Natalee Case Discussion #830 2/25/10 - 3/13/10

[texasmom]

Even if the accident was contributed to by a "blow out" of one of the tires on the white car (I think the Diario article hinted at that)...IF the driver of the black car was under the influence he may not have responded promptly to the other car in his path!

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/16880/1/

fiscal dop kruimel does not for test chofer of accidente fateful

sunday, 07 march 2010 - 08:01

the chofer of the kia opirus owing to go hospital cu ambulance after of the impacto. the was injury. his situation do not so important. in one desgracia so earnest always is come autoridadnan mash alto. the trip here till even fiscal dop kruimel owing to present for presencia the investigacion of the miembronan of cuerpo policial encarga cu the departamento of trafico. click read more for more info... police always in casonan so is deal at test chofernan envolvi in the desgracia for can completa they investigacion cu all seguridad y less cualkier doubt. thing cu owing to wing atencion is cu owing to coy sample of the chofer cu owing to fayece in the desgracia. esey do not problem although everybody know cu walter franken do not drink alcohol. sinembargo polisnan owing to stay one some babuca hour cu the same fiscal owing to tell cu do not necesario for take sample of blood of the opirus. not know of where the conclusion of the fiscal but polisnan is achieve cu the fiscal was robez. esey is immidiately one remarke cu kizas another fiscalnan not have to let go without more. one onderzoek (research) have to is 100% completa.

Comments:

comentarionan (3) subscribe to this comment's feed mustra/kita comentarionan come across...

scirbi for chandrikapersad moondi, march 08, 2010

aunque do not the owing to ocasiona the accidente abysmal here, yet mirando the sla serious cu both car owing to abide, will was good for owing to test the chauffeur day the kia. locual my not can compronde is cua is the maneho of ministerio publico in sort of casonan so. jen of fanfaria cpa owing to anuncia publicamente via prensa cu last one chauffeur cu is envolvi in sort of accidentenan so, will have of blow or give blood for verifica the eventual porcentahe of alcohol in they sistema. seems cu mp y cpa is work completamente near of another, locual not can. the sort of casonan so is place person lose all respet for dicho autoridat, of the bit cu owing to stay still. pg/korpschef as so good of come cu one maneho coherente cu do not sow doubt serca we tocante the obhetividat of as mp or cpa +12 come across...

scirbi for racer, march 08, 2010 here is come the words of one famous idiotic, hij is niet zomaar iemand. at aruba owing to stay demostra once more cu have husticia of classe. depende that are you, or what surname do you have are you wordo persigui penalmente etc. not let we of forget the pachi cu wordo gedaal for one another pachi, the not owing to neither go close for one day why? because the is figure conosi upstairs we island. same cu this, because the is a conosi pesey the can core sober etc. never we will know what precies owing to happen, but con we can is assure cu the kia opirus do not aberration? the can owing to go at his hand left also y go bek at his hand left, so place the another desvia at his hand left y strike in the opirus!!!!! think one rato upstairs this!!! besides the kia assure certain was come much duro, but the can owing to slow y strike cu less impacto etc. condolencia at the family of the fayesidonan. +0 come across...

scirbi for mam hernandez, march 08, 2010 apreciabel senor chandrikapersad. mane the artic*lo self is tell. the polisnan owing to stay babuka. do not alcaso cu cpa and mp do not work cu another or bandi another. hour one fiscal jega at one sitio is the have the delatsto word. the is the leader of the investigacion. till even the have more of tell cu de witte self, neither the can overule the. mane the artic*lo is tell, till even the polisnan is hanja cu the fiscal owing to actua robez. and because; police do you not can overule one fiscal. have to remarca, of good fountain but hear cu do not first trip senora kruimel know take descicionan aberration. for as the investigacion more objectivo, transparente and above-board have to did take sample of both person.

[texasmom]

Truth and Justice for Natalee!

That's what it's all about Aruba,

We won't give up!

 

[jen3560]

Thank you TxMom for all the articles.

Let me see if I have this right.....

Papito is pissed (apparently for the VERY first time) with the press for publishing pictures of the car accident and the victims - and of course, the taking of blood from the driver.

