Natalee Case Discussion #846 9/12/10 - 9/21/10

[wreck]

I wonder if they are using the old divide and conquer technique?

Beth = stick

Dave = carrot

???

Who knows.

I definitely heart the stick.

It is hard to reason with the unreasonable.

My prayers for Dave though, he is a good man.

I agree. I know Dave is a good man and is too weary to fight. Trust was definitely put in the wrong places.

[Magnolia]

You've posted this several times and I have had my thoughts about why and have posted them in the past.

Silvetti and Shaefer are businessmen.  They offered their services for the search. 

Miller is the founder of a nonprofit organization that searches for missing persons.  He relies on donations.  Silvetti and Shaefer still provide assistance.

The businessmen can donate time, equipment, staff, whatever and it has a $ amount.  They can write it off.

Miller, imo, could have been offered a deal he couldn't turn down. 

Watts deliberately asked if Beth had ever made a donation to TES.  Miller's response detailed how she bowed out of 2 recent events, adding that she gets paid for speaking.  I believe since she no longer teaches, she lives on the pay she gets for speaking engagements.  I do not believe that any $ from the recent events in Peru or Aruba are for her personal gain, but instead for the center in Washington DC. 

It seemed Miller eluded to Dave helping on searches for other missing persons, but I'm not sure about that.  If so, then Dave 'contributed'. 

I may be forgetting all the thoughts I would want to relay, but I think it's all about the money and notoriety. 

Maybe someone will fill in the blanks I have left. 
________________________________________________________________________________________


Tim is still trying to collect money to go and search in Aruba on those other 100 targets that Silvetti and
Company said they found.  Remember they were going to bring in the big boat from Trinidad.  There are no
other targets.  IMO

That other time that Tim was on with Steph, he admitted that human remains were found and
the Aruban authorities said that the remains were male.  Steph said on that show, that they were
going down to Aruba and had a big house and lots of steaks and beer and told Dave to come on down.
Dave went and they were all there for a week............did nothing.  It was just a vacation. IMO

[carpe noctem]

Have a na da, Edward! - Everybody Loves Raymond

 

[texasmom]

I wonder if they are using the old divide and conquer technique?

Beth = stick

Dave = carrot

???

Who knows.

I definitely heart the stick.

It is hard to reason with the unreasonable.

My prayers for Dave though, he is a good man.

I agree. I know Dave is a good man and is too weary to fight. Trust was definitely put in the wrong places.

I agree with you both, with special emphasis on what I've made bold.

[Tamikosmom]

I apologize.  I was hoping to be provided with a transcript of THE interview that I could post on the forum this evening.  However ... the kids had unexpected company and ... DIL is just listening to the recording now.  Hopefully ... tomorrow there will be something to post.

Good Night All.

Janet
9:55 PM PT

 

[Bearlyhere]

Great to see that Jen3560 stopped by and posted about the current discussion of Watts and Miller.  Wish her the best.

Also great to see that Klaas launched our resident astronaut to his new home at the space center.   

He didn't have his helmet on.  Too bad, so sad.

 

[wreck]

You've posted this several times and I have had my thoughts about why and have posted them in the past.

Silvetti and Shaefer are businessmen.  They offered their services for the search. 

Miller is the founder of a nonprofit organization that searches for missing persons.  He relies on donations.  Silvetti and Shaefer still provide assistance.

The businessmen can donate time, equipment, staff, whatever and it has a $ amount.  They can write it off.

Miller, imo, could have been offered a deal he couldn't turn down. 

Watts deliberately asked if Beth had ever made a donation to TES.  Miller's response detailed how she bowed out of 2 recent events, adding that she gets paid for speaking.  I believe since she no longer teaches, she lives on the pay she gets for speaking engagements.  I do not believe that any $ from the recent events in Peru or Aruba are for her personal gain, but instead for the center in Washington DC. 

It seemed Miller eluded to Dave helping on searches for other missing persons, but I'm not sure about that.  If so, then Dave 'contributed'. 

I may be forgetting all the thoughts I would want to relay, but I think it's all about the money and notoriety. 

