Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND, OR #28 9/12/2010 - 9/18/2010

[klaasend]

Poster's are commenting on O's show today. The poster must be from the Chicago area (Time Zone).  

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/09/new_strategy_in_kyron_horman_c/4053/comments-newest.html

I thought Oprah wasn't on until 3 or 4pm which would mean that you couldn't have seen the entire show yet no matter what coast you are on in the US. 

[seahorse]

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message1170793/pg70

TOM JONES
User ID: 1060460
9/16/2010 5:12 AM

What Dede has heard about Rudy Sanchez (RS) from Terri ;
She said that neither Terri or herself are convinced RS did something with Kyron but can see possible motive and opprotunity on his part.
According to Dede sometime around last fall Terri told her that Kaine was continuing to pressure her to get more done around the house and property and that Terri was thinking of hiring a landscaper.
Then later at the birthday party in march Terri told her that she had hired a landscaper and that he had assaulted her in a sexual manner. Terri then talked to her about RS trying to contact her afterwards by phone one morning while she was with a friend from the gym eating at a IHOP.
This friend was also at terris birthday party, Terri had told her about RS and what had happened so she took the call for Terri and basically told RS to piss off and to quit calling and leave Terri alone.
According to Dede when she stayed with Terri she told her more about her interaction with RS.
Terri told the investigators about RS and what had happened, they left and investigated RS.
He then later showed up at Terris trying to extort the 10G, which turned out to be the botched sting.
According to Dede they both suspect RSs motive could be that his " machismo" was insulted when Terri rejected his advances and theorize that RS may have taken Kyron as revenge.
Considering his past record with children and his knowledge of the school grounds and operation, he would be comfortable there and if seen would be able to explained his being there rather easily because he had worked there.
They theorize when LE investigated RS infront of his family he came up with the MFH proposal of him by Terri, and then didn't have much choice but to play along with the sting operation set up by LE.
He had to to save his own skin and keep his family, who is now unaccounted for. What happened to them and where is Rudy Sanches?
Hummmmm........

Is this saying that RS and/or his family are 'missing'??  I know the source is questionable but have we heard anything stating something similar?  I would assume (HOPE) that LE has close tabs on RS AND his family just in case...

Tom Jones is full of cream cheese.     DDS is making a puppet out of Jones.  Who really thinks the LS
tried to get frisky with SM?   

[seahorse]

Poster's are commenting on O's show today. The poster must be from the Chicago area (Time Zone).  

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/09/new_strategy_in_kyron_horman_c/4053/comments-newest.html

I thought Oprah wasn't on until 3 or 4pm which would mean that you couldn't have seen the entire show yet no matter what coast you are on in the US. 

Klaas,

I think she is Live in Chicago in the morning and played at later times throught the US. 

http://www.oprah.com/index.html

[seahorse]

Ophra is recorded Live in Chicago 9:00 am.


http://listings2go.tvguide.com/PartnerGrid/Grids/closerlook.aspx?Qr=17611700&S=299&N=7&cl=WLS&DT=09/16/2010 09:00&cc=&SID=84409&PartnerID=216&ProfileID=1020

http://www.suntimes.com/television_listings/index.html

[sackyattack]

