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Author Topic: Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND, OR #22 8/19/10 - 8/21/10  (Read 221842 times)
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« Reply #760 on: August 21, 2010, 07:01:28 AM »

You guys have been moving so fast I cannot catch up.  I have not heard or seen this anywhere else and I am sorry if it has been discussed, but on NG they said that they were digging in the gardens today where DeDe worked....has there been anything more on that????

WOW, no I didn't hear that or read that anywhere. 

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1008/20/ng.01.html

GRACE: And breaking tonight, live, rural Oregon. Stepmommy walks a 7-year-old boy down the hall of his elementary school. He`s never seen again. Police insist that stepmommy take a second poly. In a stunning twist, 7-year-old Kyron`s dad files for divorce in secret. The court slams stepmommy Terri Horman with an emergency order to stay away from her own children. Bio mom pleads for stepmommy Horman to please, please help police.

In another bizarre twist, we learn stepmommy tries to hire a hit man to murder Kyron`s father, her husband, and carries on a torrid sex affair after Kyron goes missing, even sending X-rated photos to the lover.

Breaking tonight. Police try their best to ID an accomplice spotted in stepmommy`s truck the day Kyron goes missing and now investigating a third accomplice. We learn stepmommy so concerned about police tapping her home, she goes out in the yard to talk, even has friends use disposable cell phones. If she`s so innocent, what`s there to hide?

Now her friends refuse lie detector tests. And also, somebody tell me where does stepmommy Terri Horman get nearly a half a million dollars cash? How -- how -- does a 7-year-old boy go missing from his own elementary school classroom?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kyron`s disappearance involves criminal behavior.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators have focused intently on Kyron`s stepmother, Terri Horman.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... Dede Spicher...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Dede Spicher is a very close friend of Terri Horman.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She`s become a new focus of the Kyron investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... Dede Spicher...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) developments, the woman the Hormans say refuses to cooperate with the search for their son, Kyron...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... that mother`s friend...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dede Spicher, one of Kyron`s stepmom`s friends, was gardening the day Kyron vanished.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s obviously very suspicious.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... significant process...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) opinion, I hope Terri Horman is arrested. And her friends that are involved, they need to speak up.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We love you, Kyron.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you know if Terri is hiding something? Were you with her on June 4th?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The key date is June 4th.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Never give up hope! We are all coming to get you to bring you home.



(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Terri, do you know where Kyron is?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Terri Horman has been under intense scrutiny since Kyron disappeared.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Can you please tell the world something?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A new lead prompts a massive search.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Authorities handed out flyers here with Dede Spicher`s picture on it and Terri Horman`s picture on it.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Stepmom and her friend unaccounted for for several key hours that fateful day.

KAINE HORMAN, FATHER OF MISSING 7-YR-OLD BOY, KYRON HORMAN: We don`t know where he is. And we need to keep looking.

DESIREE YOUNG, MOTHER OF MISSING 7-YR-OLD BOY, KYRON HORMAN: I don`t know that I`m getting through it. I know that I just -- I`m trying to take it each day at a time.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: A witness claims Terri displayed some odd behavior during an encounter the day Kyron went missing.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Holes in Terri Horman`s timeline.

HORMAN: Come forward. Bring it forward. It may be uncomfortable.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: They believe that Terri Horman has these answers.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The parents believe that perhaps Terri might be stashing the boy. The father thinks that perhaps she`s executing a plot.

HORMAN: Put yourself in his shoes for two minutes. Makes you really emotional, I mean. He`s afraid.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HOST: You know I don`t understand it. Out to you, Ellie Jostad. The mom is so worried police are tapping her home, that she goes out into the yard to have conversations with stepmom?

If she`s innocent what does she care if police hear her talking about what she`s cooking for dinner or what time she has to go to work or whatever? Who cares?

ELLIE JOSTAD, NANCY GRACE CHIEF EDITORIAL PRODUCER: Well, this is coming from Dede Spicher. Now that`s the friend of the stepmom`s. She`s the woman who`s on that flyer with the stepmom Terri Horman that they were passing out to residents saying, did you see these two women that morning?

Now Spicher says that she stayed with Terri Horman, the stepmom, for 11 days and she says that whenever they wanted to talk about something they would go out into the yard because they assumed that they were being surveilled.

GRACE: To CW Jensen, retired Portland police captain. You know, CW, I don`t buy it. Who, if they don`t have anything to hide, gets their friends to all buy disposable cell phones like terrorists and drug dealers use?

And who goes out in the front yard to talk? I don`t buy it. And now we`ve got these text messages. I`ve got them right here in my hands where she`s writing her alleged lover, who becomes her lover right after the little boy goes missing -- you can see where her head was.

That she paid her lawyer 350 grand -- $350,000. Now where did she get nearly $500,000, CW Jensen?

CW JENSEN, RETIRED PORTLAND POLICE CAPTAIN: Well, what most people believe is that her parents, who were involved in the educational system in a town in southern Oregon, have some money.

