Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND, OR #22 8/19/10 - 8/21/10

[Tamikosmom]

Tracygirl's post   
I don't think anyone here is making her out to be a saint, but perhaps not wanting to hang her for everything that comes out against her.
That is what I'm doing.

"Our" no rose ... the voice of reason.

Janet

[no rose colored glasses]

oh my, Pica is a terrible thing, we had a family member with this. May I please ask, is this card system used with all children, or with children with learning problems? The reason I ask is, did Kyron have learning problems?
[/quote]

In our school it is an every child thing. Sammi does not have any "learning" problems, only the behavioral problems. The anxiety issue causes her to not do well on time test though. Thank God she is almost out of the Pica. She had what the dr.s called a mild case. But she has eaten everything from change to stuffing out of pillows! Still has some issues with it, but have found that chewing gum helps a lot.
[/quote]Thank goodness  Thank-you, so it is used with all kids. Like I said before this was not used when my kids were small. Sounds like a good idea but with everything has its flaws.

[Tracygirl]

I think everyone needs to take a deep breath and a step back and consider things.

I know for myself I can read something and consider a middle stance, some people cannot do that and respond out of emotion. Funny because I think that is what Terri does, such as what Gypsy was saying. She has an overboard response to situations and circumstances from what we can gather from news reports and quotes anyway.

Truth be told, I don't care if it is Terri, Dede or a big purple bunny with green spots that took Kyron, I want him to be found and the person who did this to be arrested and held accountable for their bad behavior. hmm there I go again with that holding people accountable. I suppose that is how the world works? I wonder if Terri was ever held accountable for her bad behavior or bad choices? or CA was she or did her parents just jump in and protect her? I sort of think Terri was being strick because she saw her own flaws and didn't want that for her own children. I think in her own crazy, screwed up way, she did care about Kyron, as James said she treated him like her own child.

[no rose colored glasses]

Tracygirl's post   
I don't think anyone here is making her out to be a saint, but perhaps not wanting to hang her for everything that comes out against her.
That is what I'm doing.

"Our" no rose ... the voice of reason.

Janet

I'm trying, though wish I could be the voice of reason with other issues.

[Lenie]

After reading about this color coding system I have some serious doubts about my own parenting ability.  WOW, I'm LAZY.

I think that expecting perfect behavior out of a second grader every single day of the week is completely unrealistic.

Maybe I shouldn't be so laid back.  BREAD AND WATER TONIGHT! 

Justamama it really isn't as bad as it sounds. The teachers do not require perfect behavior. To me it seems more like the counting thing I did with my older kids when they were growing up. If I got to 3 they new they were getting punished. Red here is for a very bad day, kinda like the kid completely ignored the teacher SEVERAL times. That is why I could not understand about Sammi getting a red, she is growing up with 2 old people and very respectful.

[Wyks]

I remember getting little gold stars when we did well and that was it  But find it very interesting this system.  Wyks with the info you just gave with this card system, is it just for kids with learning problems, or the entire class?  I remember getting in trouble with bad grades in math.

It can be used either way, Rosie.  Some teachers don't want to single a child out using this card system, because for some kids, that would perhaps give the wrong kind of attention.  Those teachers might use the card program with the whole class, and with a positive reward approach.  It kind of works similiar to what you said about the gold stars (same as what was used back in my day too).  In fact, a parent can use gold stars, or something similiar, at home with a child who kept/earned back a green card for the day. 

There are so many great ways to use these color cards, both at school and at home.  All to help a child in whatever his/her goals are. 

[sebastian]

Maybe she wanted the daily updates on Kyron because she thought there might be something wrong with Kyron (attention disorder) and, as a teacher herself, she knew the best way to try to figure out if he needed special attention was to get the daily reports to see what was going on and to ensure that the teachers were giving him attention.

The thing about the inheritance was odd to me, too.

