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Author Topic: Natalee Holloway Case Discussion #853 11/23/10 - 11/26/10  (Read 143445 times)
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carpe noctem
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History repeats itself. It's a cyclical beast.


« Reply #580 on: November 23, 2010, 09:20:32 PM »


Therefore it was human remains. Nimrod, if you look at the evidence bags, I'm sure you'll see what appears, to me anyway, blue denim that could match Natalees skirt worn that night.


Why would Aruban divers bag a crab?

Janet

To send it to Johan?
Logged

For Natalee and Stephany, whatever it takes.

-JUSTICE FOR NATALEE ANN - BOYCOTT ARUBA
------------------
"Don't talk about what you have done or what you are going to do." Thomas Jefferson
"The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first."Thomas Jeff
nimrod
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« Reply #581 on: November 23, 2010, 09:23:44 PM »

Nope, not even close. Look at the so called skull carefully. It is actually two or more pieces of "something" piled up together to give an appearance of a skull. I see white sand with green light reflections that probably made one to think of Natalee's green dress. Also, the wire mesh is about two by two inches square which makes the "skull" too small to be Natalee (or a male). One has to wonder why Kyle's photos were never sold to Enquirer, ABC, etc, etc. That said and done, it is still only my opinion that Kyle was wrong.

c.

Well it is my opinion that it was a skull in that cage.  So much so that the Aruban divers when down and collected its contents.  Why bother to collect it if it was nothing.




And don't forget Tim Miller said they (ALE) came back after 6 weeks and said it was a male.


Yeah, I've heard that Tim Miller said that. Have you ever seen a link where Aruba said that? I haven't either. When I  first heard that, I thought only Tim said that to excuse his original mistake.
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Rob
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« Reply #582 on: November 23, 2010, 09:26:17 PM »

ch-ch-ch ah check it out.... wha the wha the what's it all about... Monkey Devil!

Aruba now has two unidentified sets of remains - so, tell me how was this a good day for Aruba?

The remains from the trap - an unidentifed male according to them and now a white female..

... and this is on top of all the other missing people

no wonder Stein thought it was a laffin' matter...

it's raining cadavers, body parts and these friggin' idiots have no clue which end is up...

ya'll come back now ....

come across...



They are claiming the rib bone was of a dog. 

The good news is Patches has been identified, his relatives all notified, the guilty rounded up, and charged. And justice will be brought down swiftly. This case which has literally haunted the good citizens of Aruba since Patches' dog collar was discovered on the beach is finally coming to a close.

Modern technology has allowed DNA to conclusively determine this was Patches. There will be a memorial service at the beach at the Phoenix followed by a buffet and free drinks courtesy of Aruba Today.
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« Reply #583 on: November 23, 2010, 09:33:16 PM »


Therefore it was human remains. Nimrod, if you look at the evidence bags, I'm sure you'll see what appears, to me anyway, blue denim that could match Natalees skirt worn that night.


Why would Aruban divers bag a crab?

Janet

To send it to Johan?

Yeah he needs some crab balls.

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jen3560
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« Reply #584 on: November 23, 2010, 09:34:51 PM »

Good to see you Kermie!

You too up there Sharon!
 
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Kermit
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« Reply #585 on: November 23, 2010, 09:35:44 PM »

My condolences to you Snoopy.
Make a scrapbook - it helps. One day you'll look back at it with such fond & wonderful memories.

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Kermit
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« Reply #586 on: November 23, 2010, 09:36:13 PM »

Good to see you Kermie!

You too up there Sharon!
 

Heh Heh Ms. jen

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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #587 on: November 23, 2010, 09:37:02 PM »


I bet Beth and Dave were thrilled when they saw Kyle's "depiction".

Considering Dave Holloway's ongoing relationship with Tim Miller, John Silvetti and Louis Schaefer in regards to raising moneys for an ongoing search in Aruban waters to investigate 141 targets ... I suspect he is not a believer in what is perceived by many on this forum as the Persistence betrayal.

However ... Beth Holloway was informed of Kyle Kingman's posts which had been submitted to the Natalee Freebirds and ... after consultation and careful consideration gave permission for the info to be publicly released publicly.

Janet

++++++

WhiskeyGirl
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #746 4/4
Reply #58 on: April 05, 2008, 09:19:47 AM


More from John ~

Quote from: Debbie

John, what can we do to insure that the search is completed?