From some of the comments from the locals, we see that they are pissed that ALE has acted in a biased way, by not testing the blood of the driver of the other vehicle, and now want transparency from ALE (about 5 years too late, I might add).

So........................ALE is pissed because their press caught it with pictures, and now they can't just make a claim of out and out drunk driving on the part of the deceased driver, with the other driver not being at fault?

I find it very weird that NOW Aruba is not wanting pictures of the deceased on the front pages of their newspapers.

[wreck]

Posted at RU:

Elaine S  PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:18 pm         

resigned wrote:
How much of ALE's annual budget is going to investigate Joran's stories?

....Are the good citizens of Aruba outraged about it?

I promised myself not to get involved in any Natalee discussions, and I've held to that promise, but having just come back from Aruba after a month's stay, I felt I wanted to answer your question, Pat. The answer is they are totally disgusted. Before I get the same rhetoric that I got here time and again, no ~ I don't know every single local that lives on the island, but in the last 17 years, I've been lucky enough to get to know and love quite a few that are like family to me.

In the beginning of this case Joran had support because Arubans couldn't believe that he could have been involved in Natalee's disappearance. That's not the way it is anymore... and, that support's gone because he's told so many lies and so many stories. The doubters are no longer doubting that he's involved in Natalee's disappearance. He's despised, not wanted on the island, and his own worse enemy. Several told me "he better watch his back."

I was there when Paul died, and I felt sad for him. I read here that the "island was in mourning." Interesting, because I didn't experience or see that. I'm sure that family and friends were indeed mourning, but just like my Mom's death that occurred a few days ago, life went on and it was business as usual. Nothing stopped, it was just another day that G-d decided to call someone home. Unfortunately, because of Joran, many people had unkind things to say because they're angry. Karma's always talked about here on the board, and karma was talked about at Paul's death... sad, to say the least.

It's the opinion of many that this case although cold, won't be closed any time soon; that Joran remains and will remain the prime suspect.

The people of Aruba ARE good people ~ kind, warm, caring and have taken lots of hits because of not only how this case went down, but because Joran continues to "stick it to everyone," and they're sick and tired of his shit. He may be on island now so I've read, but I can tell you in no uncertain terms that if he is, he isn't welcome, and if he is, it's not warm and cozy for him, and I don't care what anyone says to the contrary... I know for a fact that this is the way it is because I heard it from many horse's mouths... first hand!

There was much talk on the beach between us timesharers when Paul died because it brought this case to light once again. I can tell you in no uncertain terms that he had not one supporter. These people have followed the case from the moment it happened because, like for me, it happened on an island we love. The consensus was that ultimately, although it may take a lot more years than any of us like, the truth will come out... and Joran will ultimately be made to pay the price for his involvement in Natalee's disappearance. Note that I said disappearance and not death ~ although we all believe she was dead before the sun rose the next day.

I'm not going to argue with anyone nor do I intend to get into a diatribe with anyone. What I've said is real... it's what locals are saying, and how people feel ~ period!

And, for anyone who cares, Aruba is alive and well... the crowds at the new mall reminded me of Times Square. In fact, it was so crowded that I went only one night, and decided that it was something I didn't want to do again. Like any other place on the planet, the economy isn't what it should be so people are eating out less, but there's certainly no lack of tourists. My timeshare was 96% occupied. So, for the naysayers, not to worry.... Aruba's not going down the tubes. It's a fantastic island, and a wonderful place to vacation. It was wonderful visiting my second home, and I'm counting the days until I go back.

5 years too late -- but I think the tide is finally turning!!!

[jen3560]

I think you're right, Wreck.

I have to admit, I was glad to read Elaine heard from people that Joran had better "watch his back". 

[2NJSons_Mom]

Family still vigilant in search for answers to sister's '03 slaying
By Oliver Mackson
Times Herald-Record
March 09, 2010 2:00 AM
MIDDLETOWN — Karen and James Whalen are hoping that the larger-than-life sight of Megan McDonald's smiling face will jolt someone who knows about her death into stepping forward.