I might believe this about the request of the teacher except she also wanted Kyron disciplined when he didn't have a green card. Why would you discipline him instead of assist him. That doesn't show caring to me. It shows the behavior of a mean witch. JMO

Guess I am a witch as well.

I am a witch too Tracy! I have seen the results of the children that have been raised by enabling parents and it is not pretty. It is easy to be permissive with your children but very hard to teach them right from wrong. It is a lot of work to raise your children to be honest, hard working, law-abiding citizens and in this day and time, I don't see too many parents who want to put out the effort. Having said this, I do not believe in physical punishment. I think if you bully a child, you will end up with a child who is a bully.

[Justamama]

oh my, Pica is a terrible thing, we had a family member with this. May I please ask, is this card system used with all children, or with children with learning problems? The reason I ask is, did Kyron have learning problems?
[/quote]

In our school it is an every child thing. Sammi does not have any "learning" problems, only the behavioral problems. The anxiety issue causes her to not do well on time test though. Thank God she is almost out of the Pica. She had what the dr.s called a mild case. But she has eaten everything from change to stuffing out of pillows! Still has some issues with it, but have found that chewing gum helps a lot.
[/quote]

I ACHE when I read this about your daughter.  I suffer from PTSD, Panic disorder and agoraphobia.  (Wait for my Lifetime for Women movie to come out about my life ahahahaha) and I know first hand the pain and suffering someone goes through when they have these anxiety disorders.  It seems to just depend on how it manifests itself.

WHAT is causing this much anxiety in her life and how can you help her?

[Scandi]

Jesus, Mary, and Joseph!  I have read comments about where are Kaine and Desiree and why aren't they talking.  Could it be because people are accusing them of trying to railroad Terri and control information about this case?  Damned if they do, damned if they don't!

I was thinking about why they have not come out to talk and I remembered that Desiree was dreading August to come around without Kyron being found because she had plans for them to go on vacation. We have seen Kaine, but not desiree and I really do feel she is just in so much pain she can't put two words together. My prayers go out to her, everyday I pray that God will wrap his arms around her and protect her heart.

Maybe she and Tony are on vacation.

[no rose colored glasses]

I think everyone needs to take a deep breath and a step back and consider things.

I know for myself I can read something and consider a middle stance, some people cannot do that and respond out of emotion. Funny because I think that is what Terri does, such as what Gypsy was saying. She has an overboard response to situations and circumstances from what we can gather from news reports and quotes anyway.

Truth be told, I don't care if it is Terri, Dede or a big purple bunny with green spots that took Kyron, I want him to be found and the person who did this to be arrested and held accountable for their bad behavior. hmm there I go again with that holding people accountable. I suppose that is how the world works? I wonder if Terri was ever held accountable for her bad behavior or bad choices? or CA was she or did her parents just jump in and protect her? I sort of think Terri was being strick because she saw her own flaws and didn't want that for her own children. I think in her own crazy, screwed up way, she did care about Kyron, as James said she treated him like her own child.

That is what I'm wondering, because Kyron wasn't doing the best in school, if she lost it? Hard to imagine that, but who knows? James did say she treated him like her own child. One thing that really surprised me, James saying that Kaine and Terri rarely fought. I don't recall the exact words, but found it interesting, I'm sure they fought like all couples but did it to where the kids didn't hear it.

[Puzzler]

  I come in peace...(gingerly stepping into the pond),

I just finished reading that whole article and then came on here and I must say it's truly fascinating to have read something and then read the different points of view on the same article.

What some report reading is not how I comprehended it at all.  Who's right?  I think everyone is.

When I read that article I see some truth but mostly I see a slant from ex-people in her life.  The interview with Eker's parents?  Come on...the mother states that Terri 'wanted our son'.  Sounds like some old farmhouse, golden child, bible thumping going on there.  Like, "Ohhhh that evil red headed woman come to da house to steeeel our Jimmy away!!!! She's eveeeel I say, !!"