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message1170793/pg70

TOM JONES
User ID: 1060460
9/16/2010 5:12 AM

What Dede has heard about Rudy Sanchez (RS) from Terri ;
She said that neither Terri or herself are convinced RS did something with Kyron but can see possible motive and opprotunity on his part.
According to Dede sometime around last fall Terri told her that Kaine was continuing to pressure her to get more done around the house and property and that Terri was thinking of hiring a landscaper.
Then later at the birthday party in march Terri told her that she had hired a landscaper and that he had assaulted her in a sexual manner. Terri then talked to her about RS trying to contact her afterwards by phone one morning while she was with a friend from the gym eating at a IHOP.
This friend was also at terris birthday party, Terri had told her about RS and what had happened so she took the call for Terri and basically told RS to piss off and to quit calling and leave Terri alone.
According to Dede when she stayed with Terri she told her more about her interaction with RS.
Terri told the investigators about RS and what had happened, they left and investigated RS.
He then later showed up at Terris trying to extort the 10G, which turned out to be the botched sting.
According to Dede they both suspect RSs motive could be that his " machismo" was insulted when Terri rejected his advances and theorize that RS may have taken Kyron as revenge.
Considering his past record with children and his knowledge of the school grounds and operation, he would be comfortable there and if seen would be able to explained his being there rather easily because he had worked there.
They theorize when LE investigated RS infront of his family he came up with the MFH proposal of him by Terri, and then didn't have much choice but to play along with the sting operation set up by LE.
He had to to save his own skin and keep his family, who is now unaccounted for. What happened to them and where is Rudy Sanches?
Hummmmm........

Is this saying that RS and/or his family are 'missing'??  I know the source is questionable but have we heard anything stating something similar?  I would assume (HOPE) that LE has close tabs on RS AND his family just in case...

there is speculation that his wife and 2 kids are missing, it is in the rudy sanchez murder for hire thread, also on blinkoncrime comment sections

[novella]

I think, based on the sherriff's body language and inability to control emotions, that LE highly suspects Kyron is no longer with us.  What puzzles me is Desiree and Kaine...surely they would have been informed.  I think Kyron being stashed by Terri is the best case scenario that Desiree is hanging onto for dear life.  And personally, Desiree and Kaine continuing to finger Terri...though I do understand it...is not helping this case. 

[Scandi]

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message1170793/pg70

TOM JONES
User ID: 1060460
9/16/2010 5:12 AM

What Dede has heard about Rudy Sanchez (RS) from Terri ;
She said that neither Terri or herself are convinced RS did something with Kyron but can see possible motive and opprotunity on his part.
According to Dede sometime around last fall Terri told her that Kaine was continuing to pressure her to get more done around the house and property and that Terri was thinking of hiring a landscaper.
Then later at the birthday party in march Terri told her that she had hired a landscaper and that he had assaulted her in a sexual manner. Terri then talked to her about RS trying to contact her afterwards by phone one morning while she was with a friend from the gym eating at a IHOP.
This friend was also at terris birthday party, Terri had told her about RS and what had happened so she took the call for Terri and basically told RS to piss off and to quit calling and leave Terri alone.
According to Dede when she stayed with Terri she told her more about her interaction with RS.
Terri told the investigators about RS and what had happened, they left and investigated RS.
He then later showed up at Terris trying to extort the 10G, which turned out to be the botched sting.
According to Dede they both suspect RSs motive could be that his " machismo" was insulted when Terri rejected his advances and theorize that RS may have taken Kyron as revenge.
Considering his past record with children and his knowledge of the school grounds and operation, he would be comfortable there and if seen would be able to explained his being there rather easily because he had worked there.
They theorize when LE investigated RS infront of his family he came up with the MFH proposal of him by Terri, and then didn't have much choice but to play along with the sting operation set up by LE.
He had to to save his own skin and keep his family, who is now unaccounted for. What happened to them and where is Rudy Sanches?
Hummmmm........

Is this saying that RS and/or his family are 'missing'??  I know the source is questionable but have we heard anything stating something similar?  I would assume (HOPE) that LE has close tabs on RS AND his family just in case...

there is speculation that his wife and 2 kids are missing, it is in the rudy sanchez murder for hire thread, also on blinkoncrime comment sections

WOWSERS, and thanks for that Sacky.  Is he the one who was arrested and taken down to Sheridan?  Do you know if he is still there?  His arrest and transfer was just so timely with Kyron's case.   It could have nothing to do with Kyron's case, but I wonder if he is involved with the Mexican Mafia or their gang?  They are heartless and quite a force at least here in the Portland area.  I think Terri knew some real 'bad boys' !!!

[klaasend]

Poster's are commenting on O's show today. The poster must be from the Chicago area (Time Zone).  

http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/09/new_strategy_in_kyron_horman_c/4053/comments-newest.html

I thought Oprah wasn't on until 3 or 4pm which would mean that you couldn't have seen the entire show yet no matter what coast you are on in the US. 

