NANCY GRACE
Joran Now Says Natalee Fell to Her Death From a Balcony
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1003/05/ng.01.htmlTonight's Nancy Grace
Aired March 5, 2010 - 20:00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway, missing off her high school senior trip, Aruba. Aruban police couldn`t or wouldn`t make a case against judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot even after high-tech surveillance catches him describing the night Natalee was killed. After Van Der Sloot`s father, Judge Paulus Van Der Sloot, believed to have been key in the cover-up for his son, collapses dead, speculation Joran Van Der Sloot would talk.
Bombshell tonight. Van Der Sloot gives a second confession on air. Just days after his father cremated, video emerges of Van Der Sloot claiming teen beauty, American girl Natalee Holloway falls -- falls -- to her death from a balcony. How many more confessions does this guy have to give? And when will justice finally win out?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A shocking new alleged confession surfaces from Joran Van Der Sloot, a suspect in the Natalee Holloway disappearance.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He confessed to taking the body and putting it in a swamp or marsh on the north side of the island.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In an interview conducted by a Dutch reality TV star, broadcast on European network RTL, Van Der Sloot claims Natalee Holloway was doing cocaine, drinking and dancing on the balcony of his friend`s house when she suddenly plummeted to her death two-and-a-half stories below.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do we already know that can corroborate this confession by Joran Van Der Sloot?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t think it is a confession. He has given an interview, and he has made a version of what could have happened.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): How do you know she`s dead, Joran?
JORAN VAN DER SLOOT, SUSPECT IN NATALEE`S DISAPPEARANCE (through translator): I just know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): How did you see it? Did you feel her pulse? Did it go in one time?
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): I just touched her, and there wasn`t anything anymore. It was over.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Did you try to resuscitate her?
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): I tried everything. I even lifted her up.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why is Van Der Sloot speaking out now?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This appears to be at least the third different version of facts he`s given. He told an American reporter in `08 that he had sold Natalee to a sex slave trade. That`s why the prosecutors don`t know what the truth is.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The bottom line is he can keep on telling stories to many, many people. But until they get a piece of evidence that`s going to corroborate what he says, they`re not going to be able to prosecute him. However, the more he talks, the more directions that the prosecution can go in to try to find that evidence.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why hasn`t there been an arrest in the case? And just what more does Van Der Sloot reveal? Why now?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Good evening, I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Bombshell tonight. Joran Van Der Sloot gives another confession, this time saying American girl Natalee Holloway falls -- falls -- to her death from a balcony. Will Aruban prosecutors finally listen?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Breaking news. Joran Van Der Sloot, long suspected of being involved in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, has made an alleged confession that he hid Natalee Holloway`s body in a swamp.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s consistently demonstrated that he`s reckless and that he`s sloppy. There is no way that Joran Van Der Sloot is going to carry the body of Natalee Holloway to the interior of a 70,000-square-meter swamp.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The interview conducted by a Dutch reality TV star and aired on European network RTL, where Van Der Sloot spills the beans, saying Natalee plummeted to her death off a balcony she dancing on after a night filled with drugs and alcohol. Then with a friend, the two hid Natalee in a swamp.
DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE`S FATHER: We`re just wondering where this -- what the name of this body of water is and where it`s located because, you know, I would probably be willing to get a search team together and go search all of it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He wanted -- he said he wanted to clear his conscience, so let him tell where he put the body, and then we can very thoroughly investigate on that special spot.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This alleged confession flies in the face of an earlier alleged confession, where Van Der Sloot was being secretly recorded and said he dumped Natalee in the ocean after making out with her on the beach.
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): I was talking to her, talking to her, talking to her and she didn`t say nothing. Nothing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): How long was she shaking for? Do you know what that is?
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): An epileptic attack or something?
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): I don`t know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): She was shaking? Was there foam coming out of her mouth?
