Natalee Case Discussion #835 6/6/10 - 6/8/10

[Anna]

Hi, Ms.Marple.  If Glenda's saying he told where Natalee's buried, why doesn't she use her so-called sharp reporting skills and find out what he said and tell everyone?  Maybe she's saving that information to try to cut a deal in case she's tried for obstructing justice.

According to Glenda, she knows the exact place because she said that there is now a house on the spot.

She cannot explain however, why he was given more money in May after telling where Nat was in April.

So this information has been given to the authorities and they are in the process of excavating the house or what, lol!

Anything Glendo knows, everybody on the island knows so if this is true, they are all obstructing justice again.  Does this woman have any idea how much damange she does to the reputation of that flyspeck?

I don't know if it's the inbreeding or the tiny proximity on the island of all living so close together or what but they have lost their collective minds!

[msmarple]

Hi Anna - Oh, dear, no, there was speculation here (at SM) about a deal like that being proposed. I don't think that's been offered up for real at all. Sorry, I thought you were reading when that was going on.

I've been in catch up all weekend, so I don't know know what I knew, when I knew it

[carpe noctem]

Murderer gets header wall
 
 
According to facial features such as eyebrows, pointed nose and deep eyes, Dutchman Joran Andreas Petrus van der Sloot (23) is a smart, cold and manipulative. "I refuse to talk," was all he said Dirincri yesterday when detectives were preparing to question him. Its aim would be to structure a defense that allowed to contradict the police investigation.

Yesterday it was learned that he was stunned because it butted against one wall of the elevator that led to the eighth floor of the Dirincri, where it occupies a maximum security cell, guarded by four soldiers who did not lose sight. It was learned that they fear being killed or committing suicide.

"The Sabbath was made several inquiries at the offices of Homicide and Criminal. There he saw a tattoo on the left chest with the phrase: 'No problem' in Thai language," said one agent.
It was learned that the laptop was found to be delivered to the Division of High Technology for testing. The spokesman added that "to calm him, a police officer patted him and said, 'Ya, quiet, quiet."


About 9 pm, the prosecutor of the Prosecutor 40, detectives and the public defender met to pick the statement abroad. "It was learned that the detainee was going to say he was innocent and uphold it. But it was thwarted when his attorney stated that he was induced to provide answers that he did not want", he referred to a judicial source.

Around midnight, Joran was taken to a cell on the eighth floor. "It is next to another inmate for murder. The order is that at no time be alone," the informant.

He ate fried chicken
Yesterday morning, the European coffee and breakfast bread. Meanwhile, homicide detectives awaited the arrival of the public defender and translator Maurice Steins, given by the Consortium of Legal Translators.

At noon, Joran van der Sloot Andean Potatoes lunch and fried chicken with rice and potatoes, plus emollient menu that was distributed to all police officers Dirincri.

Peruvian police also coordinates with similar Aruba.

http://www.trome.com/tonline/Html/2010-06-06/ontractualidad1093554.html

Sounds like the same POS punk he`s always been. He is under the impression he`s the Dutch TuPac or something. I think we need to go to www.youneedagoodpunchintheface.com and order him up a couple.

[Hat]

Nite Darleen - nice having you back!  Maybe I should invite Wonderwoman back too, LOLOL

Good one, Klaas!

I have been wondering about the body language Stephany exhibited following that goon to his room. Her head bowed like that. Her father mentioned it, yes? That may be partially due to fatigue or the drugging scenario. I get some kind of resignation signals there - as if she suspects she has been hustled out of her money and is going through the motions of trying to recover it.

Then there is the space between the two as they walked. He was leading by much too long a gap for them to be a couple. Just my opinion.

Makes me think he hustled her with some financial computer related angle that required them going to his room where he had his laptop. Like showing her his online gaming account, for instance.

I was thinking he got her money away from her with a con and lost it gambling while telling her he was good for it via his online gaming activity. I think he may have hustled her this way and the physical conflict grew out of his psychotic reaction to not being able to pay her back or demonstrate financials he did not really possess.

If any of this is true there is a good chance his laptop will show activity related to online poker in the time frame of the assault.

I also believe the coffee run was alibi related, thought so as soon as I heard of it as I'm sure many here did.

The Peruvian system will not give him up to serve a sentence elsewhere, I am sure. He killed one of their innocent daughters and it will be very bad for him. I wish he could see the online info about the prisons we are seeing he deserves to anticipate the terror he will experience.

His days of working the system with a smirk on his face are over.

