Kyron Horman, 7 years old PORTLAND,OR #29 9/18/10 - 9/21/10

[Puzzler]

Ky's alleged comment......Terri's DEAD.......It's said that he was a smart little guy, could these supposed fits & seizures be just a way of ignoring her?  He was being possibly verbally abused by TH, hopefully not physical also, but he could have just been in protection mode when around TH by himself.    Perhaps he found by being "wierd" she would back off....

Why would a 7 y.o come up with that wording?  Did he hear someone else say that...someone who might have thought Ky wasn't listening?

[Scandi]

Bearlyhere-I was thinking Terri could have swapped cars after the Freddie's visit.  She could have driven the truck to the school, done whatever, drove to Freddie's, and then switched cars (assuming Intel has no parking lot security/gate guards).  Theoretically, she could have used the car and returned it to the same parking spot (as I've done with my spouse's before) in plenty of time before Kaine left (car cooled).  She had a good hour to play with between the Freddie's receipt and the gym.  I'm wondering if she picked Dede up, got the car, did whatever, dropped the car off, dropped Dede off, and headed to the gym?  Dede's car was supposedly on the property, but Dede wasn't (per the home owner and her co-worker).  In light of Dede's "absence", she either met someone on the property and did whatever or someone provided the means for her to leave the property (picked her up and dropped her back off).  JMO  Just trying to think through how someone could have spotted the mustang and a white truck simultaneously on Sauvie.  I'm wondering if Intel has parking lot surveillance video for June 4th and what it shows, and the same for the gym.  Just hinking out loud.  All MOO 

Also ISpy, LE said in that presser on the 12th they wanted any witnesses seeing her in the area of those 5 roads between 10:15 and 10:45am.  Those roads all lead to Newberry which like I said earlier merges with Hwy #30 very close to the SI bridge. 

In other words I think this would fit into the timeline.


PS:  My boss's wife works at Intel.  I'll call her in the morning and ask about the security measures one would encounter getting in and out of the parking lot there.  So we know what bldg he worked in?  Maybe engineering is enough.

[ISpy]

** Self-Edit**  Thinking, not hinking...although that could be an accurate description also.     Since I can't seem to spell or type straight, it's time to run.  Have a good evening, everyone!

O/T Shell- It's been awhile since I've seen you on Caylee's thread.  Good to see you here.

[Scandi]

Ky's alleged comment......Terri's DEAD.......It's said that he was a smart little guy, could these supposed fits & seizures be just a way of ignoring her?  He was being possibly verbally abused by TH, hopefully not physical also, but he could have just been in protection mode when around TH by himself.    Perhaps he found by being "wierd" she would back off....

Why would a 7 y.o come up with that wording?  Did he hear someone else say that...someone who might have thought Ky wasn't listening?

Wow Puzzler, I'm hearing so many new things tonight.  Amazing    ;}

[Bearlyhere]

21.Letsworktogether says:
September 19, 2010 at 7:53 pm
 
Kyron knew who he left the school with, not a stranger, and not his stepmom.



Indeed.
B

FOX 12: You've all said recently that you think someone else besides Terri may have been involved in Kyron's disappearance. Do you have any theories about who that may be?

Kaine Horman: currently I do not although i do believe that it is someone that Kyron has met before, whether I know of the person or they were only a friend of Terri's.

http://www.kptv.com/news/24283158/detail.html

[Puzzler]

Bearlyhere-I was thinking Terri could have swapped cars after the Freddie's visit.  She could have driven the truck to the school, done whatever, drove to Freddie's, and then switched cars (assuming Intel has no parking lot security/gate guards).  Theoretically, she could have used the car and returned it to the same parking spot (as I've done with my spouse's before) in plenty of time before Kaine left (car cooled).  She had a good hour to play with between the Freddie's receipt and the gym.  I'm wondering if she picked Dede up, got the car, did whatever, dropped the car off, dropped Dede off, and headed to the gym?  Dede's car was supposedly on the property, but Dede wasn't (per the home owner and her co-worker).  In light of Dede's "absence", she either met someone on the property and did whatever or someone provided the means for her to leave the property (picked her up and dropped her back off).  JMO  Just trying to think through how someone could have spotted the mustang and a white truck simultaneously on Sauvie.  I'm wondering if Intel has parking lot surveillance video for June 4th and what it shows, and the same for the gym.  Just hinking out loud.  All MOO 

Also ISpy, LE said in that presser on the 12th they wanted any witnesses seeing her in the area of those 5 roads between 10:15 and 10:45am.  Those roads all lead to Newberry which like I said earlier merges with Hwy #30 very close to the SI bridge. 