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): No. No foam coming out of her mouth. I didn`t see that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: NBC news is reporting that he is still saying her death was an accident. And Nancy, that is corroborated with what you just showed on the air, that undercover investigative report that was done years gone by.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Van Der Sloot later denied that story. But how many versions of the truth does Van Der Sloot claim to know? Where there finally be justice for Natalee Holloway?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to the director of "Diario" magazine, Jossy Mansur, joining us from Aruba. Another confession, Jossy?
JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING DIR. & PUBLISHER, "DIARIO" (via telephone): Well, so it seems. But again, this confession was also looked into by the prosecution, investigated. And under the house, the balconies, they made measurements and they concluded it`s a big lie.
GRACE: You know, out to you, Jean Casarez, correspondent, In Session. You know, what does this guy have to do, take out a billboard on 3rd Avenue to get arrested?
JEAN CASAREZ, IN SESSION: Nancy, I`ve been studying this confession. This was just broadcast on Dutch television just very -- a short time period ago. And I see it as being very, very different from the rest. And Nancy, your show just got a response from the prosecutor that they now have switched courses. They say there is a plan of action, that they are going to review all of the interviews, all of the evidence. They are going to see what may corroborate because they feel that there are many lies, but they feel there are aspects of the truth in many things, especially this last confession he gave a short time ago.
GRACE: Before we go to Natalee`s father, Dave Holloway, joining us from Meridian, Mississippi, let`s take a listen to what Joran Van Der Sloot has just had to say on national TV.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In the interview shown on European network RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot is confronted with allegations that he`s been trying to game the lie detector tests, so-called counter-measuring, or manipulating his body on purpose to beat the polygraph. After Van Der Sloot is confronted about trying to cheat, he becomes agitated, stands up and throws a glass, Van Der Sloot admitting he lies to people, one moment storming out of the polygraph session and visibly upset, the next moment chatting with interview team and smiling.
But some months later, the interviewer, a reality TV star and acquaintance of Van Der Sloot`s, finally gets him to describe what happened the night Natalee was last seen alive.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In an interview shown on European station RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot allegedly finally confesses information the world wants to know about his involvement in the disappearance and death of Natalee Holloway. But is this version the truth or more lies?
Van Der Sloot claims he was at a friend`s house with Natalee, where she was drinking and doing drugs on his balcony. Van Der Sloot then suggests Natalee Holloway was dancing on the balcony, and Van Der Sloot tried to grab her. But Van Der Sloot claims Natalee fell to her immediate death. It was then, Van Der Sloot says, he and his friend loaded up a car, throwing Natalee`s lifeless, bloody body in the back seat, driving under the cover of darkness and throwing Natalee Holloway`s dead body in a swamp.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Out to Renee Rockwell and Peter Odom. Renee, if she had fallen from a balcony, why not just call 911?
RENEE ROCKWELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Right, because -- and that would have been an easy accident to explain. But Nancy, that`s not what happened. I don`t think he`s ever told the truth. He keeps talking and talking and talking. Until there`s some physical evidence, you`re not going to see these investigators make a move, Nancy.
GRACE: What about it, Peter?
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, he has made so many different statements that without physical evidence, there`s no way to prosecute it. And of course, the police right now are doing exactly what they need to do. They`re trying to figure out what physical evidence can corroborate this new account in hopes of maybe arresting him, but it`s quite doubtful.
GRACE: Jean Casarez, let`s go through the statement. Number one, why did he give it? How much money did he make off of it? What is the gist?
CASAREZ: All right, why did he give it? It was money-motivated because the reality star in the Netherlands that did the interview said that Joran contacted him, that he had gambling debts, he had rent payments he had to make. So he gave him the money. But he said that that created a bond that would facilitate the truth. So we know money was involved.
But the facts, Nancy, here, prosecutors in Aruba say they do fit the timeline. Let`s just tell everybody what he said. He said that he was walking Natalee to her hotel. He bumped into a friend of his, had been a friend since childhood. And that is an accomplice right there. They went to a friend`s home, and that`s where Natalee fell off the balcony.
GRACE: Joining me right now, special guest Dave Holloway. He`s Natalee`s father. What do you make of it, Dave?