Maybe someone will fill in the blanks I have left. 
________________________________________________________________________________________


Tim is still trying to collect money to go and search in Aruba on those other 100 targets that Silvetti and
Company said they found.  Remember they were going to bring in the big boat from Trinidad.  There are no
other targets.  IMO

That other time that Tim was on with Steph, he admitted that human remains were found and
the Aruban authorities said that the remains were male.  Steph said on that show, that they were
going down to Aruba and had a big house and lots of steaks and beer and told Dave to come on down.
Dave went and they were all there for a week............did nothing.  It was just a vacation. IMO

It was Edward's claim that the Silvetti and Schaefer were "paid a fortune" to search. From everything I read --- Silvetti and Schaefer supposedly did this out of "philanthropy". Dave certainly did not have "$millions" to sponsor their search -- I still believe that The Persistence was there ONLY to make money and further their OWN agenda. Their financial straights at the time are well documented - they did not do this search out soley out of generocity. When they found exactly WHAT they were looking for (WHERE they were looking for) -- they bolted. 

[spooky112483]

I've copied and will work on clipping to just that portion where Tim is talking about Beth.   

Ive listened, quite sad for sure, geeze dont you think levi and steph both practise sounding like NG
Bombshell, they are both full of crap

It's sick and sad what has happened to Tim.

I'm in shock over this. I thought so highly of Tim Miller. We called him a true American hero. Did he not start his own foundation/notforprofit buisness (TES) when his own daughter was murdered? So how is he any different than Beth? I just can't believe how so many seemingly good people have lost their damn minds in this whole thing!!!!! I've been here since day one and it's still as crystal clear to me today as it was then. Tim Miller saw with his own eyes how that hellhole treated Beth AND Dave. He searched thru that landfill. He delt with what happened on the Persistance. Is it worth it, Tim, to sell your soul to the devil to get TES funded? I should probably shut up now cause I am PISSED.

[wreck]

I posted earlier that I thought Tim may have been complicit at the time of the Persistence search ---- I think I jumped the gun. After further thought, I think that both Tim and Kyle originally had good intentions. I think they both to succumbed to the pressure of securing their financial benefactors for the long run. They both sold-out. -JMO

[texasmom]

You've posted this several times and I have had my thoughts about why and have posted them in the past.

Silvetti and Shaefer are businessmen.  They offered their services for the search. 

Miller is the founder of a nonprofit organization that searches for missing persons.  He relies on donations.  Silvetti and Shaefer still provide assistance.

The businessmen can donate time, equipment, staff, whatever and it has a $ amount.  They can write it off.

Miller, imo, could have been offered a deal he couldn't turn down. 

Watts deliberately asked if Beth had ever made a donation to TES.  Miller's response detailed how she bowed out of 2 recent events, adding that she gets paid for speaking.  I believe since she no longer teaches, she lives on the pay she gets for speaking engagements.  I do not believe that any $ from the recent events in Peru or Aruba are for her personal gain, but instead for the center in Washington DC. 

It seemed Miller eluded to Dave helping on searches for other missing persons, but I'm not sure about that.  If so, then Dave 'contributed'. 

I may be forgetting all the thoughts I would want to relay, but I think it's all about the money and notoriety. 

Maybe someone will fill in the blanks I have left. 
________________________________________________________________________________________


Tim is still trying to collect money to go and search in Aruba on those other 100 targets that Silvetti and
Company said they found.  Remember they were going to bring in the big boat from Trinidad.  There are no
other targets.  IMO

That other time that Tim was on with Steph, he admitted that human remains were found and
the Aruban authorities said that the remains were male.  Steph said on that show, that they were
going down to Aruba and had a big house and lots of steaks and beer and told Dave to come on down.
Dave went and they were all there for a week............did nothing.  It was just a vacation. IMO

I've wondered but never asked what they actually DID while they were there.  If the news reports were right and IIRC, Dave arrived one day..talked to the authorities...and left the next.  I don't think he was there the whole time.  It was curious to me that they (Tim) waited until they got there to find out they wouldn't be allowed to search ONE SINGLE area.  And exactly what was Steph's purpose there again?  And yet Tim wants to rant and rave about wanting the Natalee Holloway case to go away?  Like it's keeping him from searching for other people?  Seems to me it would be a matter of having better planning!  I hope he listens to all the crap he said on that show and thinks long and hard about what he's said!

 

 

[2NJSons_Mom]

You've posted this several times and I have had my thoughts about why and have posted them in the past.

Silvetti and Shaefer are businessmen.  They offered their services for the search. 

Miller is the founder of a nonprofit organization that searches for missing persons.  He relies on donations.  Silvetti and Shaefer still provide assistance.

The businessmen can donate time, equipment, staff, whatever and it has a $ amount.  They can write it off.

Miller, imo, could have been offered a deal he couldn't turn down. 

Watts deliberately asked if Beth had ever made a donation to TES.  Miller's response detailed how she bowed out of 2 recent events, adding that she gets paid for speaking.  I believe since she no longer teaches, she lives on the pay she gets for speaking engagements.  I do not believe that any $ from the recent events in Peru or Aruba are for her personal gain, but instead for the center in Washington DC. 