<snipped>


Quote from: jdsurveyor1

The important thing is to raise funds.  It will require corporate support as well as private donations.  Dave and Beth have been doing a great job getting the word out and while I was on the island, Dave put me in contact with the head of the Hotel Association who is working on raising a sizeable amount.  So many on the island are supporting our efforts as well as people from all over the world.

<snipped>.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2769.40


Debbie
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #820 6/10/09 -
Reply #598 on: June 18, 2009, 11:29:24 PM


Okay... there was/is no conspiracy with the Persistence.  Louis, John, Tim and Dave are trying to get the funds to complete the search on the targets.... they are working together. 
 
Slam me, bash me, I don't care, but it is the truth.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5127.msg845027;topicseen#msg845027


klassend
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #787 12/24/08 -
Reply #411 on: December 30, 2008, 06:53:44 PM

Sent to me by Natalee's Freebirds:


Please feel free (if you'd like) to post this at your board.
 
During the journey of the Persistence to Aruba, Kyle reached out and emailed with us.  During that time, one of the questions posed to him was regarding protocol if/when Natalee's remains were found.
 
Kyle's response was that he was unsure, but felt that would be settled before the search began.
 
The cautions were given to him about the lack of integrity on the part of Aruba's law enforcement, prosecutor's office, and its judiciary.
 
Contact with Kyle continued throughout the duration of the search by the Persistence.
 
Once back home, Kyle asked us for our help.  He was very concerned about the activities that transpired during their search - specifically surrounding the find of the fishing cage and its contents.  Kyle wanted our help in presenting this information in a factual way, to then be given to Natalee's family. 
 
This was March 18, 2008.  At that time, Kyle assured us he had just recently sent the images from the Dec 30th and Jan 7th dives to the FBI, but had never received a response from them.
 
We later found that to be false.
 
Also at that time, Beth's brother saw the images Kyle had shared with us - but none of the detail he shared later.

We compiled the images Kyle presented us, along with his opinions and the facts surrounding the sequence of events regarding that fishing cage.  Kyle stated he would be getting in touch with Beth Holloway.
 
We later found out that never happened.

At this time, Kyle shared with us the broadcast networks he had approached in February, in an attempt to sell these images to the highest bidder.
 
This didn't concern us greatly at that time - as we were under the impression US law enforcement and Natalee's family had already been made aware of their find.
 
Approximately May 2008 Kyle began dodging questions for details (we had asked for names of Aruban police and divers to be included in our documentation of these events), hedging on moving forward with this, and then he completely disappeared from our board.
 
During that time, we learned Kyle had never contacted Beth, or Dave, or the FBI with this information.
 
We put our original plan into motion - that of presenting this information in a clear and concise manner, and we sent it to Beth Holloway.
 
Beth was disturbed, needed time to digest the information, and wanted to share it with someone she trusts.
 
When Tim Miller was returning to Aruba this past fall, Beth gave us permission to release this information publicly
.

At that point, we gave it to John Kelly, Carmen Adams with the FBI, and got it ready for public consumption.
 
The next step was to publish this information at our blog.
 
One of our members felt we were betraying Kyle in doing so, contacted him, and he re-surfaced at our site with threats of litigation against us - stating this was his "intellectual property" and we could not use it.
 
That of course concerned us greatly - as none of us could afford to be sued.
 
He also stated at that time, Luis Shaefer had just recently sold the rights of the video of these images to a broadcast company for the purposes of a documentary.
 
We contacted legal counsel and were advised to keep our distance from any Persistence crew member, in the face of potential obstruction/accessory charges.
 
At this point, one of our members decided to brace for the possibility of civil litigation, resigned from our membership to protect it from same, and posted what he knows to be factual at SM.
 
Kyle did tell us human remains were found in that fish cage.
 
Kyle did tell us about John Silvetti's intent to open an office on the island of Aruba, to enable him ease in conducting business in South America, and Aruba.
 
Kyle also told us of John's absolute refusal to give that fish cage and its contents any credence - before even it was inspected on Jan 7th.
 
Kyle told us in no uncertain terms that Tim Miller and Dateline were abruptly removed from the Persistence on Dec 30, resulting in only Persistence crew being aboard between that date and the Jan 7 dive of the Arubans.
 
Nothing that was posted at SM by kermit was incorrect, out of context, or in any way false.
 
Regards,
 
Former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator

Natalee and her family deserve justice - and we will not let up until they have it!

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4269.msg603349#msg603349
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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

A person of integrity expects to be believed and when hes not, he lets time prove him right. -unknown
nimrod
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« Reply #588 on: November 23, 2010, 09:40:12 PM »


Therefore it was human remains. Nimrod, if you look at the evidence bags, I'm sure you'll see what appears, to me anyway, blue denim that could match Natalees skirt worn that night.