HOLLOWAY: You know, I don`t believe the story. There may be some truth or context in his story, but I`ve spoken with the prosecutor. I`ve actually searched that pond area. And you know, a lot of things just don`t match up, Nancy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In the interview shown on European network RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot says after Natalee Holloway fell from the balcony, he and a friend ran down to check on Natalee, but claims she was already definitely dead. Van Der Sloot says he and his friend then picked Natalee up and threw her in the back seat of his friend`s car, the back seat covered in blood as the two sped towards a swamp to dispose of Holloway`s body.
Van Der Sloot says the two wanted to put Holloway`s body as far as possible into the swamp, Van Der Sloot even admitting he lost one of his shoes in the swamp. Van Der Sloot says he knows the exact swampy spot where he claims to have left Natalee Holloway.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In an interview view aired on Dutch network RTL, Van Der Sloot claims he and a friend put Natalee Holloway`s body in a swamp to conceal that she was drinking and taking drugs before her death. After the alleged confession, Van Der Sloot attempts to apologize half a decade later for all his lies, even asking Natalee Holloway`s parents for forgiveness. But many doubt the sincerity of Van Der Sloot`s apology, just as many doubt the sincerity of Van Der Sloot`s alleged confession.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Brand-new details have emerged from the suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. In an interview with a Dutch reality TV star, shown on European network RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot claims Natalee Holloway was dancing on his friend`s balcony after drinking and doing drugs.
Van Der Sloot, fighting back tears, looking increasingly upset, then says, "And we were sitting on the balcony. She was standing on top of it to start dancing. Then I went to her to go and grab her, but she dropped down from the balcony. It`s really quite bad, and I`m so sorry that I haven`t told it for so long, but I was just always afraid of the consequences, as also drugs and stuff had been used."
Van Der Sloot`s voice quivers through the alleged confession. Then suddenly, as Van Der Sloot recounts Natalee`s fall, he walks away. But are the tears real?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In his alleged confession airing on network RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot says Natalee Holloway fell from a friend`s balcony two- and-a-half stories in the air as he tried to pull her to safety. Van Der Sloot says Holloway was definitely dead immediately after the fall, and he and his unnamed friend got rid of her body and kept it quiet.
Is that possible? And why would Van Der Sloot attempt to identify this alleged accomplice now? Van Der Sloot describes what happened next after Natalee`s fall, claiming they sat next to Holloway to make sure she was dead. And his alleged accomplice always kept his mouth shut because he`s such a good friend.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): How do you know she`s dead, Joran?
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): I just know.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): How did you see it? Did you feel her pulse? Did it go in one time?
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): I just touched her, and there wasn`t anything anymore. It was over.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Did you try to resuscitate her?
VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): I tried everything. I even lifted her up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Out to the lines. Lois, Indiana. Hi, Lois.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. Love you. You are so wonderful! I`m so inspired by you! Continue to keep up the great work. You are a great person! I am truly inspired by you!
GRACE: Lois, thank you. I don`t deserve that, but thank you so much. What is your question, dear?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, you do! I have a question and a comment.
GRACE: OK.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is, will they, now that the young man does not have, you know, hope in terms of the judicial system helping him with this case -- will they have a success and will they -- I mean, will we have a voice for the women and children that are continually hurt day in and day out? Who will be this voice for these women? Who will be a voice for Natalee?
GRACE: You know, I`m going to go to Natalee`s father, Dave Holloway. Dave, there is a new prosecutor. Do you have any faith that there`s going to be a prosecution?
HOLLOWAY: You know, I`m not really sure, Nancy. I had an opportunity to speak with him for a long period of time yesterday. I was inspired from what I heard. He believes that this latest story is false, and he gave me some reasons why. And you know, he just felt like the original video with Peter De Vries was the most accurate confession because it was not under any terms of money being paid. It was not under any duress or anything like that. He gave it voluntarily.