The 20-year-old college student from the Town of Wallkill was found, beaten to death, on March 15, 2003. Her body was left in a muddy field off Bowser Road, in a remote part of the town. Last weekend, two billboards displaying her image went up in Middletown: One on Route 211 near the city's border with Wallkill, another on East Main Street.

The billboards were the idea of Megan's older sister, Karen Whalen, and her brother-in-law, James Whalen.

They drew their inspiration from a TV program that showed Joran Van der Sloot — the suspect in the 2005 disappearance of 18-year-old Natalee Holloway in Aruba — bemoaning Holloway's mother's persistence in keeping the search for her daughter's killer in the public consciousness.

"She wouldn't let it be. She just kept trying to get results," said Karen Whalen, who lives near Albany.
The Whalens share the belief of the state police that someone who's still in the area knows something. Investigator Matthew Skarkas, who's handled the case since 2008, is hoping that some of McDonald's acquaintances, disinclined to talk with police in their late teens and early 20s, have matured since then.

"I think there are multiple people who could be of assistance," Skarkas said.

"Whoever did this is still in the area," said James Whalen, "and we want them to know we're going to remain aggressive. We're going to remain vigilant. We're going to do everything we can to make sure this person is brought to justice."

The billboards are owned by Rock City Media of Woodstock. The company supplied the billboards at cost.

A reward for information leading to an arrest and conviction of Megan's killer has been raised to $27,000. The increase is pegged to her age: She would have turned 27 this year.

"It's so long, you don't realize," James Whalan said. "We don't have any digital photos of her."

omackson@th-record.com



TRACY BAXTER REPORT
To see a video report about this story:


McDonald murder case

http://www.recordonline.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100309/NEWS/3090313/-1/SITEMAP

Edit to add link

[Anna]

Good Morning, Monkeys,

What salts my snails about this wreck is that Cheremy Croes is know to drink to excess, wear T-shirts with obscene messages on them, and hang out at C&C now Sr Frog.

Long ago we have vid links posted, I think on the Front Page comments, showing cars squaing their tires loudly at C&C, sort of a parade of them at leaving time.  Probably driven by local drunks.  Some of you may recall this.  It was posted along with one of what appeared to be a local girl dressed in animal print short dress on stage doing the usual obscene danching and the poster was perporting that it was in fact an American and typical of American behavior in Aruba.

Is Cheremy's father the uncle of Steve Croes who works for ALE?  Or is that also the uncle of Cheremy?  Most likely it is and perhaps there are even other connections.  Everyone is related to everybody else per Beth.

[Anna]

*squealing their tires*

Need much more coffee.

[Anna]

Posted at RU:

Elaine S  PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 6:18 pm         

resigned wrote:
How much of ALE's annual budget is going to investigate Joran's stories?

....Are the good citizens of Aruba outraged about it?

I promised myself not to get involved in any Natalee discussions, and I've held to that promise, but having just come back from Aruba after a month's stay, I felt I wanted to answer your question, Pat. The answer is they are totally disgusted. Before I get the same rhetoric that I got here time and again, no ~ I don't know every single local that lives on the island, but in the last 17 years, I've been lucky enough to get to know and love quite a few that are like family to me.

In the beginning of this case Joran had support because Arubans couldn't believe that he could have been involved in Natalee's disappearance. That's not the way it is anymore... and, that support's gone because he's told so many lies and so many stories. The doubters are no longer doubting that he's involved in Natalee's disappearance. He's despised, not wanted on the island, and his own worse enemy. Several told me "he better watch his back."

I was there when Paul died, and I felt sad for him. I read here that the "island was in mourning." Interesting, because I didn't experience or see that. I'm sure that family and friends were indeed mourning, but just like my Mom's death that occurred a few days ago, life went on and it was business as usual. Nothing stopped, it was just another day that G-d decided to call someone home. Unfortunately, because of Joran, many people had unkind things to say because they're angry. Karma's always talked about here on the board, and karma was talked about at Paul's death... sad, to say the least.

It's the opinion of many that this case although cold, won't be closed any time soon; that Joran remains and will remain the prime suspect.

