Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND, OR #24 8/25/10 -8/28/10

[JessStar]

For those who know this...

... if Terri were to confess to everything she's done in privacy to her attorney... would the attorney then be obligated to reveal the location of the victim, if she were to tell it to him?

I'm curious about this too. I think there are legalities about what she can/should tell her attorney, but my knowledge is vague and based somewhat on TV shows and newscasts.
*snicker*

Hopefully someone with proper knowledge of the law will tell us.

Well, that is a good question. Normally no - the attorney has no duty to disclose if the person is not in current harm - for example if Kyron were dead, then no more harm can come to him and there is no duty to report what his client told him. If, on the other hand, Kyron was being held somewhere - I do believe he would have an ethical duty to report it because Kyron would be in harm;s way. Ethically, there is only a small set of times an attorney can disclose confidential information.

This is an EXTREMELY complex question that does not allow an "easy" answer.  It depends on what is contemplated by the phrase "duty to report."  The attorney client privilege protects confidential communications between the attorney and his/her client.  The only person that can waive the privilege is the client.  So an attorney can NEVER disclose such conversations to anyone without the client's consent. 

Now, the privilege only applies to the disclosure of the confidential communication.  It may NOT apply to the information itself.  Yes, it's splitting hairs.  But in some jurisdictions (and I don't know if Oregon is one or not), the lawyer is under a duty to disclose the FACT, but cannot disclose the source of the fact if the source is his/her client.

The other rule that is implicated is the rule that prohibits an attorney from allowing his/her client to lie under oath.  In other words, if an attorney is told by his/her client that he/she committed a crime, but the client wants to take the stand and falsely testify that he/she did not commit the crime, the attorney either (a) must counsel the client not to testify falsely, or, if the client insists on taking the stand (b) withdraw as counsel.

Finally, the attorney is also prohibited from "misleading" the jury.  The situation where a client confesses to his/her lawyer, but then mounts a defense, is a VERY hairy situation.  While the client is entitled to put the prosecution to its burden of proof, the defense lawyer cannot mount a defense that MISLEADS.  The best example I can give of this situation occurred in the Westerfield trial--I'm sure most remember that POS.  He's the guy that brutally raped and murdered Danielle VanDamm.  His defense lawyer treaded dangerously close to the unethical in the manner in which he handled Westerfield's defense.  Following the trial, it became clear that Westerfield confessed to his attorney and told him where Danielle's body was.  The attorney used that information to try to strike a deal with the prosecution to take the death penalty off the table. Essentially, his attorney said, "I've received information about where Danielle's body is.  I'll tell you if you take the death penalty off the table."  The prosecution refused, and Danielle's body was later found.  Nonetheless, the attorney mounted a vigorous defense and presented affirmative evidence based on forensic anthropology and forensic entomology that suggested his client did not kill the little girl.  Ethical charges were brought against him but, to the best of my recollection, he was cleared.

[shy-monkey]

shy monkey - trim up your "screen capture" you took of a page .. save it to your pc
THEN in the REPLY box click on "Additional Options" below the white box you type your "reply" in - and direct it to the ScreenCapture you would like to post ... I just learned that trick from klaas yesterday I believe    good luck 

thanks zippiddy-found it and here goes....

[Tamikosmom]

Hubby is sawing logs on the couch with the Discovery Channel blaring.  If any Monkey is up to a game of Scrabble with me ... there is fresh Blueberry pie with real whipping cream to follow.

Janet
8:00 PM PT

[zippiddy_doo_daw]

 

[zippiddy_doo_daw]

   you did it shy! woot

[MonkeyFlower]

http://www.oregonlive.com/news/
Just found this  video, on right side of page, I'm having a hard time getting it to load, but it sounds like a new statement from Desiree

http://videos.oregonlive.com/oregonian/2010/08/desiree_young_reads_a_prepared.html

shes making a statement to Terri

You can tell she's really holding back! I can just imagine what she really wanted to say. I don't think this'll do much good, but you never know, miracles could happen and Terri could decide to do the right thing.

Lucky7 thanks for the link.

Scatty I wonder why she would appeal to Terri?  If Terri dislikes her wouldn't it annoy Terri?
I'm sure Tony is well aware of D's prepared statement.  I can't imagine he disapproved.
At least it keeps Kyron's name out there and shows interest people that Desirree has not changed her focus.

