Natalee Case Discussion #835 6/6/10 - 6/8/10

[nimrod]

Jean Caseraz (sp?), who's in Peru, says that in Joran's room was found a woman's small white leather purse with jewels on it and in videos of Stephany no white purse is seen.

Who's purse is it?  Has he been stealing purses for money?

I thought I saw something white in her left hand when she was walking behind Joran in the office. Also, at first, it looked like she was holding something very small in her right hand. Anyone else see that?

[Port Valerie]

If she saw anything on his laptop, imo...it would be something recent. She didn't have a lot of time to dig for stuff.

Scenerio:
The laptop was on w/ screensaver covering screen...Joran goes out for drinks...she touches laptop and screensaver goes poof and TADA ---
On laptop screen is info re: the new charges brought forth by Alabama/FBI, etc. re: extortion, etc., in Natalee's case.  She knows he is a 'wanted man'. Just then, Joran comes back and catches her reading it and flips out...

Not sure I believe the laptop confession, but the above could have happened (or something similar), if true.

Would have had to be "something similar," as you say, not that exactly. The news about the extortion charge didn't come out until the middle of the following week. Not in the news anyway. I suppose he might have received some emails from the Aruba people about it.

[the big hammer]

Another Confession...

LIMA, Peru -- Dutchman Joran Van der Sloot, long the prime suspect in the 2005 disappearance of a U.S. teen in Aruba, has confessed to killing a young Peruvian woman in his Lima hotel room last week, a police spokesman said.

Well, this should preclude Tacopina's theory about a third person hiding in the hotel room.

Unfortunately, the goon's long history of numerous previous confessions -- all of which turned out to be either false or incomplete -- overshadows his latest admission of murder.

In takes unusual circumstances, imo, for a computer search to yield real-world fatal consequences given the circumstances described: he found her on his computer when returning with coffee and bread, looking at certain files, so he killed her.

Hhhmm.  This description of the events is almost impossible to believe.  But, like all of the goon's references to his known victims, he takes the path of blaming his victim for her own demise.  He continues to off-load accountability.  He cannot take personal responsibility for his actions.  He remains in denial about what he is, what he does, and why.

Previous posts underscore the motive of robbery + murder, which in this jurisdiction evidently carries longer prison terms than even rape + murder.  An interesting comment on societal mores at work here.  Is the goon this calculating -- could he have weighed the odds, etc? Does he even have an attorney who could properly advise him to plead in hopes of leniency?  Have official charges even been brought yet?  Has he been indicted -- or equivalent of same?  Does this evolve into a "crime of passion" -- the kind of offense which gains special sympathy in Latin American cultures?

This "confession", imo, leaves more open questions than providing real answers.

The only thing I'd suggest as true here, is that this latest confession is a lie.

Based on what appears as known facts, we do know the goon's cash supply had dwindled, that he was attempting to extort money, that he performed less than optimally at the gaming tables in Peru --

Robbery, with a sexual assault appetizer, more than likely.

.

[Puzzler]

He killed her.
He know they know and have the evidence to prove it.
He is legal smart.
He probably knows that Peru gives lighter sentences when a confession is made (or he was told by LE to make it easier on himself and confess)
He probably is trying to get charged with manslaughter, rather than murder (not sure that's gonna happen)
Difference between manslaugher and murder is 10-15 years
Heard on TV from an international attorney that a prisoner has to serve one-third to one-half the sentenced time before being eligible for parole
Same international attorney said he has had trials in approx. 24 different countries and the prisons in Peru are by far the worst

[Nut44x4]

One thing I give the Peruvians - think about how transparent they have been with video footage all along.  I think there is more to come..

i would love to see the video when he left the hotel for coffe. He must wear the clothes he wore when he got in to the hotel with stepany

Exactly!  If they obtained the footage of then entering and him leaving, I am sure that will come out as well.

I hope we will get to see it too. LE has to have all the footage...that is why they know for a fact that no one else was in that room.

[Jo-An]

I don't believe for one bit that she saw information about killing Natalee on his laptop.
If she did, why didn't she get the hell out of the hotel?
No, something else happened.
I still think it's plausible that he wanted her to make an online money transfer and she refused.

[Blonde]

Well he did confess to the death of Natalee too remember something bad happened,just saying

[Ono]

Why would this girl look at his laptop while he was gone? Perhaps while he was out getting them some coffee and bread..  her family had no idea who Joran was, so why would she have been looking him up online?  Seems odd..  unless he said he was famous, and curiosity got the better of her?

As usual, he was probably lying.

I think so too-in his mind, he thinks this justifies his murdering her, imo.

[Ono]

Another Confession...

LIMA, Peru -- Dutchman Joran Van der Sloot, long the prime suspect in the 2005 disappearance of a U.S. teen in Aruba, has confessed to killing a young Peruvian woman in his Lima hotel room last week, a police spokesman said.

Well, this should preclude Tacopina's theory about a third person hiding in the hotel room.

Unfortunately, the goon's long history of numerous previous confessions -- all of which turned out to be either false or incomplete -- overshadows his latest admission of murder.

In takes unusual circumstances, imo, for a computer search to yield real-world fatal consequences given the circumstances described: he found her on his computer when returning with coffee and bread, looking at certain files, so he killed her.

Hhhmm.  This description of the events is almost impossible to believe.  But, like all of the goon's references to his known victims, he takes the path of blaming his victim for her own demise.  He continues to off-load accountability.  He cannot take personal responsibility for his actions.  He remains in denial about what he is, what he does, and why.

