Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND, OR #4 7/8/10 - 7/11/10

[Deenie]

Good afternoon everyone!

I've been wondering about Terri's DUI charges.  I wonder if it affected her job or possibly presented a problem with her getting a job with the school system especially since endangering a child was also added to the charge.  It's possible that her stay at home mom status was not of her own choosing.  It could also be another reason for Desiree's apprehension and resentment towards her.

4getUnot
I don't think that her DUI charge can be used against her person for employment. Why I say that is because " millions of people" in the US have dui's or oui's .. on record.
The endangered charge her son being in the car? I still do not believe that it would effect her employment. *seems* We read too frequently that a teacher is arrested for molesting students ..come to find out they have a criminal history. Yet, they're history not found out until they were " caught" doing something heinous/wrong.
I do not believe many school systems have the capability to run crim checks on their candidates for employment .. they leave it up to the word of the candidate to disclose the information in paperwork. Such as a dd ticket. (( Not many will admit it and pray no one does run a check on them)) no one is proud of a dd ticket.
* I do agree though that there is a "long term tension" between Des and Terri.   

[sebastian]

If TH hid Kyron somewhere and told her Attorney, would he be obligated to report it? How would that coincide with Attorney client privaledge?

I believe he would be required to report it but how quickly I'm not sure. 

Thanks Klaas! I then have to wonder where TH got the money for this Attorney. From what I have read, he is a high powered Attorney in that area. Maybe he is handling her case pro-bono? If that is the case, I would imagine that he told her up front that if he catches her in a lie, that he is done with her. I just really pray that if she had hidden Kyron somewhere and he is alive and well, that they are scrambling (TH and her Attorney) to figure out a defense before they release the location?

Why would they not make a comment? Why, "no comment", "no comment", "I am not going to comment on that"? The police are saying the same thing.."no comment", "I can't comment on that".

It is maddening to say the least!

[Tracygirl]

I don't think Terri is the only one with a DUI.

Yes but do you think that it could have affected Terri's ability to get a job in the education system?  Seems most if not all of her credentials were in education.

It should but I don't think it always does.

[cw618]

http://videos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2010/07/kyron_hormans_parents_share_de.html

kaine says the baby is with TH at the school at 1157: or so
how does he know this, why wasnt it mentione by any eyewitness

example
cop: did you see TH at school
me; yes
cop; anything unusal
me ;no
cop; was anyone with her and kyron or with TH later
me; yes the baby was with them, both times i saw them

[Tracygirl]

God forbid this ever be the case, I wouldn't be the one making the phone call to my step daughters mother. I would probably ask the school to call her as well if my husband couldn't. My sons former step mother (acutally fathers ex girlfriend) she wouldn't call me either

The relationship between mom and step mom are more times then not, a difficult road to travel on. I wouldn't put too much into Terri not wanting to call.

[seahorse]

Going back to the day of the 4th of June.

Kaine has said that he came home from work. He found Terri on the computer/desk top? or laptop? ( wondering if she was able to go portable with a laptop)
He said he came in kissed Kiara grabbed some food went to his home office.
Then he said he got Kiara ready to go get Kyron at the bus stop. That he put on Kiara shoes and they went together to walk to greet Kyron.
** understanding this is Kaines view of what happened as he said it. Him not embellishing - this is his factual that he remembers. I wonder why he didn't mention Terri in his recall. Was it because they were having a " riff " of sorts that day?
That they were avoiding each other.
Just thinking, he would have asked Terri about the Science Fair " How did Kyron do today?" ....something.. that he could remark to the press. I believe if the did ask Terri that he would have said it in his remarks. 

I feel that there was not much of a conversation between the adults right before before walking to the bus stop. Sounds to me " Kaines version" that he was feeling that Terri did not want to go to the bus stop. He mention of putting on Kiara shoes. *me*Thinking they were not speaking, yet there was tension, He is putting all his attention to Kiara ((Kiara is on my side)) He grabs her shoes and puts them on ... Terri is sitting silent dreading the time of 3:30.  Kaine possibly even aggravated at Terri like what is wrong with you? Kyron is getting off the bus any minute. Kaine fixed on going and Terri is not moving. He goes with Kiara not thinking twice about leaving Terri behind. Finally she catches up to the bus stop * too late Kaine knows Kyron is not on bus. ( all of this going down in mins)

Kaine is blown away that Kyron is not on the bus. Do you think that when Kaine learned that Kyron was not on the bus. He handed Kiara over to Terri. Jumped in his car and went up to the school like a crazy man.
( after he found out from the school via Phone that Kyron was marked absent)
 Kaine was a hot mess* more than likely was tearing up the school or school yard.  That must have been the worst 30 mins of Kaine's life.
Terri not cooperating and Desiree 4 hours away freaking out .. and No Kyron. And the school not offering any info. Because they really did not have any info. At that point, the secretary would have known nothing other than "It says on the records Kyron was absent today Mr. Horman"

Sigh. Did Kaine tell Terri to Call Desiree right now ..while he went and checked the school/outside of school Yet, Terri chickened out and had the secretary do it.
Knowing that Kyron was to be dropped off that early evening 1/2 way to Medford to meet his Mom.. maybe that is the reason why Terri opted out of calling DY.