Klaas,

I think she is Live in Chicago in the morning and played at later times throught the US. 

http://www.oprah.com/index.html

OK thanks.  I didn't realize it was actually on live in Chicago at 9am

[klaasend]

I think, based on the sherriff's body language and inability to control emotions, that LE highly suspects Kyron is no longer with us.  What puzzles me is Desiree and Kaine...surely they would have been informed.  I think Kyron being stashed by Terri is the best case scenario that Desiree is hanging onto for dear life.  And personally, Desiree and Kaine continuing to finger Terri...though I do understand it...is not helping this case. 

WHY, LE is also pointing the finger at Terri and has from the beginning.  I'm not forgetting the sexting Terri did with Michael Cook or the LS.  I'm not forgetting the MFH plot either.  LE believed it too.  If Terri is so innocent, why isn't she screaming at the top of her lungs to get her daughter back?

Nope, I don't buy it.

[Gypsy DD]

I think, based on the sherriff's body language and inability to control emotions, that LE highly suspects Kyron is no longer with us.  What puzzles me is Desiree and Kaine...surely they would have been informed.  I think Kyron being stashed by Terri is the best case scenario that Desiree is hanging onto for dear life.  And personally, Desiree and Kaine continuing to finger Terri...though I do understand it...is not helping this case. 

WHY, LE is also pointing the finger at Terri and has from the beginning.  I'm not forgetting the sexting Terri did with Michael Cook or the LS.  I'm not forgetting the MFH plot either.  LE believed it too.  If Terri is so innocent, why isn't she screaming at the top of her lungs to get her daughter back?

Nope, I don't buy it.

I am with you on this one Klaas.  If LE and the DA no longer suspected Terri, the DA would have met with her lawyer to let him know that..and also to request any info she had on others that might help solve the case.  IMO they have not let go of Terri, because tthe evil circling in this case has Terri at it's vortex.  Through Terri's group of aquaintances, and then fanning out from there..I take it they have uncovered some very disturbing things.  She is still on their radar, and so are her cohorts.  I really would like to uncover more on Terri and what she spent all day doing...

[zippiddy_doo_daw]

Kaine tells Oprah (Terri) 'would change her story daily'
http://www.kgw.com/news/Kyron-Hormans-parents-to-go-on-Oprah-missing-portland-102816349.html

Kaine Horman and Desiree Young used the worldwide clout of Oprah's media empire to appeal to the public to remember Kyron's face through buttons and bracelets, by any means, to buoy chances for his return.

Kaine also characterized when he first suspected something was amiss with his wife Terri Moulton Horman. It was the day she first flunked a polygraph exam.

"She would change her story daily, if not more than that," Kaine told Oprah. "Every time you talked to her, it was a little bit different about what happened that day."

(Includes a video clip on the link, also)

[novella]

Well, last time I checked...murder for hire is illegal...and they still have not arrested Terri on that plot...so my guess is...no evidence...Why no evidence?  Maybe the MFH is completely manufactured...the sheriff stated that some things would surprise us...Terri being arrested would not be a surprise...them following false testimony and setting up a completely bungled sting...????  Now, why make up a MFH plot?  Who does that?  Terri taking Kyron from school...too many what ifs...what if she was seen...what if Kyron told someone he was leaving...etc. etc...the abduction seems to be opportunistic...Now the MFH...could have drawn LE from the real perpetrators...The sexting...maybe Terri is just stupid...manipulative...lonely...PROBABLY...but her abducting Kyron at school...she does  not appear to be a sociopathic genius...she could be a sociopath...but the kind of coordination it took for her to pull off that kidnapping...took genius...and she doesn't strike me as the smartest cookie.  Now...I know why Desiree wants to believe that Terri took her...I would want to believe that too...it would mean that Kyron still has a chance at being alive...or that he was killed quickly without being tortured sexually...

