Natalee Case Discussion #830 2/25/10 - 3/13/10

[jen3560]

OK so what we have so far:

1 - 20 yr old Aruban
2 - Drug dealer in the hotels
3 - At his father's house
4 - Mother alibied him
5 - Gave 2 witness statements
6 - Blood below his balcony
7 - Blood in his car
8 - Name (either first or last) begins with A
9 - Disposal in Bubali Bird Sanctuary - from the only entrance to it there is, walked as far as they could

How many statements did Freddy give?

Freddie Alexander Arambatzis
June 12, 2005 11:05
pages 5
writer: Dennis Jacobs/Juan Boezem
description: witness statement of JVDS neighbor/friend

Freddie Alexander Arambatzis
June 13, 2005 17:00
pages 5
writer: Johny Erasmus
description: witness statement

Freddie Alexander Arambatzis
June 16, 2005 15:30
pages 8
writer: Dennis Jacobs/Marcelino Ras
description: witness statement

Freddy Zedan
June 17, 2005
pages 6
writer: Dennis Jacobs/Eric Soemers
description: witness statement

Freddie Alexander Zedan Arambatzis
June 28, 2005 14:25
pages 11
writer: Shaniro Kelly/Haydee Nadal
description: witness statement

Freddy Zedan Arrambatzis
July 1, 2005
pages 9
writer: Dennis Jacobs/Haydee Azucena
description: witness statement

[Tamikosmom]

To me..It seems like this:

Take all of the (few) tidbits of truth (to the story) that exist (or have been discovered)...
Formulate them into a different (concocted) story that encompasses these tidbits and distances real culpability of anyone involved.

Use Paulus if necessary. He is deceased and can not be held accountable.

The concocted story will be designed to minimize jail time (for those responsible) while attempting to wrap up the case.

The question remains: Will the world buy this load of shit (from the little boy who cries wolf)?
"If they find the girl's body, they will see the shit" - Probably does not refer to whiskey or cocaine.

"Your own father, unbelievable" - Paulus probably wasn't climbing the pole with her.

BINGO!!

BUCKSHOT ... The bottom line is ... Natalee Holloway's remains ... a some point in time ...  ended up the cage/trap on the ocean floor where it remained for over 2 1/2 years until it was discovered by the Persistence and ... recovered unchallenged by the enemy who had prevented justice from prevailing since the getgo.

IMO

Janet

++++++


KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

Kyle Kingman:  Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF.


WASTE OF TIME AND EFFORT
 
"If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy.

Private Eye - Scared Monkeys

[EURobert]

Just in SBS6 Shownews the first images of the interview JvdS with TerrorJaap: Joran crying... and crying... and crying...
Makes me curious. Can he 'act' that?

Does a bear poo poo in the woods
 

Well, he had the time to prepare, so...

Here a link to the preview: http://www.shownieuws.tv/web/show/id=186479/langid=43/contentid=148846

Oh, they cut out the images of Joran crying; probably because of the copyright. The interviewed guy also says he thinks there will not be very much left of Natalee's remains; "the van der Kouwes-girl was found after a couple of weeks and only little was left of her body".

[Kermit]

Just in SBS6 Shownews the first images of the interview JvdS with TerrorJaap: Joran crying... and crying... and crying...
Makes me curious. Can he 'act' that?

Does a bear poo poo in the woods
 

Well, he had the time to prepare, so...

Here a link to the preview: http://www.shownieuws.tv/web/show/id=186479/langid=43/contentid=148846

Thank you EU Robert.

Seems like Joran has made everyone in Aruba bend over and take it.

[jen3560]

Buckeye - thank you for posting that.

That's a lot of info actually on this "A" person.

[Rob]

Few points on Buckeye's article from the last page.

1. Can't be Lorenzo - his father is dead. This person has a living father - or did in 05.

2. Astrid did not move in October of 05 - she moved later - in 06 if I recall correctly.

3. Looks like Freddy to some extent because of the two houses.

4. why do these people not just bark out the name and keep playing the initial game?

