Caylee Marie Anthony # 146 9/4/09 - 9/13/09

[Wyks]

Living with Cindy is enough of a factor to convince me that there was emotional abuse to anyone else in the place!

I don't doubt for a moment that Cindy's possesiveness of Caylee and criticism of Casey added to the environment that would result in Caylee's death. The only way I can even kind of understand Cindy's staunch support of Casey is that it's because if Casey is found guilty, she can look in the mirror and take some responsibility, too. JMO!

Yeppers!!  Totally agree! 

[crazybabyborg]

[Wyks]

Sunny I'm snipping this section of your post.   JMO....kc, dragged Caylee around all hours of the day and night. WE KNOW that from statements of  kc's friends.  Caylee might surely have suffered AT TIMES from being TIRED. We have no proof, not even statements from friends, that Caylee was abused in any way.  In fact, just the opposite! Some friend, can't remember who at the moment and it's not important,  said kc was perhaps, at times, overly protective. Little kids fall and get bruised and yes, they get black eyes.                 


 Exactly, I don't recall anyone say they saw her being abusive to Caylee, not one person. And putting aside my feelings and what I think about George and Cindy, they may be a lot of things, but imo if they saw Casey beating on Caylee I don't think they would have tolerated that, of course I could be wrong.

nrcg...I agree...it is difficult sometimes to put our feelings aside, in this case in particular.  But I do agree......I don't believe the a's would have allowed Caylee to be abused physically. I do think they loved her......but I guess not enough.

My mind goes back to CinCin remarks about trying to get custody of Caylee.  Whether that was a threat she just used toward Casey to get her own way in things, or if she actually tried for that, I dunno.  Makes me wonder what, if anything, may have been happening to cause CinCin to make that threat.  Knowing what we do of CinCin, may have been nothing except her own need for control.  On the other hand.. what if she had good reason?  Her seeming need to control everything around her, incl what seems now to be covering for Casey no matter what, could be why she doesn't come right out and tell media what may have happened before to cause her to threaten getting custody.  Seems she has switched back and forth, from Casey is a bad mama/person to Casey is the mother of the year.    

   

Good afternoon, monkeys.

It just struck me that Cindy can protect KC all she wants, but the fact is that she went to a therapist to find out how to handle the situation of getting custody of Caylee.  So - Cindy's stuck with the fact that she thought KC was such a bad mother that Cindy should take custoday away from KC.

Another thing that Cindy is stuck with (if we heard the truth) is that the therapist told her to get Caylee in a safe place before Cindy should confont KC about getting custody - Cindy did not get Caylee in a safe place "first".

All very true, Puzzler!  IMO too.  And CinCin, no matter what she says publically, has to live with that, for the rest of her life.  That, IMO, will be worse than anything else. 

[Gizzie]

Hi carolb, and welcome!    

I agree with you, have wondered the same things myself. 

And as awful as it is to have heard about the duct tape being used on Caylee, I've since heard about it used in other cases.      Makes me wonder what the heck?? 

Also it seems that I'm hearing about more and more 'caregivers' giving children something to make them sleep. 

And I wonder... are these things a new trend amongst 'caregivers' who don't give a rat's patooty, having no patience or understanding, or whatever, of young children?  Or has this kind of thing happened forever, only we're just hearing more about it now cuz of the internet and awareness and instant news reporting, etc.  It sickens me to realize just how many children are being treated in such horrible ways. 

I was in another thread for another child, and trying to remember Jessica Lunsford's name.  So I googled 'child buried alive'.... and OMG a kajillion news items popped up!!!!!        I had noooooo clue there were so many! 

Anywho.... I'm thinking as well that Caylee had been duct-taped prior to that day.  Could have been so often that she wasn't looking forward anymore to being with Casey alone.  And she may have said something about it to CinCin.  IF that happened, as much as I don't like CinCin, she probably would have been horrified to hear such a thing.  IMO 
 

Ugh, this makes me so sad. I'll betcha she was starting to realize when it was time to be with KC, and she knew exactly what was in store for her. 

[Wyks]

Wyks? You're a great Mom, and you did your best at the time. That's all any of us can do. I believe that Caylee is playing with other children and angels on rainbows, under the Watchful, Loving, and Smiling eyes of God, and that His arms are a favorite place for her. I really do.