And after he gave that statement, Nancy, you know, everyone turned on him and realized that he`s the -- you know, the wolf in the sheep`s clothing. And then he had a difficult time of making friends with anyone. And they finally decided that, Hey, we`ve got to get him out of here, get him somewhere where no one knows him. You know, he`s had death threats, bodily harm issues and that sort of thing. So they tried to send him to Australia, and Australia blocked him from going to that country, and he ended up in Thailand, where he continued on with his issues and...
GRACE: Right. He started working...
HOLLOWAY: ... prostitution, et cetera.
GRACE: ... in prostitution, trying to recruit young girls to be prostitutes and strippers. And we have that on video. But you were saying, Dave Holloway -- everyone, with me is Natalee`s father -- that you believe the version he gave with the undercover reporter in the SUV.
HOLLOWAY: I believe that`s the most accurate confession. You know, he has two themes that goes along with this. And if you`ll notice, in this third confession, he makes sure that she`s dead. He points that out because I think he received a lot of criticism due to that first video, and he can`t escape it. And he`s trying now to make up different versions so that everyone will try to forget the original.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In an interview just aired on European network RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot makes new claims and alleged confessions about the night Natalee Holloway vanished. But why now? Van Der Sloot claims in the interview he`s been lying all the time since Holloway first went missing. Van Der Sloot now claims he had an accomplice, a friend Van Der Sloot says was doing drugs, witnessed Natalee Holloway fall two-and-a-half stories to her death, transported Natalee`s dead body in her car and helped Joran Van Der Sloot carry Natalee`s body into a swamp. So what does this new alleged confession mean to the Aruban investigation? Will there finally be justice for Natalee?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Pat Brown, criminal profiler. Pat, what do you make of yet another confession?
PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER: I make that he`s making fools of us. He`s making money. And he`s going to laugh if we all go try to dig up that whole swamp. I agree with Dave, the first confession was the closest one. Natalee probably did die on the beach, I believe while he was probably raping her. And that part where he said she started shaking? No, that`s when he started shaking her to see what happened to her because he probably smothered her. A very, very sad situation, but I think that`s where it all happened. And everything after that, I think there`s just -- he`s just playing -- he`s just playing with us.
GRACE: Well, many people predicted once his father, Judge Paulus Van Der Sloot, died, that he would become even more of a loose cannon. And now on Dutch television RTL, he gives another confession. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In a new interview shown on European network RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot finally agrees to take a lie detector test, Van Der Sloot even saying the polygrapher can ask him any question they want. Van Der Sloot is hooked up to a polygraph machine in a sterile white room and questioning begins.
Van Der Sloot denies he caused the death of Natalee Holloway and denies knowing who caused the death of Natalee Holloway. But according to the expert who examined the polygraph results, Van Der Sloot`s answers aren`t what they seem. The polygrapher suggests Van Der Sloot is trying to game the system and control his body to influence the results of the test, an expert on the program concluding Van Der Sloot is a liar and confronting Van Der Sloot with the results of the polygraph.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In the interview shown on European network RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot is confronted with allegations that he`s been trying to game the lie detector test, so-called "countermeasuring," or manipulating his body on purpose to beat the polygraph.
After Van Der Sloot is confronted about trying to cheat, he becomes agitated, stands up and throws a glass, Van Der Sloot admitting he lies to people, one minute storming out of the polygraph session and visibly upset, the next minute chatting with the interview team and smiling. But some months later, the interviewer, a reality TV star and acquaintance of Van Der Sloot`s, finally gets him to describe what happened the night Natalee was last seen alive.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: In an interview shown on RTL with a Dutch reality TV star, Joran Van Der Sloot is sniffling and holding back tears as he describes how he moved Natalee`s helpless body to the car with the help of an unnamed friend. The two would allegedly drive to a swamp to dispose of Holloway`s body.
Joran says, "We just picked her up without taking a sheet. Under her arms, just behind the passenger seat, against the backseat. At that point it was me by the feet and he vice versa. The water immediately starts there so we just ran through the shrubs into the swamp, and look for the deepest possible spot. And there we just put her down."
