Natalee Holloway Case Discussion #852 11/20/10 - 11/23/10

[snoopy]

This has been such a chain of events lately.  Beth really stirred something up a few weeks ago when she was in Aruba.  Wonder what it was that got Tim so riled up?  hhhmmmm my mind is spinning now.  haha

[texasmom]

Forgot until just now....Tim Miller also said:  We'll probably also find her clothes in that container.

Wonder if they'll still be in the ziplock baggies!  

Tim Miller sounds mighty confident about all of this!  


 

I was waiting for him to ask for donations...but it wasn't mentioned.  Neither did
he mention Silvetti or Shaeffer.

Maybe the second recovery is on Aruba's dime! 

 

[carpe noctem]

Tim,

Do not let your mouth write a check...

That your




Can`t cash.


One day at a time, brother.

[texasmom]

This has been such a chain of events lately.  Beth really stirred something up a few weeks ago when she was in Aruba.  Wonder what it was that got Tim so riled up?  hhhmmmm my mind is spinning now.  haha

[texasmom]

Forgot until just now....Tim Miller also said:  We'll probably also find her clothes in that container.

We know

 

[Magnolia]

Forgot until just now....Tim Miller also said:  We'll probably also find her clothes in that container.

Wonder if they'll still be in the ziplock baggies!  

Tim Miller sounds mighty confident about all of this!  


 

I was waiting for him to ask for donations...but it wasn't mentioned.  Neither did
he mention Silvetti or Shaeffer.

Maybe the second recovery is on Aruba's dime! 

 

Tim said a while back ...the Jen Hale interview...that they had $1.5 million
earmarked for the search of the 141 targets.  Then when he drew criticism,
he retracted the statement...said it hurt donations.

[crazybabyborg]

I know Snoopy. I did three days work today hoping to be able to stay home tomorrow. I find myself wishing Thanksgiving was next week..............   

I want Beth and Dave to be able to bring her home!! I want Natalee's remains to have a respectful burial and for there to be a place Beth can take flowers! I want Beth to feel like she has accomplished all she can do and I want her to know that this last act she can do for Natalee has been accomplished purely out of her heart and the determination of love from a Mother for her daughter!

I want Natalee to be far from the evil of Aruba!

[sb]

Gathered 'round the circle in our Cage tonight, waiting with all of you.

Sounds like Dave may have some info that hasn't been released as of yet, but he sounds pretty certain.

I noted that glenda posted on the human refuse site & said that the results would go to JQK so that he could inform the family, right before they make the announcement (back around pg. 21-22 or so). This could be why it's been all quiet on the front today. But of course the accuracy and validity of that source is rather questionable. To say the least.

Rob, my friend, is of the opinion that finding remains will immediately "validate" all of the evidence collected and will trigger the case (that has already been built) at last. I don't know if I am that optimistic that this will wind up being the difference-maker that we may think it is. I am kind of questioning if there will be much forensic value in this small remains that could be unequivocally used against JVDS or K2. Given that Aruba and Holland have such a high bar set against any incrimination of ANY kind for even a CLEARLY GUILTY person...

UNLESS... they have (a) evidence we don't know about, and (b) the WILL to go for broke and press on with a vengeance to try the case, I still feel like Justice for Natalee may more or less have to ride shotgun to Justice for Stephany Flores.

But it will be Justice nevertheless.

And THAT is how God does things. You may walk today, but you will hang the next time.

Wonder what happens to the Kalpoes LOL.

I still am kind of overwhelmed with the thought that we may finally sort of have Natalee tangibly WITH US, whereas those of us who never met her have only kind of known OF her, in an abstract way, through a glass darkly, by means of the memories of her family and the accounts of what happened there on that island that night. And I am gladdened by the thought that she may at last, COME HOME in a physical sense.

But of course we know where she REALLY is, and where she has been that night, don't we?

I thought when Joran went to jail that we were getting some fulfillment at last. THIS would be to me, even bigger. That Beth gets to bring her Home.

Let Us Continue...   

[crazybabyborg]

Wonderful Post sb!! GREAT to see you!! 

[Northern Rose]

A possible second bone has been found off the coast of Aruba, and Nancy Grace spoke with the tourists who found it. (video)

http://www.cnn.com/video/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_freevideo+%28RSS%3A+Video%29&utm_content=Twitter#/video/crime/2010/11/22/ng.aruba.bone.found.hln

[crazybabyborg]

This has been such a chain of events lately.  Beth really stirred something up a few weeks ago when she was in Aruba.  Wonder what it was that got Tim so riled up?  hhhmmmm my mind is spinning now.  haha

I will never get over how Tim turned on Beth. Never.

[crazybabyborg]

A possible second bone has been found off the coast of Aruba, and Nancy Grace spoke with the tourists who found it. (video)

http://www.cnn.com/video/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_freevideo+%28RSS%3A+Video%29&utm_content=Twitter#/video/crime/2010/11/22/ng.aruba.bone.found.hln

Thanks, NR!!

[klaasend]

A possible second bone has been found off the coast of Aruba, and Nancy Grace spoke with the tourists who found it. (video)

http://www.cnn.com/video/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fcnn_freevideo+%28RSS%3A+Video%29&utm_content=Twitter#/video/crime/2010/11/22/ng.aruba.bone.found.hln

6-8 inches long about an inch or so wide according to the mom

[Tamikosmom]

Forgot until just now....Tim Miller also said:  We'll probably also find her clothes in that container.

