Harry Oakes - Search Dogs

[Claycat]

Well, as you know from being a witness to it yourself, Harry's dogs have alerted to death scent before where LE had already searched with dogs, and he found bodies. 

If LE doesn't do another very careful search, with Harry's help, we may never know whose body is in that area!

[Claycat]

Sassi, when you were in contact with Desiree's family member, did they know that Harry's dogs had alerted to death scent on the Horman property?  I can't remember. 

[sassifrass]

Well, as you know from being a witness to it yourself, Harry's dogs have alerted to death scent before where LE had already searched with dogs, and he found bodies. 

If LE doesn't do another very careful search, with Harry's help, we may never know whose body is in that area!

I agree CC. Although, as I've stated before, I may not like the way HO has come across to the public, I absolutely believe in his skills as a SAR handler. As you said, I have witnessed it myself. I also know that if something were to happen to me, I would want my family to use HO. 

[sassifrass]

Sassi, when you were in contact with Desiree's family member, did they know that Harry's dogs had alerted to death scent on the Horman property?  I can't remember. 

CC From the conversations with them and with HO also, No they did not, although they are aware of it now. HO, at that time only contacted Kaine, NOT Desiree. I was told that DY had no control over KH's decisions and they didn't  even want to think of a death scent relating to Kyron, because they firmly believe that he is alive.

I then asked HO if his dogs could pick up a live scent of Kyron after all of this time has passed. He said yes, up to 1 year.

There is much more that transpired, but the bottom line here is they have complete faith in the direction that LE is going right now, and part of that belief is that Kyron is alive.

Hope that answers your question. 

[Claycat]

Thanks, Sassi!  I understand why they would hope that, but the odds are against them. 

[sassifrass]

Thanks, Sassi!  I understand why they would hope that, but the odds are against them. 

I've always liked to bet against the odds. 

[sassifrass]

So, after the presser with DH, you can see why she would not want to support any outside help from groups or individuals that may prove or suspect, that Kyron is not alive. A big part of me understands why she and Kaine have ignored HO requests.

They are heavily relying on LE with answers, and that's the path they chose. I don't believe for one moment that they don't have something from LE that backs up their beliefs.

So having said that, I think HO should back off the family right now. There may be a body near the Hormans residence, but that may be a matter that will have to be dealt with at a later time. Right now is not the time. JMO. 

[TnMuse]

So, after the presser with DH, you can see why she would not want to support any outside help from groups or individuals that may prove or suspect, that Kyron is not alive. A big part of me understands why she and Kaine have ignored HO requests.

They are heavily relying on LE with answers, and that's the path they chose. I don't believe for one moment that they don't have something from LE that backs up their beliefs.

So having said that, I think HO should back off the family right now. There may be a body near the Hormans residence, but that may be a matter that will have to be dealt with at a later time. Right now is not the time. JMO. 

Hi Sassi,
I do think HO needs to change his approach.  He may be one of the best in the business, but his attitude turns people off.  It is a natural reaction.  He knows the political environment in which he moves, he says so himself...so I can’t understand why he thinks his show of aggression and insinuations about money when it comes to the family and LE will get him what he wants.

Just a WILD thought came in my head…if there really is a death scent and if Terri really could be violent (the MFH)….well, are there any landscapers missing? 

[sassifrass]

The latest blog from HO.

http://www.myspace.com/127939120/blog?bID=539631167


 Sunday, October 03, 2010
   
Kyron Horman search efforts.
Category: Blogging

Thousands of emails from folks I've never meant have asked me repeatedly what can we do to help me search for Kyron Horman and is he still alive?

Let me answer this in a two-part answer.

The first thing that the public can do is QUIT supplying money to the Horman’s. They don't need the money to search for Kyron. Stop it now.

Mult. Co. Sheriff's office is a public office and funded through state, federal and county budgets and grants. They are in charge of the investigation and the official search for Kyron. They do not exist on donations.

 

The FBI sure doesn't need your money. They are federally funded.

What you can do if you are serious about helping.

Write the Oregon Dept of Justice and demand that they investigate ALL OF THE FUND RAISING EFFORTS for Kyron Horman.

The public has a right to know who is raising the money, how much has been brought in, and where is it now? How is it being spent?

Desiree is on TV begging for more money. For what?

 

If this was a ransom situation I guarantee the FBI would have put up the money in a second and nailed the S.O.B.'.s who are asking for the $$$ for ransom.

