Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND, OR #24 8/25/10 -8/28/10

[Tolerance]

Has this been posted?
 the drawing creeped me out.
It is from 8-18   and w/ regard to a molester in Beaverton
http://beaverton.katu.com/content/did-you-see-man-around-beaverton-monday

[no rose colored glasses]

Justamama  I have odd feelings about Jason also, just can't exactly pinpoint and put it down in words. I really have to say that I'm not sure if that is his father who was arrested on child porn. Do we know that for sure?

I   don't know for sure.

I do know this, I am a survivor of abuse.  I also am an advocate of not accusing people of things unless I know the facts especially as it comes to allegations of sexual abuse because as any other survivor knows it is an act that happens when you are ALONE with that other person and often it becomes a matter of who is believable.

To wrongly accuse someone of this very horrible crime is to place someone in a position of great difficulty in defending themselves in a court of law.

That said, I didn't randomly choose Mr. Jason out of the crowd and start picking on him.  By his own admission he is an odd ball in that he's a single man with no children of his own and he has taken on the cloak of a child advocate in which he makes this issue VERY, VERY public in his own work as a fence builder.

If he wasn't connected to the situation with Kyron I would have written him off as an oddball long ago and moved on.  Actually I myself HAVE moved on but this subject with my post to him just keeps re-surfacing.

I don't know what to make of it or what to do with is.  I have apologized to him.

I apologized in a public way on here for all to read.

I personally think he's using my interaction with him on here as an excuse.

He posted ON AND ON  about how when Kyron comes home it will be a celebration like no other, that a GROUP of people conspired to take Kyron ect...ect...well these kinds of posts just BEG to be questioned.

*sigh.

  I cannot argue with anything you have said. I have a gut feeling on Jason, and I'm uncomfortable with him. And certainly if someone is being accused of such horrific deeds and they are not guilty, that makes me ill, and I am talking about anyone being accused. You have apologized to him, what more can you do? Nothing.

[sassifrass]

Justamama  I have odd feelings about Jason also, just can't exactly pinpoint and put it down in words. I really have to say that I'm not sure if that is his father who was arrested on child porn. Do we know that for sure?

I   don't know for sure.

I do know this, I am a survivor of abuse.  I also am an advocate of not accusing people of things unless I know the facts especially as it comes to allegations of sexual abuse because as any other survivor knows it is an act that happens when you are ALONE with that other person and often it becomes a matter of who is believable.

To wrongly accuse someone of this very horrible crime is to place someone in a position of great difficulty in defending themselves in a court of law.

That said, I didn't randomly choose Mr. Jason out of the crowd and start picking on him.  By his own admission he is an odd ball in that he's a single man with no children of his own and he has taken on the cloak of a child advocate in which he makes this issue VERY, VERY public in his own work as a fence builder.

If he wasn't connected to the situation with Kyron I would have written him off as an oddball long ago and moved on.  Actually I myself HAVE moved on but this subject with my post to him just keeps re-surfacing.

I don't know what to make of it or what to do with is.  I have apologized to him.

I apologized in a public way on here for all to read.

I personally think he's using my interaction with him on here as an excuse.

He posted ON AND ON  about how when Kyron comes home it will be a celebration like no other, that a GROUP of people conspired to take Kyron ect...ect...well these kinds of posts just BEG to be questioned.

*sigh.

I typically don't respond to these types of posts' because this thread is about Kyron. It's very easy for emotions to run high when a child is missing and we're at a standstill.

Justamama - I don't think there is any monkey here that doesn't respect you. You give a lot to this forum. I agree with you about the subject being rehashed when it should have ended. Hopefully this will end now. I think maybe you should take a nice bubble bath and a glass of wine and relax. It's got to be 5:00 somewhere! 

Now let's find Kyron! 

[Justamama]

I found out yesterday that my granddaughter who is 12 and lives in Florida has to walk the 1.7 miles to school everyday. She has to leave her home at about 6:15 to 6:30 every morning. She can not walk the .3 miles to the bus stop. Because she lives under 2 miles it is the parents responsibility to get her to school. My daughter leaves for work at 4:30 every morning so she can not take her. They are trying to get neighbors together to car pool these kids and all the parents who can't take a turn will pitch in on gas. During this process they have found that their are several sex offenders living within a 2 block radius that are not on the list for some reason. Scares me 1/2 to death.

What a horrible position to put a family in.  It's good that they have located the registered ones and know who they are.  Question is how many aren't on that list so they don't know who they are?