Generally, I would assume that when people are in this kind of a situation, they go to friends. They go to relatives. And I believe that probably the parents are giving her some money.

Does she need all $350,000 right now? Probably not but she needs a lot to keep this thing going. And why do you go outside to talk to people? It`s because you`re guilty.

GRACE: You know, the other thing, now we learn that the best friend Dede Spicher refuses to take a polygraph.

Why, Jensen? Why? Even if I was afraid I`d flunk it because I was nervous and whatever -- although we know that everybody is nervous when you take a polygraph, everybody. Even if you`re telling the truth. That does not affect a polygraph just being nervous.

She refuses a polygraph. Why?

JENSEN: I`m sure that her attorney has told her don`t cooperate with the police in that kind of a thing. Don`t take a polygraph. It`s just going to make you look that much worse.

So she has an attorney. She knows that they`re looking at her. Everybody in the community knows.

GRACE: Why would a polygraph make her look that much worse, CW? I don`t agree. I mean, yes, you`re saying that`s what the lawyer said. But to me your willingness to take a polygraph would show you have nothing to hide.

JENSEN: Well, I think that if people have nothing to hide, in my experience as an investigator, they take polygraphs. There`s one reason why you don`t want to take it. It`s because you think you`re going to look bad.

GRACE: Out to the lines. Adrian in Illinois, hi, Adrian.

ADRIAN, CALLER FROM ILLINOIS: Hi, Nancy. How are you doing?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

ADRIAN: Well, for one, I`m sorry to hear about your foot.

GRACE: Thank you.

ADRIAN: And I was wondering. You know, I think Terri, for one, is as guilty as hell. And second of all, I don`t understand why -- what makes someone -- for one -- put out a contract on her husband and then all of a sudden his child is missing and she`s the last one to see him?

If she`s that unhappy, why not just get out of it? I mean I`ve never seen that woman once show a bit of emotion about anything.

GRACE: Jean Casarez, legal correspondent, "In Session," how many times have you and I seen women and men, as opposed to getting a divorce, they commit murder?

JEAN CASAREZ, LEGAL CORRESPONDENT, "IN SESSION": That`s right. And when you talk about motive, you know, some e-mails have come out. She had a son, an older son that went to live with her parents a few months before.

E-mails have come out saying that he was doing so much better when he wasn`t in the presence of Kyron.

GRACE: Now I don`t understand that. What does that mean, Dr. Bethany?

BETHANY MARSHALL, PSYCHOANALYST, AUTHOR OF "DEALBREAKERS": I don`t quite understand that one, to be quite honest with you. But to go to the caller`s question I think that Terri may have had, like, a borderline personality disorder which causes extreme --

GRACE: There you go again.

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: You say that every -- you know, do you think everybody out there has a personality disorder?

MARSHALL: Well, most --

GRACE: Do you think you have a personality disorder? I mean because every time I ask you something you say they`ve got a borderline personality disorder.

MARSHALL: Well, Nancy, something is really wrong with someone who puts a hit -- tries to get a hit-man to kill her husband and then does away with her child but -- because with borderline there is such extreme ragefulness and there`s lack of a conscience and at the slightest insult they really want to do away with people.

There is a callousness and a coldness. And that`s why I think about borderline.

GRACE: You know, very quickly, Marc Klaas, what do you make of it? This is your expertise?

MARC KLAAS, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, KLAASKIDS FOUNDATION: Well, I don`t believe that there`s a grand conspiracy afoot here at all. I don`t believe that Terri was working with other people to get rid of Kyron.

That would make sense if there was possibly some kind of a ransom demand. But I think that this was something much more nefarious and much more sinister than that and as such I believe that possibly she was working with one other person, certainly no more than that in whatever it is that she did after 8:45 that morning. On June 4th.

GRACE: Speaking of the timeline. Ellie Jostad, our chief editorial producer, I understand the timeline has been narrowed. Explain.

JOSTAD: That`s right. It`s actually been narrowed down to between 10:15 and 11:30. That`s the period of time that both Dede Spicher and Terri Horman cannot be accounted for.

Now we know a little bit later Terri Horman went in and checked in at her gym at 11:39. We also know Dede Spicher was apparently seen back on her job gardening at 1:00 but there`s this little window where they can`t figure out where either of them were.

GRACE: OK. We are taking your calls. Very quickly, Sheryl McCollum, what do you make of this?

SHERYL MCCOLLUM, CRIME ANALYST, DIR. OF COLD CASE SQUAD AT PINE LAKE P.D.: Nancy, the problem with this case is it`s revenge. She attempted to have the husband murdered. She was sexting his best friend from high school. She attempted to do something with Kyron, kidnapping at the very least.

And then she tried to get the other daughter from day care. She is going after this husband in every way that she can. It is revengeful. There`s never going to be a ransom note. It`s not about money. Ever.

GRACE: And still no sign of little Kyron.