Previous posts underscore the motive of robbery + murder, which in this jurisdiction evidently carries longer prison terms than even rape + murder.  An interesting comment on societal mores at work here.  Is the goon this calculating -- could he have weighed the odds, etc? Does he even have an attorney who could properly advise him to plead in hopes of leniency?  Have official charges even been brought yet?  Has he been indicted -- or equivalent of same?  Does this evolve into a "crime of passion" -- the kind of offense which gains special sympathy in Latin American cultures?

This "confession", imo, leaves more open questions than providing real answers.

The only thing I'd suggest as true here, is that this latest confession is a lie.

Based on what appears as known facts, we do know the goon's cash supply had dwindled, that he was attempting to extort money, that he performed less than optimally at the gaming tables in Peru --

Robbery, with a sexual assault appetizer, more than likely.

.

Well said Hammer!

[seemeatthebeach]

Maybe Joran had a reminder set on his computer calendar.....a little pop-up the morning of May 30th

"My 5 year anniversary......got away with murdering Natalie"

Joran is arrogant and evil enough........

[crazybabyborg]

From what I've read, Joran may get a somewhat lighter sentence for confessing, but IMO, it doesn't matter. I firmly believe if he goes in to start serving a sentence inside a Peruvian prison, he'll never come out alive.

As far as his chances of NOT serving time in a Peruvian prison but being able to serve the time in Holland................ I haven't seen anything that would force Peru to agree to that. I really think that Peru wants to keep him and I'm betting/hoping that they aren't going to let that trophy that they paraded around, go so easily.

[seemeatthebeach]

From what I've read, Joran may get a somewhat lighter sentence for confessing, but IMO, it doesn't matter. I firmly believe if he goes in to start serving a sentence inside a Peruvian prison, he'll never come out alive.

As far as his chances of NOT serving time in a Peruvian prison but being able to serve the time in Holland................ I haven't seen anything that would force Peru to agree to that. I really think that Peru wants to keep him and I'm betting/hoping that they aren't going to let that trophy that they paraded around, go so easily.

IMO Joran's @ss is staying in Peru.....much to the delight of hundreds other Peruvian prisoners!

Momma Sloot better FedEx that butt plug!

[Puzzler]

From what I've read, Joran may get a somewhat lighter sentence for confessing, but IMO, it doesn't matter. I firmly believe if he goes in to start serving a sentence inside a Peruvian prison, he'll never come out alive.

As far as his chances of NOT serving time in a Peruvian prison but being able to serve the time in Holland................ I haven't seen anything that would force Peru to agree to that. I really think that Peru wants to keep him and I'm betting/hoping that they aren't going to let that trophy that they paraded around, go so easily.

IMO Joran's @ss is staying in Peru.....much to the delight of hundreds other Peruvian prisoners!

Momma Sloot better FedEx that butt plug!

With all that Stephany's father has done for the Peruvian police and how highly they think of him....and all the other connections the father is supposed to have, too....it will only take one word from the father and it's all over for Joran.

[Bearlyhere]

In regard to "green" bruises:  a bruise is caused when trauma to an area causes blood to gather at the spot of trauma, initially, the bruise is red for a few minutes; as the blood loses oxygen, the bruise turns blue for a few days; as the blood breaks down, the bruise turns green for a few days and then yellow for a few days before the bruise goes away.

Thanks for the explanation....mine just seem to go from purple to yellow...never seen green...

so those may have been the first blows ? knocking her down of maybe dragging her across something hard...just thinking out loud

I just woke up and am many pages behind...forgive if this has been addressed and I have not seen it yet.....

All of the above (as darleen described) would be from a living person ... but once a person is dead there is no blood flow. The stages of bruising still happen after death?? This seems impossible, but maybe not.

I have some personal experience with this one, Nut. Mom's face was badly bruised, and she was killed instantly (dead on the scene) from a car wreck. When the providers get here, I'll ask how that happens. Blood will stop pumping when the heart stops, but blood can flow from an injury. Generally there isn't much blood unless a person's heart is beating.

CBB, I just want to wrap you up in a big old hug, grab a bottle of wine and go watch the lightning bugs together for awhile under the moonlight on the beach.  ((((CBB))))

Then grab some hunks and dance the stress away like in Mama Mia.

I wish you didn't know that from experience.

[seemeatthebeach]

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/natalee-holloways-dad-speaks-10853748

Natalee Holloway dad speaks

[Sdb]

Jean Caseraz (sp?), who's in Peru, says that in Joran's room was found a woman's small white leather purse with jewels on it and in videos of Stephany no white purse is seen.

Who's purse is it?  Has he been stealing purses for money?

Maybe "purse" was actually a "wallet" she had in her pocket. Translation confusion?

[Puzzler]

Fox News said LE is supposed to do a "reenactment" at the scene of Room 309 later today.  I believe they're going to take Joran there, too.

[Blonde]

Do you think if he really knows where Daddy put Natalee he will tell us now?
Also if he does will the Netherlands arrest him so he goes to serve his  sentence  there first?
Or does Peru  get him first..

[SunnyinTX]

Is there a manslaughter charge available in Peru??

[Anna]

The Peruvian police will likely issue a written Press Release at the news conference.  We will be able to get a copy and see what it hsa to say.  They can release evidence because there is no jury pool to contaminate as it is a 3 member panel of judges.

Because Joran says it doesn't mean the judges have to believe him.

Let's wait and see what LE has to say. 

It's amazing that it took LE only 48 hours to extract a confession and ALE didn't in 5 years.  And even if he takes it all back, anything said can still be used against him with the judgese deciding on the merit of  it.

He can wait up to 2 years for an actual trial.  I will be amazed if he survives to stand trial if it takes 2 years.

Will be interesting to watch the Arubans and Dutch try to spin this.  "After all, Joran DOES now say he did this"

I think that is what the judges are going to hear.  But I remain hopeful that something about Natalee was found.