Why would Aruban divers bag a crab?

Janet

To send it to Johan?

I thought the FBI looked at the "blue denin". Also, how long does blue denin stay blue in salt water?

Who said it was a crab?
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Kat_Gram
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« Reply #589 on: November 23, 2010, 09:40:56 PM »

I remember that Red 
So do I. Now that was a funny one. There were plenty of them, but that was one of the top ten.
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Tamikosmom
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« Reply #590 on: November 23, 2010, 09:45:57 PM »


And don't forget Tim Miller said they (ALE) came back after 6 weeks and said it was a male.


Yeah, I've heard that Tim Miller said that. Have you ever seen a link where Aruba said that? I haven't either. When I  first heard that, I thought only Tim said that to excuse his original mistake.


STEPH WATTS AND TIM MILLER INVERVIEW

The Trap

February 14, 2010 - Male DNA


http://www.blogtalkradio.com/watts-up-with-this/2010/02/15/watts-up-with-this

Tim Miller: 

Aruba authorities dove on it and six weeks later they said that the DNA came back as a male.

So, did we find Natalee?  I dont know. It certainly looked like her clothes in that fish trap and again we know the night that Natalee disappeared the fishermans huts was broken into the knife was stolen; the big fish trap was stolen. 

Its ironic we found one and Ive actually got the pictures of that... you know that certainly appears to be a body in that fish trap.

Transcript: Kermit


February 28, 2010 - Backtrack

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/watts-up-with-this/2010/03/01/watts-up-with-this

Tim Miller:

We don't know really know we can't say positively sure it was human remains we've got some pictures that made us wonder.

John Silvetti doesn't feel 100% that it was.  That is why John wants to go back to search we just got mixed messages on that and perhaps we over-reacted on that what we seen at the time looked suspcious.

I can't say positive one way or another what it was.

Transcript: Kermit
Logged

Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

A person of integrity expects to be believed and when hes not, he lets time prove him right. -unknown
carpe noctem
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History repeats itself. It's a cyclical beast.


« Reply #591 on: November 23, 2010, 09:47:59 PM »

I remember that Red 
So do I. Now that was a funny one. There were plenty of them, but that was one of the top ten.

4 years later and it is still FRESH! Steve Cohen, what a jackass.

Logged

For Natalee and Stephany, whatever it takes.

-JUSTICE FOR NATALEE ANN - BOYCOTT ARUBA
------------------
"Don't talk about what you have done or what you are going to do." Thomas Jefferson
"The two enemies of the people are criminals and government, so let us tie the second down with the chains of the Constitution so the second will not become the legalized version of the first."Thomas Jeff
Tamikosmom
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« Reply #592 on: November 23, 2010, 09:49:30 PM »


Nimrod

I do believe that Kyle Kingman's professional expertise/qualifications in analysing  solar scan and ROV images should be the bottom line to whether or not the object within the trap may be a skull.

When you read all of Kyle Kingman's posts ... in a nutshell what is the picture that emerges regarding the Persistence search.

Thanks

Janet


BUMPED
Logged

Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

A person of integrity expects to be believed and when hes not, he lets time prove him right. -unknown
BooMonkey
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Nemo Me Impune Lacessit


« Reply #593 on: November 23, 2010, 09:54:03 PM »


Whoa! You weren't alone in questioning Tim and his drinking, but MANY of us had enough respect for the MANY good things he had done in the past to grant him more than just a little lee way. Mainly out of respect to Red who worked elbow to elbow with Tim in the sordid garbage dump of Aruba. I think it is safe to say THAT Tim Miller is different than the Tim Miller that has evolved today. If you are going to blast us for being protective of Tim, so be it -but, I would just hope that if you hate it here so much - just stay away.
Dude, it's no biggie. I didn't realize Red was an elbow girl. Yeah, Tim evolved. That's kind of you to say.
I never said anything about hate, not my words, thanks though.
Settle down, it's the holidays.

I never questioned Tim's drinking. I always questioned his integrity and professionalism. I just hope he knows that he does more harm than help in 2 major cases, this one and the Anthony case. He did harm. Part of the 12 steps is to realize he has a problem first. 