My very first memory as a child was screaming and crying because my mother was going to leave me with my father again while she went somewhere. She didn't understand why I acted like that.  I was molested until I turned 13yo and never told anyone.  Until my brother got married to a woman with a small daughter.  I told her to never, ever leave that little girl with my Father and Mother.  She asked me why and I told her.  She made it a point to get into a conversation in front of my Dad on purpose. No names mentioned and just stated that if anyone ever touched her little girl she would cut his D*** off and watch him bleed to death.
Point taken. She and my brother are the only two people who ever gave me support in my time of need.

God watched over me though because one month before my daughter was born my father died. I made it clear to any men I met that if they ever touched my child they would suffer.

After becoming an adult I was raped and the perp tried to kill me while in the military. I survived the attack if you can call it surviving. Again she was the only person who truly understood. I didn't know how much she and my older brother understood until about a year ago when she had to write a letter stating what she knew had happened and how it all ruined my life so I could get disability.  Let me just say I was shocked when I read her letter.
She really does understand why I'm so scared of people and so untrusting. Why I have my place completely fenced in and patroled by large dogs. I never sleep through a night, I have multiple nightmares still.

I signed a petition to get it on the Oregon ballot for tougher sentences for those who commit sexual crimes. I sure hope we have an opportunity to vote on it in November.

If you live in Oregon please sign this petition if you haven't already.

If you are reading this website and know where our Angel Boy "Kyron" is please do the right thing and bring him home.

We should start a survivor thread but it would be too depressing to read.

Each time I was pregnant I PRAYED to have a boy.  I didn't want girls because of all the things that had happened to me.  God in his good and wonderful grace saw fit to answer my prayers.

We share so many of the same after effects.  I have talked so openly about my experiences that I have been asked to become a speaker on this subject.  I'm not ready.

I too am on the 'defense mode' ALL THE TIME.  My guard is never let down.  We react this way because while other little children were busy thinking daddy was the all seeing all knowing protector, ours was busy at home robbing us of the very security children should have.  This vulnerability will never go away because we learned the HARD WAY not to trust.

Not to trust the ONE PERSON on the FREAKING PLANET that was suppose to protect us.


I have written before that these people are everywhere.

If there were truly 300 people in that school that day, STATISTICS say that there were at least a few pedophiles in attendance as well.

[Justamama]

I typically don't respond to these types of posts' because this thread is about Kyron. It's very easy for emotions to run high when a child is missing and we're at a standstill.

Justamama - I don't think there is any monkey here that doesn't respect you. You give a lot to this forum. I agree with you about the subject being rehashed when it should have ended. Hopefully this will end now. I think maybe you should take a nice bubble bath and a glass of wine and relax. It's got to be 5:00 somewhere! 

Now let's find Kyron! 

You are such a good and kind person.    thank you so much.  It's this exact attitude that drew me to this board to begin with.  I should have taken the high road but my personal GPS was broken...getting back on track now...

[Justamama]

I'm heading off into my day.  You all have a great one and let's hope that today is the day that we here positive news about Kryon.

[Tamikosmom]

I'm heading off into my day.  You all have a great one and let's hope that today is the day that we here positive news about Kryon.

Justamama

I apologize.  Life beckoned outside the computer room and ... I did not have a chance to respond to your post.

I have concerns regarding what was the underlying reasons that Jason inserted himself into the case.

Think about it.  If Jason had been contacted by the media ... all he would have had to say was that he had not seen his former girlfriend in over a year and ...the DeDe he knew would never harm a child.  The dynamics of the relationship and ... his speculations regarding Kyron's homecoming were irrelevent.

IMO

Have a good day.

Janet

++++++++

REMINDER

DeDe Spicher's former boyfriend describes Terri Moulton Horman's friend as a 'high-energy, dynamic' person who changed dramatically
Published: Wednesday, August 18, 2010, 4:30 PM
Updated: Thursday, August 19, 2010, 2:36 PM

I met DeDe Spicher in late September of 2008 at the Rock Creek Campus of PCC in chemistry 100 lecture and lab class taught by Dr. Harry Davis. She completed the Portland Marathon during the first couple weeks of class and my first discussion with her was regarding this event. I was impressed with her high intelligence, energy and straightforward matter-of-fact attitude. I had returned to school in the spring of 2007 at the University of Phoenix in Tigard for Criminal Justice and had transferred to PCC for a health then a chemistry class and had achieved a 4.0 GPA the entire time. I realized after the first two weeks of class that I may lose my GPA with this chemistry class and hooked up with DeDe as a study partner. I spend many hours with her, and with other students outside of class in independent study groups.

