Shantina"'Kat" Smiley & 8 yo son Azriel, WA Missing 3/13/10(BODY OF BOY FOUND)

[Wyks]

Wykes to me it looks like the same spot, just the tides are different. Where the van is parked is at the shoreline during low tide and the pic showing the path I think shows that area in high tide. Just a guess though

Am looking at the pic again, and yep, that sure could be, TG! 

I just got thru reading what you wrote about the tire tracks.  I posted mine before reading yours.  We're on the same train of thought with all that!   

 

[Wyks]

Ok, y'all sick of me yet??   

Well I'd like to read what the rest of you think about this case too.  Questions, comments.  Not trying to hog it all.  Even if that is a lil pink piggy.  LOL 

 

[theboyzmom]

I just wanted to know if anyone else had seen this. RS deleted this so here is the link through the google cache. In it he talks abt stopping at a winery to do some wine tasting. And this was approximately the week he would later say she had "relapsed." This whole blog that he had up & had deleted was abt his excursionons into different areas of the region & it is a log of those adventures w/ detailed descriptions of these places. In addition, you can see one picture where Shantina is sitting at a table w/ pizza and beer on it & he is snapping photos of her eating. For someone who knew she had an alcohol problem, he doesn't seem to concerned abt taking her along for pizza w/ beer & for wine tasting. I wonder why he removed this blog. Something stinks.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:UzrC6v5wK0IJ:robbsimmons.wordpress.com/2010/03/06/our-first-motophoto-trip-to-portland-the-gorge/+/search%3Fhl%3Den%26q%3D%2Bsite:robbsimmons.wordpress.com%2Brobbsimmons.wordpress.com&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

Ok - this is just my thought born of experience. As an alcoholic, i would have no problem going to a place with beer and have gone to wine tasting with my hubby - I just do not indulge in even tasting the wine. But when we are on a trip my hubby will sometimes ask to stop at a winery - I have no problem with that.

The removal of the blog is quite another issue - that is strange.

[Tracygirl]

Azriels father speaks the day his son is found. Sad interview, you can tell he has regrets. It is a good thing he spoke to azriel not long before this happened.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRNwBAOnXjY

TG ~ thanks for this link! 

Remember what I posted about Robb's video before, about a person looking to the left or right during recall while speaking?  Azriel's father seems to be speaking to a person to the center right of how he is standing/sitting.  The only time he appears to look to the further right while speaking is when he is referring to the water, which seems to be to his far right.  Kind of looked over at when he referred to it. 

Seems the rest of the time when he wasn't looking down or at the one he was speaking to, during recall he glanced to the left many times.  Remembering actual facts, speaking the truth.  His facial expressions and tone of voice are congruent with his words too, IMO. 

   

I know what you mean about not looking at a person when talking or looking to the side. There is a school of thought if a person looks right it means something and if a person looks left it means another. As I understand it you have to take into account what hand someone is and what they are talking about. If you want to know what I think aout this person? I think he could care less about what happened to these two and that is why he looks to the right or looks away.  I don't think there was any love loss. If I recall correctly Kat called him to say she had forgiven him and they worked it out. He was abusive to both of them, her forgiving him wouldn't matter a bit. Of course this is jmo.

[Tracygirl]

The items on the beach is what really got me thinking this case is something more then what it appears to be.

What are your thoughts about the things on the beach? 

I think the items were planted there to identify Kat and Azriel where at that spot by the stairs that lead close to the home that heard the knocking on the wall. They wouldn't have stayed put in a high tide given a ball floats, especially a hand ball like the orange one we see and  because of the same theory they wouldn't all float at the same rate or at the same time due to their weights.

[Wyks]

Although Smiley’s body has not been recovered, she is presumed to have drowned in Puget Sound. A service for Smiley was held Saturday at Brinnon Community Church.





http://www.kitsapsun.com/news/2010/apr/17/shantina-smiley-remembered-for-love-like-a-cloud/#ixzz0lQKXS6eO

4-17-2010

BRINNON

There was mourning and missing closure in equal measure Saturday as family and friends of Shantina Marie “Kat” Smiley gathered to remember her as a young woman known for “that smile” and the courage to move beyond a tough past.

The 29-year-old Smiley of Silverdale, along with her 8-year-old son, Azriel Carver, vanished March 13 while driving from Silverdale to Castle Rock to visit relatives. The van she was driving was found March 14, abandoned and partially submerged in water on a remote Puget Sound beach north of Olympia.

Azriel’s body was found March 18 on a beach at the south end of Fox Island near Gig Harbor. The Pierce County Medical Examiner’s Office ruled that the boy’s death was an accidental drowning.