[klaasend]

REMINDER - Late night posts of Nativelingo back in August 2005:

Sat Aug 06, 2005 10:56 pm   
Nativelingo posted some interresting information about Joran early this morning:

1.  Joran has/had emotional problems and is a patient of a local pediatric/juvenile psychiatrist (fact).
2.  The incident where Joran killed his dog and blamed it on someone else is fact
3.  That bullying friends and the dog issue are the least of Joran's problems (according to reliable sources)
4.  His HOBBY is Criminal Law (fact)

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?p=83858&highlight=pediatric+paediatric#83858

[klaasend]

Goodnight all!

[Northern Rose]

Former attorney questioned Joran van der Sloot tests involving the Netherlands (video)

http://www.tv.grupobloglatino.com/2010/06/ex-abogado-de-joran-van-der-sloot.html

[Puzzler]

Hypnotic effect from date rape drugs – I’m thinking that Stephany may have had just enough drug to put her in a relaxed state, but not so relaxed as to be stumbling or falling down, and in that altered state of mind was susceptible to Joran’s directing her what to do. Maybe that would explain why she was following Joran through the hostel with her head down.


http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/ed075p719`

Rohypnol: Profile of the "Date-Rape Drug"

Rohypnol is one of the benzodiazepines, the class of drugs that includes such popular sedative–hypnotic agents as Librium and Valium. Although marketed legally abroad, Rohypnol is illegal in the USA. Nevertheless, it is regularly smuggled into this country and has recently achieved notoriety here as a formidable chemical weapon utilized by rapists to overpower their female victims, many of whom have been selected from the high school and college social scenes. This article describes the criminal use of this central nervous system (CNS) depressant within a chemical context and emphasizes its pharmacological effects, mechanism of action, and physiological fate or biotransformation. Moreover, the article describes another drug that, unlike Rohypnol, has legitimate medical applications in the USA but has also been used by criminals to harm others under strikingly similar circumstances.
This drug is lorazepam (Ativan), another benzodiazepine with sedative–hypnotic properties.
A key message of this article is that the chemistry classroom is an ideal setting for promoting awareness among students of the dangers of some of the drugs that have been developed for otherwise beneficial, therapeutic purposes but which have also acquired a sinister character.



http://sexual-abuse.suite101.com/article.cfm/understanding_date_rape_drugs

Understanding Date Rape Drugs
Rohypnol
Rohypnol, or flunitrazepam, is an illegal form of benzodiazepine, the same prescription class as Xanax and Valium. Also called a "roofie," Rohypnol is available in pill form and is extremely powerful. The Counselor Advocate Training Manual states that “at low doses, Rohypnol produces intoxication, muscle relaxation,
and sedative-hypnotic effects that last two to eight hours.
At higher doses, the body shuts down and breathing stops.” One of the most common side effects of Rohypnol is amnesia, which assailants use to their advantage.

[carpe noctem]

Goodnight all!

nighty night! My tyrannical ruler.

[carpe noctem]

REMINDER - Late night posts of Nativelingo back in August 2005:

Sat Aug 06, 2005 10:56 pm   
Nativelingo posted some interresting information about Joran early this morning:

1.  Joran has/had emotional problems and is a patient of a local pediatric/juvenile psychiatrist (fact).
2.  The incident where Joran killed his dog and blamed it on someone else is fact
3.  That bullying friends and the dog issue are the least of Joran's problems (according to reliable sources)
4.  His HOBBY is Criminal Law (fact)

http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?p=83858&highlight=pediatric+paediatric#83858

Anita needs to write a book: How Paul and I Built a Monster

[Jo-An]

Some reports from this morning's Dutch newspapers:

Spits
Says CNN yesterday reported that the Dutch embassy complained about the way Joran was paraded before the press. This report is wrong. The Dutch embassy doesn't know where this report came from. They say they were indeed surprised and not happy about the way that happened but that an embassy can't just file a complaint against the Peruvian authorities. That should be done by the department of foreign affairs and they haven't done that.

Metro
Describes the hotel video footage as the "found footage" genre (like Hitchcock or Blair Witch Project) where you know or sense the deadly ending, but you don't get to see it.

[Anna]

Puzzler,

When mixed with alcohol, the effects of that become unpredictible.  We have had monkeys who posted personal experiences of becoming compliant after being drugged even if that is not the expected result.  Normally in medical lit when it says hypnotic, it means sleep-inducing.  But we have had those who said they became completely compliant and obedient and didn't know why and didn't recall walking and talking until others told them what they did.

So I personally think that it could account for Stephany Flores different mannerisms but JMO.  And that of her father apparently.  Mixing alcohol with most drugs does make a difference.  And the wrappers were found in her vehicle.

