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Author Topic: Elizabeth Olten #3 11/18/09 -  (Read 574180 times)
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MuffyBee
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« Reply #1160 on: December 03, 2009, 03:38:22 PM »

We used to have a member/moderator by the name of *******.  That person had a meltdown in the forum and was banned.

He threatened to cause trouble if his name is mentioned in the forum.  He really can't do anything but it was just easier to filter out his name.  I know it seems silly but please don't override the filter, TIA


I'm sorry everyone.  Forgive me?  an angelic monkey   he he he

 
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Wyks
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« Reply #1161 on: December 03, 2009, 03:41:06 PM »

We used to have a member/moderator by the name of *******.  That person had a meltdown in the forum and was banned.

He threatened to cause trouble if his name is mentioned in the forum.  He really can't do anything but it was just easier to filter out his name.  I know it seems silly but please don't override the filter, TIA


Ok Klaas, thanks for explaining that too. 

It seemed a silly filtering at the time, but with these explanations, I understand now the seriousness of it all.  Sorry for having made light of it.  I truly didn't know beforehand.  I ought to have known that there had to be a good explanation for it.  I just thought our filter had gone wacky.  Sorry again.   

I promise to be a good monkey for the rest of the day.    an angelic monkey


........ Sits on hands just to be sure.  hehe   

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Wyks
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« Reply #1162 on: December 03, 2009, 03:44:06 PM »

We used to have a member/moderator by the name of *******.  That person had a meltdown in the forum and was banned.

He threatened to cause trouble if his name is mentioned in the forum.  He really can't do anything but it was just easier to filter out his name.  I know it seems silly but please don't override the filter, TIA


I'm sorry everyone.  Forgive me?  an angelic monkey   he he he

 

    Ducks and runs for cover...   

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Wyks
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« Reply #1163 on: December 03, 2009, 03:48:15 PM »

Soooooo.. with the 'Request For Discovery' being filed on 11.19.09 by the defense, the prosecution had 10 days to hand that over.  Right?  And if so, then the defense *should have* that by now? 

Wonder how long it will be before we see that?  Or will we?  Am thinking that's where the diary (or the copy of 'the writings') might be. 



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YourMom
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« Reply #1164 on: December 03, 2009, 04:50:34 PM »

Soooooo.. with the 'Request For Discovery' being filed on 11.19.09 by the defense, the prosecution had 10 days to hand that over.  Right?  And if so, then the defense *should have* that by now? 

Wonder how long it will be before we see that?  Or will we?  Am thinking that's where the diary (or the copy of 'the writings') might be. 





10 days?  There is no way....
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femonanon
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« Reply #1165 on: December 03, 2009, 05:00:57 PM »

OMG   
I AM SO GLAD I'M HERE WITH THE SANE ONES...was messing around over at ws and there is something really wrong going on over there/// they now only have about 25 posters involved (not banned) on the Olten case...and so much info is incorrect I fear it is hurting both sides of the case
 



just wanted to say HELLO
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FEMONANON
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« Reply #1166 on: December 03, 2009, 05:04:12 PM »

      WELCOME  femonanon       
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MuffyBee
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« Reply #1167 on: December 03, 2009, 05:16:00 PM »

Hello and welcome to Scared Monkeys femonanon

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YourMom
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« Reply #1168 on: December 03, 2009, 05:50:41 PM »

OMG   
I AM SO GLAD I'M HERE WITH THE SANE ONES...was messing around over at ws and there is something really wrong going on over there/// they now only have about 25 posters involved (not banned) on the Olten case...and so much info is incorrect I fear it is hurting both sides of the case
 



just wanted to say HELLO


I am suprised there are still 25 non-banned people left.... ha ha   Welcome Smile
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Wyks
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« Reply #1169 on: December 04, 2009, 12:02:47 AM »

Soooooo.. with the 'Request For Discovery' being filed on 11.19.09 by the defense, the prosecution had 10 days to hand that over.  Right?  And if so, then the defense *should have* that by now? 

Wonder how long it will be before we see that?  Or will we?  Am thinking that's where the diary (or the copy of 'the writings') might be. 





10 days?  There is no way....

No way..... what?   

The first part of the Request for Discovery says:

"Defendant requests the following within ten days and throughout the duration of this cause, pursuant to Rule 25.03............. "

The prosecution doesn't have to comply within that time frame?  Or are you wondering how they can do that, or what?  lol  Might be time for me to go play some games for a bit.  My brain is scrambled!   





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Wyks
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« Reply #1170 on: December 04, 2009, 12:05:48 AM »

Hi femonanon, and welcome!   

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Wyks
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« Reply #1171 on: December 04, 2009, 12:18:14 AM »


I am suprised there are still 25 non-banned people left.... ha ha   Welcome Smile

Yeppers!  And of those 25 left, 24 post in constant fear of being banned.  Funny how they say that our forum is filled to the brim with banned posters from over there.  When the reality is, in my opinion, some/many? haven't been banned from there, just prefer being over here in an environment where there isn't that constant threat, and etc.   