In other words I think this would fit into the timeline.


PS:  My boss's wife works at Intel.  I'll call her in the morning and ask about the security measures one would encounter getting in and out of the parking lot there.  So we know what bldg he worked in?  Maybe engineering is enough.

Ooohhh...good one!  Would love to know about the parking lot at Intel.  THANK YOU!

[Shell]

** Self-Edit**  Thinking, not hinking...although that could be an accurate description also.     Since I can't seem to spell or type straight, it's time to run.  Have a good evening, everyone!

O/T Shell- It's been awhile since I've seen you on Caylee's thread.  Good to see you here.

Good to see you too ISpy.  I pop in every now and then, not as often as I would like.

[Scatty]

Ky's alleged comment......Terri's DEAD.......It's said that he was a smart little guy, could these supposed fits & seizures be just a way of ignoring her?  He was being possibly verbally abused by TH, hopefully not physical also, but he could have just been in protection mode when around TH by himself.    Perhaps he found by being "wierd" she would back off....

Why would a 7 y.o come up with that wording?  Did he hear someone else say that...someone who might have thought Ky wasn't listening?

Hmm. Maybe Terri DID run afoul of some nasty types. Kaine had mentioned that he'd found out she was spending money like water and he probably tightened the purse strings. Maybe what she was spending on wasn't legal. Or maybe she borrowed. Maybe the bad gal owed some bad guys too much money and wasn't able to pay thanks to Kaine's newly watchful eye. Maybe Kyron overhead a threat to Terri or Terri telling someone of a threat that she would be DEAD if she didn't pay up. I don't think Kyron's abduction was a revenge thing; he may have been Terri's sacrificial lamb to settle her debts. Child pornographers come to mind.

[Bearlyhere]

Thanks ISpy - Good to see you here.
I do not believe Terri had much respect for Ms. Porter. Desiree even said that Terri would email her and complain of Ms. Porter. Terri saying " I should have her Job" ..what a horrible thing to say. If Terri was employed as a Teacher, I bet she would not be checking " Ms. Porter or Kyron" every day. I think it was on a mission of hers to break Ms. Porter down.. Why? Because she could. She/Terri could smell Ms. Porter's anxiety and she fed off it.  Ego ID issues Yes?

I think that Terri has a personality traits; that she is not one people go towards, People keep their distance from her .. *because they do not know how she is going to react. *Kyron included.
 

I agree with the statement I bolded.  As a woman, there is no way I can imagine her having many/any female friends.  I am not sure she is even interested in having any female friends.  She is surrounded by Moms and teachers who put children first, I cannot see Terri putting anyone but Terri first.  When you are in a friend relationship with someone, there is not only taking, but giving.  When someone is always giving 100% or very close to it, in a relationship, that person will burn out, then the relationship will burn out.  People cannot maintain 100% of a two-way relationship, it can't happen.

I cannot believe she checked on Kyron and his behavior every day.  What a control freak.  I had a therapist who wanted my son's behavior checked every 5 minutes and if he failed to be perfect at any time, he was to be punished.  He was 5 at the time.  She sounds like one of them.  Did I do it?  Heck no!  I showed her the door and reported her.