Wishing for a miracle for Kyron.

I'm thinking good cop bad cop routine would have worked better, knowing Terri's  personality disorder. If Kaine acted like he still had feelings for her and said he knows she's really a great person at heart and knows she will do the right thing...Then Desiree interrupts all mad at him and says he's crazy as she is, Terri will never do the right thing..Then they agree to disagree, sorta mad, and say "let's see who's right in the end." TH will feel compelled to prove Desiree wrong.  Of course it's prbably too late now.

I think Terri will only do the right thing when it serves her own purpose. Period.

"Motivational interviewing" is big in working with people, that is what motivates them and what can you get them to do (probably not what you want them to do). Maybe Desiree et al thought that pleas was worth a try. I think only one major thing is gonna get TH to talk and that is some type of fear - fear of many years in prison, fear of no life in NW maybe. I personally don't see how she will be able to have any life here when released (though if on probation there are a lot of programs that would help her when released). If she thinks she is gonna get outta this with no "time," what would she think she could do when she is so vilified in this area. I would think she would have to move out of NW to another area to have any type of life and get a job. Of course, she could always sucker a guy with money maybe......
When a friend heard she was moving back to Roseburg (and friend had worked there a bit), she instantly thought that people would be out to get her as it is a big gun-toten type of a place. Definitely lots of Wild West atmosphere.

[pfaubush]

I feel like my posts are being ignored.

Anyway, I posted harry's replies to the questions.  http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8432.new#new

Good night Monkeys.


Bring Kyron Home. 

I'm not ignoring you. I'm just catching up! Seems like today was a big day in here, and I'm a little slow on the uptake. 

[Deenie]

I started to watch those new videos and couldn't do it.  It just hurts to watch Desiree!

Our laws need to be changed to favor the child when a child is missing.  If someone is even thought to be with-holding information, there should be a way to force them to talk.  Forget their rights.  The child's rights should trump theirs.  This is ridiculous. 

I see Desiree's pain too and it's heartbreaking
( do not know if this applies to Kaine or not) 
Too many people have abused the system in Divorce/custody etc. Using children as pawns to get their way " fighting the ex spouse to be" rather than understand what is best for their own child. It breaks down to Ego and I Won, not necessarily what is in the best interest of the child.  That goes with both Men and Women. Its sad. 
Dr. Phil has said ( and I am on the fence with his ideals) Better to be from a broken home than to live in one.  Which I bang my head against the wall on Terri. Her being so " Self Engaged" why not file for divorce? Why is she today in the position that she is in? Why has she allowed herself to be scrutinized by law enforcement? by Kaine, by the public? and never has once offered a statement?
Casey Anthony has never offered a statement either on behalf of Caylee, she was brought up on charges of fraud, check cashing etc.. stealing from Amy H. And as well as Child neglect, misleading law enforcement, basically lying. She HAS Never Offered a Statement ever. She though was " Snagged by her illegal activities" and arrested. 12 charges I believe were just of cash, stealing etc. Once Caylee's body was found - she was then indicted with enough evidence for Murder.  She still today has never opened her mouth publicly.