Tonight, the latest developments in the search for 7-year-old Kyron. We learn step-mommy is so afraid police are listening she goes outside in the front yard to have conversations, asking her friends to use portable disposable cell phones.

Quick break. Happy birthday to Georgia friend, defense lawyer Peter Odom.

Happy birthday to Hardwick Butler, a local Boy Scout leader for years.

Happy birthday, Mr. Butler.

Tonight I want to tell you about a little 4-year-old Florida boy Ayden in the fight of a lifetime battling spinal cancer. Doctors able to remove out 30 percent of the tumor. Ayden has no feeling in the right leg. Requires physical therapy, proton therapy, chemotherapy.

Tonight his family needs help. Take a look at this precious boy. For info and to donate go to Cure4ayden.com.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

YOUNG: My theory is that Kyron is alive.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Terri Horman has been the subject of a lot of speculation.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Holes in Terri Horman`s timeline.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Searchers return to wooded areas and open fields several miles south of Skyline School.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The area is where Dede Spicher, one of Kyron`s stepmom`s friends, was gardening the day Kyron
vanished.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s obviously very suspicious.

HORMAN: A minute away was awful enough. To be this far along and have him not home is terrible.

YOUNG: Someone`s holding him.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: No criminal charges have been filed. No suspects have been named.

YOUNG: I just have a feeling that somebody`s holding him.

HORMAN: I wish there were a lot of things that were different so that I could take on the burden that he`s going through right now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kyron`s disappearance involves criminal behavior.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Investigators have focused intently on the stepmother Terri Horman.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Dede Spicher.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Dede Spicher is a very close friend of Terri Horman.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: She`s become a new focus of the Kyron investigation.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Dede Spicher.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Significant developments.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The woman the Hormans say refuses to cooperate with the search for their son Kyron.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stepmother`s friend.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Dede Spicher, one of Kyron`s stepmom`s friends, was gardening the day Kyron vanished.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s obviously very suspicious.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Significant progress.

YOUNG: In my opinion I hope Terri Horman is arrested and her friends that are involved, they need to speak up.

We love you, Kyron.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Do you know if Terri is hiding something? Were you with her on June 4th?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: The key date is June 4th.

YOUNG: Never give up hope. We are all coming to get you to bring you home.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We are taking your calls. Out to Holly in Georgia. Hi, Holly.

HOLLY, CALLER FROM GEORGIA: Hi, Nancy. I watch you every night and I love your book.

GRACE: Thank you. Thank you.

HOLLY: You`re welcome. I`m just wondering if they found Kyron`s body, what condition would it be in at this point?

GRACE: To Dr. Michael Arnall, board-certified forensic pathologist out of Denver? What about it, Doctor?

DR. MICHAEL ARNALL, BOARD CERTIFIED FORENSIC PATHOLOGIST: After this period of time if the body has been exposed to the air, there may be significant decomposition even animal predation. But if a body is buried you might be surprised at how well the body has been preserved.

GRACE: Hmm. If the body is buried. Why is that, Doctor?

ARNALL: When the body is buried, it`s in an environment where insects may not be able to get to it and animals may not be able to get to it. Now it will slowly be degraded by bacteria, but without animal predation and insects, the body may be preserved.

GRACE: It`s so hard to look at this little boy with his thick little glasses and imagine that he is buried somewhere.

What about if he`s in water, Dr. Arnall?

ARNALL: If he`s in water, in a summer environment, then there`s going to be insects in the water. There`s going to be predation by invertebrates and there could be extensive degradation of the tissue.

GRACE: To Jean Casarez, legal correspondent, "In Session," you said something earlier that to me just hat ran a chill down my spine. You said that the stepmother says that her husband Kaine Horman is so much worse when he is around little Kyron.

How can you be worse when you`re around your child? I don`t understand that.

CASAREZ: Well, I think what she was saying was that her older son was getting D`s in school but when he went to live with his grandparents that he started getting A`s because he wasn`t around Kyron, the little boy, Kyron. So they had problems.

GRACE: Oh, I see. I understand now. I got it.

Marc Klaas, try to put the pieces together.

KLAAS: Well, I believe that Terri is absolutely involved in this. Her timeline has never made any kind of sense.

I do not for a minute believe that there is a grand conspiracy, that maybe she was working with one other person. That`s a possibility.

I believe that the little boy is not alive, but I understand why the parents say that he is alive. They really have no alternative but to do that. They have to keep hope alive. And I think that this case may go unsolved unless Terri breaks.

GRACE: To CW Jensen. Now we understand cops have been digging in a garden for Kyron`s body. Where is the garden and why digging there?

JENSEN: This is significant. Dede Spicher was gardening at an estate on June 4th and then she disappeared for a period of time. So they went to that estate and they`ve done some significant searches there, I think, to look not only for the possibility of Kyron but the possibility that other evidence might have been buried by Dede Spicher.