 
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jill
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« Reply #1172 on: December 04, 2009, 12:35:44 PM »

All documents have been posted:

http://www.colecountycourts.com/courtnews.htm


NO!  I have too much work to do today to get behind.!   Oh well, looks like I will be staying over tonight...LOL

Not unless you read really reallllllllllllllllllly slowly.   

But still am glad to have gotten what we did. 


hi everyone 

looks like not much was released.

ugh.

Wonder if they are placating us by releasing some stuff.  Making it look like they have set up a special page for it and all - when in actuality they will not be posting the docs with substance...
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Northern Rose
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« Reply #1173 on: December 04, 2009, 12:43:01 PM »


BLOCKED WEBSITE
« Last Edit: April 09, 2011, 08:33:49 PM by MuffyBee » Logged
Wyks
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« Reply #1174 on: December 05, 2009, 01:02:52 PM »

A couple of things occured to me.  And my apologies if already pointed out by more quick-thinking monkeys. 

-- I kind of touched on this one before, but hadn't fully explained how I felt.  I think.  lol.  Since Alyssa is going to be treated as an adult, am thinking that they ought to be treating her as an adult in all ways.  As in no going back to treat her as a juvenile in part, then forward to treat her as an adult in part.  Seems awkward to me.  She did an adult crime, IMO, she ought to be getting the adult treatment all the way, regardless.  Feels like pampering her, and BS, for them to be so dang concerned not to consider the DP for her, because of her tender age of 15, even tho at that tender age of 15 she was able to take a life!  What about the rights of Elizabeth?  Is she any less dead because her murderer was 2 months younger than one able to be considered eligible for the DP?  Sigh........

-- Ok, *IF* this goes to a trial by jury.......... We've heard of a defendant's "right to a fair trial with a jury of one's peers"... What does "one's peers" mean in terms of a teenage defendant such as Alyssa?  Would her "peers" be a jury panel full of ordinary-type teens?   Or 12 teenage psychopaths?  Perish the thought!  Maybe a mixture of both?  Yet, how could a jury panel of adults be considered her "peers"??   How the heck will a jury be picked for this case? 

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KarenK
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« Reply #1175 on: December 05, 2009, 06:09:52 PM »

Am guessing it doesn't matter how close Alyssa is to being 16 yrs old, that they go exactly by how old she was at the moment of the alleged crime/s.  ?? 

According to what some have found out, Elizabeth would have been 10 yrs in just a couple of weeks - December 15th, born in 1999. 

And all I have read so far is that Alyssa evidently was born in 1994.  Anyone have a date of birth for her? 

Jan 28, 1994

   



Wyks so sorry but I got in your box.  While I was there I left fresh cut flowers, fresh out of the oven bread, and some country beef vegetable soup.  I also dusted and changed the cat litter box for you. 

Alyssa's DOB is Jan 28, 1994

Awesome!  That's so sweet of you.  And you're welcome to get in my box anytime then!  Thanks so much!      Guess I may as well run out and get a cat now.  lol


::HelloKitty::I have just the perfect kittens for you. One blue eye and one green eye one 3 months the other 10 11 months (the mother)
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Deenie
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Year of Karma ~ 2009


« Reply #1176 on: December 05, 2009, 07:04:59 PM »

  Welcome Femonanon
------
Me thinking like Wykes ( you look smashing Wykes)
I was going back and reading all the posts of the " Friends" of AB. That some are defending her or backing her. We all have to remember and its hard to feel, let alone recognize... but the truth of the matter is " These Girls are victims too".  Its actually very Sad. All of it is.
The girls who seem to cling to AB and are asking for others to see her as they knew her .. that she was their friend. They are of their age. They still do not get it. They do not have the emotional/psych skills yet formed in their brains .. That what AB did was Vial and incomprehensible. For them they see her as " Misunderstood" by the People and by LE. Which is pretty much what should be expected of them at this time.
I only hope that their Parents " At least recognize within their daughters" they may need outside help to cope with this.

Elizabeth was a living thriving Human being who was brutally murdered by AB, planned and executed by AB. The core friends of AB see her * AB as the victim. That is not right.

These young girls cannot though grasp the actual "murder" because its out of their scope of real. Yet it is causing an affect on them, even though their focusing on their friend Alyssa.

I really hope that their is a intervention for these Girls who are in AB's corner. Its hard enough for Adults to "conceive, understand,deal" with all of this. I can't even imagine being 15, knowing your so called BFF ( as Girls say) that you went to school with, had a friendship, trust with ... out of the blue Murders someone * child * anyone in cold blood ..and even confesses. With all of what has happened and with Christmas coming. I am betting that these girls are going to be with many challenges ahead of them.
I hope that someone steps in and just flat out asks " Are You Alright? Talk to Me" .. something. Anything..
I hope the same for Elizabeth's Mother. I pray someone is holding her together first and foremost.