The people of Aruba ARE good people ~ kind, warm, caring and have taken lots of hits because of not only how this case went down, but because Joran continues to "stick it to everyone," and they're sick and tired of his shit. He may be on island now so I've read, but I can tell you in no uncertain terms that if he is, he isn't welcome, and if he is, it's not warm and cozy for him, and I don't care what anyone says to the contrary... I know for a fact that this is the way it is because I heard it from many horse's mouths... first hand!

There was much talk on the beach between us timesharers when Paul died because it brought this case to light once again. I can tell you in no uncertain terms that he had not one supporter. These people have followed the case from the moment it happened because, like for me, it happened on an island we love. The consensus was that ultimately, although it may take a lot more years than any of us like, the truth will come out... and Joran will ultimately be made to pay the price for his involvement in Natalee's disappearance. Note that I said disappearance and not death ~ although we all believe she was dead before the sun rose the next day.

I'm not going to argue with anyone nor do I intend to get into a diatribe with anyone. What I've said is real... it's what locals are saying, and how people feel ~ period!

And, for anyone who cares, Aruba is alive and well... the crowds at the new mall reminded me of Times Square. In fact, it was so crowded that I went only one night, and decided that it was something I didn't want to do again. Like any other place on the planet, the economy isn't what it should be so people are eating out less, but there's certainly no lack of tourists. My timeshare was 96% occupied. So, for the naysayers, not to worry.... Aruba's not going down the tubes. It's a fantastic island, and a wonderful place to vacation. It was wonderful visiting my second home, and I'm counting the days until I go back.

Every time this dies down, Joran stirs it up again.  At the expense of Aruban tourism which is their god and he knows it and just doesn't care.  Money is all he wants.

I think many turned on Joran when the first set of tapes came out and even more now.  He is doing a great job of alienating the whole island.

[Anna]

2NJ,

That billboard would be a wonderful idea for Natalee as well.  But I have to wonder if Aruba would allow it?  Instead of letting Beth have it at cost, they would probably double the price considering their lack of character in general.

ALE should post one with a phone number if they really wanted evidence but then they would just make it disappear themselves!  Or decide it was not credible.

It would be so much better if we were dealing with rational people who reacted in a normal manner instead of these weirdos!  They also might deface the billboard considering half of them specialize in blaming the victim.

But I would like to see it at least tried.  Something that could be done, anyway.

[Anna]

Someone could be found beheaded in Aruba and right away they would set about finding a way it was self-inflicted! 

Seriously, with regard to the car wreck, that's their approach.  I bet Cheremy was totally drunk and they could smell it but don't want a  vehicular manslaughter trial so he will get away with this and it's even locals who were killed.

Could have just as easily been a tourist and they were all for it being the fault of the victim when it is so obvious that car was hit by another traveling at a very high rate of speed, likely faster than should be allowed anywhere on the island.

Sounds as though the cops sell photos  or take bribes to allow them to be taken, too.  How much money do you have if you want photos of gore?

[Anna]

OK, I will stop talking to myself. . . off to work and lurk.

Hope ALL Monkeys have a wonderful day--no exceptions!

[Lifesong]

OK, I will stop talking to myself. . . off to work and lurk.

Hope ALL Monkeys have a wonderful day--no exceptions!

I don't really have anything to add to the conversation, except to say that I too am glad the locals were not mourning Paulus and are now not pleased to have Joran in residence.  I surely wish they'd DO something about it.

Anyway, I'll wholeheartedly second Anna's wishes for a wonderful day to ALL monkeys.  We stand with the girl and today we are one day closer to Justice.
 

[Lifesong]

http://open.salon.com/blog/don_rich/2010/02/27/no_mystery_just_no_justice_for_natalee_holiday_a_neighbor

FEBRUARY 27, 2010 12:46PM

No Mystery, Just No Justice, For Natalee Holloway, Neighbor

<<snip>>

In any event, Frank had been hired at one point to investigate the Holloway case by the family, and was outraged at the lack of justice in this matter. When he told me what he found, I was too.

Frank interviewed bartenders and wait staff in Aruba, off the record of course, and van der Sloot, who was always the primary suspect, and has confessed, twice, had the following well documented modus operandi.