5. blood on pavement - and blood other places - and no one noticed this?

[Buckeye]

EURobert

If they do not have the "evidence" to arrest him, why can they not order a psych eval and commitment until he is stable enough to tell the truth?  Why do they not take some action?

[msmarple]

Hi Monkeys,

I check news sites off and on during the day - ABC has this latest (2nd in one week) confession from Joran as its big story. Headline:

Natalee Holloway Snorted Coke, Fell to Death, Suspect Says
Joran van der Sloots alleged new confession asserts graphic details of the night she died

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/latest-confession-natalee-holloway-suspect/story?id=9954650

[Buckeye]

Few points on Buckeye's article from the last page.

1. Can't be Lorenzo - his father is dead. This person has a living father - or did in 05.

2. Astrid did not move in October of 05 - she moved later - in 06 if I recall correctly.

3. Looks like Freddy to some extent because of the two houses.

4. why do these people not just bark out the name and keep playing the initial game?

5. blood on pavement - and blood other places - and no one noticed this?

Didn't Koen have an apartment, in town?  Maybe a second "family" home? 

Whose father also posts a lot of online pics?

 

[klaasend]

Posted by Poochy at GM:

This just in from a friend:

Joran said Natalee fell off of a balcony.
Van der Sloot lost his shoe in a swamp

"We drove together to Bubalie Pond"

Terror Jaap paid for admission

       Joran van der Sloot's confession in his new explicit about how he has dumped her body: "We have her back, just behind the passenger seat down, and drove together to the Bubalieplas."
 
The trip to the marshes in the north of the island occurred in panic. Earlier that night he was with Natalee on the beach accomplice A. encountered, both at home inviting for cocaine and whiskey.

       "Natalee wanted after kissing and cuddling on the beach not return to her hotel," he says. "We were at A. home, so I think that, uh, we both forests ... "Then Joran claims that he often took girls. "We have been with three friends rented a hotel room, and brought back so many girls. That has happened. "And:" You should also remember that the island is mostly just a party ... They're just more loose. "

       According to Van der Sloot was the car at the gate of the house where the fatal fall occurred. After the fall he was with A. "Complete tripping", said he was very emotional. "We actually sat on her, and feel everything. But she was really one hundred percent dead. "

        "I was seventeen and had to say about one weeks to America. It's all so quickly. Almost half of the Netherlands thinks I'm a murderer. "

       It also highlights his friend A. as someone who did not want Natalee to his home would be found. A. would be a small dealer in the hotels on Aruba. "We had to get her way, because it was his father's house. And he was awfully much coke in his room ... I thought we would go to jail if we did nothing. "

       Both reason then to the marsh below, with only one entrance. He had this place near a tower, to which birds could be monitored. "We took her as far as possible in the swamp. We are the water as far as possible by all the blades of the marsh caught up, the deepest place and sought her out there. "

   Bloodstain
       Van der Sloot claims he was in the swamp also lost one of his shoes, who was stabbing in the mud. "I could not find him." The other threw it back on the road. On the back of the car was a bloodstain. "A. has brought me home. And I also think he has cleaned his car himself, and so on, so his parents would find nothing about it. "

        The accomplice said the investigation into the disappearance twice as a witness. A. it always remained silent. "He has kept his mouth shut all these years, when in fact my fault ..." said Van der Sloot. Her body mass during the searches never found, Joran shall not explain. "I think I've just been lucky, lucky that I've had angel on my shoulder."

       For Justice in Aruba is the highly emotional television confession, like the undercover operation by De Vries, a major dilemma in relation to the establishment. The former winner of the Golden Cage, Terror Jaap, made contact with Van der Sloot and repeatedly paid sums on Joran. In the months preceding the emotional confession was videotaped many hours of 'interviews', which hardly can be taken seriously.

        Van der Sloot also took him to the renowned detective agency Schalken & Partners him to submit to the polygraph. These actions are described as judicial "null and void".

       The makers of RTL approached therefore additional external experts for an opinion on the value of the confession.

