Natalee Case Discussion #840 6/17/10 - 6/22/10

[Tamikosmom]

Joran told the Telegraaf reporter that he was lured to Peru by the FBI in order to be extradited to the USA so he could be arrested there. Because Peru has an extradition treaty with the US and Aruba doesn't, at least not when it comes to extortion.
Apparently this is written in tomorrow's paper.

The FBI claims otherwise.

Janet

+++++

Press Release
For Immediate Release
June 9, 2010

FBI Birmingham
Contact: Public Affairs Specialist Paul E. Daymond
(205) 279-1457
United States Attorney's Office
Northern District of Alabama
Contact: (205) 244-2001
 
Joint Statement by United States Attorney Joyce White Vance and FBI Special Agent in Charge Patrick Maley Regarding the Joran van der Sloot Investigation

In April of this year, the FBI and U.S. Attorney's office in Birmingham, Alabama initiated an investigation into allegations of criminal conduct by Joran van der Sloot related to the disappearance of Natalee Holloway in Aruba five years earlier. Prior to law enforcement's involvement in the situation, Van der Sloot offered to provide information to an individual regarding the location of Natalee Holloway's remains and the circumstances of her death in exchange for $250,000.00. The FBI-led investigation was conducted in conjunction with Aruban authorities. The U.S. Attorney filed a criminal complaint charging van der Sloot with extortion and wire fraud on June 3, 2010.

Some news accounts have suggested that the FBI provided $25,000.00 in funds that were transmitted to van der Sloot. This is incorrect. The funds involved were private funds.

News accounts have also questioned why charges were not brought earlier, so that the tragic death of Stephany Flores could have been avoided. We offer our heartfelt sympathy to the Flores family. The Birmingham investigation was not related in any way to the murder in Peru. Despite having been in motion for several weeks at the time of Miss Flores’ death, it was not sufficiently developed to bring charges prior to the time van der Sloot left Aruba. This is not due to any fault on the part of the FBI or the U.S. Attorney’s Office, where agents and prosecutors were working as hard as possible to bring the case to fruition when they learned of the murder. A case based on events outside of the United States is a complex matter, and work was proceeding with all deliberate speed to prepare the evidence, the charges, and the necessary procedures to obtain custody of van der Sloot.

http://birmingham.fbi.gov/pressrel/pressrel10/bh060910.htm

[carpe noctem]

Would You Help Your Kid Get Away With Murder?
posted Monday, June 21, 2010

For some parents, blood is thicker than water -- even when it comes to violent crime.



How far would you go to protect your children? What if they were involved in a crime -- and that crime was murder?

Even with the mountain of evidence against Joran van der Sloot -- including video footage and a confession -- his mother, Anita, still believes her son is innocent; that he is, in her words, "not a murderer." In an e-mail to Joran's former girlfriend, Anita wrote, "[Joran] is not the monster they like the world to see .... It stinks and feels like a big trap set up for him."  Before his death earlier this year, Joran's father, Paul, also stood by his son -- some say even going so far as to pay off the authorities after Joran was accused of murdering Alabama teenager Natalee Holloway in Aruba in 2005.

Casey Anthony, the Florida mom accused of murdering her 2-year-old daughter, Caylee, can also count on her parents for support. Both George and Cindy Anthony regularly make public appearances defending their daughter's innocence. And they allegedly changed their stories and possibly tampered with evidence ....

This brand of family solidarity is not uncommon. In addition to protesting their child's innocence (whether they really believe it themselves or not), the parents of criminals often offer various levels of help, says Robin Sax, a former Los Angeles County Deputy District Attorney. The first kind of assistance, says Sax, involves knowing about a crime but not telling the authorities. The second is refusing to cooperate with the authorities even when they have information about the crime. And then there are the parents who actually lie and cover up the crime to keep their child out of prison. Still, despite all the possibilities, Sax says that many parents actually do the right thing: They turn in their child.