As Van Der Sloot sits firmly with his legs crossed, eyes locked straight ahead at the interviewer, he says the backseat was covered in blood and still knows the exact spot where he and this accomplice dumped Natalee`s body.
PATRICK VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): How do you know she`s dead, Joran?
JORAN VAN DER SLOOT (Through Translator): I just know.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): How did you see it? Did you feel her pulse? Did it go in one time?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): I just touched her and there wasn`t anything anymore. It was over.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): Did you try to resuscitate her?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): I tried everything. I even lifted her up. And at one time, Patrick, it was just like in the movie, this is what she did.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): Shaking?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): Yes. Very much. So I said to myself, (EXPLETIVE DELETED), what is going on?
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): What did you do then?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): So I stayed with her. There was nobody there, Patrick.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): Of course there was nobody there. It was night, Joran.
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): So I was talking to her. Talking to her. Talking to her. And she didn`t say nothing. Nothing.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): How long was she shaking for? Do you know what that is?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): I don`t know.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): An epileptic attack or something?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): I don`t know.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): She was shaking? Was there foam coming out of her mouth?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): No, no foam coming out of her mouth. I didn`t see that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NANCY GRACE, HOST: To Natalee`s father, Dave Holloway, that is the confession that you believe is closest to the truth?
DAVE HOLLOWAY, FATHER OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: It is, Nancy, and it still hurts to listen to him say all these crude things about, you know, your daughter, but I believe that`s the closest to the truth that we`re going to get at this point of time.
GRACE: Do you have any doubt in your mind that he is responsible for her death?
HOLLOWAY: Well, there`s no question in my mind at all. He said this even in this third confession that he was with her when she died and then he helped dispose of her body.
GRACE: Because, Dave, if it had been an innocent accident he would have called 911.
HOLLOWAY: Oh, yes, there`s no question about it. And you know, even in the third version they make a conscious decision that that`s not the option. So it tells you one or two things. You know there`s other crimes that may have occurred in her passing so.
GRACE: You`re right. You`re absolutely right, Dave Holloway. And let me ask you, you said you were on the phone for a long time with the new Aruban prosecutor and he gave you inspiration. Do you think they`re ever going to move on the case?
HOLLOWAY: He had indicated to me that, you know, they`re going to look at all these statements and, you know, he believes, as I do, that in these statements you tell a lot of the truth, but then again, you lie. So he thinks there`s some bits and truth to all of these statements.
And it`s just a matter of dissecting them and putting it all together and looking at, you know, is there anything we`ve missed, and is there anything else that we can do to move this investigation forward?
It doesn`t look promising, but, you know, at least they`re trying.
GRACE: Also with us, out of San Francisco, Marc Klaas, president and founder of KlaasKids Foundation, who also lost his beautiful daughter.
Marc, it`s so great to see you even though you`re so far away. Weigh in. What do you think of this latest confession on national TV?
MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: I believe that this story is one of the sleaziest little melodramas that has ever played out on the world stage.
And I believe three things. Number one, Joran Van Der Sloot is a horrible little man without conscience who is willing to do absolutely anything for money, even trafficking young girls.
You know, that`s called sexual tourism. If he were an American he would be extradited back to this country and put in prison for the rest of his miserable life.
Number two, I believe that the authorities in Aruba have never demonstrated a will to prosecute this case. They`ve allowed this guy to slide from day one and they show absolutely no -- they do not show that they are going to change in any way that I`ve seen.
And number three, every time this little creature opens his mouth he re-victimizes Natalee Holloway`s story. And it`s for nothing more than his own personal gain. And I just wish it would stop.
I wish people would stop giving him money. I wish they would stop putting him on TV. And I think that all of these people in Europe who are part of this should be ashamed of being associated with this creature in any way, shape or form.
GRACE: To Ellie Jostad, what can you tell me about a polygraph?
ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER, COVERING STORY: Right, Nancy. Well, the reality star who arranged this whole thing with Joran Van Der Sloot asked him if he would take a polygraph.
Joran Van Der Sloot said sure, I`m not worried about it at all. It would be advantageous to me to take one. But once they give him this test and I ask him questions like, are you responsible for the death of -- Natalee Holloway? Are you responsible for her disappearance? Of course he answers no.
But the expert later confronts him with her read of the results. She says, not only do I think that you were trying to manipulate the results of the test, I also believe you were lying.
He becomes very angry. He tells his friend, you know, that he can`t take this anymore, et cetera, and then later he called him -- you know, months later and said, you know, I`m really sorry but I thought that this one more time, even with the polygraph, I could beat the system.
GRACE: So he confesses he`s lying in the polygraph.
To Mark Smith, polygraph expert, vice president of New Jersey Polygraphists. Former detective. What do you make of them saying he tried to control the lie detector test?
MARK SMITH, POLYGRAPH EXPERT, V.P., NJ POLYGRAPHISTS, FMR. DETECTIVE: A lot of people do that, Nancy. They think they can manipulate the results. And what happens is it`s very clear on the charts when someone tries to do that. It`s very easy to see.
You can distort the charts but you can`t beat the polygraph. You can try to distort it but the conclusion is going to be that you can`t read the charts.
GRACE: To Renee Rockwell and Peter Odom. You know, Peter, I agree in my heart with Marc Klaas about people continuing to pay him for interviews. But as a former prosecutor I want him to keep talking and keep talking and keep talking. Because he is going to trip up again.
PETER ODOM, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, the problem, Nancy, is that he can talk all he wants but his credibility is so tainted without physical evidence. It means nothing. It`s just blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. He`s a liar.
GRACE: What about it, Renee?
RENEE ROCKWELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, everybody keeps talking about these being confessions. He has never confessed to anything. All these are is one lie after the other. No confessions.
GRACE: What do you have to say to that, Dave Holloway, that none of these are confessions?
HOLLOWAY: Oh, I believe the one in the SUV where he wasn`t -- he was not aware that he was being recorded is the closest to the truth that we`ll ever see. He was not under any pressure to tell anything. He was not paid. And he was unaware that he`s being recorded. And he was with one of his -- what he thought was his best friend. And that`s who you generally confide in when the chips get down. Is your best friends.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: In a new interview shown on European network RTL, Joran Van Der Sloot finally agrees to take a lie detector test. Van Der Sloot even saying the polygrapher can ask him any question they want.
Van Der Sloot is hooked up to a polygraph machine in a sterile, white room. And the questioning begins. Van Der Sloot denies he caused the death of Natalee Holloway and denies knowing who caused the death of Natalee Holloway.
But according to the expert who examined the polygraph results, Van Der Sloot`s answers aren`t what they seem. The polygrapher suggests Van Der Sloot is trying to game the system and control his body to influence the results of the test.
An expert on the program concluding Van Der Sloot is a liar and confronting Van Der Sloot with the results of the polygraph.
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): And in one time, Patrick, it was just like in the movie, this is what she did.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): Shaking?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): Yes, very much. So I said to myself, (EXPLETIVE DELETED), what is going on?
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): What did you do then?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): So I stayed with her. There was nobody there, Patrick.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): Of course there was nobody there. It was night, Joran.
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): So I was talking to her. Talking to her. Talking to her. And she didn`t say nothing. Nothing.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): How long was she shaking for? Do you know what that is?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): I don`t know.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): An epileptic attack or something?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): I don`t know.
VAN DER EEM (Through Translator): She was shaking? Was there foam coming out of her mouth?
VAN DER SLOOT (THROUGH TRANSLATOR): No, no foam coming out of her mouth. I didn`t see that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: To Pat Brown, profiler, why doesn`t he just shut up?
PAT BROWN, CRIMINAL PROFILER, AUTHOR OF "KILLING FOR SPORT": Because he`s amusing himself. He enjoys thinking back on what he did and he likes to play with people. So this is a natural psychopathic behavior and he`s going to keep at it. He`s got no reason to stop.