Thanks CBB.       

[Bearlyhere]

Hi CBB!   

I agree, am thinking that at the least, Caylee was emotionally, if not verbally, abused.  Just in how the A's act in public, gosh......... I can only imagine what it must have been like, behind doors.  A child can be emotionally abused (IMO) just sitting in the midst of squabbling adults.  Worse if the fight bet the adults gets physical.  This is why some kids need to have therapy in their later life, even if the only abuse they received was being the witness to other abuse going on around them.  My middle son is one of those.  The squabbling and abuse from his father toward me, scared him so much he would hide under the nearest table.  He remains to this day overly cautious, with a great deal of anxiety.  And that's after 20 years!!  That's emotional abuse, and am betting that at the very least, it was like this with Caylee.  IMO 

I am so sorry you and your son experienced this.  And I do honestly belief Caylee witnessed many arguments and disagreements between kc and the a's. Even when she didn't understand the words, I am betting she understood the tone.

Thanks Sunny.  What I forgot to make clear is that our experiences lasted just a few years, then I kicked his father out, getting a restraining order, etc.  Although the actual trauma to my sons, (each with different experiences), was during those few years, the effects have been long-lasting.  Sigh.  I can look at each son, and trace back to those few years where the effects began.  It's been verrrrrrrrrrrrrrrry difficult for me, watching them grow up and become the men they've become, knowing what they've gone and how it's affected them.  My guilt is huge.  And I was one of the victims as well.  Mom's guilt, I guess.  The kind of thing where I asked myself over and over, why didn't I act sooner with the restraining order?  Ahhh well.  Hindsight and all.  All I can do is apologize to them, which I've done, and try to help them not repeat with their own families.  Middle and younger sons are doing fine, each as well as can be expected.  But my oldest?     He is his father's son, cut from the same cloth.  And that's even with 20+ years since he's laid eyes on him.  <cries>  It's such an awful feeling, one that I do try hard daily to shake.  Not easy tho. 

My heart breaks for Caylee.  And as sad sad sad it is that she's no longer on this earth, as horrid as her death must have been........ the more we learn of the A's, the more glad I am that Caylee is in heaven, hopefully tucked safely in the arms of the angels.  IMO 

And also IMO, children are a blessed gift.  It does bring some measure of peace to think that *perhaps* the good Lord looked down, saw how His blessed gift may have been treated, and plucked His gift back from the undeserving mother.  <<<<------- Just my opinion. 

Wyks? You're a great Mom, and you did your best at the time. That's all any of us can do. I believe that Caylee is playing with other children and angels on rainbows, under the Watchful, Loving, and Smiling eyes of God, and that His arms are a favorite place for her. I really do.

Me too, CBB!

Wyks, hindsight is 20/20.  I am sure you did everything you could do at the time.

[Wyks]

Hi gizzie!!  It's sad how anyone can't love a child enough to want her murderer, no matter who that person is, punished.

Hi Sunny, I will agree with that! So many times during this case, I have tried to put myself in G & CA position, swapping KC with my almost 20 year old daughter, and every single time, I come up with the same conclusion, that I would be there for my daughter, but I would have to be on the prosecution's side the whole time. I would want my daughter punished, no matter how much I love her. Some may disagree, but I was raised to accept responsibility for my actions, and I have raised my children to do the same.

And my daughter has followed this story right along with me. And she knows how I would react if, heaven forbid, we were ever in this type situation. Gee, this made much more sense in my head, lol. 

It makes sense!     I feel the same way, and other monkeys have related similiar feelings.  It's what I think most moms would feel.  We love our kids and tried to teach them these things, am sure.  But when push comes to shove, standing for what is right, is one of the ultimate ways in showing our love.  Even if it means our child goes down for the count, because of their wrong choices, etc.  We can still support the child, without accepting the behavior/choices, etc.  It's a hard thing to communicate to others, but it does make sense!  IMO

[Wyks]

Hi carolb, and welcome!    

I agree with you, have wondered the same things myself. 

And as awful as it is to have heard about the duct tape being used on Caylee, I've since heard about it used in other cases.      Makes me wonder what the heck?? 