If a member of your immediate family told you they'd killed someone, would you help them cover up their crime -- or would you turn them in to the police?

http://www.momlogic.com/2010/06/van_der_sloot_casey_anthony_mo.php

[EURobert]

Don't know if this was posted yet.

From: El Commercio

Joran van der Sloot refused to testify before the judge for the crime of Stephany Flores

According to his lawyer, the Dutchman will not speak until they thrive filed habeas corpus to overturn police investigation

Monday June 21, 2010 - 1:07 pm

The confessed murderer of the student Stephany Flores, Joran van der Sloot , declined today to answer questions from Judge Carlos Morales Cordova, who came to the Castro Castro prison for a first diligently with the subject.

Radio Programs reported, the judge stayed for nearly an hour inside the prison, and finally had to put on record the refusal of the Dutchman in a joint report with the prosecutor.

In the abortive diligence also participated Dutchman's lawyer, Max Highness, who retired without giving statements to the press. As reported by the radio, even before the lawyer had said his client did not declare before the judge until an unsuccessful habeas corpus filed for the annulment of all proceedings, ie his confession to the crime.

We also learned that just before the arrival of the judge, Van der Sloot watched the game Switzerland-Chile in the company of hitman Ospina Colombian Alejandro Trujillo.

With whom it wanted to talk Van der Sloot was with a journalist of "De Telegraaf"
who told Flores confessed to the crime in exchange for an alleged offer of extradition by the police. This interview was broadcast today.

http://tinyurl.com/3xpbfeg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Habeas_corpus

[Anna]

Remember Anita said that "somebody" had invited Joran to a poker tournament in Peru.

That's probably what her sporter told her, anyway.  And so they now have delusions of some sort of entrapment ploy or what?

Joran is not under arrest for extortion in Peru.  It's for the cold blooded murder of another young girl.

The FBI has nothing to do with anything.

[cecilita]

Joran told the Telegraaf reporter that he was lured to Peru by the FBI in order to be extradited to the USA so he could be arrested there. Because Peru has an extradition treaty with the US and Aruba doesn't, at least not when it comes to extortion.
Apparently this is written in tomorrow's paper.

The FBI claims otherwise.

Janet

+++++

Press Release
For Immediate Release
June 9, 2010

FBI Birmingham
Contact: Public Affairs Specialist Paul E. Daymond
(205) 279-1457
United States Attorney's Office
Northern District of Alabama
Contact: (205) 244-2001
 
Joint Statement by United States Attorney Joyce White Vance and FBI Special Agent in Charge Patrick Maley Regarding the Joran van der Sloot Investigation

In April of this year, the FBI and U.S. Attorney's office in Birmingham, Alabama initiated an investigation into allegations of criminal conduct by Joran van der Sloot related to the disappearance of Natalee Holloway in Aruba five years earlier. Prior to law enforcement's involvement in the situation, Van der Sloot offered to provide information to an individual regarding the location of Natalee Holloway's remains and the circumstances of her death in exchange for $250,000.00. The FBI-led investigation was conducted in conjunction with Aruban authorities. The U.S. Attorney filed a criminal complaint charging van der Sloot with extortion and wire fraud on June 3, 2010.

Some news accounts have suggested that the FBI provided $25,000.00 in funds that were transmitted to van der Sloot. This is incorrect. The funds involved were private funds.

News accounts have also questioned why charges were not brought earlier, so that the tragic death of Stephany Flores could have been avoided. We offer our heartfelt sympathy to the Flores family. The Birmingham investigation was not related in any way to the murder in Peru. Despite having been in motion for several weeks at the time of Miss Flores’ death, it was not sufficiently developed to bring charges prior to the time van der Sloot left Aruba. This is not due to any fault on the part of the FBI or the U.S. Attorney’s Office, where agents and prosecutors were working as hard as possible to bring the case to fruition when they learned of the murder. A case based on events outside of the United States is a complex matter, and work was proceeding with all deliberate speed to prepare the evidence, the charges, and the necessary procedures to obtain custody of van der Sloot.

http://birmingham.fbi.gov/pressrel/pressrel10/bh060910.htm

This monster wants to blame the FBI for his own actions, unbelievable!!!! well why not to believe that he killed Stephanie to avoid extradition to USA for the extorsion and soon or later face Natalee's murdered trial.