Let's put pressure on the Horman’s to allow me to search their property and vehicles with my trained and tested search dogs. Why?

 

During this whole search, we've not been allowed on the Horman property to search for Kyron. We've not been given a scent article of Kyron's.

If this was my son or grandson missing, I wouldn't care who found him, I would allow anyone and everyone who wanted to help to do what ever it took to find my family member.

Have you seen the Horman’s passing out fliers of Kyron? I haven't.
Have you seen them out searching for Kyron? I haven't.

This isn’t normal.

In 38 years of SAR and 25 with the search dogs, when I'm involved in the search, usually I have overwhelming volunteers from the family and their friends actually out there looking along side me.

 

I've donated over 240 hours of searching for Kyron. Donating over $44,000 dollars of my own search and rescue services. Not once have the Horman’s offered to help pay for my gas or time. That's not the issue here.

The issue is why is Desiree asking for money?

 

The sheriff's office has already printed up thousands of fliers.

Anyone can go online and print up their own amount of fliers on their own printer.

NO amount of money for a reward is going to bring Kyron home.


In 97% of the missing children cases I've worked over the years, regarding the kids who were kidnapped by strangers, the children were dead within 3 hours of their kidnapping.

 

If Kyron is still alive, why isn’t Dee Dee and Terri cooperating with the investigation?

Why have they clammed up?

Why did Terri fail two polygraphs?

Why is MCSO scaling back their resources and concentrating their efforts on their INVESTIGATION and the search for Kyron’s remains?

 

Why every time I get near the Horman property with my search dog teams, the search dogs indicate a “DEATH ALERT” on or near the Horman property?

 

I of all people would love nothing more then MCSO, the FBI or anyone else to bring Kyron home ALIVE.

 

This is every parent’s nightmare.

 

But the facts are screaming otherwise.

 

If Kyron had been kidnapped for Child Slavery, you can bet the FBI, Interpol, and other agencies would be all over this case in a second bringing him home.

 

If Terri and Dee Dee were innocent of Kyron’s disappearance, then why did they buy untraceable disposable cell phones before Kyron disappeared?

 

Why was Terri seen buying a shovel and paying cash for it before Kyron disappeared?

 

 

There are too many facts showing that Kyron is no longer with us. Until we find his remains, we hold out all hope that he is alive. But you can’t ignore the obvious.

Can we make MCSO give me a scent article of Kyron’s? No we can’t. It’s their case and they don’t want anyone showing them up like we’ve done so many times before on other cases.

 

It’s politics and ego’s as usual I hate to say.

What can my search dogs show the DA’s office and MCSO if they allowed me on the Horman property?

If Kyron was killed on the property? Where he was killed? Which vehicle was used to transport him if he in fact was transported?

 

If he’s buried on the property, there’s a good chance we could locate that site.

 

If tools were used, which ones and where are they now (If still on the property)?

 

I’ve trained and written numerous articles on Forensic scent evidence.

My search dogs findings are admissible in the courtroom. We’ve been successful in these kinds of cases in Mult. Co. Clark Co. Skamania Co. Yamhill Co. Polk Co. Linn County and many other jurisdictions in the NW.

 

But again just like the Ward Weaver case in Oregon City, Ore. 2002, the Law enforcement folks don’t want to be embarrassed again.

 

It’s a shame. The focus should be on finding Kyron. Not who finds Kyron.

 

Harry

[sassifrass]

They have recently started an online petition. http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/kyronhormanscentarticle/

Little do they know they online petitions in Oregon don't qualify. 

[sassifrass]

I don't know. Although I admire his skills and abilities as a certified SAR guru, he is being way too aggressive. Is it because he's just so frustrated? Maybe that's the case and I would understand that. He's been on this case from the beginning, but his pushing and pushing is a bit tiresome.

Don't get me wrong, I totally believe in his skills, but I don't believe in his approach. There is obviously a death scent near or on the Horman residence according to HO. I believe this. Who is it? I sure as heck don't know. Could it be Kyron? Very possibly, but ultimately, it up to Kaine to allow him to search.

I believe with their (bio parents) mindset right now, they only want to hear about a live Kyron. JMO

[klaasend]

Sassifrass - not sure what to do about this thread.  To be honest, I don't care for Harry's tone.  I don't condone what Harry is saying. 

I need to make it clear I don't as Administrator of Scared Monkeys condone what Harry is saying/doing. 

[sassifrass]

Sassifrass - not sure what to do about this thread.  To be honest, I don't care for Harry's tone.  I don't condone what Harry is saying. 