What the Hell is wrong with People today? I can't wrap my brain around it. How can you be so self indulgent? that a innocent child means " nothing or is used hurt/abused/other". In common with Casey and Terri they both love to be center of attention. Terri showed off " Kiara" like she was her Trophy. I honestly believe though it was Terri wanting the attention. Terri wanted her body to be perfect so she could display it 35+ over competition body building. Not to be observed as a healthy body but as a challenge. That she felt she had to make and meet. One competition and it was all done, after all the sacrifice/training. Same as her education/master degree etc.  Everything in Terri's world has been a competition. She only though goes so far and then quits. And presumably points the finger towards others of why she failed.  " It's your fault" Not my fault, I have all the qualifications and yet ... utter utter. I simply can't carry it to the accomplished line. She met the finish line, yet never pursued it over that. She married Kaine and became pregnant/had Kiara and quit. Had to find yet another challenge to escape ? What was it? What was Terri's next challenge? What did she get her self into? that She avoided Kaine for months ? I still go back to the photo's of Christmas in the Horman House - Dec 09. That she was sleeping on the couch. ( My belief) that she had sheets on the couch/ her night gown on the couch. That they were no longer sleeping in the same bed. That is a red flag. I can't see her taking Kiara and sleeping on the couch. No. 
Something was very wrong 8+ mos ago in the Horman house. Was Kaine that oblivious? Or was he just ignoring all the red flags copping out thinking " It's just Terri" ..what was to come of it? Did he just sweep it under the rug thinking it would get better? What was Kyron thinking ? He was ( my thoughts) watching his family fall apart before his eyes and more than likely he turned to doting on Kiara ( being a big brother). Or looking to James for Love and Attention. Then James was sent away. How was Kryon to understand his big brother being sent away? Did Terri tell Kyron it was his fault? That he was being a bad boy? ( with her so on his color rating daily within school) Kaine not knowing, or did Terri tell Kyron your DAD sent James away .. twisting the truth? That all that stress made KYRON feel dizzy and feel out of sorts as it was said in the last weeks .. that he felt his entire world was crashing ?
--
If I was Desiree I think a restraining order would be filed against me - Because I would want to rip every hair out Terri's head, until she squawked the truth.     
 

[klaasend]

JessStar - good to see you 

[klaasend]

Hubby is sawing logs on the couch with the Discovery Channel blaring.  If any Monkey is up to a game of Scrabble with me ... there is fresh Blueberry pie with real whipping cream to follow.

Janet
8:00 PM PT

 

[Deenie]

Zip I don't believe that is Desiree do you?  I think it is someone using Desiree's name. jmo. 

[zippiddy_doo_daw]

Zip I don't believe that is Desiree do you?  I think it is someone using Desiree's name. jmo. 

Its her FB acct .. yup it is

[klaasend]

Zip I don't believe that is Desiree do you?  I think it is someone using Desiree's name. jmo. 

I'm pretty sure it is Desiree.  I suppose I could be wrong but that is how her facebook name was listed from the beginning.

[Deenie]

  JESS

Within this case of Terri Horman - Why do you believe ( if you can offer) she has not been named a suspect or person of interest in Kyron's disappearance?

Thank You

[cw618]

Jeez I feel like such a old person, but can anyone tell me how to take a screen shot of a page?       

I am so disgusted at the level of cruelty being displayed by the people on the support page. I shouldn't be, in light of why they are there to begin with, but to speak to DY in the manner they did, makes me SICK. 
 
Kyron, Hang in there buddy.

hope it helps
http://take-a-screenshot.org/

[O4Bull]

It's really disheartening to see the level people will stoop to.  I may have opinions on Desiree's choices,  and I've made no secret that I don't particularly care for Kaine,  but to make fun of their grieving is nothing less than evil.  What it screams to me is that someone(s) running that board have a lot to lose if TH goes down for this.  This is exactly what I mean though, about not appealing to evil to stop being evil.  TH is evil, IMO, and so are some of her supporters, again IMO.  All this game playing they are doing over there is evil.  I wish them all God's vengeance, since I believe there will be vengeance.  They all deserve nothing less.

[cw618]

JessStar - good to see you 

real good to see you, you have Qs, sorry no links
i have faith you will catch up to us

mine was can kyrons disappearance be brought up in/during  the divorce proceedings
and a big TYIA

[mchenry]

I started to watch those new videos and couldn't do it.  It just hurts to watch Desiree!

Our laws need to be changed to favor the child when a child is missing.  If someone is even thought to be with-holding information, there should be a way to force them to talk.  Forget their rights.  The child's rights should trump theirs.  This is ridiculous. 

I see Desiree's pain too and it's heartbreaking
( do not know if this applies to Kaine or not) 
Too many people have abused the system in Divorce/custody etc. Using children as pawns to get their way " fighting the ex spouse to be" rather than understand what is best for their own child. It breaks down to Ego and I Won, not necessarily what is in the best interest of the child.  That goes with both Men and Women. Its sad. 
Dr. Phil has said ( and I am on the fence with his ideals) Better to be from a broken home than to live in one.  Which I bang my head against the wall on Terri. Her being so " Self Engaged" why not file for divorce? Why is she today in the position that she is in? Why has she allowed herself to be scrutinized by law enforcement? by Kaine, by the public? and never has once offered a statement?
Casey Anthony has never offered a statement either on behalf of Caylee, she was brought up on charges of fraud, check cashing etc.. stealing from Amy H. And as well as Child neglect, misleading law enforcement, basically lying. She HAS Never Offered a Statement ever. She though was " Snagged by her illegal activities" and arrested. 12 charges I believe were just of cash, stealing etc. Once Caylee's body was found - she was then indicted with enough evidence for Murder.  She still today has never opened her mouth publicly.