I found DeDe to be a very unique individual in that she was extremely neat and clean and very organized. You could eat off her garage floor it was so clean. I discovered that that at age 42, she never had a boyfriend or any children. DeDe also participated in the Centurion bike ride in 2008 and was in very good physical condition. She worked in Tigard as a receptionist and she invited me to her company Christmas party in December 2008.

Her daily routine was to get-up and work-out very early in the morning, go to work and then come to school. I only saw DeDe in make-up once in the 10 months I knew her. She would prepare all her meals on Sunday and place them in Tupperware containers for the rest of the week. She had a very strict diet and ate 5 small healthy meals per day.

I met DeDe’s Mother in the spring of 2009 when she came up for a visit with DeDe. I almost met her Dad when he came up to Portland for some sort of training for his position as a reserve officer with the Klamath County Sheriff’s office. She talked of her brother who reportedly had a tree service business and a shop where he bought and sold cars and had restored old muscle cars. She was very close with her family and talked of them much. I came to the conclusion that she had a very good family and was raised right.

I was told that when DeDe came up to Portland from K-Falls after she graduated in 1984, she moved in with her Aunt in the Helvetia area. She reported that her cousins with this Aunt became like siblings to her. She worked at a hospital then eventually got an apartment off cedar hills blvd. in Beaverton.

DeDe told me that in about 1994, she went to live in Japan to teach English.  She is familiar with the Japanese language as a result.

I want to reiterate that DeDe presented to be of very high intelligence and when inspired, possessed great drive and determination.

I can’t recollect her mentioning Terri or Kaine’s name during the time I knew her.

She did tell me repeatedly that I was going to be the last man in her life and if it didn’t work out with us, that she would never pursue another man again, and I believed her.

In the winter of 2009, we became so close, that we had discussed marriage.

DeDe had many casual friendships and communicated with some of these people on Twitter. DeDe got laid-off from work sometime in January of 2009.

Prior to this, she claimed that she could get another job at the snap of her fingers. But when she did get laid-off she took her neighbors advice and just lived off unemployment. When she got laid-off and went on unemployment, her personality did a 180 degree turn and she did not take any more classes, completely stopped working out and riding her bike and diet went out the window. This sudden and dramatic turn of events in her life was a turn-off for me and I lost respect for her. She would just talk to her friends on the phone and have little luncheon get-together’s with her friends almost daily.

DeDe told me she previously served on the HOA board where she lived. After going on unemployment, she contemplated going back and serving on the board again.

I tried to discourage her from committing to this as it was unpaid and she was opening a dysfunctional can of worms that was a needless vacuum of time for her when she should be getting back on track with her life.

The event that threw a cold, wet blanket on our relationship was that sometime in the early spring of last year she came to me with some drawings for 4 planter boxes and four stands with exact measurements and materials to be used. At that time the economy had tanked and I was working for almost nothing, I was eating top-ramen and day-old bread money was so tight. She wanted me to buy this material and assemble these 8 items free of charge. It took about $200.00 in material and about 20 hours time to complete what she wanted. I was slow in getting everything to her as I was working 15 hour days while she was sitting at home collecting unemployment. It was like she was demanding a $1200.00 gift from me and I was not acting fast enough. She even said that she was going to finish it on her own if I didn’t deliver it fast enough. This was a very huge turn-off for me and after I delivered everything, I backed off substantially.

DeDe decided to serve on her HOA board again

and this distanced us even further.

I basically lost respect for her and just did my child advocacy work and worked every day trying to stay in business.

I could not afford the money or time to continue my criminal justice degree last year.

I could not believe the total change in DeDe’s personality in such a relatively short amount of time.

Never once did I see or hear her say anything mean or evil, even at the end of our relationship on or about August 1, 2009.

I am convinced today that DeDe Spicher would have no part of harming anyone, let alone a little boy. I believe that she would have no part of hiding a dead body. She knows right from wrong and has a good constitution.

I ask myself why DeDe would become involved with Terri and risk her reputation and freedom and possibly engage in multiple felonies in connection with Kyron’s disappearance. What would make someone’s friendship bond so close that they would risk everything?

Last year Terri Horman was not that close of a friend of DeDe’s otherwise I would have remembered her name.

I suspect that sometime after we broke-up on August 1st, 2009, DeDe reconnected with Terri and Terri found DeDe to be a good listener, provided sound feedback and possibly provided each other with emotional respite. This cultivated to gaining DeDe’s trust and support.  Terri Horman has been described as very intelligent and I read where she had earned a Master’s degree.

