Lively Case Discussion #573 1/13 - 1/14/2007

[Tibrogargan]

If I was going to be sick in a car, I'd head for the window.  I think it would be instinctive.  Did they have the windows open?  Natalee supposedly yelled to her friends.  She would have leaned out the window.

Might be why the 3 amigos made a point of testifying to that.

Covering for screaming escape activity.

They misunderstood what she said.  She was yelling Murderers and they thought she was saying Aruba.  

How was that a misunderstanding?

Nadira sounds like murderer so murderer must sound like Aruba

[Carnut]

SunFreak - I could be totally wrong (of course), but I have always believed she was hurt somehow at the rocks and then placed in the car. I truly believe the blood was from those injuries, and that those injuries are the ones that caused her death.

I've always thought that too.  I'm just wondering why the blood on the rocks (or whatever it was) was not seen earlier when they were doing island-wide searches. Part of their story in the very beginning took Natalee to the Lighthouse and then to the HI.

Now I wonder what the purpose of Joran bring up the issue of a gun in the secret police car tape was?  Was she accidentally shot? Or shot on purpose b/c she was fleeing or struggling or attacking the driver of the car?

Dunno, but unless it had a silencer on it, some folks in the area probably would have heard something.

Also if she was struggling it had to be a pretty lucky shot to hit anything that would stop the action.

I really think rocks and guns are just complicating the situation.

[BTgirl]

SunFreak - I could be totally wrong (of course), but I have always believed she was hurt somehow at the rocks and then placed in the car. I truly believe the blood was from those injuries, and that those injuries are the ones that caused her death.

I've always thought that too.  I'm just wondering why the blood on the rocks (or whatever it was) was not seen earlier when they were doing island-wide searches. Part of their story in the very beginning took Natalee to the Lighthouse and then to the HI.

Now I wonder what the purpose of Joran bring up the issue of a gun in the secret police car tape was?  Was she accidentally shot? Or shot on purpose b/c she was fleeing or struggling or attacking the driver of the car?

Yes, I've never been sure exactly how she was in the area of the rocks. It could have been by beating, shooting, being struck by car, etc. I keep visualizing the scenes from the rock painting video and thinking how likely it would be that a bleeding person attempting to escape would leave just such a trail on the rocks.

As to why it wasn't spotted earlier - well, it depends on who was searching. If it was ALE, they certainly weren't looking for evidence to use against J2K. What was the date of the rock painting video? Anyone have that at hand?

[robots]

getting kicked with SHOES that are covered with blood


 

[Tibrogargan]

OK Monkeys.  I am off to catch a mouse      
Will try to check back later

[Carnut]

SunFreak - I could be totally wrong (of course), but I have always believed she was hurt somehow at the rocks and then placed in the car. I truly believe the blood was from those injuries, and that those injuries are the ones that caused her death.

I've always thought that too.  I'm just wondering why the blood on the rocks (or whatever it was) was not seen earlier when they were doing island-wide searches. Part of their story in the very beginning took Natalee to the Lighthouse and then to the HI.

Now I wonder what the purpose of Joran bring up the issue of a gun in the secret police car tape was?  Was she accidentally shot? Or shot on purpose b/c she was fleeing or struggling or attacking the driver of the car?

Yes, I've never been sure exactly how she was in the area of the rocks. It could have been by beating, shooting, being struck by car, etc. I keep visualizing the scenes from the rock painting video and thinking how likely it would be that a bleeding person attempting to escape would leave just such a trail on the rocks.

As to why it wasn't spotted earlier - well, it depends on who was searching. If it was ALE, they certainly weren't looking for evidence to use against J2K. What was the date of the rock painting video? Anyone have that at hand?

Think the gun and the hit girl with car thing were brough up by JVDS and Friends to put the blame on anyone but JVDS.

[mishy]

If I was going to be sick in a car, I'd head for the window.  I think it would be instinctive.  Did they have the windows open?  Natalee supposedly yelled to her friends.  She would have leaned out the window.

LilPuma, if Natalee were already passed out (or asleep as Roger would have it), she wouldn't have been able to make it to the window...

[SunFreak2]

If I was going to be sick in a car, I'd head for the window.  I think it would be instinctive.  Did they have the windows open?  Natalee supposedly yelled to her friends.  She would have leaned out the window.

You put it so much nicer than I did    

Also if drugs and alcohol ripped out her stomach lining wouldn't vomit include blood?

One can get an esophageal tear ( Mallory-Weiss) from vomiting too hard.  It is sually associated with alcohol. If the person is also a bulemic (not saying Natalee was) an esophageal rupture (Boerhaave syndrome) can occur from retching too hard.  They are both life threatening, with the rupture often being more fatal.

[Cat]

I think the gun is a red herring.What does concise mean,CARNUT?I have been the car with a girl/woman vomiting(I guess I bring that out)and you would amazed how much and where it goes.I go for the repeated beating myself,because the style fits the sporter.I have given a few late night rides to those that called because their dates were to drunk to drive.I have a feeling that there was more than one car.Cat

[SunFreak2]

If I was going to be sick in a car, I'd head for the window.  I think it would be instinctive.  Did they have the windows open?  Natalee supposedly yelled to her friends.  She would have leaned out the window.

LilPuma, if Natalee were already passed out (or asleep as Roger would have it), she wouldn't have been able to make it to the window...

I used to open the car door and lean over.  Maybe she fell out if she wasn't wearing a seat belt.  Then when they backed up they accidentally ran over her?

[San]

I believe Joran was hitting Natalee.  Deepak got upset for a reason and this is why they said Joran is crazy.  The Kalpoes didn't say this because he was raping her because that was their intent when they got in the car that they all were going to rape her so why get upset and call him crazy.  JMO.

[SunFreak2]

As to why it wasn't spotted earlier - well, it depends on who was searching. If it was ALE, they certainly weren't looking for evidence to use against J2K. What was the date of the rock painting video? Anyone have that at hand?

June 10 and 11.

[BIGORANGECRUSH]

I remember Blood samples sent to the Dutch turned into chocolate!! Someone said the samples were switched before it got to Holland!!   Some one helping with the COVERUP!!!  

[Carnut]

Hope y'all don't mind if I sit here a bawl while I'm watching 'Forrest Gump'.

[SunFreak2]

Hope y'all don't mind if I sit here a bawl while I'm watching 'Forrest Gump'.

Carnut, I never would have figured you for the sensitive type.

   

[cubbeegirl]

Good evening Monkeys! Has anyone heard from Snoopy or Angie?

[Carnut]

Hope y'all don't mind if I sit here a bawl while I'm watching 'Forrest Gump'.

Carnut, I never would have figured you for the sensitive type.

   

I'm not, just some things really touch me, and this movie does.

[nonesuche]

Sunfreak, you and i are on the same page regarding carnut not being sensitive - just who does he think he's kidding? the nerve !  

   

hi sweet Cubbee, I had an email from Angie today so I think she's around?

[nonesuche]

Hope y'all don't mind if I sit here a bawl while I'm watching 'Forrest Gump'.

Carnut, I never would have figured you for the sensitive type.

   

I'm not, just some things really touch me, and this movie does.

you being sensitive is just a dirty lie - so there !

[cubbeegirl]

Sunfreak, you and i are on the same page regarding carnut not being sensitive - just who does he think he's kidding? the nerve !  

   

hi sweet Cubbee, I had an email from Angie today so I think she's around?

Hey nonesie! Glad to see you up and around.....We are having a coughing fit here tonight... my kids asthma is out of control, so off to the doctor we will go tomorrow.....