What the Hell is wrong with People today? I can't wrap my brain around it. How can you be so self indulgent? that a innocent child means " nothing or is used hurt/abused/other". In common with Casey and Terri they both love to be center of attention. Terri showed off " Kiara" like she was her Trophy. I honestly believe though it was Terri wanting the attention. Terri wanted her body to be perfect so she could display it 35+ over competition body building. Not to be observed as a healthy body but as a challenge. That she felt she had to make and meet. One competition and it was all done, after all the sacrifice/training. Same as her education/master degree etc.  Everything in Terri's world has been a competition. She only though goes so far and then quits. And presumably points the finger towards others of why she failed.  " It's your fault" Not my fault, I have all the qualifications and yet ... utter utter. I simply can't carry it to the accomplished line. She met the finish line, yet never pursued it over that. She married Kaine and became pregnant/had Kiara and quit. Had to find yet another challenge to escape ? What was it? What was Terri's next challenge? What did she get her self into? that She avoided Kaine for months ? I still go back to the photo's of Christmas in the Horman House - Dec 09. That she was sleeping on the couch. ( My belief) that she had sheets on the couch/ her night gown on the couch. That they were no longer sleeping in the same bed. That is a red flag. I can't see her taking Kiara and sleeping on the couch. No. 
Something was very wrong 8+ mos ago in the Horman house. Was Kaine that oblivious? Or was he just ignoring all the red flags copping out thinking " It's just Terri" ..what was to come of it? Did he just sweep it under the rug thinking it would get better? What was Kyron thinking ? He was ( my thoughts) watching his family fall apart before his eyes and more than likely he turned to doting on Kiara ( being a big brother). Or looking to James for Love and Attention. Then James was sent away. How was Kryon to understand his big brother being sent away? Did Terri tell Kyron it was his fault? That he was being a bad boy? ( with her so on his color rating daily within school) Kaine not knowing, or did Terri tell Kyron your DAD sent James away .. twisting the truth? That all that stress made KYRON feel dizzy and feel out of sorts as it was said in the last weeks .. that he felt his entire world was crashing ?
--
If I was Desiree I think a restraining order would be filed against me - Because I would want to rip every hair out Terri's head, until she squawked the truth.     
 

Great post Dennie!!! ITA

[O4Bull]

In my previous statement, I said "I believe there will be vengeance".  After reading SeamusORiley, I am starting to analyze myself.    I should have said, confidently, "THERE WILL BE VENGEANCE". 
Deuteronomy 32:35 'Vengeance is Mine, and retribution, In due time their foot will slip; For the day of their calamity is near, And the impending things are hastening upon them.'
 Romans 12:19
New International Version
Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord.

[Scatty]

**The hellions are actually poking and insulting Desiree over on "that woman's" support page.........  (I don't know how do to a screen print copy thing! Sorry)
   

Terri Horman Support Page's Photos - Terri
Photo 29 of 29   Back to Album · Terri Horman Support Page's Photos · Terri Horman Support Page's Profile