GRACE: What about it, Bethany?
BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": Well, I agree. But they paid him to give his interview and he delivered on his paycheck. He told a big old dramatic story complete with tears and trembling.
But he`s also talking, Nancy, because in each of these stories he`s revealing his deviant sexual arousal patterns. Sex offenders always have a deviant arousal pattern. In each case he paints her in a very degrading way. She`s snorting coke, she`s drinking whiskey, she`s out of control, then she goes unconscious, then he has control over her. And after she dies he gets rid of the woman.
This is his arousal pattern. However, in the final version, this -- ultimate version because there will be more, he cleans it up a little bit because I read the transcripts. He says that she goes to the house to do coke first but he didn`t do any because he`s green as grass at that point.
She gets on the balcony, he didn`t put her there. He reaches out to steady her, she falls over the edge. He goes after her to see if she`s OK. So he`s cleaning up his image. And Dave Holloway is right. This time he says that she`s dead because he doesn`t want the public to look down on him.
GRACE: To Dr. Marty Makary, Johns Hopkins University, if Natalee had fallen off the balcony, how many feet off the ground would result at a mortal fall?
DR. MARTY MAKARY, PHYSICIAN, PROF. OF PUBLIC HEALTH, JOHNS HOPKINS: Well, 50 percent of people that die at four stories -- that`s sort of the cut off height, after which we consider falls to be lethal. Those bruises are permanent. Oftentimes, they can be discovered years later. So it`s a tragic situation.
GRACE: But from two stories? Two stories?
MAKARY: Two stories we`re looking at a 20 percent death. Three -- 35 and four stories, 50 percent fatality rate.
GRACE: To Rupa Mikkilineni, also on the story. Rupa, what about triangulation? Has that been used?
RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: In this case, Nancy, it has been. Actually it`s one of the reasons why the prosecutor has discredited this recent confession of Joran. This confession places Joran in this balcony apartment which is quite far away from actually where police have him at the beach at these fishermen -- the fishermen huts.
And this was based on telephone, cell phone triangulation. They have him speaking to Deepak Kalpoe back at his house while he was on the beach.
GRACE: And back to Natalee`s father, Dave Holloway, joining us from Meridian.
Dave, the triangulation, the pings off his cell phone are consistent with that story he`s his friend in the SUV.
HOLLOWAY: That`s correct. You know, you`re not going to be able to get away from those simple facts. And that`s some of the reasons the prosecutor decided that this story wouldn`t hold water.
You know, Joran gave the address of the friend`s house and he gave a wrong location. And then they also checked out the car and they could not find any evidence of any blood in the vehicle or anything like that.
The car that they allegedly used was a family vehicle and if they would have gone to the swamp area that`s -- in other words, that`s called the sewage waste water treatment area and if they would have gotten back into the car, you know, they would have totaled it out just because of the smell.
And in the interviews with the family members that was not the case.
GRACE: Dave, you know he`s totally using Natalee now. He`s completely whoring her memory out to make money. When you discover he`s made another statement, what does that do to you?
HOLLOWAY: It`s -- it brings up a lot of stress and anxiety. You know, I look at it two ways, Nancy. It`s good that he`s talking, but I don`t like the way that it`s being portrayed or done. So --
GRACE: You`re glad he`s talking but you don`t like what he`s saying?
HOLLOWAY: Yes. I don`t like the fact that he`s in it making money on a crime that he`s -- you know, committed, and in profiting from it. So, you know, he --
GRACE: I agree. To Jean Casarez, you`re hearing Dave Holloway, Natalee`s father. Has this guy, Joran Van Der Sloot, ever worked a day in his life? And how much do we think he got paid, Jean?
JEAN CASAREZ, CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": You know, it hasn`t come out how much he`s been paid and this video is only over in Europe right now. I think --
GRACE: Well, Jean, Jean, they tried to charge us $160,000 for the footage. OK? If that`s any hint as to how much he got paid.