I need to make it clear I don't as Administrator of Scared Monkeys condone what Harry is saying/doing. 

I agree Klaas. It makes me want to puke. I don't think we should lock it though. We don't know what is around the corner.

I'm just so disgusted with him right now. 

[klaasend]

I'm going to lock this thread.  Harry doesn't deserve the attention.

THIS THREAD IS LOCKED - PLEASE DON'T START ANY NEW HARRY OAKES THREADS, TIA

[Kokos Cat]

 

Harry Oakes has officially quit Kyron's case due to the hopelessness of the situation WITHOUT THE PARENTS GIVING HIM A SCENT ARTICLE.

Now that LE has scaled back to a task force... a task force that is shrinking by the minute... why would they not accept help from one of two people in the world who may have found Kyron?  For free. 

I feel like I've gotten a glimpse into the pit of Hell with these people.  Heart wrenching, disgusting, infuriating.  But, apparently nothing that MORE MONEY couldn't fix, according to DY.

 

http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendId=127939120&blogId=539719106

Wednesday, October 06, 2010
   
Good Bye Little Kyron. I'm done with this search.

Category: Blogging

Dear Kyron

10-06-2010

You don’t know me but let me introduce myself to you.

My name is Harry Oakes. I’m a private search and rescue coordinator and dog handler who has volunteered his time to try to bring you home to your family.

Why am I writing you this letter? So I can put some kind of closure on one of the most messed up SAR cases I’ve ever been involved with in the last 38 years.

Kyron when a person, child or adult, goes missing, it’s law enforcements sworn duty to do everything they can within their legal power to determine what happened to that missing person. Did the victim walk away on his or her own power? Were they kidnapped?
Are they dead or alive?

We try to determine the facts. Who, What, When, Why, Where, and How and find the evidence to support our findings to bring closure on each persons case.

Before I go any further, please let me tell you about my background.

In 1972 I was involved heavy in the Boy scouts and joined the Multnomah County Sheriff’s Department’s Law Enforcement explorer program #900. We were taught all aspects of law enforcement, investigations, report writing, crime scene investigation, court procedures, and search and rescue.

I was the first LE Explorer cadet to ever graduate from an adult police academy with a Board on Police Standards and Training (BPST) basic certification, completing the 310 required hours of the academy through MCSO, graduating in March 1974.

Unfortunately I wasn’t 21 years old so I couldn’t carry a side arm. But the training and certification was still and is still valid. Anyway, I decided to serve my country so I joined the US Army and went through their Federal Military Police Academy and graduated at Fort Gordon, GA Dec. 1974. Then I was assigned to the 7th Division combat MP Company.

My second duty station was overseas where I was cross- trained as an EMT. Having seen some of my fellow soldiers die, I thought the medical training; along with my SAR and L.E. training might make a difference.

When I got out of the Army in 1977, I became a sworn police officer and worked full time, and also as reserve LE officer in various agencies. I also taught for the police academy to a variety of law enforcement agencies.

In 1983, after four budget cuts and two divorces, I quit my LE career and changed it over to SAR. (Search and rescue). Why am I telling you all of this? So you know I’m not just some smuck off the streets who has been looking for you.

In 1979, I coordinated Search and Rescue for Morrow Co. Sheriff’s Dept. while I worked there. I worked some helicopter and ground SAR cases while serving overseas in the Army 1974-1977. I was a team leader and co-instructor while an active member of Portland Mountain Rescue from 1986 to 1994.

I co-founded the search dog program for the State of Oregon in 1986 and volunteered my skills until 1997 when I quit the non-profit volunteer world and turned the SAR team into a professional for profit K9 SAR team.

Kyron, I’ve worked over 8,100 search requests from 1986 to date. Each one documented. I’m considered an expert witness regarding search and rescue, K9 training, testing, and certification, as well as in all aspects of Search and Rescue. Our government has used my expertise around the world on hundreds of cases.

Disasters such as bombing, kidnappings, earthquakes, floods, fires, hurricanes, tornados, and other cases where my expertise brought closure to the victim’s cases and for their families when they needed closure.

Back when I volunteered my time in search and rescue, I saw many innocent people die needlessly to include children because certain Law enforcement agencies wouldn’t use their resources properly.