And one thing that I think everybody needs to realize is we focus on Dede Spicher disappeared for a period of time. Terri Horman disappeared for a period of time. But remember so did Kyron Horman and only two of those people have ever shown up again.

GRACE: You know, they`ve also searched other locations that relate to the best friend Dede Spicher, CW Jensen. Where?

JENSEN: They didn`t search her home and seized evidence there. What they`ve done is they`ve tried to figure out where these women went and on the best kind of guess they can, go to those areas and search.

I think that we`ll probably see more searches in the future as they continue with this case. We may be in a period of time where we won`t hear a lot. But believe me, the investigators are working very, very hard to find this little boy and to solve this case.

GRACE: Ellie Jostad, didn`t they also search Dede Spicher`s mom`s condo or something like that?

JOSTAD: Yes, it was actually her aunt`s home, Nancy.

GRACE: Yes.

JOSTAD: Reportedly that was one of the other locations that they checked because Dede Spicher had lived there for some time.

GRACE: OK. What about the divorce? What are we learning from the divorce filings and statements related to the divorce?

JOSTAD: Well, Nancy, Kaine Horman wants this divorce to go forward but Terri Horman is asking for it to be stayed. She says because of all the negative attention, all the negative media reports that she can`t possibly -- that her lawyer can`t handle the divorce case right now.

GRACE: Why? What`s her reasoning?

JOSTAD: Well, I guess what they`re trying to say is that they think this should be stayed or put in abatement until after the criminal case is settled. But Kaine Horman`s lawyers are saying we don`t know when the criminal aspects of this case are ever going to be resolved so we need to go through with the divorce case now.

GRACE: Well, Renee Rockwell, Alex Sanchez, it`s not like she`s named a defendant or a suspect. She has no Fifth Amendment immunity so why can`t the divorce go forward, Rockwell?

RENEE ROCKWELL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, because they`re going to want to depose her and start asking her questions. She has a lawyer to the tune of $350,000 so I`m sure he`s giving her some very good advice that they don`t need --

GRACE: Right.

ROCKWELL: -- to put her in any kind of witness position.

GRACE: OK. Sanchez?

ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes. She doesn`t want to get on the witness stand and stop making statements.

GRACE: OK.

SANCHEZ: Which the police could use to implicate her in these offenses. It`s as simple as that.

GRACE: I don`t think they need a whole lot of help.

Out to the lines. Linda, Missouri, hi, dear.

LINDA, CALLER FROM MISSOURI: I was calling to see if they actually sent the dogs out to track if there was --

GRACE: Mm-hmm. What about it, Jean Casarez?

CASAREZ: Dogs everywhere. And in that garden area where the garden party was going to be the next day, they`ve gone neighborhood to neighborhood, resident to resident with pictures of Terri and Dede asking them if they saw them or the truck.




Klaas, Thank-you. I missed a good show.  Why an unidentified reporter?  I need to search for the Video-NG Aug.20,2010.
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Bearlyhere
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« Reply #761 on: August 21, 2010, 07:20:43 AM »





Time for a station break.  Please put your seats in a forward position.

If there is a problem with any monkey you feel is bullying you for making a post or having an opinion that is different than your own, please hit the "Report to Moderator" button.  The offending Monkey will then be rocketed into oblivion or, if the complaint is warranted, be dealt with accordingly.  The choice depends solely on the mood of the Moderator/Administrator at the time.

We have a thread called 'Monkey Musings' where you can talk about anything OT you like.  We also have a thread called 'JSM Asking for the Ban Button Thread'.  This thread belongs to all of the Monkeys, the only reason JSM's name was on it because she was OT a lot and always saying, 'I hope I don't get the ban button for this.' 

These threads are for any and all monkeys to use.  Neither of these threads is a place to trash other Monkeys.  This will not be tolerated EVER.

As you were, Monkey citizens!

 salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut salut



People are entitled to their opinion, just as you are entitled to yours.  There is no Kaine's side, Terri's side, Desiree's side, or LE's side in this cage, we are all on Kyron's side.  Please respect the rights of others to have opinions.

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« Reply #762 on: August 21, 2010, 07:31:27 AM »

"That makes Desiree a liar then.  Hmmmm......"




No it doesn't.

The fact that they don't agree about their status during that time just shows how estranged they were. They couldn't communicate clearly about what their intentions were during that time. Obviously Kaine thought he was just living with Desiree to support her during the
pregnancy, and she apparently was hoping for more. They were in the middle of a divorce, after all, and I doubt Kyron was a planned baby. The fact that Kaine sees things differently than she does just means that they were each in a different place. He obviously had accepted that the end of their marriage had already taken place, and she was not that far along. Plus, being pregnant just makes the end of a marriage harder to take.

 

I think it is a huge thing.  How the heck can someone not know if you are in a marriage or not?  Desiree's statement and Kaine's statement are mutually exclusive.

 

He either cheated or he didn't cheat.  Was he married or wasn't he married.  Is she a little bit pregnant and he is a little bit married?