       Justice, the statement laid aside as unreliable, because Joran refuses to cooperate in further investigation. However, Van der Sloot has drawn a map where Natalee was left. Search in the swamp after years proved no more useful.

       Van der Sloot made the confession, his own words, because he said "would make clean sweep". "I'm not one hundred percent right in, but I know that a good decision." His father would never have been involved in crime. "My father always told me that if something had happened, I just had to tell."

telegraaf  (online translator used)

=====================================
 
 AMSTERDAM - Joran van der Sloot appear have explained in its new consent emotionally and very given full details concerning its share in the death of Natalee Holloway. Has it been played really or? Joran van der Sloot say for RTL-camera' s to that he clean ship wants make and explains that he to the body of Natalee Holloway in a marsh has let disappear.

Old police Chief Gerald Dompig, which did research to disappearance, stated yesterday that the reading is appropriate really in the findings of the first research. The telegraph yesterday knowledge has integratedly taken of on video conversation taken of 2.5 hour.

The new consent took place in a hotel in Düsseldorf and Sunday evening RTL 5 is transmitted.

Remake Joran happen by its violent emotions more convincing than in its first involuntary tv-biecht. Justice on Aruba would take off the consent too rapidly as a remake ' fantasia and leugens' , at least this way ex-politieman Dompig in a response to the conclusion of head officier Peter Blanken. (Dompig) Former the research LEADER says that the consent serious research asks. According to him is appropriate the reading in the time line. Also this time is specific of van der Sloot according to him.

Thus Joran call the exact house address where Natalee died, the name of accessary and define he the car with which its body was transported. van der Sloot  maintains in its new consent the most important components which he admitted during undercoveroperatie of Peter deVries: that he present was at its dead and its body let disappear.

Joran name name and toenaam of accessary a friend, A. Joran state that he Natalee took along that night with these, then 20 person whose birthday it is, Arubaan to his parental house, where they used cocaine on the balcony and drank whisky. " A. had put on music exactly. And, eh, their two had both exactly what coke op." Natalee and A. sniffed the narcotics of the edge of a house key, put he. According to Joran Natalee climbed on the edge of the balcony. " Them was think I considerably sloshed, therefore she will dance simply a smattering half striptease, just like them on training period at Carls & Charlies to doing was."

http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/6142789/___Natalee_snoof_cocane_en_viel___.html
==============
Alberto Groeneveldt Finally the island got afew years of rest of the Nathalee Holloway case, and here comes Joran van Der sloot right after his dads funeral..... to say " i have a third confession" is this now for real Joran? are you getting paid to keep this story alive? because you are defenitely f....ing up our island of which you are ...not a native...... now live at Nancy Grace who is exaggerating and making things way worst again....See More
Tue at 8:41pm ·
 
Julia Renfro Does.... This confession was made in March 2009... Yes, it is BS, but nothing different than all the BS that has been presented by all and everyone so far.
Tue at 8:45pm
 
Jay Gee Oh gosh, again!!!!!!
Tue at 8:55pm
 
Julia Renfro This confession was given nearly a year ago. The OM investigated it with the cooperation of forensic scientists from the Netherlands, the declared his taped account of what happened a fantasy... didn't and couldn't have happened that way. SO, the question is, why is RTL going to air a "Fantasy" of what didn't happen to Natalee? When they know that there is no evidence?
Tue at 9:06pm
 
Alberto Groeneveldt oh ok but still its too much now
Tue at 9:37pm
 
Julia Renfro who brought this out now? Joran made this interview nearly a year ago, the tape was already investigated by the authorities and deemed fantasy... Rubish... And never of interest to anyone prior to Paul's death.
Tue at 9:45pm
 
Julia Renfro Yes, everything you've seen on TV is not exactly the truth....
Tue at 9:59pm
 
