Natalee Case Discussion #839 6/14/10 - 6/17/10

[Tamikosmom]

I totally agree...and had the management of the Holiday Inn and the other casinos not allowed minors.....well you know....the fact that hs parents allowed him to go to casinos, gamble, have girls in his quarters.....all those events led to him being given free reign.....and he  to expect that he should not be told no....

THE CHAIN OF EVENTS

The Excelsior Casino

Rita Cosby Live & Direct - April 4, 2006

RITA COSBY, HOST:  John, first of all, is there a possibility that Paulus might have been talking to Natalee the night that she disappeared?

JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY FAMILY ATTORNEY:  JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY FAMILY ATTORNEY:  Well, if you look at the surveillance video footage, it appears that he’s the one sitting directly next to her and tries to engage her in conversation a couple of times.  And it’s sort of ironic that it’s his father who brought his underage son to a casino and left him there after he left, with access to his line of credit, to put this unfortunate chain of events in process. 

You know, if Joran had never been there, not been allowed in there, because he’s underage and wasn’t accompanied by his father, the whole rest of the night wouldn’t have happened. 

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12150698/


Caros & Charlies

Joran van der Sloot - Suspect Statement - June 9, 2005

To your question as to who gave me the VIP pass to Carlos & Charlies, I answer you that I got it through the office of Carlos & Charlies. I do not remember with the help of who I got the VIP pass. I got to Carlos & Charlies about one to three times a week.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=160.0

Sunny

Could it be that part of the cover up agenda in the Natalee Holloway case to distance an underage Joran was all about preventing possible civil lawsuits brought by the family against the Excelsior and Carlos & Charlies?

Janet

I think that might be part of it.....I hope, and would assume, Beth and Dave have looked into seeing if a civil suit against them is possible....

I would not be surprised if John Q. Kelly has looked into the possibility of a civil lawsuit.  Think about it.  Joran's last "confession" to the family's attorney reveals that he was directly responsibile for Natalee's death.  Even IF her death was not intended ... the Natalee Holloway/Joran van der Sloot connection would never have happened if the managements of the Excelsior and Carlos & Charlies had not afforded an underage young man privileges that he was not entitled to.

Janet

++++++++


Deadly Intentions?
June 11, 2010

JOHN KELLY: He actually admitted,  this was the first time he admitted being personally responsible for physically causing her death.

According to Kelly, van der Sloot claimed that he and Natalee were at the beach and when he wanted to leave, Natalee tried to stop him. 

JOHN KELLY: He got angry and actually threw her. He actually made the gesture in the car, on video, showing me how he threw her in anger, because she wouldn't leave at that point.  And according to him, she hit the back of her head, lots of blood and she was dead.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/37650865/ns/dateline_nbc-crime_reports/page/5/

[msmarple]

The glaring [ & mis-leading ] thing in regards to the truth is:

Aruba's hospitality marketing image was that Aruba was a destination which was one of extreme safety and happiness.  They catered to Americans and naturally & rightfully so, Americans took for granted that they would not only be safe there, but if something bad should happen, the authorities would act in a timely and honest manner.   Little did anyone know that an American tourist had better 'pack some heat', know karate, and carry their own covered "go cups" with them everywhere!

Yes, exactly. That is why the Holloway case was handled from a PR perspective rather than a judicial perspective.

Of course the PR campaign devolved into something more like a slash-and-burn political campaign. I am familiar with the defense tactic of "smear the victim" but I have never seen anything close to what was done to Natalee and her family.

[Jo-An]

http://frontpage.fok.nl/nieuws/390935/1/1/50/joran-krijgt-aids-toegediend-als-wraak.html

´Joran get administered AIDS as revenge "

06/17/2010 @ 1:46 p.m. by Stefan on

According to Peruvian reporters, the father of the murdered Stephanie Flores not to take revenge by Joran in jail to murder. That states this week's Nieuwe Revue. He has other plans.

In a report about the hell that Joran van der Sloot awaits, the magazine notes that Joran will get an injection with HIV. Administered by a hired fellow prisoner. Since living conditions are so bad, the HIV and AIDS will soon turn into within two years Joran will be done.

Next week, Joran brought before the court. Currently, the Dutchman is isolated in a cell. Eventually he will have to share a cell with dozens of others.