Having worked so many cases and knowing how to coordinate all the different resources, I tried my best to educate the agencies. It finally came down to where I testified against them in the Ore. Legislature on HB 3093 in 1994, and I was then officially removed as one of the “Good Old Boy’s” and told, ”I would never be used again in an official search on behalf of the Sheriff’s department since I testified against them”. Even though my testimony and the HB 3093 was supported by the Oregon Mountain Rescue Council, the Oregon State Police, The Oregon Firefighters Association and the Civil Air Patrol, the Oregon State Sheriff’s Association removed me from the call out list.

I remained focused on why I got involved in search and rescue. To help others in their time of need, “So others may live”. It wasn’t long after I went private that more and more calls kept coming in from families missing their loved ones. They were frustrated with the sheriff’s departments not finding their loved ones. I now average between 350 and 750 calls per year. I have trained over 6,500 search dog teams around the world. We average a 97% success rate at either finding the victim or finding out what happened to them. Dead or alive.

This has a tendency of embarrassing “The good old boy’s”. When they tell the families of the missing that they can’t find their loved ones, and the families call us in privately and work with us. We often have found the victim in the original search area unfortunately dead, but at least it brought closure to their family and friends.

This makes for some hard feelings from the sheriff’s departments. It would be one thing if this happened now and then. But when our teams found 9 different victims dead in the original search areas in one year, then something is very wrong.

So when you came up missing and I heard about it on the news and through the over 1,300 emails from the general public asking for my help on your case, my heart sank.

Being a father, and grandfather, my heart went out to you and your family, as I know exactly what they are going through. Having gone through this myself in each and every search I coordinated for the families of the missing victims over the years. And as a father when my own son was missing for 30 days down in Mexico. I understand the pain of not knowing if my loved one was dead or alive, if they were suffering, etc.

In your case, I waited for over a month and watched as MCSO and the FBI tried to bring resolve to your case. It didn’t happen. With everyone screaming at me because of my experience to get involved and try to find you, after 30 days of watching from afar, I finally said, OK. I’ll do my best.

Normally what happens when a child is missing and I’m asked to get involved privately, the victim’s family signs a contract for services agreement as we are a for profit business that specializes in finding the missing. Then I interview the family and friends, build up a missing person’s profile and I obtain a scent article. I often do the search whether they can afford my fees or not. In this case your family nor has the sheriff’s office paid me a single penny to try to find you.

I go to the point last seen, I introduce the victim’s scent article to my search dog or search dog teams, and then the search dog(s) show me what’s really happened to the missing person. Which way they walked, if they were ok or upset, and if they were killed, where that happened, and at times we’ve identified who the victim was killed by, with the transfer of the victim(s) scent onto the suspect(s) involved. This has held up in the courtroom and is 100% admissible in the courtroom.

Unfortunately in your case, MCSO and your own family refused to cooperate with our private search efforts. Your family refused to return the many email requests and telephone request from various people trying to get me something that had your scent on it so I could do the best job I could to find your or find out what really happened to you and who was involved in your disappearance.

So instead of giving up, I worked a different search method. This method takes a lot longer and is far less accurate in finding the missing. I usually only reserve this search method when I am working disasters where I don’t have time to obtain a scent article.

But when I’m looking for one specific scent of one person, I have less then a 3% chance of success without a scent article.

So after working over 240 hours on your case, donating my own time, my own money, and my search efforts to find you, only to get bad mouthed by many folks for trying to find you. I’ve decided I can’t do this any more. Remember I do this for a living, and some folks just don’t understand this.

I ended donating over $44,000.00 dollars of my services and after four months of searching for you, and your family and MCSO still refusing to help me find you, I’m saying Goodbye.

I gave it my best shot, being hindered the whole way by stupidity, politics, and egos.

I never once saw the people who were bad mouthing me trying to find you, I never saw them standing by my side searching for you or taking over 240 work hours off of their own paid jobs, with no pay, to try to find you. But I was there. Along with some very wonderful volunteers. Mothers and fathers, fellow search dog handlers and their dogs. All just trying to bring you home.

The one person with the reputation, skills, and documentation of 25 years of success with the K9 services, the one person that had the best chance of finding you or at least finding out what really happened to you, has reached an impasse. That one person is I.

Kyron, it’s with a heavy heart that I say, “I’m sorry, I’ve done everything within my power and resources to find you. But because of your family and MCSO, Kyron they wont help me help them find you, and because of this I’m done”.  I have to get back to my paid work and the many other cases I’ve been asked to be a part of. For families who truly want some honest answers and closure in their loved ones cases.