[seemeatthebeach]

Joran told the Telegraaf reporter that he was lured to Peru by the FBI in order to be extradited to the USA so he could be arrested there. Because Peru has an extradition treaty with the US and Aruba doesn't, at least not when it comes to extortion.
Apparently this is written in tomorrow's paper.

he's BLAMING the FBI for being in PERU????? WTF??? I hate this kid! I guess they told him to kill Stefany too huh?

Yeah, it's unbelievable the stuff this guy comes up with!!!

Joran's email to John Ludwick:

May 29:
"Happy birthday man I hope you had a good day & remember how imortant family & friends are.  I won't bother you today but send me some money through Western Union tomorrow.  The only information of mine you is my name Joran van der Sloot, the country Peru & the city Lima.  I need this man for my ticket back so di it for me.  Take care & enjoy your b-day."

May 26:
Hey,
Just so you know I will be coming back to Aruba on Sunday."

May 10:
"I am going to Peru to live their (sic) until I need to go back to Thailand & take care of my shop.  I am done with Aruba.  Take care."


----

Looks like he wanted to call Peru home! Well, he got his wish.

The only thing that lured Joran to Peru was a poker table, and the opportunity to steal someones $$$$$.

Didn't he tell his demon mother he was "invited" to a tournament in Peru? Of course mother sloot could be lying about the "love note" Joran left for her. They both lie as naturally as we breath air.

[nonesuche]

This is a driveby real quick.. Thanks to everyone AGAIN who has posted links and news articles.. I been VERY busy and will be all week.. first I got to ctach up in the last few days. I have my baby grandaughter whos probably going to wake up any minute from her nap and need to get going. AGain.. Thanks for the articles.. I hardly even have time to watch tv either.
  IF Anyone sees NONESUCHE.. tell her she has mail 

 I can't get over Joran is retracting his statement.. Go figure.. but then again.. why should anyone be shocked about it. Pfftttttttttttttt.

 Read Melody got a nice sum of $ for her diary.. Geesh.. I kept one on my EX.. wonder if anyone would be interested in that thing from 16 yrs.. LOL


Hope all is doing well.. MERE nice seeing you and OS  and others.. off to finish cooking before baby wakes up !

HUGS !

Sorry Angie, I did get your voicemail and I will review the email again, lovely photos of your precious granddaughter. I've just been swamped, having to work up a presentation for my boss for the head of our division plus perform quality control on several new business process documents - all due asap.

[DPJ]

Just watched the re-run online and John van den Heuvel had this to say about his visit to Joran:

Joran seemed calm, all the stress of the past few weeks seems to have disappeared.
He's come to terms with the fact that he is now locked up.
There were reports that he felt unsafe and threatenend, but that's not true.
John asked him if he was innocent and Joran didn't say that he was innocent but he doesn't want to go in to that.
John also talked to Joran's lawyer, he said that there were countless procedural errors and he's convinced that Joran will be a free man soon.
He talked to Joran for about 20 mins.
Joran is willing to undergo psychological and psychiatric tests.
His lawyer said that if those test say that Joran is mentally ill, he might be transferred from the prison to a mental hospital.
And earlier I said that it was Joran who said the FBI lured him to Peru, but John says he and his team investigated the whole extortion case and they now think that it was indeed the FBI that lured Joran to Peru.

I find that extremely hard to believe tbh...
And even if it is true, Joran still killed an innocent girl and should be sentenced to xx years for that!

Saw that to Jo An and van den Heuvel seemed quite confident about the legal and procedural errors and Joran's lawyer aiming to use all of them.