It seemed Miller eluded to Dave helping on searches for other missing persons, but I'm not sure about that.  If so, then Dave 'contributed'. 

I may be forgetting all the thoughts I would want to relay, but I think it's all about the money and notoriety. 

Maybe someone will fill in the blanks I have left. 
________________________________________________________________________________________


Tim is still trying to collect money to go and search in Aruba on those other 100 targets that Silvetti and
Company said they found.  Remember they were going to bring in the big boat from Trinidad.  There are no
other targets.  IMO
That other time that Tim was on with Steph, he admitted that human remains were found and
the Aruban authorities said that the remains were male.  Steph said on that show, that they were
going down to Aruba and had a big house and lots of steaks and beer and told Dave to come on down.
Dave went and they were all there for a week............did nothing.  It was just a vacation. IMO

Thanks, Magnolia....that was one of the points I wanted to talk about, in a way.   During the entire Watts show he kept asking for donations.  It was overkill and his constant stroking of Tim's ego was annoying.  Watts sucks & Tim was horrible.  (I also couldn't fix the quote thingy on my reply, so thanks for pulling it.)

As for the trip and the vacation....I don't know.  I just know how business owners work when it comes to donations for nonprofits.  It's no big deal for them usually. 

It would be interesting to know who provided the house they stayed in while they were there with no media.   Hmmmmm.  Just thinking...

Again, can't wait for Dana's show. 

[carpe noctem]

I remember it clearly... the sales pitch from the Persistence.

Searching costs big money - we are in need of your heartfelt charitable donations.
Please donate and do it now! URGENT! The whole trip scheduled around the holidays
so people would be passionately in the mood to find Nat and bring her home... the
religious aspect of it being around Christmas time...

They were out of there soon after that... with Hans Mos making a statement that they
would never be coming back.

Took the money and ran.

[texasmom]

I've copied and will work on clipping to just that portion where Tim is talking about Beth.   

Ive listened, quite sad for sure, geeze dont you think levi and steph both practise sounding like NG
Bombshell, they are both full of crap

It's sick and sad what has happened to Tim.

I'm in shock over this. I thought so highly of Tim Miller. We called him a true American hero. Did he not start his own foundation/notforprofit buisness (TES) when his own daughter was murdered? So how is he any different than Beth? I just can't believe how so many seemingly good people have lost their damn minds in this whole thing!!!!! I've been here since day one and it's still as crystal clear to me today as it was then. Tim Miller saw with his own eyes how that hellhole treated Beth AND Dave. He searched thru that landfill. He delt with what happened on the Persistance. Is it worth it, Tim, to sell your soul to the devil to get TES funded? I should probably shut up now cause I am PISSED.

I know how you feel Spooky, I've erased a record number of posts this evening.  And as much as I hate to admit it, I'm afraid you've probably hit the nail on the head.

I'm STILL PISSED TOO! 

[2NJSons_Mom]

I posted earlier that I thought Tim may have been complicit at the time of the Persistence search ---- I think I jumped the gun. After further thought, I think that both Tim and Kyle originally had good intentions. I think they both to succumbed to the pressure of securing their financial benefactors for the long run. They both sold-out. -JMO

That's what I'm sayin'.

[texasmom]

You've posted this several times and I have had my thoughts about why and have posted them in the past.

Silvetti and Shaefer are businessmen.  They offered their services for the search. 

Miller is the founder of a nonprofit organization that searches for missing persons.  He relies on donations.  Silvetti and Shaefer still provide assistance.

The businessmen can donate time, equipment, staff, whatever and it has a $ amount.  They can write it off.

Miller, imo, could have been offered a deal he couldn't turn down. 

Watts deliberately asked if Beth had ever made a donation to TES.  Miller's response detailed how she bowed out of 2 recent events, adding that she gets paid for speaking.  I believe since she no longer teaches, she lives on the pay she gets for speaking engagements.  I do not believe that any $ from the recent events in Peru or Aruba are for her personal gain, but instead for the center in Washington DC. 

It seemed Miller eluded to Dave helping on searches for other missing persons, but I'm not sure about that.  If so, then Dave 'contributed'. 

I may be forgetting all the thoughts I would want to relay, but I think it's all about the money and notoriety. 