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      5 people like this.
    *
          o
            Jacque Russell ahhh....she's pregnant with Kiara.
            Yesterday at 2:28pm ·
          o
            Mary J Johnson This must be Kyron's Birthday Party?? Who are the other children?
            Yesterday at 4:20pm ·
          o
            Terri Horman Support Page ‎(MB) Terri's older son and Desiree's older son
            Yesterday at 5:15pm ·
          o
            Mary J Johnson Yes, I can see the resemblance in her. What is his name? He and James look like the same age, were they friends?
            Yesterday at 6:11pm ·
          o
            Terri Horman Support Page ‎(MB) I believe they are around the same age.. They look pretty close.. almost like brothers. His name is Quinn.
            Yesterday at 6:41pm ·
          o
            Terri Horman Support Page ‎(CS) Yep, very close in age. On J's FB page, he lists Q as his 'brother' so obviously they have a very special bond. I thinks that's so neat! Just goes to show even more about their family dynamics and relationships. Some mixed/blended families would never consider being so involved in one another's special celebrations or lives. It seems Terri had a way of simply making things work out, in the best interest of everyone ♥
            18 hours ago · 2 peopleLoading... ·
          o
            LW Glover Go crawl back under your rock. These were publicly published previously.
            8 hours ago · 1 personLoading... ·
          o
            LW Glover We heard you the first time.
            7 hours ago ·
          o
            LW Glover If I was an admin, I'd block you. Actually, I'll do it anyway.
            7 hours ago ·
          o
            Terri Horman Support Page ‎(MB) Yeah.. try telling the Obamas that you can't post their kids pics!
            7 hours ago · 4 peopleLoading... ·
          o
            Desiree Davidson Young ADMIN - My son is in this picture and needs to be removed from this website and page. If you do not I will provide you with court paperwork to cease and desist!!!!! I am his parent and he is a minor child you may not post this picture without ramifications.
            about an hour ago · 6 peopleLoading... ·
          o
            Sherie Dawn Admin, remove this picture. Obviously, his true mother does not want it to be posted and you should respect her wishes.
            about an hour ago · 1 personLoading... ·
          o
            Rebekah Young Wow Desiree speaks. your ridiculousness wouldn't you want more pictures of your son out there or do you just not not like the fact that this shows how good of mother Terri was to your son and that you are sorely missing here like most of his childhood? I have a question most parents of missing children participate in the why couldn't you and Kaine do that again?
            54 minutes ago ·
          o
            Mark Christenson Do you even understand that she is not talking about Kyron? There is no reason what so ever to have a picture of her oldest son on here, get a clue!
            52 minutes ago ·
          o
            Mark Christenson God forbid that your child should go missing! What a horrible thing to say!
            48 minutes ago ·
          o
            Rebekah Young no one one would have even realized it was the older son until she said something and what about Terri she is also the mother of a missing child and everyone is criticizing her
            48 minutes ago ·
          o
            Sherie Dawn Rebekah, unless I'm missing something, this site is supposed to be supportive of TH. WHy not simply respect Desiree's request and remove Quinn's picture. She doesn't want it up, she has every right to make the demand and nobody should be calling her names because of her request.
            44 minutes ago ·
          o
            Wendy Gorman Well said sherie!!!!
            34 minutes ago ·
          o
            Mark Christenson Rebeka, THSP are the ones that identified him if you would read these posts. Desiree, I pray you are able to do something about all of this! And may I say I think you are a class act! I pray daily that YOUR SON comes home soon!
            22 minutes ago ·
          o
            Rebekah Young I support terri not desiree it has always been my oppinion that desiree is a bad mother its her fault kyron is missing if she was raising him like a good or even most bad mothers do he wouldn't be missing. She's just looking for attention to look like mother of the year to reconcile her own guilt about her lousy parenting yes your lousy parenting
            19 minutes ago · 1 personLoading... ·
          o
            Mark Christenson Karma, Rebekah, karma! Jesus taught not to judge others and that is exactly what you are doing! You have no idea what has happened in Desiree's life and until you know, you really should be ashamed of yourself. I would have to assume that you are perfect and have a storybook life, because only someone that has never suffered a loss could be as judgemental as you! He who is without sin cast the first stone!
            13 minutes ago ·
          o
            Mary J Johnson
            If you people do not listen and abide by Desiree's wishes. I will believe that you are all a bunch of child preditors. Disgusting. I have over 100 screen shots of your gross accasations toward innocent parties and am willing to share wit...h anyone that would care to ask. Ban me and tell me to go hide under a rock. Someone needs to protect these kids. I don't think that Terri even has the right to post little K's photo on a public domain at this point. Shame on you all. Protect our children....
            Grow up ladies!!!!!See More
            8 minutes ago ·
          o
            Holly Medin Desiree is an admin on here? What does that mean? she administers this site?

            Does she have secret access in here for some reason? Why would that be?            8 minutes ago ·

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If Desiree is an Admin at that site, that would be pretty slick, LOL!! She'd be privy to know who the real loonies are and the real names behind their handles.