CASAREZ: You know, I think one positive that can come out of this Nancy, and from Mr. Holloway also, is last time we covered Natalee Holloway, prosecutors had said that timeline fits, other things don`t, that`s it.
But now they have changed and now they say we have a plan of action. We`re going to look at everything. So if this, in fact, opened up this investigation again, and investigation that many though was closed, that`s a positive, Nancy.
GRACE: Well, you`re echoing what Natalee`s father, Dave Holloway, has said.
Everyone, very quickly, tonight`s "CNN Heroes."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When I went to go see Dr. Moore, this is what he seen. Would you like to see it? I developed skin cancer from too much sun exposure. When I see this it just -- I have a hard time looking at this photo right now.
DR. ANDY MOORE, MEDICAL MARVEL: This cancer was so far advanced eventually it would have killed him. He felt that he could not afford to have the surgery.
In this economic time our friends and family can`t wait. They need this health care now.
All right, bud, how are you doing?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A little nervous.
MOORE: Yes. Maybe you`d be a little crazy if you weren`t a little nervous. That`s OK.
Today he`s now back for that operation to reconstruct his nose. We`re going to give you some joy juice to take care of that.
I`m Dr. Andy Moore. I`m a plastic surgeon that perform free surgical procedures on people that have no health insurance.
OK. Let`s let the good times roll.
When I started 26 years ago I would just simply make a call to the hospital and say I`ve got somebody I`m going to do for free.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, everybody, this is Michael (INAUDIBLE).
MOORE: It just became for complex with computers and HMOs and insurance companies. These people don`t have health insurance. And I think it`s our duty to reach out and help those type of people as often as we can.
Yes, we just finished up. Everything went great.
It`s about what I went into medicine for. It`s about taking care of people and not necessarily expecting something in return for it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GRACE: What a week in America`s courtrooms. Take a look at the stories and more important, the people who touched our lives.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHERIFF WILLIAM GORE, SAN DIEGO SHERIFF`S DEPT., ON THE CASE: It`s with great sadness this afternoon that we discovered shortly after 1:00, human remains near the water`s edge in a shallow grave in the area our search efforts had been concentrated. There is strong likelihood that we have found Chelsea.
GRACE: Investigators zero in on a child sex predator, John Albert Gardner III.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The first count was murder. The second count is assault with intent to commit rape.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Gardner wishes to enter a plea of not guilty on both counts.
BRENT KING, CHELSEA KING`S FATHER: One of the nicknames that I have always called my daughter is my angel.
GRACE: California investigators race to the Jackson home on reports Michael Jackson`s three young children in danger.
That`s video from RadarOnline. It`s Jermaine Jackson`s first 13-year- old son beating his younger brother.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is the third time that they`ve been here and they`re obviously really concerned about the kids. Are they in safe?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jaafar is in a lot of trouble. His dad was out of town. When his dad gets back, he is in big, big trouble.
SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY & CHILD ADVOCATE: Grandma say you they better take this seriously because it`s like the taser, doesn`t even phase her.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A Florida pastor is arrested and behind bars on pornography charges.
GRACE: One word, freak.
STACEY NEWMAN, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Most of these DVDs, though, Nancy, were young boys, 6, 7, 8 years old.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Police say 43-year-old pastor Eric Spandorf downloaded and tried to distribute porn.
GRACE: This guy needs to go to jail for life.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Let`s stop and remember Navy Hospitalman Lucas Emch, 21, Kent, Ohio, killed Iraq. Left studies at the University of Akron to enlist. A "Devil Doc", awarded the Purple Heart, Navy and Marine Corps Commendation medal, Army Commendation medal.
Loved fishing, sports, Green Bay Packers, movies, history, politics. Big heart, funny impersonations. Leaves behind parents Wes and Julie, sister, Samantha.
Lucas Emch, American hero.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being with us. And a special good night from the New York control room. Good night, Bret, Liz, Squeaky and Evil.
Everyone, I`ll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.
END