Alberto Groeneveldt i am tired of all this shit
Tue at 10:04pm
 
Uka Hernandez Me 2 Alberto ban busca e guy ki of laga nan deshaci di dje ya Aruba por ta trankil y Turismo y economia ta sigui cana stabil!!!! E tin mi T%&^% yen caba mi ta tur ANSHA pa via di dje om I hate him!!!! psyco kens ey
Tue at 10:25pm
 
Esther d'Aguiar macamba stinki.....
Wed at 3:10pm
 
Tatiana Da Costa Gomez I saw Nancy Grace yesterday and its sad that such an ass get so much attention.....and it also said see how bad Nancy Grace talks about Aruba like all of us are the same as that bastard of Joran........I wish he could desapare
Wed at 4:00pm
 
Nick Heyden he better go pray for his father so he can rest in peace
Wed at 4:02pm
 
Charles Croes I Repeat: "This is a very sad situation and it will have many reprecussions and implications when it is finally solved"
Wed at 4:03pm

Jo Hepburn What a shame, this guy caused suuuuch bad press for your island! And he's not even there right now... right? so sad xx
Wed at 5:48pm
 
Guido Arends de un bagaso no se have caso!!!!!!!!!!!
Wed at 7:49pm
 
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=649675584

modified to add this pic:

[Edward]

Natalee was brought to a party..
Natalee was raped and murdered in cold blood by a drug dealer and friends.

Arubagirl first reported this very early on right here at scared monkeys in a post called rumor.

Joran is only telling part of a story.

There was no accident .. She was murdered.

Let us not chase another shango riddle.

[Kermit]

Just in SBS6 Shownews the first images of the interview JvdS with TerrorJaap: Joran crying... and crying... and crying...
Makes me curious. Can he 'act' that?

Does a bear poo poo in the woods
 

Well, he had the time to prepare, so...

Here a link to the preview: http://www.shownieuws.tv/web/show/id=186479/langid=43/contentid=148846

Oh, they cut out the images of Joran crying; probably because of the copyright. The interviewed guy also says he thinks there will not be very much left of Natalee's remains; "the van der Kouwes-girl was found after a couple of weeks and only little was left of her body".

So has Joran agreed to show them where he put her body yet?

[Buckeye]

Andre Santos has a brother and a sister.???

[Edward]

Arends, relative of Sara M.  was replaced by Freddy
Freddy may have never existed in the story..Just placed there on purpose.

Let us not forget that part... 

[Kermit]

OK so what we have so far:

1 - 20 yr old Aruban
2 - Drug dealer in the hotels
3 - At his father's house
4 - Mother alibied him
5 - Gave 2 witness statements
6 - Blood below his balcony
7 - Blood in his car
8 - Name (either first or last) begins with A
9 - Disposal in Bubali Bird Sanctuary - from the only entrance to it there is, walked as far as they could

How many statements did Freddy give?

Freddie Alexander Arambatzis
June 12, 2005 11:05
pages 5
writer: Dennis Jacobs/Juan Boezem
description: witness statement of JVDS neighbor/friend

Freddie Alexander Arambatzis
June 13, 2005 17:00
pages 5
writer: Johny Erasmus
description: witness statement

Freddie Alexander Arambatzis
June 16, 2005 15:30
pages 8
writer: Dennis Jacobs/Marcelino Ras
description: witness statement

Freddy Zedan
June 17, 2005
pages 6
writer: Dennis Jacobs/Eric Soemers
description: witness statement

Freddie Alexander Zedan Arambatzis
June 28, 2005 14:25
pages 11
writer: Shaniro Kelly/Haydee Nadal
description: witness statement

Freddy Zedan Arrambatzis
July 1, 2005
pages 9
writer: Dennis Jacobs/Haydee Azucena
description: witness statement

Wasn't Freddy's mother the supervisor of the Bulbai Sanctuary?

[2NJSons_Mom]

I remember a party in Malmock or thereabouts was posted very early in the case.  It may have been on the front page......or RWV

[Anna]

Timeline: The last night of Natalee Holloway
Based on several certificates, records and research documents of the Aruban law enforcement agencies, and the mob of Joran describes the route, is to create a timeline. Natalee was her last night with Joran and his two friends Deepak and Satish. That is certain.