The part about how Terri 'pushed' their son into adopting James nearly made me ill.  This man KNEW she had a child, THEY knew she had a child.  This was known going into the marriage and if the biological father couldn't support the child and this new family they made together was working I can sure see how the idea would be to adopt the boy, form a new family unit and move on from there.  But to me, to read it from the elder Ekerts you might think their sonny boy was just some hapless DUPE who was sucked in by this red headed siren with a CHILD, (gasp) from a previous relationship...How DARE she wear a WHITE wedding dress?


In the end here I don't think we all will ever agree and I don't know that we should.  I do know that I SINCERELY HOPE with all my might that NOTHING in my life ever happens so that people come to interview all my former 'friends' and neighbors and ex husbands!!  Good grief like that's not a biased view point from the get go.

Then, by their son "adopting" James, is the reason he's paying child support...and not because she "charmed" him.  It was a responsibility because James is his son.  Okay.

[Tracygirl]

Sorry, I have to disagree with the discipline thing.  I think what Terri wanted Kaine to do was excessive and not necessary.

Well I disagree with you completely. She was parenting Kyron.

Do you feel it is reasonable to expect perfect behavior in the classroom every day? There are 4 colors of cards. If my (or any other child) had perfect behavior every single day in the classroom, I would find that to be a little strange. We all want our children to be perfect, but if a child gets 29 greens and one card that is the step lower than a green, do we ground them for that (if so, then for how long)? My point is we all have varying parenting styles. There is usually more than one way to get from point A to point B; however, expecting perfection from a child can set up just as many issues as allowing chaos to rule IMO. I have no idea if Terri was too punitive or expected perfection from Kyron. If she wanted excessive consequences for any behavior that was one iota less than perfect, that could be an indicator of other issues. All I can reasonably discern from the article is that Kaine and Terri did not agree on the management of these cards nor on the potential consequences.

To punish a child on a daily basis based on a color card can be detrimental to a childs self-esteem.  After a while the poor kid will question if they can ever do anything right.  

She was in the process (step by step) of getting rid of Kyron one way or another.  The purpose of these steps would lead
to commit Kyron to an institutional facility for Autism.  I would bet my stuffed animals she had that up her sleeve. IMO.

oh my...

  Tracygirl, my theory may sound a bit imaginative, but look at SM, she is cunning.  She had plans for the child. IMO

Well they just don't institutionalize children with autism now a days. It just took me by surprise thats all.   

[no rose colored glasses]

I remember getting little gold stars when we did well and that was it  But find it very interesting this system.  Wyks with the info you just gave with this card system, is it just for kids with learning problems, or the entire class?  I remember getting in trouble with bad grades in math.

It can be used either way, Rosie.  Some teachers don't want to single a child out using this card system, because for some kids, that would perhaps give the wrong kind of attention.  Those teachers might use the card program with the whole class, and with a positive reward approach.  It kind of works similiar to what you said about the gold stars (same as what was used back in my day too).  In fact, a parent can use gold stars, or something similiar, at home with a child who kept/earned back a green card for the day. 

There are so many great ways to use these color cards, both at school and at home.  All to help a child in whatever his/her goals are. 

Thank-you, I suppose a teacher would want to use it with all the kids, it certainly would look bad if only being used with certain kids. Very interesting.

[Tracygirl]

After reading about this color coding system I have some serious doubts about my own parenting ability.  WOW, I'm LAZY.

I think that expecting perfect behavior out of a second grader every single day of the week is completely unrealistic.

Maybe I shouldn't be so laid back.  BREAD AND WATER TONIGHT! 

  this is going to be me with my lunch today.

[Justamama]

After reading about this color coding system I have some serious doubts about my own parenting ability.  WOW, I'm LAZY.

I think that expecting perfect behavior out of a second grader every single day of the week is completely unrealistic.

Maybe I shouldn't be so laid back.  BREAD AND WATER TONIGHT! 