[Bearlyhere]

Why in the world would the Aruban officials want to help him?! Thanks for the information, though, Turbothink.  Oh, and as for the worries that he will be sent back to the Netherlands (I've read in other areas)--that's never going to happen.  

IMO, There are some who helped in the cover-up of Natalie's case who by now are very afraid at this point that he will give up the Who, What, When,Why & How it happened.
If the ones I think are responsible are............it could bring down a large portion of their "officials" rapidly if all this comes out.

Watch out Joran (slime bag) for Aruba sent lawyers bearing gifts.

I am watching tapes of the police in Peru, so far they look neat and clean, and no one has yet had to run out to get a bowl of Frosted Flakes.

I have a feeling, though, that due to this being a high profile case for them with lots of cameras rolling, Joran will be treated better than the average criminal there.  He is already getting three meals a day and a blankie.

[carpe noctem]

I guess Joran`s magical love potion was not perfected in the past 5 years.

Or Stephany would be alive today.

Goon boy will just never get the hang of it!

[Bearlyhere]

Bearly - Absolutely. He and Casey are so sloppy - yet believe they are SLICK.

It`s just ridiculous. Long term thinking - doesn`t exist. Addict mentality. Need it

now. Consume it now. Suck it dry. Move on to next fix.

---

Also - on that `Law of the Donkey` thingie...

Have you ever seen the size of a donkey`s toot chute?

It could swallow Manhattan. Just a thought.

I agree with you agreeing with me.  ;-p

I don't have a clue what you are talking about with Donkey butts swallowing Manhattan and how we got there from dyed shutters, I think you must have made a wrong turn at the jug handle.

[Northern Rose]

Murderer gets header wall
 
 
According to facial features such as eyebrows, pointed nose and deep eyes, Dutchman Joran Andreas Petrus van der Sloot (23) is a smart, cold and manipulative. "I refuse to talk," was all he said Dirincri yesterday when detectives were preparing to question him. Its aim would be to structure a defense that allowed to contradict the police investigation.

Yesterday it was learned that he was stunned because it butted against one wall of the elevator that led to the eighth floor of the Dirincri, where it occupies a maximum security cell, guarded by four soldiers who did not lose sight. It was learned that they fear being killed or committing suicide.

"The Sabbath was made several inquiries at the offices of Homicide and Criminal. There he saw a tattoo on the left chest with the phrase: 'No problem' in Thai language," said one agent.
It was learned that the laptop was found to be delivered to the Division of High Technology for testing. The spokesman added that "to calm him, a police officer patted him and said, 'Ya, quiet, quiet."


About 9 pm, the prosecutor of the Prosecutor 40, detectives and the public defender met to pick the statement abroad. "It was learned that the detainee was going to say he was innocent and uphold it. But it was thwarted when his attorney stated that he was induced to provide answers that he did not want", he referred to a judicial source.

Around midnight, Joran was taken to a cell on the eighth floor. "It is next to another inmate for murder. The order is that at no time be alone," the informant.

He ate fried chicken
Yesterday morning, the European coffee and breakfast bread. Meanwhile, homicide detectives awaited the arrival of the public defender and translator Maurice Steins, given by the Consortium of Legal Translators.

At noon, Joran van der Sloot Andean Potatoes lunch and fried chicken with rice and potatoes, plus emollient menu that was distributed to all police officers Dirincri.

Peruvian police also coordinates with similar Aruba.

http://www.trome.com/tonline/Html/2010-06-06/ontractualidad1093554.html

Sounds like the same POS punk he`s always been. He is under the impression he`s the Dutch TuPac or something. I think we need to go to www.youneedagoodpunchintheface.com and order him up a couple.

I found it amusing that he did a Casey Anthony in the elevator and that did not work out well for him either.  DOH!

[carpe noctem]

Do some of you remember the donkey in the dumpster?  :--( 

http://www.gambling911.com/poker/%E2%80%9Claw-donkey%E2%80%9D-could-be-applied-joran-van-der-sloot-060610.html
“Law Of The Donkey” Could be Applied to Joran van der Sloot
June 6, 2010


Joran van der Sloot, accused of killing a young Peruvian woman and who has long been the lead suspect in the disappearance of Natalie Holloway back in 2005, could be facing some severe jail time if convicted in the slaying of Stephany Flores Ramirez in his Lima hotel room.

"Severe" may be an understatement.  The prisons in Peru are known to be among the most brutal in the world.