I had not even thought or imagined this could happen by injection.........

Me either, and too me that is really scary that this could be done to someone.

I think they may using the term injection loosely...

I'm afraid it's not.
They actually do mean a syringe with infected blood.

This is done in the gay community too.
There are some gay men who deliberately give each other aids, by injecting themselves with infected blood.
That way they can have unprotected sex because... well... they have aids now anyway!
Plus nowadays you don't die of aids anymore because of the available medication.
So yeah... it's really sick...

[msmarple]

http://elcomercio.pe/noticia/496239/fiscales-aruba-quieren-hablar-joran-van-der-sloot-sobre-caso-natalee-holloway

el comecerio article today 6/17, but it’s from AP – we may already have it. I’ve bolded a couple of places. This is through Google translate.

* * *
Aruba Prosecutors want to talk to Joran van der Sloot on the Natalee Holloway case

A policeman and a prosecutor investigating the disappearance of the girl could get to Lima in August, ahead of the Caribbean island authorities

(AP) .-. Aruba Prosecutors reported that they want to take the declaration of Joran van der Sloot, who has expressed his intention to talk with Taiwan {??} authorities on the disappearance of American teenager cleared Natalee Holloway.

The judicial authorities in Peru hope to organize a conversation between the police of Aruba and Van der Sloot, said prosecutor Robert Pietersz.

And is that the confessed murderer of the young Stephany Flores is the only suspect left by the disappearance of Holloway, which occurred in 2005 on the Caribbean island.

Would come to PERU
A policeman and a prosecutor in Aruba could even travel to Peru in August, according to Peter Blanken, the chief public prosecutor of the island, who considered it unlikely that the Dutchman is brought to Aruba before completing any sentence in the South American country.

"I think it is undisputed that because the case in Peru is of the utmost severity, and the Peruvian authorities have said they do not want that (extradition)," Blanken said.

Dave Holloway, father of the missing girl, met Tuesday with the police in Aruba, according to Blanken. He said authorities had no new information to discuss the case.

Natalee Holloway, an 18-year-old from Alabama, was last seen on May 30, 2005, he left a bar with Van der Sloot. It was the final night of a trip that the teenager made to Aruba to celebrate graduation.

* * *

Some of the comments –

I wonder how I MOTHER OF Joram IN ARUBA?

* * *
Joran father Was a judge in Aruba and politieofficer Was protected by Jan van der Straaten. Aruba is corrupt! Aruba let him free to kill Other People. Joran must get life sentence. I Killed Nathalee and extort her family. He has no remorse and regret. He is a serialkiller. Do Not extradite him!
* * *
Reciín remember the police or authorities unable to Aruba for Natalee crime, we must teach Peruvians how to do a true and forceful police investigation.
* * *
Hopefully the Peruvian police with mischief criollismo and managed to get anything really that I fail Aruban police. I hope that the crime of the girl Holloway esclaresca and can rest in peace.
* * *

[klaasend]

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/TheLaw/joran-van-der-sloots-girlfriend-dutch-playboy-exclusive/story?id=10935055

Joran van der Sloot's Ex-Girlfriend on Dutch Playboy's Other Side
In Exclusive '20/20' Interview, Melody Granadillo Says She's Now Scared Looking Into First Love's Eyes
By CHRIS CUOMO, JIM DUBREUIL and THOMAS BERMAN

June 17, 2010—

Before the world knew him as a notorious alleged killer of young women, Melody Granadillo knew Joran van der Sloot as a personal prince charming.

"He was amazing. ... He was romantic," the 23-year-old said of her former boyfriend and first love, in an exclusive interview to air on "20/20" Friday. "It was very playful, very honest. We could sit and talk for hours. We liked looking into each other's eyes."

The couple met at a mutual friend's birthday party in Aruba in October 2003 and dated for seven months. The 16-year-old quickly fell head over heels in love with 17-year-old van der Sloot -- the man she calls "Chi Chi" or "Mr. Wiggles."

Watch the exclusive interview on "20/20" Friday at 10 p.m. ET

In the "20/20" interview, Granadillo describes van der Sloot as sweet and charming. She recalls how for her 17th birthday, he surprised her with her favorite candy.