Also I got reports of many RTL people on Aruba and legal and consular council on their way to Peru. It seems the gameplan is to keep this as high-profile as it gets and that might just be the thing to get the Peruvian government to cave in.

[klaasend]

msmarple - nice job commenting on the Peru website 

http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Felcomercio.pe%2Fnoticia%2F498451%2Fjoran-van-der-sloot-se-nego-declarar-ante-juez-crimen-stephany-flores&sl=es&tl=en&hl=&ie=UTF-8

[klaasend]

Just watched the re-run online and John van den Heuvel had this to say about his visit to Joran:

Joran seemed calm, all the stress of the past few weeks seems to have disappeared.
He's come to terms with the fact that he is now locked up.
There were reports that he felt unsafe and threatenend, but that's not true.
John asked him if he was innocent and Joran didn't say that he was innocent but he doesn't want to go in to that.
John also talked to Joran's lawyer, he said that there were countless procedural errors and he's convinced that Joran will be a free man soon.
He talked to Joran for about 20 mins.
Joran is willing to undergo psychological and psychiatric tests.
His lawyer said that if those test say that Joran is mentally ill, he might be transferred from the prison to a mental hospital.
And earlier I said that it was Joran who said the FBI lured him to Peru, but John says he and his team investigated the whole extortion case and they now think that it was indeed the FBI that lured Joran to Peru.

I find that extremely hard to believe tbh...
And even if it is true, Joran still killed an innocent girl and should be sentenced to xx years for that!

Saw that to Jo An and van den Heuvel seemed quite confident about the legal and procedural errors and Joran's lawyer aiming to use all of them.

Also I got reports of many RTL people on Aruba and legal and consular council on their way to Peru. It seems the gameplan is to keep this as high-profile as it gets and that might just be the thing to get the Peruvian government to cave in.

If Peru caves in to Aruba or the NL when it comes to this monster the world will be outraged.  Joran will be a dead man even faster. 

[Anna]

Just watched the re-run online and John van den Heuvel had this to say about his visit to Joran:

Joran seemed calm, all the stress of the past few weeks seems to have disappeared.
He's come to terms with the fact that he is now locked up.
There were reports that he felt unsafe and threatenend, but that's not true.
John asked him if he was innocent and Joran didn't say that he was innocent but he doesn't want to go in to that.
John also talked to Joran's lawyer, he said that there were countless procedural errors and he's convinced that Joran will be a free man soon.
He talked to Joran for about 20 mins.
Joran is willing to undergo psychological and psychiatric tests.
His lawyer said that if those test say that Joran is mentally ill, he might be transferred from the prison to a mental hospital.
And earlier I said that it was Joran who said the FBI lured him to Peru, but John says he and his team investigated the whole extortion case and they now think that it was indeed the FBI that lured Joran to Peru.

I find that extremely hard to believe tbh...
And even if it is true, Joran still killed an innocent girl and should be sentenced to xx years for that!

Saw that to Jo An and van den Heuvel seemed quite confident about the legal and procedural errors and Joran's lawyer aiming to use all of them.

Also I got reports of many RTL people on Aruba and legal and consular council on their way to Peru. It seems the gameplan is to keep this as high-profile as it gets and that might just be the thing to get the Peruvian government to cave in.

Get the Peruvian government to cave in to what?

Allowing Joran to get away with cold-blooded murder when they have an airtight case against him?

[Anna]

Should Joran's attorney succeed in getting the confession throw out (or more li8kely the judge decide there is more evidence than needed without it) it does not mean Joran goes free.

It means he will not be detained any longer on the basis of his confession.  So Peru will then detain him based on something else like forensic evidence.

It's really no big deal and certainly not any game cchanger.


.