They were already divorcing, and he would've been gone if DY hadn't discovered she was pregnant. It's a different situation, because they were already calling it quits.  He said straight out that it was his understanding that the marriage was over, and he made a point of correcting her more than once.
It's obvious that they were estranged.

Since he denies having an affair, it's not exactly a done deal that he had one. There are always two sides to a divorce.


Can you give me a link to that?  Thank you.

If Kaine was married and he was sleeping with Terri, he was having an affair.  His lawyer should have told him to lay low until the divorce was final.  He was laying in dung and does not smell like a rose in this, no matter how much Febreze anyone puts on it.

If he was divorced, he was not having an affair, if he was married, he was.  There is no escape clause on a marriage certificate.


You're a wise 'ole bear, Bearly.  (not to be confused with old)
That really sums that argument up nice and tight.  I hope that puts a cork in 'er it.



Actually..it doesn't. and I have a right to debate the issue as much as anyone else on this forum. Those that disagree do not own SM, and I am not going to be run off.

The level of immaturity and personal jabs shown here is really disappointing.


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« Reply #763 on: August 21, 2010, 07:55:48 AM »



http://www.justia.com/family/divorce/docs/ending-a-marriage-faq.html

A legal separation does not end the marriage and both spouses are prohibited from remarrying or entering into a domestic partnership with another person.



You are misunderstanding their status. A legal separation is just that. A separation with no filing of divorce. This what the Gores have done. It's not a filing for the dissolution of a marriage.

When a divorce is filed, that means the marriage is over and both parties can move on after the filing date. Kaine and Desiree were divorcing, but then she discovered the pregnancy. That is a different legal status.

I have no doubt that if he'd left as he originally intended, people would rip him apart for that too.

As for the pregnancy....I do not for one minute believe they were planning a baby in the midst of their marital turmoil. But they did seem happy to have him once he was here.

Both of them love Kyron,and they have worked together to raise him. Not just Desiree...Kaine too. They both seem like nice, decent, hardworking people. And I bet Kyron would hate to see his daddy constantly trashed on the internet.

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« Reply #764 on: August 21, 2010, 08:05:00 AM »



http://www.justia.com/family/divorce/docs/ending-a-marriage-faq.html

A legal separation does not end the marriage and both spouses are prohibited from remarrying or entering into a domestic partnership with another person.



You are misunderstanding their status. A legal separation is just that. A separation with no filing of divorce. This what the Gores have done. It's not a filing for the dissolution of a marriage.

When a divorce is filed, that means the marriage is over and both parties can move on after the filing date. Kaine and Desiree were divorcing, but then she discovered the pregnancy. That is a different legal status.

I have no doubt that if he'd left as he originally intended, people would rip him apart for that too.

As for the pregnancy....I do not for one minute believe they were planning a baby in the midst of their marital turmoil. But they did seem happy to have him once he was here.

Both of them love Kyron,and they have worked together to raise him. Not just Desiree...Kaine too. They both seem like nice, decent, hardworking people. And I bet Kyron would hate to see his daddy constantly trashed on the internet.



I just want to know where is the link for all of this.

No one is trying to run you off.

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« Reply #765 on: August 21, 2010, 08:07:38 AM »



http://www.justia.com/family/divorce/docs/ending-a-marriage-faq.html

A legal separation does not end the marriage and both spouses are prohibited from remarrying or entering into a domestic partnership with another person.



You are misunderstanding their status. A legal separation is just that. A separation with no filing of divorce. This what the Gores have done. It's not a filing for the dissolution of a marriage.

When a divorce is filed, that means the marriage is over and both parties can move on after the filing date. Kaine and Desiree were divorcing, but then she discovered the pregnancy. That is a different legal status.

I have no doubt that if he'd left as he originally intended, people would rip him apart for that too.

As for the pregnancy....I do not for one minute believe they were planning a baby in the midst of their marital turmoil. But they did seem happy to have him once he was here.

Both of them love Kyron,and they have worked together to raise him. Not just Desiree...Kaine too. They both seem like nice, decent, hardworking people. And I bet Kyron would hate to see his daddy constantly trashed on the internet.



I have to disagree.  I believe it is when a divorce is granted, not just filed for.  When did Kaine and Desiree file for divorce?  I am merely looking for a link.  Please.

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« Reply #766 on: August 21, 2010, 08:10:31 AM »



http://www.justia.com/family/divorce/docs/ending-a-marriage-faq.html

A legal separation does not end the marriage and both spouses are prohibited from remarrying or entering into a domestic partnership with another person.



You are misunderstanding their status. A legal separation is just that. A separation with no filing of divorce. This what the Gores have done. It's not a filing for the dissolution of a marriage.

When a divorce is filed, that means the marriage is over and both parties can move on after the filing date. Kaine and Desiree were divorcing, but then she discovered the pregnancy. That is a different legal status.

I have no doubt that if he'd left as he originally intended, people would rip him apart for that too.