"I told him I liked red Skittles ... and what he did was he made this vase at school, went and bought a lot of Skittles packets, he took all the red ones out ... and as a present I got a vase full of red Skittles," Granadillo said. "He did things like that ... he was real thoughtful."

The teen saved everything from her dashing Dutch suitor, including a diary they shared, filled with pages upon pages of pictures, cards, emails and love poems.

In the diary, Granadillo, who said they discussed marriage and kids, writes of one of their first sexual encounters: "We fooled around a lot. He wanted a lap dance. I barely gave it. It was an awesome night. Romantic and fun. Also, I gave him a hickey."

Van der Sloot's Web of Lies

But while van der Sloot was playing Romeo, Granadillo says she learned that their romance was built on a web of lies.

"He would lie for no apparent reason at all ... and if you caught him at it ... he would double down and be even more serious about the story," she said.

Granadillo claims he told her that he was also a virgin, but was really a promiscuous playboy who cheated on her with multiple women.

Despite their break-up, Granadillo never lost contact with van der Sloot -- staying in touch through the disappearance of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway and up until his now-infamous trip to Peru.

Granadillo talks to Cuomo about the Holloway's disappearance and her contact with van der Sloot during his trip to Peru where he met and allegedly killed 21-year-old Stephany Flores.

With van der Sloot now awaiting trial in a Peruvian prison, Granadillo says while she doesn't regret their experience together, the man whose eyes she loved looking into is long gone.

"It's not connectable. You can't connect that. It's not the same person," she said. "You see he's hurt. You see he's in trouble."

Watch the exclusive interview on "20/20" Friday at 10 p.m. ET

[littletxlady]

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/17/holloway-flores-families-in-touch-over-possible-case-links/

I haven't read back very far but here is a link I hope I'm not reposting

[carpe noctem]

Granadildo = barf.

I see she caught one right in the bun warmer again.

Old dogs, new tricks.

[klaasend]

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/17/holloway-flores-families-in-touch-over-possible-case-links/

I haven't read back very far but here is a link I hope I'm not reposting

Thanks!  New to me but I haven't read back either, lol.

[klaasend]

Doesn't look like Joran had very far to get coffee:

[SunnyinTX]

RECENT ACTIVITY
Melody and Groceries Aruba are now friends. · Add as Friend
Melody likes Scared Monkeys.
Melody and Amito Aruba are now friends. · Add as Friend


http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=100000717925522&v=wall&ref=search

I am not going to bad mouth Melody for anything she is doing now. She probably needs the money from selling her story to maintain a decent life for herself and her beautiful little girl. I understand the child's father is a real loser. I doubt she would be doing this if Joran was the father of that child. Her story makes us wonder how such a 'good kid' could turn out to be such a heinous monster.

Misgivings, I was not bad mouthing Melody....I just posted that she was likes ScaredMonkeys on her facebook............so I am a bit confused by your statement

Sorry if you misunderstood my post, sweetie.  I did not think you were bad mouthing her. Since she was mentioned, I took advantage of it and posted my thoughts concerning her. She should be thanking her lucky stars she go out of that relationship when she did.

Whew, wiping my brow, thanks for clearing that up.  I hate that anyone is making or had made a red cent off Natalee's murder...but they have and will continue....  I hope we can all look back at our first love with fond thoughts.....and never have to face what she must face now....

[Scatty]

Joran van der Sloot's Ex-Girlfriend on Dutch Playboy's Other Side
In Exclusive '20/20' Interview, Melody Granadillo Says She's Now Scared Looking Into First Love's Eyes
June 17, 2010

Before the world knew him as a notorious alleged killer of young women, Melody Granadillo knew Joran van der Sloot as a personal prince charming.

He was amazing. ... He was romantic," the 23-year-old said of her former boyfriend and first love, in an exclusive interview to air on "20/20" Friday. "It was very playful, very honest. We could sit and talk for hours. We liked looking into each other's eyes."

The couple met at a mutual friend's birthday party in Aruba in October 2003 and dated for seven months. The 16-year-old quickly fell head over heels in love with 17-year-old van der Sloot -- the man she calls "Chi Chi" or "Mr. Wiggles."