In the days after the disappearance of Natalee talk them off to give a false statement. After Joran an incriminating statement against his friend Deepak issues ( "Deepak has her raped, murdered and buried in the Fisherman's Hut"), appears at least part of the truth to be told.

Sunday, May 30


22:37 hours
Joran log home on his computer. He has been with Deepak and Satish agreed to Natalee and her friends to search Carlos' n Charlies , A popular place of entertainment in Orange City.

00:00 hours
Deepak and Satish Joran get home on. He is not quite ready to go. Leave them at 00:15 hours by car from Deepak to Oranjestad.

00:30 hours
Joran and his friends walk Carlos' n Charlie's inside. A friend of Natalee with Joran says Natalee to go dancing, because she has a crush on Joran. Natalee Joran has a Jell-O shot at, a kind of jelly with alcohol, the bar is Natalee, Joran licks the Jell-O shot from her navel.

01:00
Carlos' n Charlie's is closing. According to Joran then they drink a Bacardi 151 in a pub nearby.

01:15 hours
Joran and Natalee get into the car of Deepak. Satish is on the passenger seat. Joran and Natalee sit back. They drive away. Friends of Natalee see her in the car with the three boys. A school mate of Natalee that she still calls need to be. Natalee will continue and calls back: "I want to stay! Aruba!"

01:30
Joran, Natalee, Deepak and Satish drive to the northernmost tip of Aruba, to The Californian Lighthouse. Natalee would like to see sharks, which are not according to Joran. According to various statements of the three buses are not the way to the lighthouse, but they turn back down the hill towards the big hotels.

01:50 hours
Joran and Natalee off at the beach will be just north of the Marriott hotel. According to Joran statement they walk a bit north, until they at the Fisherman's Huts arrive. There they lie on the beach. How long is unclear




01:50 hours - 03:35 hours
What exactly has played after 01:50 hours? The interview and the new declaration of Joran, they at one point fell to the hotel from Natalee. This is a fifteen minutes walk. Just before they arrive at the Holiday Inn Hotel, They would at Moomba Beach Bar a friend of Joran encountered. Then they would join him to his house Palm Beach in the neighborhood are gone, that is ten one minutes walk from the beach.

Natalee would the balcony gesjanst and some danced with Joran, she would have snorted coke there and have fallen off the balcony. Joran mentions in the interview any time, but if what he says is true, then that between 02:15 02:45 hours have been.

One thing is certain: Joran log home at 03:35 hours on his computer, according to data provided by his ISP. He has an hour or so had time to turn the house of the friend to the lake Bubali drive (which takes one minutes or 5), the pond to catch the body and leaving home to go.




The shortest route the Bubali Plas Joran leads past the house to McDonalds, where Joran one of his shoes would have left. Joran call around 03:00 am his friend Deepak to say that his way home, walking on bare feet. It is quite a long walk from the McDonalds to Joran's house. If this reading of Joran true, it is likely that he is his friend near his house to sell.

Data from the ISP that logs Joran at 03:35 hours, via the chat his friend Deepak that he gives his home, then look what he is for football sites and 04:00 he looks two films. At 04:30 pm logs from Joran. The next morning he goes to school.

http://www.rtl.nl/(/actueel/rtlnieuws/)/components/actueel/rtlnieuws/2010/02_februari/26/verrijkingsonderdelen/tijdlijn-joran-natalee-aruba.xml


I hope this has not already been posted.  I am trying to keep up and don't recall a timeline.

[Tamikosmom]

Posting to see if there is any difference in translation:

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2010/02/holloway_fell_over_balcony_say.php

Holloway fell over balcony, says Van der Sloot

Friday 26 February 2010

American teenager Natalee Holloway was killed after falling off a balcony at a friend's home after drinking whisky and taking cocaine, main suspect Joran van der Sloot is reported as saying in a German tv interview.