[Bearlyhere]

Basement of Skyline Elementary School

Skyline School Service Day

Dear Skyline School Community and Neighbors:

Many of you are aware that on May 2, 2010, more than 125 volunteers from Sunset Presbyterian spent the day at Skyline School doing inside and outside projects.  With the help of several Skyline parents, students and neighbors the amount of work that was done that day was truly amazing. In a continuing effort to support our school and complete the work started on May 2nd, Sunset Presbyterian volunteers will be returning on Sunday, August 29th for “Skyline Service Day”. Here are some of the projects that we will be doing:

    * Finish painting exterior metal handrails.
    * Finish painting trim in two classrooms.
    * Paint one wall in the library.
    * Clean out and reorganize “volunteer” room and “locker rooms” in basement of school.
    * Landscaping around the school.
    * Track maintenance

This will be our 10th and final year as Skyline parents and we are thrilled to partner with Sunset Presbyterian church for Skyline Service Day. This has been a difficult last few months for our Skyline staff and families, and we want to make sure that our school looks especially great when our kids return to class in September. As the project leaders we are seeking additional volunteers for the day from the Skyline community.  In addition, we are looking for donations of water and snacks that we can provide to the volunteers during the day.  If you are unable to volunteer we are also seeking monetary donations to help fund the purchase of supplies (paint, equipment, bark dust, etc.) needed for the day.

If you can help out in any capacity please contact us at maggieschweinfurth@comcast.net. Thanks so much!

--- EEEK someone could have stuffed Kyron into a locker ... " Why would they have Projects in the Basement? "
Soo the basement holds " Volunteer offices? a area where Volunteers do what? " and the other part is the Locker Room for Staff? or Locker Room for Storage?

Who is responsible for the Security of this School ???

May 2nd, that is almost One Month to the Date Kyron went Missing. More than 125 people came and roamed the school inside and out for the entire day ...
That would have given someone " the Ability" to Roam the Basement " the layout of the school" and check it out .. and no one would know.

August comes around and they are still inviting every one and anyone inside the school.

http://srnpdx.org/newsline-august-21-2010

Geesh!!

Puzzler, what really ticks me off on this- is School was still very much in Session. This was not after school closed for the Summer. This Day could have potentially been the beginning of Kyron's demise.

You are right, sadly.  Anyone could have come in a staked out the place.

 

[Deenie]

I don't know why they did not call Desiree (their contact person) when Kyron did not show up for the talent show.  He stood his partner up.  I would have been worried enough to call someone as that was not normal behavior for him.  At this point I would have been too worried about him.

The teachers at my son's school say they check email every hour.  There are a lot of checks and balances when removing a child from school or suspecting anything going on at home.  There are none, however, protecting our children from those that are within the walls of the school and there have been too many issues with those that the district has hired for my liking.  We try to keep our children away from strangers and then let them loose in a school full of strangers, moo.

Here's something I don't understand: why would Desiree be the contact person? She lives hours away. Kaine is in the same town. Terri is in the same town and is the stay at home caretaker. Why not one of them?

Maybe it is because " Terri " is not able to represent Kyron " Legally" " Medically" because Terri is not his adoptive Mom. But his step mom via Marriage. She has no custody of Kyron.
That is why Desiree overrides Terri... Desiree and Kaine are the bio's and are the only ones that make decisions " In a emergency " situation. I think.

[zippiddy_doo_daw]

In this photo: DeDe Spicher, Terri Moulton Horman, Liz Wenz
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2056413&id=1264414625#!/photo.php?pid=1173436&id=1264414625&ref=fbx_album&fbid=1408293968415

I'd like to know who the child is, sitting across from Terri, in this pic.  Note the 2 child-size cups, the Azteca coloring page maze, and the crayon in his left hand.  Yes, his , as the plaid shirt is way too masculine for a young girl.  He appears to be rather small boned as well.  There's a third child-size cup to the right a little, as well.  Do we know who attended this shindig?  TIA!

In the lightened picture (I think P. 14 of this thread) the kid looks like he has light brown hair. I'm thinking maybe Kurtis Villareal?

ISpy - It's a little girl in the plaid shirt - on this link:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2056413&id=1264414625#!/photo.php?pid=1172398&id=1264414625&ref=fbx_album

I don't feel all that comfy posting the photo of the 2 little girls online
Here's a link to all of the "March 2010" photo's on Terri's Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2056413&id=1264414625

[Bearlyhere]