Maybe someone will fill in the blanks I have left. 
________________________________________________________________________________________


Tim is still trying to collect money to go and search in Aruba on those other 100 targets that Silvetti and
Company said they found.  Remember they were going to bring in the big boat from Trinidad.  There are no
other targets.  IMO
That other time that Tim was on with Steph, he admitted that human remains were found and
the Aruban authorities said that the remains were male.  Steph said on that show, that they were
going down to Aruba and had a big house and lots of steaks and beer and told Dave to come on down.
Dave went and they were all there for a week............did nothing.  It was just a vacation. IMO

Thanks, Magnolia....that was one of the points I wanted to talk about, in a way.   During the entire Watts show he kept asking for donations.  It was overkill and his constant stroking of Tim's ego was annoying.  Watts sucks & Tim was horrible.  (I also couldn't fix the quote thingy on my reply, so thanks for pulling it.)

As for the trip and the vacation....I don't know.  I just know how business owners work when it comes to donations for nonprofits.  It's no big deal for them usually. 

It would be interesting to know who provided the house they stayed in while they were there with no media.   Hmmmmm.  Just thinking...

Again, can't wait for Dana's show. 

I totally agree about the show, it was infuriating to me.

I've wondered about the house too, and about the one (time share I think) that was to be auctioned at one of the fundraisers.

[texasmom]

I remember it clearly... the sales pitch from the Persistence.

Searching costs big money - we are in need of your heartfelt charitable donations.
Please donate and do it now! URGENT! The whole trip scheduled around the holidays
so people would be passionately in the mood to find Nat and bring her home... the
religious aspect of it being around Christmas time...

They were out of there soon after that... with Hans Mos making a statement that they
would never be coming back.

Took the money and ran.

And still continued to beg for more money to go back!   

[Magnolia]

You've posted this several times and I have had my thoughts about why and have posted them in the past.

Silvetti and Shaefer are businessmen.  They offered their services for the search. 

Miller is the founder of a nonprofit organization that searches for missing persons.  He relies on donations.  Silvetti and Shaefer still provide assistance.

The businessmen can donate time, equipment, staff, whatever and it has a $ amount.  They can write it off.

Miller, imo, could have been offered a deal he couldn't turn down. 

Watts deliberately asked if Beth had ever made a donation to TES.  Miller's response detailed how she bowed out of 2 recent events, adding that she gets paid for speaking.  I believe since she no longer teaches, she lives on the pay she gets for speaking engagements.  I do not believe that any $ from the recent events in Peru or Aruba are for her personal gain, but instead for the center in Washington DC. 

It seemed Miller eluded to Dave helping on searches for other missing persons, but I'm not sure about that.  If so, then Dave 'contributed'. 

I may be forgetting all the thoughts I would want to relay, but I think it's all about the money and notoriety. 

Maybe someone will fill in the blanks I have left. 
________________________________________________________________________________________


Tim is still trying to collect money to go and search in Aruba on those other 100 targets that Silvetti and
Company said they found.  Remember they were going to bring in the big boat from Trinidad.  There are no
other targets.  IMO

That other time that Tim was on with Steph, he admitted that human remains were found and
the Aruban authorities said that the remains were male.  Steph said on that show, that they were
going down to Aruba and had a big house and lots of steaks and beer and told Dave to come on down.
Dave went and they were all there for a week............did nothing.  It was just a vacation. IMO

I've wondered but never asked what they actually DID while they were there.  If the news reports were right and IIRC, Dave arrived one day..talked to the authorities...and left the next.  I don't think he was there the whole time.  It was curious to me that they (Tim) waited until they got there to find out they wouldn't be allowed to search ONE SINGLE area.  And exactly what was Steph's purpose there again?  And yet Tim wants to rant and rave about wanting the Natalee Holloway case to go away?  Like it's keeping him from searching for other people?  Seems to me it would be a matter of having better planning!  I hope he listens to all the crap he said on that show and thinks long and hard about what he's said!

 

 

I thought they never got to talk to authorities at all...not even Dave. 
They were going to search the bird sanctuary where Joran said he had put Natalee,
but could never get permission to search and somebody followed them and they got
scared, but Tim said tonight that they were treated royally.

[wreck]

You've posted this several times and I have had my thoughts about why and have posted them in the past.

Silvetti and Shaefer are businessmen.  They offered their services for the search. 

Miller is the founder of a nonprofit organization that searches for missing persons.  He relies on donations.  Silvetti and Shaefer still provide assistance.

The businessmen can donate time, equipment, staff, whatever and it has a $ amount.  They can write it off.

Miller, imo, could have been offered a deal he couldn't turn down. 