The Telegraaf, which has seen the 2.5 hour interview, says an emotional Van der Sloot made the confession in a hotel room in Dusseldorf.

Former police chief Gerard Dompig, who was involved in the initial investigation into Holloway's disappearance on the Caribbean island of Aruba in May 2005, says he believes the claim is worth further investigation.

Van der Sloot's new story fits with the time line and is very specific on the details, he told the Telegraaf.

Aruban officials have already dismissed the new statement as 'fantasy and lies'.

Whisky

In the statement, Van der Sloot says he, Natalee and another friend went to the friend's house where they took cocaine and drunk whisky.

Natalee climbed on to the edge of the balcony, he said. 'I think she was really drunk, so she started doing a sort of half strip tease, like she did on stage at Carls & Charlies,' he said.

'I walked to her to dance with her a bit, and I held her hips and when I let go she fell over the balcony.'

When the two ran down stairs, they found Natalee on the ground with a lot of blood. 'I think she hit the ground with her head first,' he is quoted as saying.

The two young men then put the body in a car and hid it in a swamp where he lost a shoe, he claims.

Alibi

The other youth has been given an alibi by his mother, the Telegraaf reports.

The new confession will be broadcast on RTL5 on Sunday night.

In 2008, Dutch tv crime journalist Peter R. de Vries claimed he had solved the mystery surrounding the girl's disappearance using a plant and a hidden camera.

During the programme, Van der Sloot told the plant, who was working for De Vries, that the girl was completely drunk and died while they were on the beach. Her body, he said, was dumped at sea.

© DutchNews.nl


http://www.expatica.com/nl/news/dutch-rss-news/natalee-holloway-died-after-fall,-suspect-says_26406.html

It is all about the lining of pockets.  Joran van der Sloot and ... each of the networks/personalities who have publicly revealed the changing confession have mutually benefitted.  I guarantee ... if Joran does not meet an early demise ... there will be more "confessions" to following as long as Joran continues to be assured that he cannot be held legally accountable.

Janet

+++++++


April 27, 2009
 
Terror Jaap breaks his silence today over the controversial interview he had with Joran van der Sloot. De Gouden Kooi-winner talks about the special friendship he has quickly built up with Joran and how far he had voluntarily and on camera to talk about the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.

... Joran had a huge gambling debt…with someone you don’t want to be in debt with. He needed my help.  So I thought…if I ‘invest’ right now…help him then I gain some power over you…you will trust me more…and at a certain point I can ask you…we have to do this. And that’s how it happened.

http://www.shownieuws.tv/web/show/id=186479/langid=43/contentid=70993

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4918.msg787749#msg787749


Holloway fell over balcony, says Van der Sloot
Friday 26 February 2010

... Aruban officials have already dismissed the new statement as 'fantasy and lies'.

http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2010/02/holloway_fell_over_balcony_say.php

 

[EURobert]

Just in SBS6 Shownews the first images of the interview JvdS with TerrorJaap: Joran crying... and crying... and crying...
Makes me curious. Can he 'act' that?

Does a bear poo poo in the woods
 

Well, he had the time to prepare, so...

Here a link to the preview: http://www.shownieuws.tv/web/show/id=186479/langid=43/contentid=148846

Oh, they cut out the images of Joran crying; probably because of the copyright. The interviewed guy also says he thinks there will not be very much left of Natalee's remains; "the van der Kouwes-girl was found after a couple of weeks and only little was left of her body".

So has Joran agreed to show them where he put her body yet?

I haven't heard anything like that. I'm afraid Joran knows that if he tells them where they can find the body they will find GHB, semen of different people and other stuff that will implicate them, as well!

 

[Tamikosmom]

Hi Monkeys,

I check news sites off and on during the day - ABC has this latest (2nd in one week) confession from Joran as its big story. Headline:

Natalee Holloway Snorted Coke, Fell to Death, Suspect Says
Joran van der Sloots alleged new confession asserts graphic details of the night she died

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/latest-confession-natalee-holloway-suspect/story?id=9954650

Thanks msmarple.

Janet