Also it seems that I'm hearing about more and more 'caregivers' giving children something to make them sleep. 

And I wonder... are these things a new trend amongst 'caregivers' who don't give a rat's patooty, having no patience or understanding, or whatever, of young children?  Or has this kind of thing happened forever, only we're just hearing more about it now cuz of the internet and awareness and instant news reporting, etc.  It sickens me to realize just how many children are being treated in such horrible ways. 

I was in another thread for another child, and trying to remember Jessica Lunsford's name.  So I googled 'child buried alive'.... and OMG a kajillion news items popped up!!!!!        I had noooooo clue there were so many! 

Anywho.... I'm thinking as well that Caylee had been duct-taped prior to that day.  Could have been so often that she wasn't looking forward anymore to being with Casey alone.  And she may have said something about it to CinCin.  IF that happened, as much as I don't like CinCin, she probably would have been horrified to hear such a thing.  IMO 
 

Ugh, this makes me so sad. I'll betcha she was starting to realize when it was time to be with KC, and she knew exactly what was in store for her. 

Yeah....   

[Wyks]

Me too, CBB!

Wyks, hindsight is 20/20.  I am sure you did everything you could do at the time.

Thanks Bearlyhere.       

I tell myself that, I do.  Yet, the choices I made at the time weren't good enough to make everything all better, no matter that I did all I knew to do.  And that's what I get to live with the rest of my life.  Forgiving myself doesn't seem a good option, not when I watch the effects it all has had, and continues to have, on my sons.     But I work on it.  And they are very forgiving of me.  Not of their father tho.  Not yet.  Maybe one day. 

[no rose colored glasses]

Me too, CBB!

Wyks, hindsight is 20/20.  I am sure you did everything you could do at the time.

Thanks Bearlyhere.       

I tell myself that, I do.  Yet, the choices I made at the time weren't good enough to make everything all better, no matter that I did all I knew to do.  And that's what I get to live with the rest of my life.  Forgiving myself doesn't seem a good option, not when I watch the effects it all has had, and continues to have, on my sons.     But I work on it.  And they are very forgiving of me.  Not of their father tho.  Not yet.  Maybe one day. 

Wyks  I can tell from reading your posts what a wonderful, thoughtful person you are. I also have made terrible mistakes, at least to me they were, and it is very hard to forgive oneself, all it causes is stress and grief. I guess a person just can't win.

[Miki Monkey]

Hi Monkeys!     Just stopping by to humbly apologize to Fanny.
 
Fanny said:  “CAYLEE sure had a lot of black eyes in her short lifetime. “  [and]  “Yes, there have been many pictures showing Caylee with obvious black eyes, not just dark circles, under them. The bruises would be on different eyes on different occassions. I had many of them on my photobucket, but deleted them because they upset me so much. Maybe someone who has some complete files of her pictures will post them.”

If I'm reading Capp correctly, she too has seen multiple black(ened) eyes... though I'm not sure if either or both also feel(s) that this is representative of Caylee's entire life. 

Capp said:   [snip] ”There are other pics that I agree her eyes are blackened (seems odd for someone so young & health)”[snip]

I defer to them both, and did not intend any offense, by seeming to question the perception or recollection of a fellow Monkey when I said I do not detect a lifetime of "many" black eyes in the Caylee pictures I have seen. IMO, it is an upsetting topic to consider in the first place, as are so many of the subjects we discuss in this tragic case. I usually try to be tactful and careful, but perhaps it's a good idea for me to try a little harder.   Again, I am sorry.

Hugs to my Monkey friends,
Desi

God Bless Our Caylee.               
                
                 

This post makes me very sad to see.  Why?  Because you are the epitome of tactful, fair, informed and respectful poster, at all times.  There are 3126 members here at SM and for the life of me, I do not know why a few make a valuable poster like you feel as if you need to apologize.  But, I do understand.  I had wanted a month or so ago to make a point about Gail St. John but the majority (which is really only a few posters who take it upon themselves to answer nearly every post) ripped me up, so I still have not written that post and if I feel as I am feeling right now, may never write it. 
I saw where you posted something to the effect of the forum not feeling the same as it once was and thus not as fun.  I see why you wrote that.  I have felt uncomfortable in some of the threads to lately.  The camaraderie and sense of teamwork have given way to the agenda of a few.
I have made some wonderful friends here, but I find my best memories are the times I spend in musings.  I am thinking of yielding to the leaders here or defer to them as you called it and take a break and maybe only post in musings, if at all.  Tupelo asking me today for that post, stirred up a lot of hurt and then when I saw your post - someone who is the most kind hearted, diplomatic poster I have ever seen in a forum, my heart just broke.  Please - never apologize for the open minded, brilliant, and open spirit that comes across in your posts.  You, do not own this.  Best, NewsJunkie