Now...I do wonder...I have known sociopaths and pathological liars that quite often sabotage themselves with their poor planning and strangely +++++++ lies...so I could foresee that Terri could be one of those that sabotages herself...BUT they have absolutely nothing that links her to Kyron's abduction...it is all just speculation...so now I am supposed to suspend disbelief?  So the sociopath also has uncommonly incredibly stupendous luck in that she was able to whisk Kyron from the school grounds and nobody noticed...even when she was not the last person to see Kyron? 

I think the biggest surprise the LE could have ARE:  Rudy Sanchez is linked to very bad people and they believed his version of events....OR....someone at the school that day...possibly an employee...did something with Kyron. 

Where is the Grand Jury...strikes me strange that they have gone on recess before this press release.   

Surely...Terri the brilliant suspect...would have fouled up somewhere and we would have already seen that arrest...I mean...everyone and their grandmother is watching and digging up info on that woman...so what is it going to take?

[zippiddy_doo_daw]

Live blog: Kaine Horman and Desiree Young appear on Oprah Winfrey show
http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/09/live_blog_kaine_horman_and_des.html

Kyron's parents, Kaine Horman and Desiree Young, have worked to ensure that Kyron is not forgotten and have done multiple interviews about the boy. Today they appear on Oprah, which airs at 4 p.m. on KGW(.

This is a live blog of the show, which is airing now on the East Coast:

The show just started. Kaine Horman and Desiree Young will appear among other cases Oprah will cover during this show. First up: interviews with two Discovery hostages and the family of a South Carolina mother accused of killing her two children.

Oprah will ask Kyron's parents:  "Do you believe your son is still alive?"

We will update this with Kyron's segment as soon as it airs.

[mompalm]

Just finished watching Oprah segment on east coast. I did not catch anything really new, (does not mean I didn't miss something) but did note that both Kaine and Desiree seem unshakable in their belief that Terri is responsible and that Kyron is alive and being held somewhere.

Oprah asked some good questions, but did not delve really deep. It seemed that this was an effort to get info about Kyron out to a large audience, and Oprah graciously provided the vehicle to help Kyron's family.

I missed the news conference today - I am watching my 3 y.o. grandson and have been  offline most of the day. Will catch up tomorrow, but I didn't catch any acknowledgement from Kaine and Desiree about the news conference.  Maybe they weren't aware it was going to happen.

[sassifrass]

Hey Monkeys! Been taking some time to relax and recoup.

In the beginning, I have to admit I was on the fence regarding Terri. Then I started to remember my mother telling me that our words mean doo doo, it's our actions that are proof of ourselves and our inner feelings of who we are as people. I am absolutely guilty of hoof in mouth disease, but I hope that I am strong enough to admit when I'm wrong.

Terri has proved from her actions, time and time again, why she is suspect in this case. Mentioned many times, her MFH plot, the sexting with MC, and let's not forget her irrational comments days within Kyron was missing. Worrying about her hair color, walking out on one of the lie detector sessions, using bat phones, not fighting for Kiara, etc. Her actions speak for themselves. Does this sound normal or even rational for a person that has raised a child for 7 years?

Desiree said publicly that it was difficult for her to wake up in the morning and remember to eat, put her makeup on, etc. Her actions show a grieving mother.

Terri put herself in this position by her actions. I just pray that when this is all done that we find Kyron alive.   

[Gypsy DD]

Well, last time I checked...murder for hire is illegal...and they still have not arrested Terri on that plot...so my guess is...no evidence...Why no evidence?  Maybe the MFH is completely manufactured...the sheriff stated that some things would surprise us...Terri being arrested would not be a surprise...them following false testimony and setting up a completely bungled sting...????  Now, why make up a MFH plot?  Who does that?  Terri taking Kyron from school...too many what ifs...what if she was seen...what if Kyron told someone he was leaving...etc. etc...the abduction seems to be opportunistic...Now the MFH...could have drawn LE from the real perpetrators...The sexting...maybe Terri is just stupid...manipulative...lonely...PROBABLY...but her abducting Kyron at school...she does  not appear to be a sociopathic genius...she could be a sociopath...but the kind of coordination it took for her to pull off that kidnapping...took genius...and she doesn't strike me as the smartest cookie.  Now...I know why Desiree wants to believe that Terri took her...I would want to believe that too...it would mean that Kyron still has a chance at being alive...or that he was killed quickly without being tortured sexually...

