Lively Case Discussion #581 2/5 - 2/10/2007

[Leslie]

I remember the time of the phone call was reported as 6:30 AM, Monday, May 30th, 2005.  An interesting time, because Joran said he is on the schoolbus at 6:20 AM.  On that particular day, it seems,, that Joran stayed home.
I wish someone would explain the "drama".

[SunFreak2]

That 6:30 phone call brings up some questions.

Joran's story is that he walks home and gets there about 3:30. Are we to think he slept only about 2- 2 1/2 hours, then dashed off to a remote spot in the island's interior, and called someone that early in the morning?

IF the phone call happened, (and there is no evidence that it didn't, it was openly reported by even the tight-lipped Dutch investigators), it poses several problems. It makes it tough to fit a theory in about some kind of party at Joran's home, where Natalee dies.

And why the interior of the island? What business does he have there on an EARLY Monday morning?

That phone call SEEMS to imply that Joran never went home at all, which Beth has contravened strongly. She has always wanted to get Joran TO his house in the story, whereas he has made up stories to try to distance himself from it.

Any ideas?

I tend to trust a gut instinct, and if Beth's told her that Natalee was at that house, I would tend to believe her.  I do not believe a word Joran says, and especially about getting home from the beach after he left Natalee at the huts.  I for one, do not believe he was ever at the huts.  I think Natalee got hurt at the rocks by the lighthouse, then Joran took Natalee to his house.  Then he decides to dispose of her, which is how he might have gotten to the interior of the island.  We think parts of her shirt were found at Boca Tortuga.  The shallow grave was near that too, although Art Wood said that he thought Natalee was never buried there, but probably a large drug stash was.

[Angiex911dsptchr]

That 6:30 phone call brings up some questions.

Joran's story is that he walks home and gets there about 3:30. Are we to think he slept only about 2- 2 1/2 hours, then dashed off to a remote spot in the island's interior, and called someone that early in the morning?

IF the phone call happened, (and there is no evidence that it didn't, it was openly reported by even the tight-lipped Dutch investigators), it poses several problems. It makes it tough to fit a theory in about some kind of party at Joran's home, where Natalee dies.

And why the interior of the island? What business does he have there on an EARLY Monday morning?

That phone call SEEMS to imply that Joran never went home at all, which Beth has contravened strongly. She has always wanted to get Joran TO his house in the story, whereas he has made up stories to try to distance himself from it.

Any ideas?

 IMO  he is covering for his Dad,

[Sam]

HI again Monkeys,

See I think we were fed a bunch of bull right from the beginning. I read so many boards at the beginning without posting and there were so many rumors of so many things. I think they may have all been diversions.

There was a post early on one of the Aruba boards supposedly by someone who had been on the same snorkeling cruise and was not a part of the MB group and she also went to Cand C's the same night and was surprised to see the MB gals being able to have so much energy.

Then in reading one of the 302's from Taco Joes filing one of the girls was telling about the snorkeling cruise and she said that only the MB folks and a couple of there chaperones were on it. So evidently the message on the Aruba board was also a lie.

[klaasend]

HI again Monkeys,

See I think we were fed a bunch of bull right from the beginning. I read so many boards at the beginning without posting and there were so many rumors of so many things. I think they may have all been diversions.

There was a post early on one of the Aruba boards supposedly by someone who had been on the same snorkeling cruise and was not a part of the MB group and she also went to Cand C's the same night and was surprised to see the MB gals being able to have so much energy.

Then in reading one of the 302's from Taco Joes filing one of the girls was telling about the snorkeling cruise and she said that only the MB folks and a couple of there chaperones were on it. So evidently the message on the Aruba board was also a lie.

Some of those early reports on TripAdvisor were from people confused with the night in question.  One I remember was referring to Saturday night, not Sunday night.  Alot of confusion and misinformation.

Edited to add:  That's where I initially started following this case.

[bleachedblack]

I remember the time of the phone call was reported as 6:30 AM, Monday, May 30th, 2005.  An interesting time, because Joran said he is on the schoolbus at 6:20 AM.  On that particular day, it seems,, that Joran stayed home.
I wish someone would explain the "drama".

Yes, one of his many lies that seems to have "cracked" under examination.

[SunFreak2]

HI again Monkeys,

See I think we were fed a bunch of bull right from the beginning. I read so many boards at the beginning without posting and there were so many rumors of so many things. I think they may have all been diversions.

There was a post early on one of the Aruba boards supposedly by someone who had been on the same snorkeling cruise and was not a part of the MB group and she also went to Cand C's the same night and was surprised to see the MB gals being able to have so much energy.