Justamama it really isn't as bad as it sounds. The teachers do not require perfect behavior. To me it seems more like the counting thing I did with my older kids when they were growing up. If I got to 3 they new they were getting punished. Red here is for a very bad day, kinda like the kid completely ignored the teacher SEVERAL times. That is why I could not understand about Sammi getting a red, she is growing up with 2 old people and very respectful.

Hey I STILL count!  I swear even the dogs know when I'm getting to "3"!! 

When I first read about this system I thought it was actually a pretty good idea.  I wouldn't want to be a teacher for anything.  But that's for another thread.

[txlisa]

My son has a folder and his teacher writes his positives and negatives.  If he has more negatives than positives, we sit down and discuss why and what he should do to improve.  I just think making a child go to his room on a nearly daily basis doesn't teach the child anything.

[Tamikosmom]

Do you suppose that because Kyron wasn't doing as well as he should have been in school that Terri lost it? James was sent away, and wasn't doing well in school, and maybe Terri wanted better kids? Just throwing this out there.

I don't know but it seems she wanted him punished harsher than Kaine did.  She's the step-parent and Kaine should have had the final say in that matter.

Then why didn't Kaine advocate on behalf of his son ... his son's emotional well-being.

I give Kaine and Desiree credit ... if they believed Kyron's emotion well-being was at risk under the care of Terri ... they would have reacted accordingly.  Anything less would imply parental neglect.  No passes.

Janet

++++++

Kaine Horman: "Terri was a good person when we first met"
Posted on July 16, 2010 at 12:12 PM
Updated today at 1:56 PM

In his response to questions from KGW, Kaine acknowledged that people have commented about 'how could he marry a woman like this' and how could he 'not see this coming.'

In response, he wrote: "Terri was a good person when we first met and for several years (I’d say up until 2008). She was always about children (teaching) and helping them grow and develop. Her attitude was always about those types of things first, her own self not even being a priority close to that. I believe that this is the Terri that everyone else saw and got to know as I did."

"Honestly everyone, including myself, that knew her or knows her did not see this coming. She was not the type of person we are seeing right now," added Kaine Horman.

"There were some signs of emotional distress here and there over the past year and a half but not enough of that directed at any one person to conclude she would be capable of anything even remotely close to events of the severity we have all seen."

http://www.kgw.com/news/Kaine-Horman-Terri-was-a-good-person-when-we-first-met-98620944.html

[Lenie]

oh my, Pica is a terrible thing, we had a family member with this. May I please ask, is this card system used with all children, or with children with learning problems? The reason I ask is, did Kyron have learning problems?

In our school it is an every child thing. Sammi does not have any "learning" problems, only the behavioral problems. The anxiety issue causes her to not do well on time test though. Thank God she is almost out of the Pica. She had what the dr.s called a mild case. But she has eaten everything from change to stuffing out of pillows! Still has some issues with it, but have found that chewing gum helps a lot.
[/quote]


The first 3 years of her life Sammi lived in a home that was horrendous in every sense of the word. Not food to eat, usually bread or chips, not bath time usually filth and  grime, no cuddle time usually left in the car seat until she got too big for it time. I could go on and on and on but.... She is getting much much better. We have had her for almost 7 years. Her anxiety issues are pretty good now also. Certain things trigger them. Especially if she gets to thinking about things in the past.

Can't wait to see the movie!
I ACHE when I read this about your daughter.  I suffer from PTSD, Panic disorder and agoraphobia.  (Wait for my Lifetime for Women movie to come out about my life ahahahaha) and I know first hand the pain and suffering someone goes through when they have these anxiety disorders.  It seems to just depend on how it manifests itself.

WHAT is causing this much anxiety in her life and how can you help her?
[/quote]

[Tamikosmom]

 

Later, Janet
12:10 PM PT

[Justamama]

Two things;

1).  Anyone else read anywhere with any credibility that Desiree is on a houseboat somewhere?

2).  Anyone believe that when fall comes and school goes back into session there is a teeny tiny chance that someone will discover Kyron's body in a place no one thought to look?