There are no new leads in the investigation of Shantina’s disappearance, but she, too, is believed to have drowned, according to Detective Sgt. Cheryl Stines of the Thurston County Sheriff’s Office. The sheriff’s office will still try to recover Shantina’s body for the sake of the family, Stines said.

“This is a hard day. It really is, not knowing and having to find some way of closure,” Robb Simmons, Shantina’s fiance of two years, told the crowd of more than 75 at Brinnon Community Church. “That’s the hard part. There are so many unanswered questions.”

Simmons spoke tenderly of the woman he met online, who became his soulmate and best support. Both have had hard times in the past, Simmons said, but together they were mapping a brighter future for themselves, Azriel, and Simmons’ two children Nicky, 15, and DJ, 11.

Shantina graduated in May from Olympic College and was looking forward to a career in medical billing.

“We had a lot of challenges, but she had my back and I had her back. She’s an incredible woman,” Simmons said.

During the initial investigation, Simmons acknowledged to a television reporter that Shantina was a recovering alcoholic who had recently relapsed. The couple had been under stress due to concerns about Simmons’ health that turned out to be unfounded.

Simmons said that he didn’t believe the relapse played any role in her disappearance.

Simmons daughter broke down as she spoke of the woman she quickly came to call “Mom.” The two shared many great girl talks and more than a few tears. Shantina always inspired her to reach for her dreams, Nicky Simmons said.

“I’m never going to forget that smile,” she said. “She was the mom I’ve always wanted. The two years I’ve known her were the best years of my life.”

Dolly Smith of Brinnon, Shantina’s grandmother, helped raise Shantina, beginning in third grade when her mother was unable to care for her, and also for a time while she was in high school. Smith and her late husband, Ron Edgell, then lived in Castle Rock.

“She was a joy, and she loved me and her grandfather,” said Smith, who has since remarried. “She loved Robb with all her heart. She love Azriel so much. She was a good mother to him,”

Dolly Smith shared that Shantina and the whole family struggled when Shantina’s mother, Tammy Brown, took her own life.

Members of Cub Scout Pack 4544, who turned out in force to the service, testified to Shantina’s warm heart for kids in general. Her fellow pack leader, Laura Brown, said she had “love like a cloud surrounding her.”

At the service, Cub Scout leaders also remembered Azriel and awarded him the “Spririt of the Eagle” award for members of the Boy Scouts of America who die before their time.

[Wyks]

A friend of mine, living near Seattle, called earlier and told me that King5 TV news at 5 p.m. this evening, said that Shantina is "presumed dead" by LE.  That they have no leads, that they will continue to search for her body so that her family can have closure.  Nothing about continuing further investigation.

Sigh.... 

    

 

[Tracygirl]

She didn't just drown and neither did her son. That idea is just plan stupid. I am very disappointed that the investigators cannot take the time to see this all does not make a bit of sense when you look at it, not just on the surface but look within. Robb has lied openly over and over again. This is a shame and an example of lazy police work.

Someone killed these two people and set it up to look like an accident or a suicide. We cannot allow this memorial to stop our work. We all know this was no accident. An innocent woman and child have been victims.

[Tracygirl]

Can someone please explain how they accidently drowned?

[Tracygirl]

"During the initial investigation, Simmons acknowledged to a television reporter that Shantina was a recovering alcoholic who had recently relapsed. The couple had been under stress due to concerns about Simmons’ health that turned out to be unfounded.

Simmons said that he didn’t believe the relapse played any role in her disappearance."

What an arrogent and manipulative man he is. He reminds me of that cop, what is his name? Petterson?

My message for Robb,
No Robb a loving mother doesn't just throw everything out the window because she thinks there maybe, possibly, perhaps a chance the man she is with may have cancer due to an internet search. In your own words you didn't go to the doctor yet. NOthing was confirmed. You didn't have end stage cancer. Telling this story, you are reducing her to be a weak and dependent person who is mentally unstable and will put her child at risk.  If you felt the drinking had nothing to do with this, why tell the story? All she did was buy wine Robb, she was not shown drinking it. By telling the police about this, you reduced her ability to keep herself and her son out of harms way which in return has given the police an easy answer.

[Itaryl Moosee]

As I had said before, the Savio way.

Disregarding common sense and what intuitive police work dictates, LE in Olympia has been too eager to file the paperwork with what little "evidence" has been presented to them, to get it "done" ASAP.

They have not cared to question in-your-face facts, and oddities in the case.

