless for any losses or damage they may incur as a result of their participation. 

While few people would appreciate having their personal information made public, perhaps it could be argued that the risk goes along with the territory, when one voluntarily becomes involved in such a case. God bless them for taking that risk, and God bless all those who searched so tirelessly for Caylee, undergoing physical stress and hazards, putting themselves through the difficulty and the emotional duress of it all -- and now having to endure this unwelcome public attention as a result.

When it comes down to it, IMO it's hard to imagine that Tim could ever realistically make any sort of guarantee otherwise.  In fact, if a TES searcher ever attempted to hold TES liable for the release of information that had been subpoenaed in a criminal case, it's hard to see how such a suit could prevail.

It is so unfortunate that Baez & Co. are low and desperate enough to harass poor Tim and the people who labored to find Caylee.  Shame on the defense for this ugly maneuver.  But I do not fault Strickland for his decision. I think he is doing his best to protect the interests of the searchers, given the realities of the need for proper procedure in the trial... IMO

I feel proud of Tim Miller, and ashamed of the A's for treating him so badly... and that their evil-spawn-daughter's actions are causing him further trouble now.  But I do think Tim has his "big boy panties" on, and can take it.  I think he is well represented in Mark NeJame, too. 

(All JMO, of course.) Long post, I know... Just one more and I'll be out of here.

[Desdemona]

Okay, Second -- and last.  This is for Fanny.

The issue of whether or not Roy Kronk's supervisor lived on Hopespring Drive is not necessarily settled IMO.

Way upthread, Tupelo posted a myth-buster reply from WS on this subject:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3989135&postcount=33
According to this post, Alex Roberts is Kronk's supervisor.  Alex Roberts does not reside on Hopespring Drive.  I have researched this, and it appears accurate.  Case closed?  Well.... it's not that simple.

-----
See, there is still the question of whether there was a "Scott" who may have been a water department supervisor.  This info came from Leonard on NG (and perhaps nowhere else).  When I research the references online to Scott as RK's supervisor, I find either NO source cited, or it comes back to Leonard.
http://daliagirl33.wordpress.com/2009/01/13/nancy-grace-leonard-padillas-latest-conspiracy-theory-meter-reader-roy-kronk-told-his-supervisor-who-is-a-neighbor-of-the-anthonys-where-caylees-body-was-the-supervisor-told-the-anthonys/
On this appearance, Leonard states that Kronk's supervisor is named "Scott" -- and that he is not only a neighbor on Hopespring, but that he talks with the A's.  Daisy chain stuff.

-----
I did find TWO Scott's on Hopespring Drive:  Scott Aldridge at 4718, and Scott Sampson at 4859.  The latter is the one named by Leonard as RK's supervisor.

While I have not been able to confirm a Scott as a supervisor of Roy's, or as an OC public utilities employee, that does not mean that it's not so.  And there IS a possible link between Scott Sampson and the A's, IIRC, besides just being neighbors, as it turns out:

Anthony neighbor Fred Robinson, the minister who runs "Messiah Center" (he and his wife are mentioned rather jokingly by Lee to Casey in a jail visit) had a non-profit business we were investigating way back.  And I sorta recall (ICBW) that the neighbor Scott Sampson's name might have appeared on a list of Directors for the non-profit.

Now, this could actually be where Leonard made his connection, who knows?

-----
ONE MORE head-scratcher:

Kronk's supervisor on December 11 was Alex Roberts, as mentioned above.  He was  interviewed by OCSO on Jan. 6.  He was very nervous in this interview.
http://cfnews13.com/uploadedfiles/audio/AlexRoberts.wma
(Very interesting comments regarding Roy's words/actions on December 11, btw.)

A person with a very similar name, Alan (or Allen) Robinson, was mentioned in this interview.  This Alan Robinson, per Alex Roberts, was sitting in his truck at the scene on Suburban on December 11 -- the only other person at the scene besides Roy Kronk, who was standing near the remains site -- when Alex Roberts pulled up after hearing of the find on his radio.

I do not find Alan/Allen Robinson to be connected to the Fred Robinsons on Hopespring... but ya never know!

Goodnight, Monkeys!

God Bless Our Caylee.
 
 

[Wyks]

Someone say documents?

     

[trimmonthelake]

[trimmonthelake]