Bearlyhere-I was thinking Terri could have swapped cars after the Freddie's visit.  She could have driven the truck to the school, done whatever, drove to Freddie's, and then switched cars (assuming Intel has no parking lot security/gate guards).  Theoretically, she could have used the car and returned it to the same parking spot (as I've done with my spouse's before) in plenty of time before Kaine left (car cooled).  She had a good hour to play with between the Freddie's receipt and the gym.  I'm wondering if she picked Dede up, got the car, did whatever, dropped the car off, dropped Dede off, and headed to the gym?  Dede's car was supposedly on the property, but Dede wasn't (per the home owner and her co-worker).  In light of Dede's "absence", she either met someone on the property and did whatever or someone provided the means for her to leave the property (picked her up and dropped her back off).  JMO  Just trying to think through how someone could have spotted the mustang and a white truck simultaneously on Sauvie.  I'm wondering if Intel has parking lot surveillance video for June 4th and what it shows, and the same for the gym.  Just hinking out loud.  All MOO 

I hope they have surveillance.  Does your husband work for a small or large company?  Does he have assigned parking?

My brother used to "borrow" my car from my work parking lot while I was at work.  It was always a challenge to find it after work when he did borrow it, or at first, frightening when I had to run an errand at lunchtime, only to find my car was gone.  Sometimes I had to wait until the parking lot cleared up some until I could find my car.  He went to college down the street from my job.  This was before cell phones.  He and his friend wanted to work out.

I could borrow my Dad's car while he was at work, but he had assigned parking.  He always knew when I did though, I told him before.



 

[Scandi]

Bearlyhere-I was thinking Terri could have swapped cars after the Freddie's visit.  She could have driven the truck to the school, done whatever, drove to Freddie's, and then switched cars (assuming Intel has no parking lot security/gate guards).  Theoretically, she could have used the car and returned it to the same parking spot (as I've done with my spouse's before) in plenty of time before Kaine left (car cooled).  She had a good hour to play with between the Freddie's receipt and the gym.  I'm wondering if she picked Dede up, got the car, did whatever, dropped the car off, dropped Dede off, and headed to the gym?  Dede's car was supposedly on the property, but Dede wasn't (per the home owner and her co-worker).  In light of Dede's "absence", she either met someone on the property and did whatever or someone provided the means for her to leave the property (picked her up and dropped her back off).  JMO  Just trying to think through how someone could have spotted the mustang and a white truck simultaneously on Sauvie.  I'm wondering if Intel has parking lot surveillance video for June 4th and what it shows, and the same for the gym.  Just hinking out loud.  All MOO 

Also ISpy, LE said in that presser on the 12th they wanted any witnesses seeing her in the area of those 5 roads between 10:15 and 10:45am.  Those roads all lead to Newberry which like I said earlier merges with Hwy #30 very close to the SI bridge. 

In other words I think this would fit into the timeline.


PS:  My boss's wife works at Intel.  I'll call her in the morning and ask about the security measures one would encounter getting in and out of the parking lot there.  So we know what bldg he worked in?  Maybe engineering is enough.

Ooohhh...good one!  Would love to know about the parking lot at Intel.  THANK YOU!

Will do.  I wish I had more info to give her about which facility or bldg he works in.  I think it is the one by Hwy26 where they've had a problem with a runner in their park patting gals in inappropriate places.  lol

[Bearlyhere]

** Self-Edit**  Thinking, not hinking...although that could be an accurate description also.     Since I can't seem to spell or type straight, it's time to run.  Have a good evening, everyone!

O/T Shell- It's been awhile since I've seen you on Caylee's thread.  Good to see you here.

Good to see you too ISpy.  I pop in every now and then, not as often as I would like.

Not as often as we would like, either.  I so wish you would put a link to your thread in your address line.  I would love to see the pictures again.  You have come through so much, Shell, and deserve kudos.

 

[Deenie]

Bearly I wonder how many employees work at Kaine's Intel location?

When I worked at a Drs. Office we as employees were given Key Cards to park in the parking structure across the street. Our Doc, paid our parking. The only " Reserved " spaces had plates on the wall that said the persons name " Doctor Smith" ...everyone else it was find it if you can. It was definitely an  incentive to get to work early. The next structure that took our cards was 3 blocks away..

I know the only Reserved spaces were for Doctors/Lawyers/Yadda was on the first floor which is kind of disclosed because " you could figure out right away" the vehicles were a bit more sheltered and protected vs ..parking in the structure itself. Not only that but they were in Eye View of those who were in the Ticket Booths ..monitoring all who entered and exited.