[Tamikosmom]

Just watched the re-run online and John van den Heuvel had this to say about his visit to Joran:

Joran seemed calm, all the stress of the past few weeks seems to have disappeared.
He's come to terms with the fact that he is now locked up.
There were reports that he felt unsafe and threatenend, but that's not true.
John asked him if he was innocent and Joran didn't say that he was innocent but he doesn't want to go in to that.
John also talked to Joran's lawyer, he said that there were countless procedural errors and he's convinced that Joran will be a free man soon.
He talked to Joran for about 20 mins.
Joran is willing to undergo psychological and psychiatric tests.
His lawyer said that if those test say that Joran is mentally ill, he might be transferred from the prison to a mental hospital.
And earlier I said that it was Joran who said the FBI lured him to Peru, but John says he and his team investigated the whole extortion case and they now think that it was indeed the FBI that lured Joran to Peru.

I find that extremely hard to believe tbh...
And even if it is true, Joran still killed an innocent girl and should be sentenced to xx years for that!

Saw that to Jo An and van den Heuvel seemed quite confident about the legal and procedural errors and Joran's lawyer aiming to use all of them.

Also I got reports of many RTL people on Aruba and legal and consular council on their way to Peru. It seems the gameplan is to keep this as high-profile as it gets and that might just be the thing to get the Peruvian government to cave in.

If Peru caves in to Aruba or the NL when it comes to this monster the world will be outraged.  Joran will be a dead man even faster. 

Monkeys will be outraged ... Beth will be outraged. but ... I do not know about the world.  Did you read Jo-An's post regarding the Dutch.  Did you read the first FBI press release regarding the extortion charge.  The release affords the Arubans appreciation  for their cooperation.  Stephany's father states publicly  that it does not concern him whether Joran is detained in Peru or the Netherlands/Aruba as long as he is detained.

Klaas ... I no longer think that the "world" gets it.  I do not think the "world" comprehends that a corrupt Aruban investigation has an agenda to protect Joran van der Sloot from implication in the Natalee Holloway case and ... the corrupt investigation has prevented justice from prevailing since May 30, 2005.

IMO

Help!  Klaas ... my comment submitted to the last Natalee Holloway FP blog went "poof".

Thanks

Janet

[seemeatthebeach]

Would You Help Your Kid Get Away With Murder?
posted Monday, June 21, 2010

For some parents, blood is thicker than water -- even when it comes to violent crime.



How far would you go to protect your children? What if they were involved in a crime -- and that crime was murder?

Even with the mountain of evidence against Joran van der Sloot -- including video footage and a confession -- his mother, Anita, still believes her son is innocent; that he is, in her words, "not a murderer." In an e-mail to Joran's former girlfriend, Anita wrote, "[Joran] is not the monster they like the world to see .... It stinks and feels like a big trap set up for him."  Before his death earlier this year, Joran's father, Paul, also stood by his son -- some say even going so far as to pay off the authorities after Joran was accused of murdering Alabama teenager Natalee Holloway in Aruba in 2005.

Casey Anthony, the Florida mom accused of murdering her 2-year-old daughter, Caylee, can also count on her parents for support. Both George and Cindy Anthony regularly make public appearances defending their daughter's innocence. And they allegedly changed their stories and possibly tampered with evidence ....

This brand of family solidarity is not uncommon. In addition to protesting their child's innocence (whether they really believe it themselves or not), the parents of criminals often offer various levels of help, says Robin Sax, a former Los Angeles County Deputy District Attorney. The first kind of assistance, says Sax, involves knowing about a crime but not telling the authorities. The second is refusing to cooperate with the authorities even when they have information about the crime. And then there are the parents who actually lie and cover up the crime to keep their child out of prison. Still, despite all the possibilities, Sax says that many parents actually do the right thing: They turn in their child.

If a member of your immediate family told you they'd killed someone, would you help them cover up their crime -- or would you turn them in to the police?

http://www.momlogic.com/2010/06/van_der_sloot_casey_anthony_mo.php

Anita may change her tune when Joran throws her and dead daddy Paulus under the bus.
If Joran thinks he will get extradited to a Netherland's prison (I don't think that would occur even if he did) for the truth about the cover-up in Aruba, IMO he very well might turn on his mother. The reality that mother isn't coming to his rescue this time could enrage him, especially if she played any part of the cover-up of Natalee's disappearance and death. His thinking will be she has to be punished as well.