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/TheLaw/joran-van-der-sloots-girlfriend-dutch-playboy-exclusive/story?id=10935055
 

Oh dear! I learned while in my early 20's, NEVER trust a guy who gazes soulfully into your eyes, who seems romantic and a girl's dream. SEEMS is the key word. Normal guys are just not like that! The con artist tries to give his/her victims exactly what the con artist thinks the victim would like.

[Buckeye]

The couple met at a mutual friend's birthday party in Aruba in October 2003 and dated for seven months. The 16-year-old quickly fell head over heels in love with 17-year-old van der Sloot -- the man she calls "Chi Chi" or "Mr. Wiggles."


My math could be off, but Mr. Romeo Wiggles, would have only been 15 yrs. old, in 2003.

[carpe noctem]

Despite their break-up, Granadillo never lost contact with van der Sloot -- staying in touch through the disappearance of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway and up until his now-infamous trip to Peru.

I think that is the part people should pay attention to.

F. Granadillo... and double that for ABC.

You know, Jeffery Dahmer loved his mommy... but he had a small problem, he ate people.

Stop glorifying the criminal.

[littletxlady]

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/17/holloway-flores-families-in-touch-over-possible-case-links/

I haven't read back very far but here is a link I hope I'm not reposting

Thanks!  New to me but I haven't read back either, lol.

not much info... not sure if Beth is in Peru or talked by phone.

[darleenofalabama]

Hi, Y'all.

OK, lets clear up some things.  First, as an RN, I'm somewhat astonished at the lack of knowledge still out in the public domain about AIDS.  I think it should be stressed that it is transmitted by body fluids, especially blood and if someone were sick enough (and I think it would be a rare incident), it would be possible to infect someone by injecting them with a syringe of AIDS-infected blood.  One of the common ways drug addicts get diseases such as Hepatitis and HIV is via sharing needles with infected people.  Also, any healthcare person who receives a needle stick must be tested and treated for just such a reason.  And no one should be lackadaisal about AIDS; it could happen to anyone who is involved in risky behavior and, although there are now medications which can lengthen the lives of those infected, those medications are certainly no picnic to take and they are NOT a cure as THERE IS NO CURE FOR AIDS.

As for the talk about seizures, although it could be possible for panic to bring on a seizure, it would be a rare occurrence.  As for the occurrence of a seizure "after death", that would depend on the definition of death; clinical death is defined by absence of brain activity.  The heart stops prior to cessation of brain activity, so it's possible for a seizure to occur after the heart stops just prior to brain death.

[msmarple]

klaas - I noticed the kitchen appliances in the videos of Joran and Stephany entering the hotel. I remember thinking that the microwave on top of the fridge seemed odd and wondered if I was seeing it right. Anyway, I was ... perplexed? ... at the original story about Joran going next door for coffee - why, if it was available right there?

Also, the hotel lists "Complimentary Breakfast" as an amenity. Probably of the coffe & bun variety.

I wonder if he got breakfast at all that morning? That would be on the surveillance tape, too. I think he claimed in the confession that he ate after he killed her. I'm not sure I believe that. His coffee and bread run was part of the scenario whereby he returned and found her on his laptop.

I for one don't think the laptop had a thing to do with what happened.

[darleenofalabama]

Please edit my comment to state that these drugs are NOT a cure, as that is certainly my point:  THERE IS NO CURE FOR AIDS. 

[klaasend]

Kindof like you would name a mouse? 

[msmarple]

darleen said -

"As for the talk about seizures, although it could be possible for panic to bring on a seizure, it would be a rare occurrence.  As for the occurrence of a seizure "after death", that would depend on the definition of death; clinical death is defined by absence of brain activity.  The heart stops prior to cessation of brain activity, so it's possible for a seizure to occur after the heart stops just prior to brain death."

Hi (waves to) darleen!

(Am I overdue for dinner, by the way? :smiley: )

Thanks for the info re. seizures. That word has come up several times. I wondered if panic alone might have caused Natalee to have a seizure. What you say about a post-mortem seizure is very interesting. I really do believe that Natalee might have had some kind of seizure as a direct result of what was done to her.

[klaasend]

Please edit my comment to state that these drugs are NOT a cure, as that is certainly my point:  THERE IS NO CURE FOR AIDS. 

FIXED