Then in reading one of the 302's from Taco Joes filing one of the girls was telling about the snorkeling cruise and she said that only the MB folks and a couple of there chaperones were on it. So evidently the message on the Aruba board was also a lie.

People want their 15 minutes of fame.  How about those 2 people that saw Jeffry Dahmer at the Hollywood Mall when Adam Walsh was kidnapped?

[dkpen]

Hi everyone!

I could of sworn it was said that Freddy and Koen both stayed the night at Joran's that night in question. Nothing was ever said or questioned on it that I recall.

Maybe that is why Koen is so scared he had to sleep with his mommy. He knows something.

Hi DK.  Whatever happened to the story that Koen had his own pad?  Koen seems too much of a Mama's boy to live on his own while still in HS.  Wasn't he a year behind Joran in school too?

I never heard about Koen having his own place. That's a new one to me.
Yes, I believe Koen is one year younger but not positive. Sanders is 2 years younger. They are both Jorans first cousins and best friends.

[sb]

If the 6:30 phone call is legit, IMO it LESSENS the chances of PVDS having much involvement in what happened. What happened to Natalee would have happened where PVDS might not find out about it until later.

[Lala'sMom]

So where did we first hear of this phone call?

[SunFreak2]

Yes, I believe Koen is one year younger but not positive. Sanders is 2 years younger. They are both Jorans first cousins and best friends.

Last night I read where Paulus & Alexander are supposed to be first cousins.  I was mulling that over in my mind as to how that would make them related - thru which relative?  Paulus & ALex would have to have parents that were related to each other.

[klaasend]

DKPen - do we have any information on the relationship between the Gottenbos and the Sloots?  I have never seen this confirmed.

[bleachedblack]

HI again Monkeys,

See I think we were fed a bunch of bull right from the beginning. I read so many boards at the beginning without posting and there were so many rumors of so many things. I think they may have all been diversions.

There was a post early on one of the Aruba boards supposedly by someone who had been on the same snorkeling cruise and was not a part of the MB group and she also went to Cand C's the same night and was surprised to see the MB gals being able to have so much energy.

Then in reading one of the 302's from Taco Joes filing one of the girls was telling about the snorkeling cruise and she said that only the MB folks and a couple of there chaperones were on it. So evidently the message on the Aruba board was also a lie.

I honestly think the feeding of the bull started somewhat slowly and snowballed.

[bleachedblack]

Yes, I believe Koen is one year younger but not positive. Sanders is 2 years younger. They are both Jorans first cousins and best friends.

Last night I read where Paulus & Alexander are supposed to be first cousins.  I was mulling that over in my mind as to how that would make them related - thru which relative?  Paulus & ALex would have to have parents that were related to each other.

I had mentioned hearing this in the early days, i thought it had been information offered up by an Aruban poster here on this board. Klaas felt it was just one of the rumors....so infact it may be.

[Leslie]

Except that PVDS has said that he would wake up the boys in the morning so that they would not miss the school bus.  If that was his usual habit, then he would have known by 6:20 AM that Joran was not going to school that Monday.  If Joran was too tired (or would not wake up) to go to school then who made the 6:30 AM phone call and why?  
O/T.  It is possible to locate, dig up and pump out a septic tank under 2 feet of snow and when the temperature is 6 degrees.   That was MY day.

[SunFreak2]

So where did we first hear of this phone call?

Good question!

I was thinking we should start a thread called FACT OR FICTION, and try to list all the things that happened from the beginning.  Then try to trace the source.  Maybe that way we can eliminate some of these diversionary & confusing claims.

[klaasend]

Yes, I believe Koen is one year younger but not positive. Sanders is 2 years younger. They are both Jorans first cousins and best friends.

Last night I read where Paulus & Alexander are supposed to be first cousins.  I was mulling that over in my mind as to how that would make them related - thru which relative?  Paulus & ALex would have to have parents that were related to each other.

I had mentioned hearing this in the early days, i thought it had been information offered up by an Aruban poster here on this board. Klaas felt it was just one of the rumors....so infact it may be.

That's the thing, I don't know if it's true or not but I'd like to know.  Just haven't seen any proof.  It's a pretty big deal if they are indeed related, IMO.

[Lala'sMom]

Wasn't it one of our former posters that lived on Aruba that told us they were related?  

[klaasend]

Wasn't it one of our former posters that lived on Aruba that told us they were related?  

I don't remember.  You mean Arubagirl, Nativelingo or Bondia?

[Lala'sMom]

Wasn't it one of our former posters that lived on Aruba that told us they were related?  

I don't remember.  You mean Arubagirl, Nativelingo or Bondia?

Yes. Maybe one of them mentioned it.  Not saying they were lying, just that maybe that is where we heard it.