Now...I do wonder...I have known sociopaths and pathological liars that quite often sabotage themselves with their poor planning and strangely +++++++ lies...so I could foresee that Terri could be one of those that sabotages herself...BUT they have absolutely nothing that links her to Kyron's abduction...it is all just speculation...so now I am supposed to suspend disbelief?  So the sociopath also has uncommonly incredibly stupendous luck in that she was able to whisk Kyron from the school grounds and nobody noticed...even when she was not the last person to see Kyron? 

I think the biggest surprise the LE could have ARE:  Rudy Sanchez is linked to very bad people and they believed his version of events....OR....someone at the school that day...possibly an employee...did something with Kyron. 

Where is the Grand Jury...strikes me strange that they have gone on recess before this press release.   

Surely...Terri the brilliant suspect...would have fouled up somewhere and we would have already seen that arrest...I mean...everyone and their grandmother is watching and digging up info on that woman...so what is it going to take?

BBM

We will not see nor hear about a single arrest in this case until every i is dotted and every t is crossed.  There is much more here then meets the eye..and they have to be ready to fully prosecute the day they arrest.  The clock starts ticking the minute her miranda rights are read to her.  They are not going to jeopardize the outcome of the trial by arresting her until they have everything they need to make the arrest stick..and justice to be served.

Terri may not have pulled the trigger, but she is guilty of cocking the gun.

 

[mchenry]

Well, last time I checked...murder for hire is illegal...and they still have not arrested Terri on that plot...so my guess is...no evidence...Why no evidence?  Maybe the MFH is completely manufactured...the sheriff stated that some things would surprise us...Terri being arrested would not be a surprise...them following false testimony and setting up a completely bungled sting...????  Now, why make up a MFH plot?  Who does that?  Terri taking Kyron from school...too many what ifs...what if she was seen...what if Kyron told someone he was leaving...etc. etc...the abduction seems to be opportunistic...Now the MFH...could have drawn LE from the real perpetrators...The sexting...maybe Terri is just stupid...manipulative...lonely...PROBABLY...but her abducting Kyron at school...she does  not appear to be a sociopathic genius...she could be a sociopath...but the kind of coordination it took for her to pull off that kidnapping...took genius...and she doesn't strike me as the smartest cookie.  Now...I know why Desiree wants to believe that Terri took her...I would want to believe that too...it would mean that Kyron still has a chance at being alive...or that he was killed quickly without being tortured sexually...

Now...I do wonder...I have known sociopaths and pathological liars that quite often sabotage themselves with their poor planning and strangely +++++++ lies...so I could foresee that Terri could be one of those that sabotages herself...BUT they have absolutely nothing that links her to Kyron's abduction...it is all just speculation...so now I am supposed to suspend disbelief?  So the sociopath also has uncommonly incredibly stupendous luck in that she was able to whisk Kyron from the school grounds and nobody noticed...even when she was not the last person to see Kyron? 

I think the biggest surprise the LE could have ARE:  Rudy Sanchez is linked to very bad people and they believed his version of events....OR....someone at the school that day...possibly an employee...did something with Kyron. 

Where is the Grand Jury...strikes me strange that they have gone on recess before this press release.   

Surely...Terri the brilliant suspect...would have fouled up somewhere and we would have already seen that arrest...I mean...everyone and their grandmother is watching and digging up info on that woman...so what is it going to take?

BBM

We will not see nor hear about a single arrest in this case until every i is dotted and every t is crossed.  There is much more here then meets the eye..and they have to be ready to fully prosecute the day they arrest.  The clock starts ticking the minute her miranda rights are read to her.  They are not going to jeopardize the outcome of the trial by arresting her until they have everything they need to make the arrest stick..and justice to be served.

