Lively Case Discussion #553 12/3 - 12/4/2006

[cubbeegirl]

Anna and Msmarple - I'll add the the Crime thread:

Posted today (12/3/2006) by Grande at T4N:

Grande wrote:
I don't know if this has been published yet or not, but I am told there was a 16 year old boy was killed last night outside of Carlos & Charlies amounting to the 2nd murder in 10 days.

Here is what I was told;

"Last night there was another killing infront of C&C. A 16 year old boy was killed. From what I heard, there was a fight outside of C&C and the kid was not even involved in the fight. He was at the wrong place at the wrong time. There was no shooting. So, I guess, he was hit and punched and he died. C&C gets very very very busy on weekends. So, a lot of people dont bother going in. They just stand outside the bar, hangout, drink and do drugs and then start fights....Well, that's exactly what happened last night and a young boy lost his life. Well, this is the 2nd murder in 10 days on the one happy island..."

and a follow-up:

Here are a couple other details I have heard...

The alleged suspect was recently released from jail

Was an employee of Tony Romas as of yesterday

Turned himself in today and has apparently taken his own life.

I have no idea how this will be reported and cannot confirm the validity at this point. I am fairly certain on all three accounts. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news regardless of the origin.

Another suicide?

[vms]

Frank Rizzo's most recent Aruba visit:

http://www.arubatoday.com/newspaper/November/AT-29-11-06.pdf
Page 1

http://www.arubatoday.com/newspaper/November/AT-28-11-06.pdf
Page 1

[Jacqueline]

I would just like to add a personal comment, real quick.

Tonight on the forum seems like old times to me.

Ideas flying, no drama and lots of great posts.

I just wanted to thank all of you here tonight for being you.

You guys are great.

[klaasend]

Thank you Jacqueline and San for the transcripts!

[Anna]

.
If Joe M is still on probation, that could be revoked and he could be required to server the balance of his sentence on the gun possession.

Don't have any idea which would be longer, that or the sixty months Jacquie said.  

Gun laws still vary by state, I do know that.  Alabama has very lenient laws on them compared even to Georgia right next door.  For example, I can legally own a stun gun.   Now there's a scary thought, isn't it?

[Tylergal]

On BFN..... MIP6 is Mark Purcell    
SandraK is SandraK

Who is REALITY?

There's no reality there at all, none whatsoever, all just repeating the Joe Taco-pee-no line.

[cubbeegirl]

I would just like to add a personal comment, real quick.

Tonight on the forum seems like old times to me.

Ideas flying, no drama and lots of great posts.

I just wanted to thank all of you here tonight for being you.

You guys are great.

Love ya Jacq  

[Tylergal]

I defer to what other monkeys heard as I can't listen with my jaw on the floor, lol!  His tone was too distracting, I really don't know what the heck he said as I have never heard him like that and was too taken aback by his emotionality.

.

Makes you wonder if Joe has to deliver on this before he gets the dough and he sees the yeast is not rising for him.

[crazybabyborg]

Jacq.............your transcripts are so very helpful; THANKS!  

[Dana]

From The LineUp with Kimberly Guilfoyle – 12-03-06

First part with Peter De Vries and Jossy Mansur.

Peter De Vries – By Phone

Kimberly:  Dutch Crime Reporter Peter De Vries conducted the investigation.  I asked him about his conversation with Van der Sloot’s first attorney Antonio Carlo.  Listen to this.

Peter:  Well we paid Carlo a visit in his office and we recorded that with candid camera and at first he tried to deny that there had been a meeting with head prosecutor but after a while he realized what we knew and then he got very uncomfortable and admitted that there had been a meeting and that was with the head prosecutor and panicked and he was very uncomfortable with this.

Kimberly:  Now how did Antonio Carlo describe why he met Karin Janssen?

Peter:  Well he didn’t want to tell us very much about it but what we found out that there was a secret meeting and that’s highly unusually because head prosecutor is not allowed to have talks during an investigation with the lawyer or attorney so that’s very strange and also Karin Janssen the head prosecutor wrote us a fax in which she admitted that a meeting took place so it’s impossible to deny that there was a meeting.

Kimberly:  And what was divulged during these meetings.

Peter:  Well in the meeting Mr. Carlo said that he had to clear his conscience and that Joran Van der Sloot played a major part in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.  No doubt at all that he said that.

Kimberly:  Did he go into any other details in terms of what that means played a major part in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway?

Peter:  Well he then stated to the head prosecutor that it was up to the police and the justice to get the full proof of this but that he wanted to clear his conscience and that yeah they had to do the work.

Kimberly:  And how many letters were exchanged back and forth between them and what information was in those letters?

Peter:  Well the head prosecutor wrote him a letter and she asked for more details and then Mr. Carlo got scared because his tip was certainly on paper and he didn’t expect that because it was a secret meeting and when Karin Janssen put it on paper he realized it was no longer a secret so then he wrote a letter back and denied he had said something like that.

Kimberly:  Now have any of the Aruban or Dutch Officials contacted you about this important information?

Peter:  Yeah they contact me I have several sources in this case and there is really no doubt not for one percent that he said that.

Kimberly:  And what do the investigators make of this?

Peter:  Now they make of this of course that Joran Van der Sloot is responsible for the disappearance of Natalee.

Kimberly:  Wow.  Now you know of course Joran’s current attorney Joe Tacopina said that this is making up facts your fabricating facts there was no such meeting.