Watts deliberately asked if Beth had ever made a donation to TES.  Miller's response detailed how she bowed out of 2 recent events, adding that she gets paid for speaking.  I believe since she no longer teaches, she lives on the pay she gets for speaking engagements.  I do not believe that any $ from the recent events in Peru or Aruba are for her personal gain, but instead for the center in Washington DC. 

It seemed Miller eluded to Dave helping on searches for other missing persons, but I'm not sure about that.  If so, then Dave 'contributed'. 

I may be forgetting all the thoughts I would want to relay, but I think it's all about the money and notoriety. 

Maybe someone will fill in the blanks I have left. 
________________________________________________________________________________________


Tim is still trying to collect money to go and search in Aruba on those other 100 targets that Silvetti and
Company said they found.  Remember they were going to bring in the big boat from Trinidad.  There are no
other targets.  IMO

That other time that Tim was on with Steph, he admitted that human remains were found and
the Aruban authorities said that the remains were male.  Steph said on that show, that they were
going down to Aruba and had a big house and lots of steaks and beer and told Dave to come on down.
Dave went and they were all there for a week............did nothing.  It was just a vacation. IMO

I've wondered but never asked what they actually DID while they were there.  If the news reports were right and IIRC, Dave arrived one day..talked to the authorities...and left the next.  I don't think he was there the whole time.  It was curious to me that they (Tim) waited until they got there to find out they wouldn't be allowed to search ONE SINGLE area.  And exactly what was Steph's purpose there again?  And yet Tim wants to rant and rave about wanting the Natalee Holloway case to go away?  Like it's keeping him from searching for other people?  Seems to me it would be a matter of having better planning!  I hope he listens to all the crap he said on that show and thinks long and hard about what he's said!

 

 

I thought they never got to talk to authorities at all...not even Dave. 
They were going to search the bird sanctuary where Joran said he had put Natalee,
but could never get permission to search and somebody followed them and they got
scared, but Tim said tonight that they were treated royally.

Yeah, steaks and beer for all! No need for a search! 

[Bearlyhere]

I've copied and will work on clipping to just that portion where Tim is talking about Beth.   

Ive listened, quite sad for sure, geeze dont you think levi and steph both practise sounding like NG
Bombshell, they are both full of crap

It's sick and sad what has happened to Tim.

I'm in shock over this. I thought so highly of Tim Miller. We called him a true American hero. Did he not start his own foundation/notforprofit buisness (TES) when his own daughter was murdered? So how is he any different than Beth? I just can't believe how so many seemingly good people have lost their damn minds in this whole thing!!!!! I've been here since day one and it's still as crystal clear to me today as it was then. Tim Miller saw with his own eyes how that hellhole treated Beth AND Dave. He searched thru that landfill. He delt with what happened on the Persistance. Is it worth it, Tim, to sell your soul to the devil to get TES funded? I should probably shut up now cause I am PISSED.

I know how you feel Spooky, I've erased a record number of posts this evening.  And as much as I hate to admit it, I'm afraid you've probably hit the nail on the head.

I'm STILL PISSED TOO! 

I am happy I am in this with my heart, because my heart stretches bigger than anyone's pocketbook.  How could you choose money over what is right?  WTH happened to Tim's heart?

Wasn't one of the TES fundraisers canceled because of the weather?

[spooky112483]

Tim Miller said he apologizes in advance but he think Beth is exploiting Natalee.  I say she was not.  She is a woman on a mission to get the truth as to what happened to her daughter.  She will do anything to get the truth.

In my opinion Tim is mad because he said Dave was working on a plan going to Peru and questioning Joran.  To me I think Tim is mad because he believes she messed up Dave's plan.  Was Beth in on this plan?

NEWS FLASH FOR TIM MILLER:  BETH KNOWS SHE IS NATALEE'S MOTHER.

It's not about money it's about getting the truth.  You should know that Tim Miller.  Just because you are friends with Dave you don't go against the mother.

And you just made me think of something. For 5 years Dave and Beth have played two roles but both basically in conjuction with each other. A good cop bad cop if you will. Beth played the part of the bully and took the heat. Dave tried to be everyones friend. How many times did we hear him and Tim talk about not burning bridges and keeping your enemies close. And that was all great. Try everything to get Natalee back. But after Joran murdered again and is sitting in a Peruvian prison it is clear Dave's plan didn't work. Does anyone think Dave can go to Peru and hand Joran a Bible now?! Does anyone think that would work?! Joran has Beth running thru his veins. He hates her with every fiber of his being. I would say hate has turned to need. We all know what I am saying here. Only Beth can talk to him now.