I was thinking though about the girls. I hope someone is helping them. Its just so tragic. Even so that these girls did not know Elizabeth nor can comprehend the Act, it seems these Gf's of AB are already at risk .. and without some sort of intervention it could really take them down to a point that is life changing. That's not right either.
Elizabeth is gone, a shameless act done by AB. And with her acts instantly so many life's changed.
That is case in point,  why Alyssa is charged with Murder 1. She knew the consequences and yet she did it anyway. NOT once though did it enter Alyssa's Mind ( Elizabeth was a Object to Her/ Ab has no Conscience)   AB never would think of, Who would suffer, who would be affected, who would live the rest of their lives in torture ( EO's Mom) ... her siblings, her Grandparents, her friends.. 

  I hope though within this time, for many Christmas time is Hard, just because. I hope that the closest to Elizabeth, and even the closest to Ab are given the support that they need ~ to get through the days and months ahead.. Its so very important that they have someone to support them. 

Sigh.   
 


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kkazoo87
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« Reply #1177 on: December 05, 2009, 07:31:03 PM »

anyone catch all JM's comments? Towards the bottom.

http://marinadedave.wordpress.com/20...er-identified/

Edit:  This link indicates page error.  MB
« Last Edit: December 05, 2009, 08:00:35 PM by MuffyBee » Logged
MuffyBee
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« Reply #1178 on: December 05, 2009, 07:58:37 PM »

anyone catch all JM's comments? Towards the bottom.

http://marinadedave.wordpress.com/20...er-identified/

Hello and welcome to Scared Monkeys, kkazoo87.  Clicking on the link you provided indicates a "404 page". (page not found)

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cw618
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« Reply #1179 on: December 05, 2009, 08:51:00 PM »

snipped from  Reply #1172 on: Today at 01:02:52 PM
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=6392.msg1028893#msg1028893


Ok, *IF* this goes to a trial by jury.......... We've heard of a defendant's "right to a fair trial with a jury of
one's peers"... What does "one's peers" mean in terms of a teenage defendant such as Alyssa?  Would her "peers" be a
jury panel full of ordinary-type teens?   Or 12 teenage psychopaths?  Perish the thought!  Maybe a mixture of both?
 Yet, how could a jury panel of adults be considered her "peers"??   How the heck will a jury be picked for this case?
---------------------------------------
me in bold
i think the jury would be adults, since you have to be 18 to be on a jury

this case was tried by jury, then went to supreme court, for a ruling on capital punishment,
 for crimes committed while under the age of 18

Roper v. Simmons

This case, which originated in Missouri, involved Simmons, who, in 1993 at the age of 17, concocted a plan to murder
Shirley Crook, bringing two younger friends, Charles Benjamin and John Tessmer, into the plot. The plan was to commit
burglary and murder by breaking and entering, tying up a victim, and tossing the victim off a bridge. The three met
in the middle of the night; however, Tessmer then dropped out of the plot. Simmons and Benjamin broke into Mrs. Crook's
home, bound her hands and covered her eyes. They drove her to a state park and threw her off a bridge.

Once the case went to trial, the evidence was overwhelming. Simmons had confessed to the murder, performed a videotape
d reenactment at the crime scene, and there was testimony from Tessmer against him that showed premeditation
(he discussed the plot in advance and later bragged about the crime). The jury returned a guilty verdict. Even
considering mitigating factors (no criminal history and his age), the jury recommended a death sentence, which the
trial court imposed. Simmons first moved for the trial court to set aside the conviction and sentence, citing, in part
, ineffective assistance of counsel. His age, and thus impulsiveness, along with a troubled background were brought up
 as issues that Simmons claimed should have been raised at the sentencing phase. The trial court rejected the motion,
and Simmons appealed.

The case worked its way up the court system, with the courts continuing to uphold the death sentence. However, in
light of a 2002 U.S. Supreme Court ruling, in Atkins v. Virginia, 536 U.S. 304 (2002), that overturned the death
penalty for the mentally +++++++, Simmons filed a new petition for state post conviction relief, and the Supreme
Court of Missouri concluded that "a national consensus has developed against the execution of juvenile offenders"
and sentenced Simmons to life imprisonment without parole.

The State of Missouri appealed the decision to the U.S. Supreme Court, which agreed to hear the case.
(Donald P. Roper, the Superintendent of the correctional facility where Simmons was held, was a party to the action
because it was brought as a petition for a writ of habeas corpus.)

more on the ruling at link
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roper_v._Simmonshttp://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=6392.msg1028893#msg1028893

more reading
http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/2009/11/post_53.html

i think A.B.  case is going to be a very long trial, and apealed many times,
and may set a few precedent or two.


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goodmorn,goodnite, got to go, as always its been wonderful, talking with you, and most of all have a great day, and dont forget to smile
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