[AmandaReckonwith]

Color me "just stupid" then.

I think they both drowned accidentally.

We don't always have to have evil surrounding unfortunate circumstances.
Yes sometimes, but not all times.

Trouble is, the media is held up as beacons of truth when they are usually just trying to get a story... and any story will do.

Drunk? Sexy? Drugs? Bad family? Looking for a lover, and to do so, killed her child??? Or the BF did it. Why? No good reason, just do something crazy... wake up one day and decide to go nuts.

Nah..............
Sensibiility goes with the cops on this one.
(IMO)

[Tracygirl]

Sorry in advance this will be another long post from me.

I have felt sick to my stomach all night. I cannot believe this poor young woman and little boy have not one person who is said to love them fighting for them. They all showed up at this memorial. Her step family was there, the grandparents, friends...what is wrong with these people! Where is the hope?

Her body would have followed the same currents as Azriel did. Why didn't they find her?
What evidence shows that she died? A shoe? A 1/2 emptied bottle of wine? How can you presume someone is dead when there is no real concrete evidence saying such. Are the police just plain old lazy and stupid or are they just waiting for this SOB to screw up? Surly a trained professional will be able to see what we all see right? They haven't in some cases. Poor Amber was assumed to be a runaway for a year until they found out she had been murdered.

From the above article posted by wykes.
"There was mourning and missing closure in equal measure Saturday as family and friends of Shantina Marie “Kat” Smiley gathered to remember her as a young woman known for “that smile” and the courage to move beyond a tough past".

The tough past meaning that she was strong enough to report abuse of her son and have the man responsible held accountable? The courage to move past her moms assumed suicide? The drinking Robb, that past? Well where was that courage to move past an internet search that showed you could have possibly, maybe, could have cancer? That courage just disappear Robb?

"Azriel’s body was found March 18 on a beach at the south end of Fox Island near Gig Harbor. The Pierce County Medical Examiner’s Office ruled that the boy’s death was an accidental drowning."

Assuming Kat would have been in the water at the same time as Azriel and considering the currents which are said to have brought Azriel to this beach 12 miles away from the van would have been the same currents that kat would have encountered, why wasn't she found? Did she take a wrong turn again?

There are no new leads in the investigation of Shantina’s disappearance, but she, too, is believed to have drowned, according to Detective Sgt. Cheryl Stines of the Thurston County Sheriff’s Office. The sheriff’s office will still try to recover Shantina’s body for the sake of the family, Stines said.
 
No new leads in the investigation...How did she drown? Did an unreported tidal wave hit the enlet during high tide?  tide records for 3/13... high tide at 4:13 in the afternoon. Low tide at 10:38 PM the water level was 1' 8". High tide hit again in a slow build up of water at 6:09 in the morning the next morning, water level 14' 1". It took about 8 hours. 

“This is a hard day. It really is, not knowing and having to find some way of closure,” Robb Simmons, Shantina’s fiance of two years, told the crowd of more than 75 at Brinnon Community Church. “That’s the hard part. There are so many unanswered questions. Simmons spoke tenderly of the woman he met online, who became his soulmate and best support. Both have had hard times in the past, Simmons said, but together they were mapping a brighter future for themselves, Azriel, and Simmons’ two children Nicky, 15, and DJ, 11.
Shantina graduated in May from Olympic College and was looking forward to a career in medical billing.

“We had a lot of challenges, but she had my back and I had her back. She’s an incredible woman,” Simmons said.
”

Yes Robb there are still so many unanswered questions such as the ones I and others have on this thread. My main questions today is, why were you so eager to have this public memorial for a woman you are said to be soul mates with. You had her back? Really? Mapping out a brighter future? Well I suppose that all ended when it appears she drowned in 1 foot of water.



During the initial investigation, Simmons acknowledged to a television reporter that Shantina was a recovering alcoholic who had recently relapsed. The couple had been under stress due to concerns about Simmons’ health that turned out to be unfounded.

Simmons said that he didn’t believe the relapse played any role in her disappearance.

Then why mention it Robb! The week before this "accident" Robb was eating pizza and donuts, drinking beer and tasting wine during a road trip on his bike for several hundreds of miles. This "health condition" was supposedly that he was passing blood and from an internet search he did she feared he might have cancer. probably a hemroid, which will also be listed as a reason for bleeding, from riding his motorcycle....just saying. Are investigators honestly buying that this woman would put herself, her son, her probation at risk because of an internet search? 