Maybe they the Moms had discussions about that " trip" earlier that week and it was not a good one between Terri and Desiree.  That Desiree would be all over Terri ..What do you mean Kyron is Lost/missing??? You just don't want to bring him here to Me, Let me talk to Kaine now. That is why the secretary called Desiree, not Terri. Kaine was ripping up the school so he could not make the call.

Deenie! Is your real name Anne Rule? You had me riveted, and waiting for the next installment!

Me, too!  Nice delivery, Deene! :O)

[crazybabyborg]

Good afternoon everyone!

I've been wondering about Terri's DUI charges.  I wonder if it affected her job or possibly presented a problem with her getting a job with the school system especially since endangering a child was also added to the charge.  It's possible that her stay at home mom status was not of her own choosing.  It could also be another reason for Desiree's apprehension and resentment towards her.

4getUnot
I don't think that her DUI charge can be used against her person for employment. Why I say that is because " millions of people" in the US have dui's or oui's .. on record.
The endangered charge her son being in the car? I still do not believe that it would effect her employment. *seems* We read too frequently that a teacher is arrested for molesting students ..come to find out they have a criminal history. Yet, they're history not found out until they were " caught" doing something heinous/wrong.
I do not believe many school systems have the capability to run crim checks on their candidates for employment .. they leave it up to the word of the candidate to disclose the information in paperwork. Such as a dd ticket. (( Not many will admit it and pray no one does run a check on them)) no one is proud of a dd ticket.
* I do agree though that there is a "long term tension" between Des and Terri.   

Hi Deenie! Love reading your posts!

Actually it's shocking what things can impact employment. We are required to run background checks for anyone in contact with patients. I would be surprised if schools don't have the same requirement. Many employers will consider all sorts of things, including tax records, credit ratings, arrest records, and personal habits such as smoking, before hiring. There is commonly "morality" clauses in many teacher contracts, which means that "immoral" behavior even outside of work can be grounds for dismissal.

[klaasend]

http://videos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2010/07/kyron_hormans_parents_share_de.html

kaine says the baby is with TH at the school at 1157: or so
how does he know this, why wasnt it mentione by any eyewitness

example
cop: did you see TH at school
me; yes
cop; anything unusal
me ;no
cop; was anyone with her and kyron or with TH later
me; yes the baby was with them, both times i saw them

Unless he's assuming that Kiara was with Terri, I'm sure the teachers have said that Kiara was with Terri. 

[4getUnot]

Thanks Deenie

So more than likely the DUI isn't a factor in this case.

[cw618]

http://videos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2010/07/kyron_hormans_parents_share_de.html

kaine says the baby is with TH at the school at 1157: or so
how does he know this, why wasnt it mentione by any eyewitness

example
cop: did you see TH at school
me; yes
cop; anything unusal
me ;no
cop; was anyone with her and kyron or with TH later
me; yes the baby was with them, both times i saw them

Unless he's assuming that Kiara was with Terri, I'm sure the teachers have said that Kiara was with Terri. 

ok do we know if there are other known parents, from skyline with FB,MS, whatever, that have posted pics, vid ect. of the Sfair

[klaasend]

http://videos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2010/07/kyron_hormans_parents_share_de.html

kaine says the baby is with TH at the school at 1157: or so
how does he know this, why wasnt it mentione by any eyewitness

example
cop: did you see TH at school
me; yes
cop; anything unusal
me ;no
cop; was anyone with her and kyron or with TH later
me; yes the baby was with them, both times i saw them

Unless he's assuming that Kiara was with Terri, I'm sure the teachers have said that Kiara was with Terri. 

ok do we know if there are other known parents, from skyline with FB,MS, whatever, that have posted pics, vid ect. of the Sfair

Wow, good question and I"ll have to search.  Terri wasn't really there for the fair though, she/they came early and left early. 

[Scatty]

PPD aside, I'm starting to get the feeling that TH may have a personality disorder, similar to Casey Anthony. I believe DY who says TH has lied for 7years. And yes I think a liar is more apt to to be pathological in other ways than not. I think TH can be very dedicated when it comes to getting something for herself, such as body building, but I also think she has low self-esteem. Like many personality disordered types (for some reason I know quite a few) her sense of self-worth may come not from working to support herself, but from working to have someone else support her. I think a history of affairs will come out. This doesn't mean I think Kaine was a choirboy-a relationship with a pathological person will always be toxic to some degree. Many hold up TH as loving Kyron because she brought him up. That certainly doesn't have to be true. Everyone thought Casey Anthony was a loving Mom. Appearances can simply just be--appearances. TH may have felt the Kyron was her meal ticket that bound her more strongly to Kaine, until Kiara came along. I do think it likely that she was considering a MFH plot, but I think she may have decided to wait till after Kyron was gone. Someone else brought up that Kaine may have left a will leaving the house to his children. And TH may have been worried about DY taking Kyron back and having a say in the property. Major, major speculating on my part, I know.
I hope we have some more information on this baffling, upsetting, yet very interesting case soon.