As for the pregnancy....I do not for one minute believe they were planning a baby in the midst of their marital turmoil. But they did seem happy to have him once he was here.

Both of them love Kyron,and they have worked together to raise him. Not just Desiree...Kaine too. They both seem like nice, decent, hardworking people. And I bet Kyron would hate to see his daddy constantly trashed on the internet.



I don't profess to know what Kyron is thinking.  I would like to see the truth, whatever that may be. 

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« Reply #767 on: August 21, 2010, 08:25:55 AM »

More than 300 trees in Portland's Forest Park will be cut down along fuel pipeline
Published: Friday, August 20, 2010, 8:00 PM     Updated: Friday, August 20, 2010, 8:12 PM


A Houston-based oil company will cut down 313 trees in Forest Park  next month to make the area around a gas and diesel fuel pipeline that runs through the park more visible to company inspectors.

Kinder Morgan Energy Partners is set to begin removing trees on a 1.7-mile stretch Sept. 13 in what is expected to be a monthlong project. Company spokesman Larry Hosler said removing the trees is necessary because the growth has become dense and has made it impossible for officials to do federally mandated inspections from helicopters.


So there will be people working in Forest Park in September.  This could be good or bad depending on how we look at it. 

I wonder if this will be anywhere close to Skyline neighborhood.

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« Reply #768 on: August 21, 2010, 08:36:09 AM »

More than 300 trees in Portland's Forest Park will be cut down along fuel pipeline
Published: Friday, August 20, 2010, 8:00 PM     Updated: Friday, August 20, 2010, 8:12 PM


A Houston-based oil company will cut down 313 trees in Forest Park  next month to make the area around a gas and diesel fuel pipeline that runs through the park more visible to company inspectors.

Kinder Morgan Energy Partners is set to begin removing trees on a 1.7-mile stretch Sept. 13 in what is expected to be a monthlong project. Company spokesman Larry Hosler said removing the trees is necessary because the growth has become dense and has made it impossible for officials to do federally mandated inspections from helicopters.


So there will be people working in Forest Park in September.  This could be good or bad depending on how we look at it. 

I wonder if this will be anywhere close to Skyline neighborhood.



It is so lush there, it is hard to see anything.

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« Reply #769 on: August 21, 2010, 08:36:55 AM »

"That makes Desiree a liar then.  Hmmmm......"




No it doesn't.

The fact that they don't agree about their status during that time just shows how estranged they were. They couldn't communicate clearly about what their intentions were during that time. Obviously Kaine thought he was just living with Desiree to support her during the
pregnancy, and she apparently was hoping for more. They were in the middle of a divorce, after all, and I doubt Kyron was a planned baby. The fact that Kaine sees things differently than she does just means that they were each in a different place. He obviously had accepted that the end of their marriage had already taken place, and she was not that far along. Plus, being pregnant just makes the end of a marriage harder to take.
Well, if it was the end of the marriage, and she was not that far along, he still liked her enough to have sex with her, planned pregnancy or not.  They were definitely "in a different place", he was in Terri's pants and she wasn't. 

Wait, where does it say they were sleeping together?



July 27, 2010 at 1:32 PM

MEDFORD, Ore. -- An in-depth interview with NBC’s Dateline, Kyron Horman’s mother blamed Terri Horman for the breakup of her marriage with Kyron’s father back in 2002.

Desiree said she was eight months pregnant with Kyron when she learned that Kaine was having an affair with Terri and it tore her apart.

"I cried solid for two months and didn't leave the bedroom because I didn't understand why she somehow equated to something that was better than me and my son,” Desiree said.

< snipped >

http://www.kgw.com/news/Kyrons-mom--99345859.html



I wonder why it says she blamed Terri.  I would blame my husband, first. 

I have a good friend who found out about her husband's affairs one at a time.  She always went to meet the woman and they always told the same story, he said you were getting a divorce, he said you were living separate lives, etc.  Kaine tells the story that way.  (I am not exonerating Terri).  Kaine is the one who tells the story about separate lives, could be Terri bought into it.  There is plenty of blame to go around. 



In my book, Kaine is the more guilty of the two. He made vows no Terri. While Terri should have known better, at the end of the day, Kaine should bear the bulk of the responsibility.
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« Reply #770 on: August 21, 2010, 08:47:51 AM »



http://www.justia.com/family/divorce/docs/ending-a-marriage-faq.html

A legal separation does not end the marriage and both spouses are prohibited from remarrying or entering into a domestic partnership with another person.



You are misunderstanding their status. A legal separation is just that. A separation with no filing of divorce. This what the Gores have done. It's not a filing for the dissolution of a marriage.

When a divorce is filed, that means the marriage is over and both parties can move on after the filing date. Kaine and Desiree were divorcing, but then she discovered the pregnancy. That is a different legal status.

I have no doubt that if he'd left as he originally intended, people would rip him apart for that too.