There is no mystery in the Natalee Holloway case, just no justice for an Alabamian in Aruba, or from the Dutch government to which Aruba is beholden.

I thought the Dutch were our allies?

Basically, van der Sloot trolled tourist bars, watching all the pretty girls, gradually finding out when they were leaving.

He tipped the bartender very well, the night or two before they were leaving, in order to get access to their drinks.

After drugging, and then raping the girls, his motif was that the girls would be confused from the drug, unsure of what had happened, and just really, really just wanting to go home to Mom, and not be embarrassed, which makes van der Sloot a cold blooded serial rapist: period.

Frank told me he stood on that beach, and you could see it all.

van der Sloot went to the well one time too many, and OD'd someone, finally.

His friends helped him hide the body to avoid the initial search,and then, he just walked her out to the sandbar, and cast her into the sea.

Why the Aruba and Dutch authorities are protecting a confessed. more than once, a confessed scumbag serial rapist and manslaughterer is beyond me, just as I have never understood why Federal or Alabama authorities don't lay murder charges agaisnt him, if the Ducth won't, put a bounty on his head, and drag him back to Alabama to get the attempted rape, kidnapping, and manslaughter charges he deserves, before he hurts anyone else, and to give the Holloway family justice, finally.

There is no mystery in the Natalee Holloway case, just no justice for an Alabamian in Aruba. Maybe Americans aren't welcome there, and should stop taking cruise ships there?

<<snip>>

http://specials.msn.com/A-List/Natalee-Holloway.aspx?cp-searchtext=Natalee%20Holloway

finis

I realize this is nothing new, but it just makes me so angry!  Why didn't anybody ever stand up for these girls?  If his modus operandi was so freaking well known...ugh.  I hope those that stood silently by are forever haunted by the memory of Natalee.  I hope when they close their eyes at night to go to sleep they see Beth Holloway and hear her pleading for help and for justice.

 

[carpe noctem]

Thank you TxMom for all the articles.

Let me see if I have this right.....

Papito is pissed (apparently for the VERY first time) with the press for publishing pictures of the car accident and the victims - and of course, the taking of blood from the driver.

From some of the comments from the locals, we see that they are pissed that ALE has acted in a biased way, by not testing the blood of the driver of the other vehicle, and now want transparency from ALE (about 5 years too late, I might add).

So........................ALE is pissed because their press caught it with pictures, and now they can't just make a claim of out and out drunk driving on the part of the deceased driver, with the other driver not being at fault?

I find it very weird that NOW Aruba is not wanting pictures of the deceased on the front pages of their newspapers.

No, No, Jen... I think you have it straight.


....and here was my favorite part of the article.

Comenencia According to the press and the police have in the past a signed agreement outlining what is and is not allowed during the performance of police services and care after a serious accident . This agreement would also have agreed that publishing the explicit photos of an accident is unacceptable. The emergence in recent years of new media on paper and online, are regular pictures in the local press published close to and often far beyond the borders of the decent went.

An Aruban wouldn`t know DECENCY if it wore a neon t-shirt emblazoned with a logo
saying: I`M MR. DECENCY. I wouldn`t go anywhere on that floating poop ball without
a 99 dollar Flip Mino HD Camera.

Cuz if you ain`t a member of the club... you are a dead duck.

In America we call it an HD VIDEO CAM... in Aruba it is called a LIFE INSURANCE POLICY.

Papito, again, just pissed that he got caught.

Bonbini Papito - 

It`s so heartening to see you`re still a dutifully employed
5 foot shrimp peckered lying jackass.

[blah]

...that floating poop ball ...
 
...5 foot shrimp peckered lying jackass.

               

[carpe noctem]

One more thing -

Joran told in his book how they set girls up for rape. It doesn`t matter that he doesn`t use the word... because in his small little scrambled egg of a brain... he doesn`t think
it is.... he thinks every girl he comes across is a drunk little whore that just could not
wait to get her hands on him. That is how a sexual predator thinks. The girl could be
punching him in the face... and he still would think she was hot for him. He just will
never get it... because he is a giant FECAL BOMB.