The rest went on to say how loving of a mom she was, how much she loved her son and Robb..what a nice person she was...I trust that is true, she seemes like she was a nice person, a good mother to not only her son but Robbs children. From some of the things I read that she had written she was focused on others and not to herself. I can tell she was a compassionate person and also a smart person. She did overcome some difficult times, she was an abused wife/girlfriend, her mother took her own life. She seemed like a survivor. I think what gets me is she is able to survives all of that but couldn't survive an internet search.

[Tracygirl]

Color me "just stupid" then.

I think they both drowned accidentally.

We don't always have to have evil surrounding unfortunate circumstances.
Yes sometimes, but not all times.

Trouble is, the media is held up as beacons of truth when they are usually just trying to get a story... and any story will do.

Drunk? Sexy? Drugs? Bad family? Looking for a lover, and to do so, killed her child??? Or the BF did it. Why? No good reason, just do something crazy... wake up one day and decide to go nuts.

Nah..............
Sensibiility goes with the cops on this one.
(IMO)

I am not falling for him one bit. Nope.

[Itaryl Moosee]

The type of "sensitivity" you describe is the kind that let Drew Petersen off the hook when his wife appeared to have drowned in an empty bathtub.

The same sensitivity that have let many men off the hook when their young wives run away with a "never seen before lover", after leaving their children, cell phones, credit cards, and purses behind.

This case might as well be one of accidental drownings, because of a drunk driver making bad choices.

But, the background we have on the people involved in this case, and the odd incidents of the day she disappeared, makes it worthwhile to take a steeper look at.

My opinion only.
 

[Tracygirl]

The type of "sensitivity" you describe is the kind that let Drew Petersen off the hook when his wife appeared to have drowned in an empty bathtub.

The same sensitivity that have let many men off the hook when their young wives run away with a "never seen before lover", after leaving their children, cell phones, credit cards, and purses behind.

This case might as well be one of accidental drownings, because of a drunk driver making bad choices.

But, the background we have on the people involved in this case, and the odd incidents of the day she disappeared, makes it worthwhile to take a steeper look at.

My opinion only.
 

I agree with you. I just don't think things are as they are appearing to be. When I first read of this case I thought it to be a murder suicide. That changed when I looked further and realized some of the things didn't fit and the story Robb was telling was different at sometimes then others. It was his own words, his interviews and the questions he answered. 

[Wyks]

Many of us cared to take a deeper look.  Seems at least one investigator cared enough to do that, he didn't believe that the items on the beach could possibly have 'washed up' in the same area.  Different weights, etc.  The tides would likely have washed the lighter weight items in a close area near to the van, the medium weight items further down the beach, and so on... Seems that investigator may have given up looking deeper, looking further than first/second appearances?  If so, wonder why? 

I remember the hard work at research on the Savio/Peterson case.  One problem with continuing to research, look at every angle, try to see what pieces fit which don't, when LE/family/friends have given up hope, is that it's even harder to confirm any of our findings.  Much less get some of them motivated again for further investigation. 

I'm just so disheartened right now.  May need to go pull weeds or something... The springtime flowers blooming in the yard may bring back a measure of hope. 
 

[Tracygirl]

Many of us cared to take a deeper look.  Seems at least one investigator cared enough to do that, he didn't believe that the items on the beach could possibly have 'washed up' in the same area.  Different weights, etc.  The tides would likely have washed the lighter weight items in a close area near to the van, the medium weight items further down the beach, and so on... Seems that investigator may have given up looking deeper, looking further than first/second appearances?  If so, wonder why? 

I remember the hard work at research on the Savio/Peterson case.  One problem with continuing to research, look at every angle, try to see what pieces fit which don't, when LE/family/friends have given up hope, is that it's even harder to confirm any of our findings.  Much less get some of them motivated again for further investigation. 

I'm just so disheartened right now.  May need to go pull weeds or something... The springtime flowers blooming in the yard may bring back a measure of hope. 
 

I find it sad that her family have given up hope, very sad. Additionally sad, it is assumed this woman was so weak she crumbled and threw her life away on an assumption.

This is my take on the investigation:
Investigators have no concrete evidence to go on. No body, no evidence in the van or around the van. They are assuming she drowned because it is being assumed she disappeared from this beach area, near to the water. Azriels death is listed as an accidental drowning because there were most likely no signs of trauma to his body, no broken bones or brusing, nothing to indicate murder.  In my opinion, this doesn't mean a murder didn't happen, just that they haven't found that one piece of evidence that proves it.

[Tracygirl]

This is one of the first stories written on this case.

http://www.kitsapsun.com/news/2010/mar/14/search-is-on-for-missing-silverdale-mom-son/

OLYMPIA — The Thurston County Sheriff’s Department is searching for a Silverdale woman and her 8-year-old son after their minivan was found Sunday in Puget Sound.