As for the pregnancy....I do not for one minute believe they were planning a baby in the midst of their marital turmoil. But they did seem happy to have him once he was here.

Both of them love Kyron,and they have worked together to raise him. Not just Desiree...Kaine too. They both seem like nice, decent, hardworking people. And I bet Kyron would hate to see his daddy constantly trashed on the internet.



I just want to know where is the link for all of this.

No one is trying to run you off.





You have the link to the separation issue yourself. And there are plenty of links referencing the status of Kaine and Desiree right here on this board. There is video from an interview where he corrects Desiree on a thread here on SM. I don't keep links, and I'm not going to dig them up.

There's this one that says Kaine has a different opinion on the status of their marriage. It was posted here earlier on this thread.



http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/terri_horman.html

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« Reply #771 on: August 21, 2010, 08:50:40 AM »



http://www.justia.com/family/divorce/docs/ending-a-marriage-faq.html

A legal separation does not end the marriage and both spouses are prohibited from remarrying or entering into a domestic partnership with another person.



You are misunderstanding their status. A legal separation is just that. A separation with no filing of divorce. This what the Gores have done. It's not a filing for the dissolution of a marriage.

When a divorce is filed, that means the marriage is over and both parties can move on after the filing date. Kaine and Desiree were divorcing, but then she discovered the pregnancy. That is a different legal status.

I have no doubt that if he'd left as he originally intended, people would rip him apart for that too.

As for the pregnancy....I do not for one minute believe they were planning a baby in the midst of their marital turmoil. But they did seem happy to have him once he was here.

Both of them love Kyron,and they have worked together to raise him. Not just Desiree...Kaine too. They both seem like nice, decent, hardworking people. And I bet Kyron would hate to see his daddy constantly trashed on the internet.



I have to disagree.  I believe it is when a divorce is granted, not just filed for.  When did Kaine and Desiree file for divorce?  I am merely looking for a link.  Please.




Nope. Once a divorce is filed the parties can date. They can't marry until the divorce is finalized, and for a specific time afterward unless they remarry each other.
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« Reply #772 on: August 21, 2010, 08:52:43 AM »

O/T
Reading back to catch up was rather disturbing; sorta uncomfortable. No wee hours posting for me! My hat's off to a brave monkey who has more backbone than I do and doesn't mind being a lone voice in the wilderness!     Don't get me wrong, I like all monks but I think I'm letting the frustrations about this case get to me a bit too much, so I'll try to stay in lurker mode for a bit.  Tiptoing out of the cage slowly to hang from rafters.
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« Reply #773 on: August 21, 2010, 08:57:04 AM »



http://www.justia.com/family/divorce/docs/ending-a-marriage-faq.html

A legal separation does not end the marriage and both spouses are prohibited from remarrying or entering into a domestic partnership with another person.



You are misunderstanding their status. A legal separation is just that. A separation with no filing of divorce. This what the Gores have done. It's not a filing for the dissolution of a marriage.

When a divorce is filed, that means the marriage is over and both parties can move on after the filing date. Kaine and Desiree were divorcing, but then she discovered the pregnancy. That is a different legal status.

I have no doubt that if he'd left as he originally intended, people would rip him apart for that too.

As for the pregnancy....I do not for one minute believe they were planning a baby in the midst of their marital turmoil. But they did seem happy to have him once he was here.

Both of them love Kyron,and they have worked together to raise him. Not just Desiree...Kaine too. They both seem like nice, decent, hardworking people. And I bet Kyron would hate to see his daddy constantly trashed on the internet.



I don't profess to know what Kyron is thinking.  I would like to see the truth, whatever that may be. 



I am not professing to know what he is thinking. I am saying that he would be hurt by it. Any child would be. That's just common sense.
 I have stated before that I hope none of the children involved are reading any of this stuff on the internet.
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« Reply #774 on: August 21, 2010, 09:04:45 AM »


We will bring you home, it is just a matter of time.  Hold tight sweet Kyron!
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« Reply #775 on: August 21, 2010, 09:14:37 AM »

Kaine Horman - married twice.  Desiree and Terri (children Kyron and Kiara)
Desiree Young - married 3 times.  To McCullough (son Quinn's), Kaine (son Kyron), and Tony Young
Terri Horman - married 3 times - to Ron Tarver (son James), Richard Ecker (legally adopted James) and to Kaine (daughter Kiara)

Pretty clear that at one time Desiree had some problems, maybe it was just medical, but she never could regain primary custody of either son.  She does have visitation with both Quinn and Kryon and appears to have her life in order.  Tony Young seems like a great guy.

So Richard Ecker legally adopts James (I find this odd that Ron Tarver would allow) but maybe it was just a matter of MONEY.  I wonder if Richard Ecker is still paying child support to Terri now that James is living with his bio dad Ron Tarver?  Both Ron Tarver and Richard Ecker have some not so nice things to say about Terri

From reports, Kaine and Desiree weren't getting along well when she found out she was pregnant.  They decided to try and work things out for the sake of the baby.  Evidentally, in Kaine's mind at least working it out didn't work.  Prior to Kyron being born it sounds like Kaine was getting "friendly" with Terri.  So Kaine moves out, Kyron is born, Desiree has primary custody and Kaine has regular visitations.  It is on the regular visitations that Terri helps out (so to speak) with Kyron. 