We know

The January 7, 2008 Recovery Dive

Kyle Kingman - In His Own Words

Kyle Kingman:  For Jan 7th, Eduardo wasn't on the boat, neither were any media, Tim Miller, or Tim Trahan.

Kyle Kingman: The Persistence had no divers on the 7th. Tim Trahan was our diver on the 30th-Dec, but he was out of the country at the time. The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat.

Kyle Kingman:  Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF

Kyle Kingman: In my opinion, the blue fabric is quite possibly Natalee's skirt. The divers found the denim where I suggested a week earlier (Dec 29th) to Tim Miller that there was likely Natalee's denim skirt under the sand. Also in my opinion, the deni-like fabric is a match in terms of color, quantity, and structure to Natalee's skirt.

Kyle Kingman: The fabric(s?) are not visible on either the Dec 29th or 30th dives. There is about an inch of sand over the fabrics. The fabrics are completely covered. The diver sampled the sand and found the fabric underneath the sand. He then bagged the blue fabric. If the other bag contains fabric, it was also in the sand.

Kyle Kingman:  The bags were removed just after the ROV got out of the way when the divers took the samples to their boat.... and took off.

Kyle Kingman: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th.

Kyle Kingman: I get done in the survey room backing up the ROV dive and head to the back deck to talk to the Polis divers and see what they sampled and see the Polis boat way in the distance heading away fast. John doesn't seem concerned at all, but I am very dissapointed, concerned, and burning inside because I have a feeling that I/we will never know what they took from the trap. That evening I talked to John asking when we plan on recovering the trap. Previously this was part of the talks and plan, but this time he doesn't seem concerned about ever looking into the trap further. After John verbally BASHED me about the trap for what I said to Tim Miller about the sand body-form and that I believed her skirt was under the sand, John pretty much committed himself to the belief the trap wasn't what we were after. This shocked me because it was exactly what we were looking for- a fish trap lost at sea with human remains.

Kyle Kingman:  John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship. I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best.

Kermit

[IBE]

CBB, Hi

Refresh my memory please. How did Tim turn on Beth? TIA

[klaasend]

CBB, Hi

Refresh my memory please. How did Tim turn on Beth? TIA

I'm sure Janet can find the exact transcript but it was on Steph Watts radio show and after Beth went to see Joran in jail.  Tim more or less said what Beth did was wrong.

[crazybabyborg]

CBB, Hi

Refresh my memory please. How did Tim turn on Beth? TIA

Hey IBE!!

Tim was critical of Beth's visit to Peru and of her visit to the prison to see Joran. I'll go look for the links for you.   

[texasmom]

Forgot until just now....Tim Miller also said:  We'll probably also find her clothes in that container.

Wonder if they'll still be in the ziplock baggies!  

Tim Miller sounds mighty confident about all of this!  


 

I was waiting for him to ask for donations...but it wasn't mentioned.  Neither did
he mention Silvetti or Shaeffer.

Maybe the second recovery is on Aruba's dime! 

 

Tim said a while back ...the Jen Hale interview...that they had $1.5 million
earmarked for the search of the 141 targets.  Then when he drew criticism,
he retracted the statement...said it hurt donations.

Yes he did, and then he backtracked and said they didn't have a dime for another search!  Now suddenly it's on again!

Remind's me of a song my FIL used to sing a lot when my boys were little, and my boys always got a kick out of it.

Don't let the devil ride...don't let the devil ride...cause if you let him ride, he'll surely wanna drive...don't let the devil ride.

Carpe will get a kick out of this guy, and that looks like it could be a young Kyle on drums!  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLZ9XKZn3vE&feature=related

[islandmonkey]

I'm still hung up on whether the jawbone washed up or whether it was planted, so I'm just going to put this out there for thought.  The Bubali Bird Sanctuary is just that, a Sanctuary, so they would not have drained the marsh when she first went missing, as it would cause harm to the bird habitat.  Just seeing how the Aruba authorities are, I just don't think they would have drained it. 

So, the last week of October and the first week of November, hurricane Tomas churns around in the southern Caribbean, with a turn to the north.  Aruba is known by it's locals as the "hurricane graveyard", where hurricanes die and throw their after effects off on Aruba.  Then while this is going on, a large storm moves off the northern coast of Venezuela and over Aruba.  The combination of all this rain has caused the bird sanctuary marsh to "overflow", and push water through the wash and out into the ocean. (just south of Divi Phoenix).  Then the winds (and it's crazy windy down there anyway, couple that with a strong storm system) kick up these huge waves that start throwing shells and tons of seaweed back on shore.

What if she had been placed in the marsh, her remains stayed there until the rains, then the remains were washed out into the ocean, and then the strong waves washed her remains back in ?  I just can't get past the idea that after 5 years, bones are just now washing up on shore.  It's either something as simple as described above, or else something very hinky is going on (not that we're surprised by that).

Sorry for the rambling, just thinking out loud 

I can see this, we have had 35 ft pieces of EXTREMELY heavy driftwood pieces wash onto shore (and just in rough waves, and small storms) and wash back out the next storm, even a hardhat from one of the crew of the DeepWater Horizon that blew up off the coast of Louisina washed ashore here on Pensacola Beach.....so, I could see this as a possibility

[texasmom]

CBB, Hi

Refresh my memory please. How did Tim turn on Beth? TIA

WATT'S UP WITH THIS? STEPH WATTS & TIM MILLER 9/19/2010 (PARTIAL) TRANSCRIPT

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8625.0