However you could enter in different sides floor level " You needed to have the Key Card though" or take a " Ticket" and not be seen directly by the Booth people.
I do know that we were issued ONE card per person. But the office manager always kept a spare/copy of your card just in case ..your card was damaged or lost.
I always left my card in my counsel, I never removed it. Then I always knew exactly where it was. I don't know if Kaine would have a Key Card for Parking ..or even have more than one for back up. ??? One in each Horman Vehicle? so it would not be misplaced? Guys even leave their wallets in their car half the time ..which I have never figured out.

[Deenie]

Thanks ISpy - Good to see you here.
I do not believe Terri had much respect for Ms. Porter. Desiree even said that Terri would email her and complain of Ms. Porter. Terri saying " I should have her Job" ..what a horrible thing to say. If Terri was employed as a Teacher, I bet she would not be checking " Ms. Porter or Kyron" every day. I think it was on a mission of hers to break Ms. Porter down.. Why? Because she could. She/Terri could smell Ms. Porter's anxiety and she fed off it.  Ego ID issues Yes?

I think that Terri has a personality traits; that she is not one people go towards, People keep their distance from her .. *because they do not know how she is going to react. *Kyron included.
 

I agree with the statement I bolded.  As a woman, there is no way I can imagine her having many/any female friends.  I am not sure she is even interested in having any female friends.  She is surrounded by Moms and teachers who put children first, I cannot see Terri putting anyone but Terri first.  When you are in a friend relationship with someone, there is not only taking, but giving.  When someone is always giving 100% or very close to it, in a relationship, that person will burn out, then the relationship will burn out.  People cannot maintain 100% of a two-way relationship, it can't happen.

I cannot believe she checked on Kyron and his behavior every day.  What a control freak.  I had a therapist who wanted my son's behavior checked every 5 minutes and if he failed to be perfect at any time, he was to be punished.  He was 5 at the time.  She sounds like one of them.  Did I do it?  Heck no!  I showed her the door and reported her.

Good For You, Go Mom
To tell you the truth, I don't think Terri likes women period. Why I say this is because of the way she did treat Ms. Porter. And the disrespect she showed Desiree! From Day one. From the moment she met Kaine. Kaine when ever he let it slide to Terri ..Oh by the way .. I am Married and my Wife is Pregnant ... she never backed away. I think it made her pursue Kaine even more so. It was a challenge for Terri .. I WON ... sorry Desiree. My gf lived with a guy for almost 5 yrs. She practically raised his two little ones. This couple they spent alot of time with, always was at my Gf's house..the woman started telling my GF she was having problems with her Man, wanting to leave him. My friend being Nice was trying to console her. So it led to a lot of girl talk and comparing their partners etc. Then they actually became friendly. The guys being friends first. Gal dumped her Guy and told " B" my gf, I need to concentrate on me.. get my life together .. Oh she did alright.
My friend then started working with this gal. Side job almost like Hospice not quite. The woman would ask my friend to trade shifts with her on a moments notice. Come to find out this woman " was sleeping with my best friends man" while she sent her off ..to work night shifts. How's that for calculating ? They got into a huge cat fight, was their last conversation .. this woman told my best friend .. You have been telling me for months he didn't make you happy .. " So I took Him" .. EVIL EVIL EVIL ... Just like Terri.

[Bearlyhere]

In this photo: DeDe Spicher, Terri Moulton Horman, Liz Wenz
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2056413&id=1264414625#!/photo.php?pid=1173436&id=1264414625&ref=fbx_album&fbid=1408293968415

I'd like to know who the child is, sitting across from Terri, in this pic.  Note the 2 child-size cups, the Azteca coloring page maze, and the crayon in his left hand.  Yes, his , as the plaid shirt is way too masculine for a young girl.  He appears to be rather small boned as well.  There's a third child-size cup to the right a little, as well.  Do we know who attended this shindig?  TIA!

In the lightened picture (I think P. 14 of this thread) the kid looks like he has light brown hair. I'm thinking maybe Kurtis Villareal?