[EURobert]

Just watched the re-run online and John van den Heuvel had this to say about his visit to Joran:

Joran seemed calm, all the stress of the past few weeks seems to have disappeared.
He's come to terms with the fact that he is now locked up.
There were reports that he felt unsafe and threatenend, but that's not true.
John asked him if he was innocent and Joran didn't say that he was innocent but he doesn't want to go in to that.
John also talked to Joran's lawyer, he said that there were countless procedural errors and he's convinced that Joran will be a free man soon.
He talked to Joran for about 20 mins.
Joran is willing to undergo psychological and psychiatric tests.
His lawyer said that if those test say that Joran is mentally ill, he might be transferred from the prison to a mental hospital.
And earlier I said that it was Joran who said the FBI lured him to Peru, but John says he and his team investigated the whole extortion case and they now think that it was indeed the FBI that lured Joran to Peru.

I find that extremely hard to believe tbh...
And even if it is true, Joran still killed an innocent girl and should be sentenced to xx years for that!

Saw that to Jo An and van den Heuvel seemed quite confident about the legal and procedural errors and Joran's lawyer aiming to use all of them.

Also I got reports of many RTL people on Aruba and legal and consular council on their way to Peru. It seems the gameplan is to keep this as high-profile as it gets and that might just be the thing to get the Peruvian government to cave in.

It's online now: http://tinyurl.com/2e7whzq Top right video: John van de Hill meets Joran
But unfortunately - as usual - all Dutch...

[mojo]

Joran told the Telegraaf reporter that he was lured to Peru by the FBI

oh really? prove it

[Anna]

The United States has extradition treaties with every country in this hemisphere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties

See the map at the bottom of the list to see that all members of the Organization of Americas all share extradition with each other.

Maybe this is something that is lost on some of the Dutch?  I dunno.

[Jo-An]

Joran told the Telegraaf reporter that he was lured to Peru by the FBI

oh really? prove it

It wasn't Joran who said that, I already posted this about it:

John van den Heuvel on tv right now (RTL Boulevard).
He's the crime reporter who interviewed both Anita and Joran last week.
He said he already contacted Anita a couple of weeks ago and she agreed to do an interview last week.
Then he asked her if she could arrange an interview with Joran.
I didn't hear the whole thing, because I was on the phone but...

Just watched the re-run online and John van den Heuvel had this to say about his visit to Joran:

Joran seemed calm, all the stress of the past few weeks seems to have disappeared.
He's come to terms with the fact that he is now locked up.
There were reports that he felt unsafe and threatenend, but that's not true.
John asked him if he was innocent and Joran didn't say that he was innocent but he doesn't want to go in to that.
John also talked to Joran's lawyer, he said that there were countless procedural errors and he's convinced that Joran will be a free man soon.
He talked to Joran for about 20 mins.
Joran is willing to undergo psychological and psychiatric tests.
His lawyer said that if those test say that Joran is mentally ill, he might be transferred from the prison to a mental hospital.
And earlier I said that it was Joran who said the FBI lured him to Peru, but John says he and his team investigated the whole extortion case and they now think that it was indeed the FBI that lured Joran to Peru.

I find that extremely hard to believe tbh...
And even if it is true, Joran still killed an innocent girl and should be sentenced to xx years for that!

[mojo]

yes, but extradition treaties are crime specific.

[Jo-An]

The United States has extradition treaties with every country in this hemisphere.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties

See the map at the bottom of the list to see that all members of the Organization of Americas all share extradition with each other.

Maybe this is something that is lost on some of the Dutch?  I dunno.

I was told that Aruba and the US only have an extradition treaty when it comes to drug related cases and not extortion for instance.