Sounds to me like Kaine and Desiree's marriage was over and they were simply trying to keep it together for the baby.  Not unusual and it didn't work.  Kaine should not have "fooled around" while still married to Desiree (if indeed he did).  After knowning what Terri did with the LS and with Michael Cook I don't put anything past her even back then with Kaine.


My point is posting this is that NONE of these people are perfect.  Many marriages fail and partners are unfaithful.  None of this answers WHERE KYRON IS, or why LE is concentrating on Terri and her friends.  I suspect it's because LE knows more than we do.

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« Reply #776 on: August 21, 2010, 09:15:59 AM »



You are right, Muffy, it is about Kyron.

 

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« Reply #777 on: August 21, 2010, 09:17:59 AM »

My ex must have thought we were divorcing the whole 12 years we were married. 
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« Reply #778 on: August 21, 2010, 09:21:52 AM »

Kaine Horman - married twice.  Desiree and Terri (children Kyron and Kiara)
Desiree Young - married 3 times.  To McCullough (son Quinn's), Kaine (son Kyron), and Tony Young
Terri Horman - married 3 times - to Ron Tarver (son James), Richard Ecker (legally adopted James) and to Kaine (daughter Kiara)

Pretty clear that at one time Desiree had some problems, maybe it was just medical, but she never could regain primary custody of either son.  She does have visitation with both Quinn and Kryon and appears to have her life in order.  Tony Young seems like a great guy.

So Richard Ecker legally adopts James (I find this odd that Ron Tarver would allow) but maybe it was just a matter of MONEY.  I wonder if Richard Ecker is still paying child support to Terri now that James is living with his bio dad Ron Tarver?  Both Ron Tarver and Richard Ecker have some not so nice things to say about Terri

From reports, Kaine and Desiree weren't getting along well when she found out she was pregnant.  They decided to try and work things out for the sake of the baby.  Evidentally, in Kaine's mind at least working it out didn't work.  Prior to Kyron being born it sounds like Kaine was getting "friendly" with Terri.  So Kaine moves out, Kyron is born, Desiree has primary custody and Kaine has regular visitations.  It is on the regular visitations that Terri helps out (so to speak) with Kyron. 

Sounds to me like Kaine and Desiree's marriage was over and they were simply trying to keep it together for the baby.  Not unusual and it didn't work.  Kaine should not have "fooled around" while still married to Desiree (if indeed he did).  After knowning what Terri did with the LS and with Michael Cook I don't put anything past her even back then with Kaine.


My point is posting this is that NONE of these people are perfect.  Many marriages fail and partners are unfaithful.  None of this answers WHERE KYRON IS, or why LE is concentrating on Terri and her friends.  I suspect it's because LE knows more than we do.



Good morning Monkey's,

Klaas, could you please tell us isJames allowed to visit SM and Grandparents? 

James said SM is lonely because she can't go out?  Thank-you


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« Reply #779 on: August 21, 2010, 09:31:30 AM »

"That makes Desiree a liar then.  Hmmmm......"




No it doesn't.

The fact that they don't agree about their status during that time just shows how estranged they were. They couldn't communicate clearly about what their intentions were during that time. Obviously Kaine thought he was just living with Desiree to support her during the
pregnancy, and she apparently was hoping for more. They were in the middle of a divorce, after all, and I doubt Kyron was a planned baby. The fact that Kaine sees things differently than she does just means that they were each in a different place. He obviously had accepted that the end of their marriage had already taken place, and she was not that far along. Plus, being pregnant just makes the end of a marriage harder to take.

I disagree. How do you know what was going on their house? You make your comments like you were there, at that time, in that household. It is just my opinion, but I have not heard anything negative posted about Desiree ANYWHERE. I am more inclined to believe her side of the story. Not only are you calling Desiree a liar, but you say that you doubt that Kyron was a planned baby? How would you know this? You are always pointing out how Hurtful people are, if Kyron comes home and reads this one day, you don't think that would be hurtful?


I am basing my opinion on what they both said. And I have seen negative things said about Desiree on this forum and others.
Saying that Desiree has a different perception than Kaine does not equal calling her a liar.
I don't care if you believe Desiree. That doesn't mean that I have to, or that I am not allowed to express my opinion without being attacked.
I am not the first one on the internet to mention that a divorcing couple does not plan a family. It's very obvious they didn't intend to stay together and do that. That has nothing to do with welcoming a baby, and being a good and loving parent, which they both are, as far as I can tell. No where did I say that Kyron was not a welcome surprise.

I am sick and tired of this constant bashing and baiting and twisting.
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