ISpy - It's a little girl in the plaid shirt - on this link:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2056413&id=1264414625#!/photo.php?pid=1172398&id=1264414625&ref=fbx_album

I don't feel all that comfy posting the photo of the 2 little girls online
Here's a link to all of the "March 2010" photo's on Terri's Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2056413&id=1264414625

This is not what she wanted for this special birthday.  Not one of those smiles is genuine.  Look at her eyes.  A party with friends and kids, and her own too, who she needed to watch during her party at a restaurant.  No indeed, she was after some Terri time.

 

[Bearlyhere]

Thanks ISpy - Good to see you here.
I do not believe Terri had much respect for Ms. Porter. Desiree even said that Terri would email her and complain of Ms. Porter. Terri saying " I should have her Job" ..what a horrible thing to say. If Terri was employed as a Teacher, I bet she would not be checking " Ms. Porter or Kyron" every day. I think it was on a mission of hers to break Ms. Porter down.. Why? Because she could. She/Terri could smell Ms. Porter's anxiety and she fed off it.  Ego ID issues Yes?

I think that Terri has a personality traits; that she is not one people go towards, People keep their distance from her .. *because they do not know how she is going to react. *Kyron included.
 

I agree with the statement I bolded.  As a woman, there is no way I can imagine her having many/any female friends.  I am not sure she is even interested in having any female friends.  She is surrounded by Moms and teachers who put children first, I cannot see Terri putting anyone but Terri first.  When you are in a friend relationship with someone, there is not only taking, but giving.  When someone is always giving 100% or very close to it, in a relationship, that person will burn out, then the relationship will burn out.  People cannot maintain 100% of a two-way relationship, it can't happen.

I cannot believe she checked on Kyron and his behavior every day.  What a control freak.  I had a therapist who wanted my son's behavior checked every 5 minutes and if he failed to be perfect at any time, he was to be punished.  He was 5 at the time.  She sounds like one of them.  Did I do it?  Heck no!  I showed her the door and reported her.

Good For You, Go Mom
To tell you the truth, I don't think Terri likes women period. Why I say this is because of the way she did treat Ms. Porter. And the disrespect she showed Desiree! From Day one. From the moment she met Kaine. Kaine when ever he let it slide to Terri ..Oh by the way .. I am Married and my Wife is Pregnant ... she never backed away. I think it made her pursue Kaine even more so. It was a challenge for Terri .. I WON ... sorry Desiree. My gf lived with a guy for almost 5 yrs. She practically raised his two little ones. This couple they spent alot of time with, always was at my Gf's house..the woman started telling my GF she was having problems with her Man, wanting to leave him. My friend being Nice was trying to console her. So it led to a lot of girl talk and comparing their partners etc. Then they actually became friendly. The guys being friends first. Gal dumped her Guy and told " B" my gf, I need to concentrate on me.. get my life together .. Oh she did alright.
My friend then started working with this gal. Side job almost like Hospice not quite. The woman would ask my friend to trade shifts with her on a moments notice. Come to find out this woman " was sleeping with my best friends man" while she sent her off ..to work night shifts. How's that for calculating ? They got into a huge cat fight, was their last conversation .. this woman told my best friend .. You have been telling me for months he didn't make you happy .. " So I took Him" .. EVIL EVIL EVIL ... Just like Terri.

I would never have dated a married man with a child on the way.  I may have gone out with him (friendly, not romantically) and talked to him and told him why he should be with his wife and what she was going through during this time.  My Doctor used to say I made a good counselor, I would talk to guys, who were separated from their wives, when they asked me out.  I sent them all back to them, for some reason I was able to talk to them about why they should stay (no lectures).  These were not bad situations, just two people not understanding each other who needed to communicate.  They are still with their wives to this day and thank me for helping them see their wives' point of view.  I could never take someone's man. 

A pregnant woman's man?  No way no how.  Now that we know Desiree, we see there was no rush for him to get out of there and into another woman's life.  She was not a threat to him.  He, however, was a threat to the health of his child, stress is very very bad for an unborn child.

[Deenie]

  I agree with you 100 percent Bearly ... 

I don't want to make our stack any bigger ....  this old monkey is headed to the Bunker
Tomorrow is another day.  Let's Find Kyron.
Good Night/morning to all
K