Terri may have told DeDe some story that Kyron was in danger and that Kaine was a bad dad and husband and that she needed to find a safe place for Kyron for a few days while she was dealing with Kaine in some way that would produce a long term solution. Some close variation of this scenario is plausible.

On and before June 4th, there was no frame of reference to how big and serious the public and law enforcement would take Kyron’s disappearance.  Little did they realize that they would be up against the collective knowledge and united resources of law enforcement of the post nine-eleven era. It was just everyday life for DeDe at this point in the game.

If DeDe is indeed involved, she probably thought she was helping protect Kyron and that she was somehow doing an act of child advocacy as well as helping a friend get out of a bad and unsafe situation.

I believe in my heart that Kyron is still alive and stashed at a safe house.

The DeDe that I knew very well for 10 months would have no part of harm to a child or getting rid of a body, no way.

Adding to my belief that Kyron is still alive is the nature of the implications of what must have happened for Kyron to be killed and buried. This is a series of events that is so unimaginably evil in nature, not even Ted Bundy, Charles Manson or John Wayne Gacy were that evil late into their murder careers. They never killed a 7 year old innocent child that just moments previously was smiling proudly for the camera with his science project.

That level of evilness is so egregious that it would have manifested itself in some way previously. This is a step way beyond trying to recruit someone to kill your husband. To extinguish the life from an innocent and tender boy under this scenario is way beyond reasonable comprehension. Then to go about your routine and act surprised when the kid is not on the bus, and act like a distraught Susan Smith for the media and law enforcement? I just fail to believe that this happened, God would not allow it.

The question is then presented as to why DeDe would act the way she did following June 4th? A possible answer is that she was acting on principal and being loyal to a “goodfriend”, not having any frame of reference of what was to develop and how serious this case got so fast.

DeDe is an intelligent and head strong woman.

I never exchanged bad, ugly or disrespectful words with her.

If ever a woman is going to “lose-it” it will most likely be at the break-up stage. This never happened. She even carefully mailed back my Hood to Coast run photo I gave her.

I have no media experience and now regret doing some television interviews.

I am a child advocate who has more volunteer time helping endangered and displaced Multnomah county children than any other man out there. I care more than anyone can realize and pray hard for Kyron’s safe return. I know in my heart that law enforcement will be successful and bring Kyron back home, and hold all those responsible for his disappearance to account for their actions in court. We will see this happen, I have no doubt.

I will continue to ask God to guide and direct the investigators to Kyron’s location

Respectfully submitted on this 18th day of August, Twenty-ten

Jason Name Redacted

http://media.oregonlive.com/portland_impact/other/jasonw.pdf

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/dede_spichers_former_boyfriend.html

[sassifrass]

It's been quiet in here the past few days and I think it has been mainly because we don't have any new leads. I firmly believe "leaving no stone unturned". I don't want to see the search for Kyron go cold so I'm going to comment on the video that Deenie posted yesterday on the other thread.

One thing that stood out to me was Walmart VB165. When I googled it, the answer was a 52" freezer that can be purchased from Walmart and only weighs 100lbs.. So it's like a freezer you would put in a dorm room. My question is: Would SAR dogs pick up a scent if he is in a freezer and buried in the ground?

I pray he is just stashed but we have to look at other possibilities. 

[klaasend]

Justamama - I think you are being overly sensitive to posts and misreading posts you think are attacking you when they aren't.  

That said I created a special thread for Jason so he could talk about the case and we could listen.  I certainly don't want the main Kyron thread turning into an argument about Jason.

[Tamikosmom]

I typically don't respond to these types of posts' because this thread is about Kyron. It's very easy for emotions to run high when a child is missing and we're at a standstill.

Justamama - I don't think there is any monkey here that doesn't respect you. You give a lot to this forum. I agree with you about the subject being rehashed when it should have ended. Hopefully this will end now. I think maybe you should take a nice bubble bath and a glass of wine and relax. It's got to be 5:00 somewhere! 

Now let's find Kyron! 

It will not end for me until it is revealed that ... in the process of elimination ... investigators have questioned and eliminated Jason Name Redacted as a person of interest in the Kyron Horman case.

Janet

+++++++

I have not been interrogated or asked my whereabouts on June 4th.

[Justamama]

Justamama - I think you are being overly sensitive to posts and misreading posts you think are attacking you when they aren't.  

That said I created a special thread for Jason so he could talk about the case and we could listen.  I certainly don't want the main Kyron thread turning into an argument about Jason.