Here is one account of what happens to prisoners such as child molesters:

A neighbor of Cieneguilla suffered the worst shock which could have happened. His daughter, only two years old, was raped by a drug addict and drunk who during a party at the neighbor's house went to her room and raped her. The unfortunate was saved from being lynched by the locals, but it was reported and he went to Lurigancho. The case, incredibly, didn't appeared in the papers, and the rapist entered in prison with nobody knewing he was. The mother, hurt, because her daughter was unable to talk permanently because of the experience, went to Lurigancho and knelt before a 'daddy' ( which is like one of the bosses among the convicts). 'I want justice, no matter the price. " 'Do not kill him, make him suffer as he did to my daughter. " The lady gave, weekly, money hidden in fruit. For seven months, the damn was massacred and raped with sticks, iron bars and pepper that they put him in the rectum. Although the lady said not to kill him and only make him suffer just a night that had consumed a lot of weed and liquor, the daddy's assasins ran his hand and did it.

Joran could face the same fate.  He is, without any doubt, the most hated person in Peru right now.  The victim's father is a prominent Peruvian businessman and one time candidate for the Vice Presidency of that country.

The van der Sloot matter has attracted the attention of poker players and industry media like Gambling911.com because the young Dutchman was in Peru to watch the Latin American Poker Tour.  He is also known to play poker online.

One Peruvian poker player defined "The Law of the Donkey" and believes it will be applied to van der Sloot should he ultimately be sentenced.

"The law of the donkey is basically about getting raped by a lot of prisoners during a lot of nights," the individual relayed.

Jagajeet Chiba, Gambling911.com

Comments
Karma
Karma...it is a bitch!!! but thank GOD there is a universal LAW!!! What goes around comes around! What a idiot that fool Joran is!! In the Ass and I hope soon! I watched the video clip of him taking the keys to the hotel room and he has a look of.... I am going to KILL HER!!! He was smiling!!!!
Submitted by Guest on Sun, 06/06/2010 - 22:39.

    * reply

Where does the donkey come
Where does the donkey come in?
Submitted by Guest on Sun, 06/06/2010 - 21:22.

    * reply

Something Lost in the Translation
"Donkey" I suspect should have been translated into "Ass", as in getting sodomized. Still, "Law of the Donkey" has a nice ring to it.
Submitted by Guest on Sun, 06/06/2010 - 21:14.

    * reply

I jump around quite a bit... but there is a method to my madness. ;p

[Puzzler]

Puzzler,

When mixed with alcohol, the effects of that become unpredictible.  We have had monkeys who posted personal experiences of becoming compliant after being drugged even if that is not the expected result.  Normally in medical lit when it says hypnotic, it means sleep-inducing.  But we have had those who said they became completely compliant and obedient and didn't know why and didn't recall walking and talking until others told them what they did.

So I personally think that it could account for Stephany Flores different mannerisms but JMO.  And that of her father apparently.  Mixing alcohol with most drugs does make a difference.  And the wrappers were found in her vehicle.

Anna...thanks for your input.

[Northern Rose]

"The autopsy determined that my daughter did not have sex or was raped"
Flores IRRC noted that the version that would have been drugged Stephany has not yet been confirmed. He said that if daughter had bruised right arm
The driver and businessman Ricardo Flores said last night that as he has informed the police, an autopsy determined that his daughter Stephany Flores did not have sex or was raped before being murdered in a hotel in Miraflores Tac allegedly at the hands of Dutchman Joran van der Sloot.

"The autopsy determined, according to police, that my daughter has not had sex or been raped," Flores said in an interview with The Sniper. But he said he had no details about the version that Stephany had been drugged. "It is collecting information to bits," he said.

Ricardo Flores made this revelation while commenting on the hypothesis that the motive for the murder have been the theft, which is considered an aggravating circumstance in the murder case and could lead to imprisonment for life shall be for the crime.

In another part of the interview, the driver said the body of his daughter was "totally bruised right arm" would have tried to defend himself because of his aggressive attack. Ricardo Flores attempted to describe the state was Stephany's neck but the pain was overcome and could not complete the sentence. "It's hard to remember," he said.

http://elcomercio.pe/noticia/490948/autopsia-determina-que-mi-hija-no-tuvo-relaciones-sexuales-ni-fue-violada

[Kermit]

Video of Joran van der Sloot in police custody in Peru (Part 1 of 3)

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/7UkxOTRoZho&amp;hl=en_GB&amp;fs=1&amp;" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/7UkxOTRoZho&amp;hl=en_GB&amp;fs=1&amp;</a>

OMG, the red hair in this one just kills me.  Instead of blending in, he sure sticks out.  I wonder how far he went with it?  Do you think the shutters match the roof?

The shutters remain unchanged