Hang on a second, please I do not wish to be pulled into this even in appearance as "a few" as there is nothing I said or directed toward Desi personally to make her feel badly or wrong about her opinion/view nor was I around a month ago in reference to any new discussion regarding Gail St John.  I needed to clarify that because my name was mentioned above.   Desi knows I and so many of us (i.e. Fanny) that respect her views & appreciate her input to SM very sincerely as with all our friends here.    Its also okay to have a difference of opinion without getting personally offended or developing angst, of course with the exception of flat out unacceptable behavior towards another member.  Mind you I have been mostly absent since my hospitalization/recovery but as I was catching up I didnt come across constant posts making members feel uncomfortable or hurt other than those discussing how they perceive an issue or comment on a personal level.    With all due respect, may I kindly request consideration be made by ALL of us from this point on not post personal issues, grievances or spats on our forum, especially case threads.   The more we have to comment publicly, the more members become involved and/or feel uncomfortable, even if its just witnessing an unpleasant exchange/dispute.  As of this moment & practicing what I am now respectfully suggesting for administrative consideration, it might be best if it became policy to discuss these type of situations privately via email member-to-member as cordial adults and/or amongst admins if their input becomes necessary.   Thanks in advance for everyone's consideration & mutual respect.  Have a blessed Sunday!

Well put Capp, so wonderful to see you back on and posting, we all missed you, a lot 

[no rose colored glasses]

I believe this week we will be hearing from Andrea Lyons 

[Gizzie]

I believe this week we will be hearing from Andrea Lyons 

That should be interesting! 

Have a good day all! 

[crazybabyborg]

I believe this week we will be hearing from Andrea Lyons 

This is the hearing over the State going for the death penalty? I've lost track, sorry! If so, I'm thinking this is going to be a real shoot out. Lyons is a much better atty than Baez. I hope Stan's been eating his Wheeties! 

[crazybabyborg]

I believe this week we will be hearing from Andrea Lyons 

That should be interesting! 

Have a good day all! 

You too, Gizzie!!!

[tupelohoney]

I found these two shots of Caylee with the sparse hair that we have been talking about. I'm not sure if it really is just the way her hair is on this day or if she is indeed missing hair. One thing that was mentioned here was her hair possibly falling out due to nerves. I have known people who pull their hair out one hair at a time due to being nervous and they don't even realize they are doing this at the time. My son did this one year in elementary school, only he pulled out his eyebrow hairs. 

[BluesyGram]

I believe this week we will be hearing from Andrea Lyons 

Is this the week that Lyons is supposed to show us her briefs?    

And I was wondering who has to write the response or compile the 'evidence' that LDB requested for the 'shared' discovery proving that the body was placed in the woods while KC was incarcerated.


  Go Saints!!

[SunnyinTX]

  SNIPPED:
And also IMO, children are a blessed gift.  It does bring some measure of peace to think that *perhaps* the good Lord looked down, saw how His blessed gift may have been treated, and plucked His gift back from the undeserving mother.  <<<<------- Just my opinion. 

Wyks, I snipped your post because I honestly BELIEVE every mother can look back and wished she had said or done something differently. Children don't come with handbooks for parents.  You are TOPS in my books.

BTW - I agree with your opinion above.

[no rose colored glasses]

I believe this week we will be hearing from Andrea Lyons 

That should be interesting! 

Have a good day all! 

You too 

[no rose colored glasses]

I believe this week we will be hearing from Andrea Lyons 

This is the hearing over the State going for the death penalty? I've lost track, sorry! If so, I'm thinking this is going to be a real shoot out. Lyons is a much better atty than Baez. I hope Stan's been eating his Wheeties! 

Yes, and it should be interesting