[cw618]

http://videos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2010/07/kyron_hormans_parents_share_de.html

kaine says the baby is with TH at the school at 1157: or so
how does he know this, why wasnt it mentione by any eyewitness

example
cop: did you see TH at school
me; yes
cop; anything unusal
me ;no
cop; was anyone with her and kyron or with TH later
me; yes the baby was with them, both times i saw them

Unless he's assuming that Kiara was with Terri, I'm sure the teachers have said that Kiara was with Terri. 

ok do we know if there are other known parents, from skyline with FB,MS, whatever, that have posted pics, vid ect. of the Sfair

Wow, good question and I"ll have to search.  Terri wasn't really there for the fair though, she/they came early and left early. 

im sure other parents had to leave early too, that thing called work

[Deenie]

CBB (( miss You))

Me thinking though .. a Criminal Check is not done until someone is " not yet technically hired" but is  at 99.9 percent " has the position" .. If you had to do a criminal background check on every " candidate" it would be so expensive and not worth it.

When I worked in automotive, I worked very close to the HR Manager. The only time he ran a background check on someone was " directly before" the signing you hired. 
Which only came to be after one employee was hired * without a background check* and he turned out to be a total fraud. He was on the payroll for 4 months and the companies he was liaison to .. figured out quickly this guy had no experience what so ever in engineering. He was hired at a high paying salary, had a perfect resume. Come out to find out - Was not even his real name. He stole someone's identity from the internet along with their credentials. I believe it was his social security number that tipped off .. the company who finally did do the background check on him. He was arrested in the office. I will never forget that day. Ever.

[Deenie]

CBB I have to add too - my experience with background checks was in the 1990's +

I so agree with you on your words of how it is today. I know they want your entire life served when applying for a job. Some even want your credit card numbers -so the prospective employer can see if you pay your bills on time/or how much debt you have. Which I think is just INSANE.  Times have changed CBB I agree. 

[cw618]

found this not sure every school does this or is required to do this
http://www.schoolsecurity.org/resources/teacher_background_checks.html

[newfie]

Most public schools have a morals clause in their contracts that says that teachers can not be involved in activities that affront the morals of the community they serve. It may not sound fair but they can use these clauses at their discretion. I think they would be more apt. to let someone be a substitute with something like a dui on their record. A DUI can ruin a persons life.

I don't think Terri is the only one with a DUI.

Yes but do you think that it could have affected Terri's ability to get a job in the education system?  Seems most if not all of her credentials were in education.

It should but I don't think it always does.

[crazybabyborg]

CBB (( miss You))

Me thinking though .. a Criminal Check is not done until someone is " not yet technically hired" but is  at 99.9 percent " has the position" .. If you had to do a criminal background check on every " candidate" it would be so expensive and not worth it.

When I worked in automotive, I worked very close to the HR Manager. The only time he ran a background check on someone was " directly before" the signing you hired. 
Which only came to be after one employee was hired * without a background check* and he turned out to be a total fraud. He was on the payroll for 4 months and the companies he was liaison to .. figured out quickly this guy had no experience what so ever in engineering. He was hired at a high paying salary, had a perfect resume. Come out to find out - Was not even his real name. He stole someone's identity from the internet along with their credentials. I believe it was his social security number that tipped off .. the company who finally did do the background check on him. He was arrested in the office. I will never forget that day. Ever.

That's true, Deenie. Background checks are too expensive to do on all candidates and are done just before the job is offerred. I've hired and then done the check but that's not the way it's supposed to be done. If something did turn up on a check, I'm not sure the candidate would be told the job was their's before the check. I wouldn't tell it, I don't think.

[cw618]

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8220.msg1181100#msg1181100

thanks klass, ill try to get some time on to, i work a lot though, and volunteer
so it could take me awhile to find anything, wish i had thought of it, when i read
TH had posted pics, on her face thing, im not a face or me or whatever that type
of blog is

[d in texas]

Sebastian-- Could of not said what you did in your post better.  This case leaves me and so many others tettering back and forth, guess it is hard to imagine anyone let alone the caretaker of a loving child causing harm to them.  For me it is just a feeling of something not fitting right with case, and can not put my finger on it.  What none of us know, we just don't have enough information, only what the family and LE want us to know.
In the very beginning when it was reported the family would not speak to media at the direction of Kaine Horman it has stuck in my mind and can not get past it.  Desiree her appearanc doesn't bother me, I wouldn't want to look like dracula's bride to the nation either, it goes further for me, she is too calm, she doesn't have the stressed out look or tone in her voice, she has determination, with  slight hint of anger.  What I take away from Kaine Horman and Desiree Young.
Terri Horman hasn't said anything, hasn't been in the public eye other than the one news conference and no doubt the look on her face (to me) at one point was "I don't want to be here", "I am very uncomfortable", and at one point when I believe  Desiree was speaking almost a look of contempt, "Shut up why are you talking you have no idea what has happened and you shouldn't be here".
Just my observations.  I have never posted so much on Scared Monkeys since Casey Anthony case began, almost like I have to share and vent with my fellow monkeys to understand, yet we don't understand.