You are probably right.  I do tend to be defensive.  (Too use to being attacked on another *board* planet!) it's as if I have come here from a great war zone.   I am trying to rid myself of these traits and realize that I'm with group of different people.  I'll keep working on it.

I'll stay off the Jason thread out of respect for you all.

I will leave you with this thought though...

Suggested reading on the "Hero Complex"


"Criminologist Michael Rustigan told The New York Times that in such cases the individuals are driven by their egos and a lack of accomplishment: “They’ve fallen down, and they now want to be heroes.” He theorized, “They are a manifestation of our culture’s obsession with fame.”

http://www.findingdulcinea.com/news/Americas/2009/March/Hero-Complex-to-Blame-in-NY-Arson-Fire.html

[sassifrass]

I typically don't respond to these types of posts' because this thread is about Kyron. It's very easy for emotions to run high when a child is missing and we're at a standstill.

Justamama - I don't think there is any monkey here that doesn't respect you. You give a lot to this forum. I agree with you about the subject being rehashed when it should have ended. Hopefully this will end now. I think maybe you should take a nice bubble bath and a glass of wine and relax. It's got to be 5:00 somewhere! 

Now let's find Kyron! 

It will not end for me until it is revealed that ... in the process of elimination ... investigators have questioned and eliminated Jason Name Redacted as a person of interest in the Kyron Horman case.

Janet

+++++++

I have not been interrogated or asked my whereabouts on June 4th.

Hey Janet!    I was talking about her feeling attacked, not the content. 

[sassifrass]

Klaas - I sent you an email! 

[Tamikosmom]

I typically don't respond to these types of posts' because this thread is about Kyron. It's very easy for emotions to run high when a child is missing and we're at a standstill.

Justamama - I don't think there is any monkey here that doesn't respect you. You give a lot to this forum. I agree with you about the subject being rehashed when it should have ended. Hopefully this will end now. I think maybe you should take a nice bubble bath and a glass of wine and relax. It's got to be 5:00 somewhere! 

Now let's find Kyron! 

It will not end for me until it is revealed that ... in the process of elimination ... investigators have questioned and eliminated Jason Name Redacted as a person of interest in the Kyron Horman case.

Janet

+++++++

I have not been interrogated or asked my whereabouts on June 4th.

Hey Janet!    I was talking about her feeling attacked, not the content. 

sassifrass

I do believe that I need that nice bubble bath and a glass of wine and relax ... the advice you suggested to Justamama.  Hey ... I don't even drink and ... it is only 9:40 AM here in the Fraser Valley of British Columbia.

 

Have a good day.

Janet

[Justamama]

I've been doing a lot of Googling this morning on this subject and there is a lot of interesting information being posted out there.  (That's where I got that other information).

Kind of like when the light bulb was patented, there was more than one person with the same idea.  Interesting to read.

Now, I really do have to get up from this chair!

[Wyks]

I'm heading off into my day.  You all have a great one and let's hope that today is the day that we here positive news about Kryon.

 

[sassifrass]

Wyks! -    Love, love, love, your new avatar! Is that a banana margarita? 

[Wyks]

I do believe that I need that nice bubble bath and a glass of wine and relax ... the advice you suggested to Justamama.  Hey ... I don't even drink and ... it is only 9:40 AM here in the Fraser Valley of British Columbia.

 

Have a good day.

Janet

Meh.  LOL  Drop some fruit in it and call it brunch.   

[Wyks]

Wyks! -    Love, love, love, your new avatar! Is that a banana margarita? 

Thanks sassifrass!     My avatar is a banana margarita, yeppers!  It was new at the beginning of this summer, CBB made it for me, isn't she wonderful!  I was taking a break from avi's for a bit. 

[nana0567]

It's been quiet in here the past few days and I think it has been mainly because we don't have any new leads. I firmly believe "leaving no stone unturned". I don't want to see the search for Kyron go cold so I'm going to comment on the video that Deenie posted yesterday on the other thread.

One thing that stood out to me was Walmart VB165. When I googled it, the answer was a 52" freezer that can be purchased from Walmart and only weighs 100lbs.. So it's like a freezer you would put in a dorm room. My question is: Would SAR dogs pick up a scent if he is in a freezer and buried in the ground?

I pray he is just stashed but we have to look at other possibilities. 

Hi Sassifras, I somehow must have missed a post...as I didn't see anything about Walmart VB165...would you be able to tell me where I can find that? I do believe that if someone was buried in a freezer that search and rescue dogs could find them. The reason is because they can find people in water, underneath concrete slabs, and just about anywhere. I'm not 100% sure on the freezer, but I think so.