The 29-year-old mother, identified as Shantina Smiley, and the 8-year-old boy, Azriel Carver, were driving Saturday from Silverdale to her stepfather’s home in Castle Rock in her boyfriend’s van. The van was discovered late Saturday beneath the water in North Gull Harbor north of Olympia.

No bodies were found in the car, Thurston County Undersheriff Brad Watkins told KOMO-TV, and there were no signs of foul play. The doors of the car were open and her intact wallet was inside, but not her purse, Mealy said.

Investigators say that Smiley left Silverdale at 5 p.m. At 6:45 p.m., she called her boyfriend from a pay phone asking him to get her cell phone, but he didn’t answer, said Thurston County Sheriff Lt. Chris MealyDetectives found a receipt at a local business that places her in northeast Olympia at 7:55 p.m..
Law enforcement officials are treating the case as suspicious. Mealy said that Smiley, a portrait photographer, has no history of mental illness or any other problems.

Investigators conducted boat and beach searches, but came up with nothing. Deputies also are checking with neighbors.


Read more: http://www.kitsapsun.com/news/2010/mar/14/search-is-on-for-missing-silverdale-mom-son/#ixzz0lUZN33po

So at first it was being reported that Robb didn't speak to Shantina but they knew she was asking him to bring her cell phone. I would guess from this she left a message for him. So how did Robb tell her he was fixing his bike if it was a v/m and he didn't talk to her? So was this bad reporting or was this version 3 of the same detail?

Is this when the items on the beach were found? During this beach search?

[Tracygirl]

As many of you may have heard, my Fiancé’ Shantina “Kat” Smiley and her son Azriel James Carver are currently missing, in the Olympia Area.

The past 36 hours have been nerve racking, and full of fear pain and sorrow. I just want  my Fiancé’ and Azriel back home .  I want to marry her, and spend the rest of my days by her side.

The media has been putting out mixed stories.           

I am keeping updates via my facebook page, search for Robb Simmons. I have posted a lot of pictures of Shantina & Azriel

After several years, Shantina had made contact with her Step Father in Castle Rock. We had planned to go down and visit them.

I had Cub Scout Training that was planned to finish at 6:30

Shantina called me twice around 4:15 to let me know she was heading out.  I asked her grab my phone charger, since my phone was near dead.

My training wrapped up at 4:30, I figured that she was already on the road heading to Castle Rock, so I proceeds to Castle Rock as well

I stopped in Toldeo-Vader to make quick repair, when she called me at 6:45 from a phone. She asked me if I could grab her phone, because she had left. I let her know where I was at. She was in the Olympia area, but wasn’t quite sure of where, Azriel was hungry, so she pulled off. She made complaint of being in the traffic. She gave me the destination address and told me she would be there shortly.
I arrived in Castle Rock around 7:40, and found her Step Father’s house.  We started to get worried about 9:00pm,  I began to check in with the WSP about accidents. Her step father and I drove around the area to see if we could spot her. I called her Grandparents house in Brinnon with her Step fathers phone. They had informed met hat she had stopped at a house in Olympia around 10:10, to use the phone, and ask for directions, and let them know she was ok.  We went back to the Step Fathers home until 12:00 when we headed up I-5 to Olympia, we checked the two rest stops on the way back. We got a few hours sleeps, headed back up I-5 at day break, got a phone charger, recharged my phone, and went back up to Olympia and back to Castle Rock.   During this time I was in vigilant contact with the authorities for any information.

We went to get a bit to eat, when I received a phone call from the Thurston County Sheriff’s office. The had found the Van.  In a follow up call, they informed me that they had to pull it out of the bay at the end of a dead end road. I immediately headed up there and say the van.  As many of you know, I usually have a camera on hand, besides being waterlogged, the van did have some damage, but no broken windows. There was no sign of Shantina or Azriel.

I spent about 6 hours on the location talking to the detectives. I left there around 5:30, and had to make numerous stops to field phone calls from numerous sources, including the media. I stopped at my childrens mother house to sit with them around 8:00pm

Last night they brought blood hounds over, and took scent item.

I have no idea of why she would have ended up down that road. I know that our family want both her and Azriel back home safe and sound.

Please pray for their safe return.  I already talked with Azriel’s Father in New York. That is a hard call to make.


hmmm sure doesn't seem like a v/m message from Robbs accounts.  Interesting that the investigators first said he didn't answer the phone when she called from a pay phone.