Peter:  No then (Peter started laughing) he doesn’t know what happened I think and I have recording with our candid camera which shows the opposite of what he is saying so I don’t think he’s very well informed.

Kimberly:  Alright well Peter thank you so much in joining me tonight and talking about these new developments.

Peter:  OK welcome.

Jossy Mansur by phone:

Kimberly:  I got to ask you what did the former police chief say to you about Joran Van der Sloot and the Kalpoe brother’s involvement in Natalee’s disappearance.

Jossy:  He definitely confirmed that they admitted to the police that they had molested the girl while she was going in and out of consciousness but among other things that he said.

Kimberly:  And how long was this conversation and who specifically did you speak to.

Jossy:  I spoke to Gerald Dompig the conversation took place in my office for about an hour and I have it all on video tape.

Kimberly:  Any why did you video tape it Jossy?

Jossy:  Because as the Diario we usually do that with people we don’t trust to begin with. To have a documented proof of whatever we are going to publish in the future.

Kimberly:  Alright well there are many people who doubt that you have this tape and want to know in fact is contained in this video tape?  Do you have a transcript of this?

Jossy:  You know many people doubt many things I say but after I publish the truth everybody becomes quiet.  They go into a profound silence.  But we have the proof I have the tape the video tape, we have various copies of it made.

Kimberly:  OK and you claim to have a transcript in fact that links the boys to Natalee’s disappearance.  Do you have that for us that you can read a portion of that?

Jossy:  I can read a portion for you for example when I asked him about the case he said well you know we cannot go because we don’t have a body but you have a model crime and on the basis of their own declarations, I’m quoting him at the bottom now and then he said look if it’s not rape they fingered her, they did a lot of things to her according to their own declarations and he we have an article in our penal code that provides an eight year sentence for that.  If you do that to a girl who is not conscious they themselves said that she passed out on (inaudible) phases in the car.  That means if you do that to a person who cannot defend herself it’s eight years.  He told me this (inaudible) I’m quoting from the tape.

Kimberly:  And what else did he tell you?

Jossy:  He told me many other things.  For example you are not talking about Joran alone because while the other guy was driving the car they were making out with the girl in the back.

Kimberly:  And when you say they who was he referring to did he specify the Kalpoe brothers?

Jossy:  He said the Kalpoe brothers with Joran yes.

Kimberly:  Did you ask him why he didn’t do anything with this information and why a case wasn’t presented by the prosecutor?

Jossy:  No because I thought they would proceed on the basis of a model crime because he confirmed that these three suspects admitted this to the police.

Kimberly:  Jossy have you presented this tape to the new police chief or the prosecutor’s office.  Who else has the information?

Jossy:  The tape I only have the tape, I haven’t given it to anyone because so many things have happened in this case and so many mistrusts of who you can trust and who you cannot trust so I will present it to the prosecution when this case goes to court.

Kimberly:  Jossy Mansur thank you for being on with me tonight.

good job jossY

[Tylergal]

Question for the Monkey Brain Trust:  

Is there a correlation between Joe Mammana's recent problems and the case against J2K heating up?  Think.  Ponder.

ABSODAMNLUTELY.

[San]

Jossy said it has been definately been confirmed that they molested the girl while she was going in and out of consciousness.

Jossy has a tape and he has many copies of it.  He usually makes tapes of people he doesn't trust.  If it is not rape, they strangled her and they did a lot of things to her.  He told Jossy many other things.  He said he will present it to the prosecutor when the case goes to court.

Correction after listening to this again I realized I heard the wrong word.  SORRY ABOUT THAT FOLKS.

[crazybabyborg]

Did you notice that Beth didn't ask Jossy to turn the tape over to anyone (KJ)? I think she's most comfortable with it being in Jossy's hands.

I worry about Jossy's safety sometimes.............

[Jacqueline]

Jacq.............your transcripts are so very helpful; THANKS!  

I wish I could do more for this case.

Just a small contribution compared to what so many others (Klaas) have done and continue to do.

[Jacqueline]

I would just like to add a personal comment, real quick.

Tonight on the forum seems like old times to me.

Ideas flying, no drama and lots of great posts.

I just wanted to thank all of you here tonight for being you.

You guys are great.

Love ya Jacq  

Back at ya

[Angiex911dsptchr]

Ty San and Jackie~!!!!!!!!!  

Oh gee SAN.. one damn typo and you are gonna apologize  ROFL
Imagine if I typed it    to my piezon!

[Hotshot]

Suicide is a lot cheaper for Aruba than a trial.

And then he will burn himself and bury himself too....  So where does Jamie work these days...

[Angiex911dsptchr]

I would just like to add a personal comment, real quick.

Tonight on the forum seems like old times to me.

Ideas flying, no drama and lots of great posts.

I just wanted to thank all of you here tonight for being you.

You guys are great.

   it does Jackie.. cept for a few missing one.  (posters I mean..lol)

[Jacqueline]

Ty San and Jackie~!!!!!!!!!  

Oh gee SAN.. one damn typo and you are gonna apologize  ROFL
Imagine if I typed it    to my piezon!

 

[Katysmom]

Good night monkeys.  The repeat of the Lineup will be on in a few minutes and I am going to snuggle up on the couch to watch it.  Have a good one and remember to say a prayer for Natalee tonight.