Terri may not have pulled the trigger, but she is guilty of cocking the gun.

 

Great post Gypsy DD!!! ITA 

[TnMuse]

Re: "We have a knowledge of things we don’t want to know about. We have a knowledge of things we wish we didn’t," he said.

Could it be that LE found out that one or more of their own is involved with some bad things having to do with children? Not with Kyron, but involved in other things.  Finding out one of their own is involved would certainly be something LE something they wish they didn't know.

That is what I first thought as well.

It could also be something that would depress LE and probably LE would think is would surprise us, as well.

Puzzler:

From part 1 of the pc:

http://www.kgw.com/news/kyron-horman/Raw-Sheriff-on-Kyron-Horman-case-pt-1-103010894.html

QUESTION:  Can you talk about weither or not you think there are going to be other cases based on the stacks of information that are there?

ANSWER:  I believe that some of the information, through some of the discussions, there are going to be some concerns, not neccessarily cases, there may be cases, that come out of this, but through the discussion, there are going to be issues that the Sheriff's office is going to have to address. 
I believe the Portland Police Bureau will be actively involved in that.  Alot of these issues we won't address until we actually do a debrief on this investigation once it's come to a conclusion. 
There are alot of issues that have developed.  There's alot of information that our detectives that have, that they've developed through the course of this investigation, have developed some concerns.  And I think those concerns need to be addressed weither it's going to turn into an investigation and/or a notification process to other government entities.   That still remains to be assessed.

QUESTION: Are we talking criminal?
ANSWER: I can't comment on that.

For lack of a better phrase, I keep saying it seems like the investigation to Kyron going missing is like opening a can of worms.  After the can (case) is opened, all kinds of things are coming out.  It does appear that there are  a lot of issues (LE's words) that have come up and even within other government entities.  Wonder if there are any high officials in other areas or other cities...not necessarily LE officials, but government officials?

It does appear that way, and never would I have thought this. Scary to me what they might have all uncovered.

Good Morning NoRose and dear Monkey's All,

I just heard the Sheriff on a news blip on HLN and wish I had known I'd need a pencil and paper to get it right !!!  ;}  But the jist is the Sheriff said they have learned info in the case they wished they hadn't and it is so surprising it will come back into your thoughts later to be pondered.  The last part about pondering what happened was what he meant, and my mind immediately went to Ann Rule's statement in her interview about Kyron's case where she said when we learn what was happening it will be explosive.

I believe the Portland Police Bureau will be actively involved in that.
Does this tell us WHERE they found the information they wish they didn't know?

I think those concerns need to be addressed weither it's going to turn into an investigation and/or a notification process to other government entities.

I think this means either it is corruption within law enforcement or something that is more national or international in nature and therefore would not be something investigated only on a local level.

[Scandi]

Hi Novella,  A thought provoking post and thanks for that.  You said "I think the biggest surprise the LE could have ARE:  Rudy Sanchez is linked to very bad people and they believed his version of events....OR....someone at the school that day...possibly an employee...did something with Kyron. 

I think the worst thing LE could learn is that Kyron was being abused, maybe by Sanchez or one of his ILK.  It would make 'mad men' out of LE officers, so to speak, especially if TH was a promoter of it.  Maybe he had threatened to tell his dad.  That would give a definite motive to have him disappear permanently on TH's part.  She just had no idea the case would mushroom into a major media event.  The threat of losing her marriage and the financial freedom it afforded her would be too much to lose IMO.

I think she is plenty smart and clever too.  With all the things Sassofras mentions, down to what I think was trying to confuse the teacher about the Dr's appt, I think she had this planned down to a T.

If so there will be something that will nail her when the time is right and LE and the DA sort out how to put it all together legally.  I think that is a given.    xox and IMO

I think that is the one thing that fits together with what the Sheriff said today.

[Tracygirl]

I am not fully convinced Terri is the mastermind behind this. I don't think she is the one pulling the strings or she thought of this plan.