Hans Mos and ALE have some computer records proving that they were communicating
about a dead Natalee. Last time I checked, computer records were accepted as proof in
any country.

So, for these DENIALISTS LOSERS AND MORONS that still have the brass set of teets
to call what happened to Natalee a disappearance

You need help and LOTS OF IT!

Like the article says:

The only mystery left in the Natalee Holloway case, is how Aruba can justify letting
Joran Van der Pig go free on the streets.

The two Kalpoes are guilty - they knew what they were setting her up for. (rape)

Joran is guilty. He murdered her in a rape gone wrong.

He even failed at the rape part... because like EVERYTHING JORAN DOES...

He BOTCHED IT.

[jen3560]

Thank you TxMom for all the articles.

Let me see if I have this right.....

Papito is pissed (apparently for the VERY first time) with the press for publishing pictures of the car accident and the victims - and of course, the taking of blood from the driver.

From some of the comments from the locals, we see that they are pissed that ALE has acted in a biased way, by not testing the blood of the driver of the other vehicle, and now want transparency from ALE (about 5 years too late, I might add).

So........................ALE is pissed because their press caught it with pictures, and now they can't just make a claim of out and out drunk driving on the part of the deceased driver, with the other driver not being at fault?

I find it very weird that NOW Aruba is not wanting pictures of the deceased on the front pages of their newspapers.

No, No, Jen... I think you have it straight.


....and here was my favorite part of the article.

Comenencia According to the press and the police have in the past a signed agreement outlining what is and is not allowed during the performance of police services and care after a serious accident . This agreement would also have agreed that publishing the explicit photos of an accident is unacceptable. The emergence in recent years of new media on paper and online, are regular pictures in the local press published close to and often far beyond the borders of the decent went.

An Aruban wouldn`t know DECENCY if it wore a neon t-shirt emblazoned with a logo
saying: I`M MR. DECENCY. I wouldn`t go anywhere on that floating poop ball without
a 99 dollar Flip Mino HD Camera.

Cuz if you ain`t a member of the club... you are a dead duck.

In America we call it an HD VIDEO CAM... in Aruba it is called a LIFE INSURANCE POLICY.

Papito, again, just pissed that he got caught.

Bonbini Papito - 

It`s so heartening to see you`re still a dutifully employed
5 foot shrimp peckered lying jackass.

Boy, that's the truth!!

Thanks Carpe.  I think we understand their system now.  Boy, I bet Arlene's pissed! 

[carpe noctem]

Aruba Amigoe News:


Aruba
Boekhandel Mariska bankrupt
March 9, 2010




ORANGE CITY - After 51 years selling books is a family business Mariska morning declared bankrupt by the court. Five workers, who for months have received no salary, had the company to court. The company offered "no defense" against the bankruptcy. Today or tomorrow is a liquidator appointed by the company under his care taking. Then clear the bookstore or temporarily remaining open or that the shop is closed. The staff has since last Friday not to work. They are suspended by the bookstore. The court noted the decision of the bankruptcy that he "very much believes that companies that have more than 45 years existence, the doors to close," said the lawyer. Recently, Marathon also video library and media company The News declared bankrupt. Last year, construction chain Brenchies its doors after 75 years in relation to bankruptcy.

[carpe noctem]

Aruba Amigoe News:


Aruba
School bus collides with car
March 9, 2010



ORANGE CITY - A bus International School of Aruba (ISA) has clashed Monday in a car. Some students who were in the bus, came to the terror Fri Nobody was injured.

The accident happened around half past three at the crossroads of the Bilderdijkstraat to Byron Street. The car drove on the Bilderdijkstraat towards the Vondellaan and did not grant priority to the bus which drove Byron Street. At the intersection the vehicles came into contact with each other roughly. The car was dragged through the intersection and came to rest on the sidewalk. The blow was good, witness the damage to the passenger. Bystanders noted that, apart from the driver happy, nobody else in this car Sat "Otherwise there were injuries."
A spokesman said that the ISA students all wore their belts. "So you see again the importance of wearing a seat belt." The students themselves seemed not much upside to the accident. Some students even got to take pictures of the damage to the vehicles.