Maybe someday down the road someone will pull their head out of their Asses and give me the proper tools to do my job to bring closure on your case. Until then I pray that God’s angels watch over you.

Goodbye Little Kyron.
Respectfully
Harry Oakes

International K9 Search and Rescue Services

www.k9sardog.com

Read more: http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendId=127939120&blogId=539719106#ixzz11k9j5QAE

[crazybabyborg]

I don't understand this with Harry Oakes. What have I missed? Why wouldn't a family member give him an article of Kyron's clothes???

[Kokos Cat]

I don't understand this with Harry Oakes. What have I missed? Why wouldn't a family member give him an article of Kyron's clothes???

Dear CBB:
   It's politics and egos.  Turf.  FUBAR. It's happened countless times, it's just that Kyron is one of the most high profile in a long time.  (Ashley Pond, Miranda Gaddis and Jane Doe, in Oregon City, before Ky).
   I was hoping Kyron would/will make a difference in this political morass that is SAR in Oregon.  I still hope for that.  I think Kyron's disappearance could help others who have the misfortune to go missing here. 
   There are so many links, so many stories.  But, at the end of the day, if my child were missing?  I would kill anyone who stood between Harry and me and a scent article. 
   DY's husband is a cop in So. Oregon.  They hate Harry there.  They hate him everywhere.  But, would I care?
   Nope. 
   Here are some helpful links:
http://kyronhorman.blogspot.com/2010/06/politics-and-egos-search-for-kyron.html
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8432.0
http://www.k9sardog.com/

[Kokos Cat]

Harry testified in the senate to try to update SAR laws in Oregon after a little girl died needlessly and LE wouldn't look where Harry said she was.  Then, she surfaced in front of a bunch of children.  This has happened over and over again.

Then, this case was the icing on the cake:

Into Thin Air.... the Oregon City girls. 


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11065622/

Many police departments don’t like him, says Oakes, and don’t use him. But in this case he waived his fee, did some background work, showed the dog some of Ashley’s clothing, and went to work.

    Harry Oakes, private investigator: The track led from the apartment complex up the road, the staircase, to Ward’s property.

That name again.

Harry, with his Valerie now excited and on the chase, knocked at Weaver’s door and asked for permission to search the house.

    Harry Oakes: He said, “I don’t have any problem with you searching, they’ve already brought in 7 different search dog teams. I have nothing to hide.” During the search of the house she gave me a death alert of Ashley’s scent in Ward’s hallway.

    Morrison: Did Valerie alert anywhere else?

    Oakes: Yes. When we went outside to the back area, there was a slab that had been poured.

    Morrison: A concrete slab?

    Oakes: A concrete slab. And where the slab met with the grass, the dirt where they came together, my dog was smelling Ashley’s scent coming out of there.

    Morrison: Did you call 911?

    Oakes: I made a report and turned it into Oregon City police department.

A record of Harry’s report shows it was indeed turned in to police on March 20th, less than two weeks after Miranda disappeared.

    Morrison: Was there any reaction from the police?

    Oakes: They basically ignored us.

    Morrison: What about the FBI?

    Oakes: Ignored us.

[hellokitty]

javascript:void(0);

why does Harry need a scent article when he said that his dogs have gotten a death scent?  does it matter who the death scent is coming from?

[crazybabyborg]

I don't understand this with Harry Oakes. What have I missed? Why wouldn't a family member give him an article of Kyron's clothes???

Dear CBB:
   It's politics and egos.  Turf.  FUBAR. It's happened countless times, it's just that Kyron is one of the most high profile in a long time.  (Ashley Pond, Miranda Gaddis and Jane Doe, in Oregon City, before Ky).
   I was hoping Kyron would/will make a difference in this political morass that is SAR in Oregon.  I still hope for that.  I think Kyron's disappearance could help others who have the misfortune to go missing here. 
   There are so many links, so many stories.  But, at the end of the day, if my child were missing?  I would kill anyone who stood between Harry and me and a scent article. 
   DY's husband is a cop in So. Oregon.  They hate Harry there.  They hate him everywhere.  But, would I care?
   Nope. 
   Here are some helpful links:
http://kyronhorman.blogspot.com/2010/06/politics-and-egos-search-for-kyron.html
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8432.0
http://www.k9sardog.com/

Thanks for the response and links!
If ANYONE approached me for an article of clothing of my missing child, and had a proven record of finding the missing, I'd empty my child's closet, and scratch out the eyes of anyone trying to stop me. Nothing else would matter. JMO.