JJ be real careful how you word your posts. I believe you are on shaky ground here. 
No biggie? Settle down, it's the holidays? Elbow girl? It might be a game to you, but the rest of us have an emotional investment here.
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"but before I can live with other folks I've got to live with myself.  The one thing that doesn't abide by majority rule is a person's conscience." -Atticus Finch
Magnolia
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« Reply #594 on: November 23, 2010, 09:55:45 PM »


Therefore it was human remains. Nimrod, if you look at the evidence bags, I'm sure you'll see what appears, to me anyway, blue denim that could match Natalees skirt worn that night.


Why would Aruban divers bag a crab?

Janet

To send it to Johan?

I thought the FBI looked at the "blue denin". Also, how long does blue denin stay blue in salt water?

Who said it was a crab?

The FBI only looked at a piece of fabric that Aruba sent them and said that it didn't
match Natalee's blouse.
I think good blue denim stays blue forever until it is gone.

And...it was Johan who said it was a crab.....a giant Caribbean crab.
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The will of heaven be done in this and all things.
BooMonkey
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Nemo Me Impune Lacessit


« Reply #595 on: November 23, 2010, 09:58:32 PM »

My condolences to you Snoopy.
Make a scrapbook - it helps. One day you'll look back at it with such fond & wonderful memories.



Same here Snoopy. I was so sorry to here about the loss of your furbaby. My heart breaks for you. I too lost my dog at the end of October, she was 13. Glad to see you are still spending time here. It helps to be with friends.
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"but before I can live with other folks I've got to live with myself.  The one thing that doesn't abide by majority rule is a person's conscience." -Atticus Finch
nimrod
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« Reply #596 on: November 23, 2010, 10:00:26 PM »


I bet Beth and Dave were thrilled when they saw Kyle's "depiction".

Considering Dave Holloway's ongoing relationship with Tim Miller, John Silvetti and Louis Schaefer in regards to raising moneys for an ongoing search in Aruban waters to investigate 141 targets ... I suspect he is not a believer in what is perceived by many on this forum as the Persistence betrayal.

However ... Beth Holloway was informed of Kyle Kingman's posts which had been submitted to the Natalee Freebirds and ... after consultation and careful consideration gave permission for the info to be publicly released publicly.

Janet

++++++

WhiskeyGirl
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #746 4/4
Reply #58 on: April 05, 2008, 09:19:47 AM


More from John ~

Quote from: Debbie

John, what can we do to insure that the search is completed?

<snipped>


Quote from: jdsurveyor1

The important thing is to raise funds.  It will require corporate support as well as private donations.  Dave and Beth have been doing a great job getting the word out and while I was on the island, Dave put me in contact with the head of the Hotel Association who is working on raising a sizeable amount.  So many on the island are supporting our efforts as well as people from all over the world.

<snipped>.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2769.40


Debbie
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #820 6/10/09 -
Reply #598 on: June 18, 2009, 11:29:24 PM


Okay... there was/is no conspiracy with the Persistence.  Louis, John, Tim and Dave are trying to get the funds to complete the search on the targets.... they are working together. 
 
Slam me, bash me, I don't care, but it is the truth.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=5127.msg845027;topicseen#msg845027


klassend
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #787 12/24/08 -
Reply #411 on: December 30, 2008, 06:53:44 PM

Sent to me by Natalee's Freebirds:


Please feel free (if you'd like) to post this at your board.
 
During the journey of the Persistence to Aruba, Kyle reached out and emailed with us.  During that time, one of the questions posed to him was regarding protocol if/when Natalee's remains were found.
 
Kyle's response was that he was unsure, but felt that would be settled before the search began.
 
The cautions were given to him about the lack of integrity on the part of Aruba's law enforcement, prosecutor's office, and its judiciary.
 
Contact with Kyle continued throughout the duration of the search by the Persistence.
 
Once back home, Kyle asked us for our help.  He was very concerned about the activities that transpired during their search - specifically surrounding the find of the fishing cage and its contents.  Kyle wanted our help in presenting this information in a factual way, to then be given to Natalee's family. 
 
This was March 18, 2008.  At that time, Kyle assured us he had just recently sent the images from the Dec 30th and Jan 7th dives to the FBI, but had never received a response from them.
 
We later found that to be false.
 
Also at that time, Beth's brother saw the images Kyle had shared with us - but none of the detail he shared later.

We compiled the images Kyle presented us, along with his opinions and the facts surrounding the sequence of events regarding that fishing cage.  Kyle stated he would be getting in touch with Beth Holloway.
 
We later found out that never happened.

At this time, Kyle shared with us the broadcast networks he had approached in February, in an attempt to sell these images to the highest bidder.
 
This didn't concern us greatly at that time - as we were under the impression US law enforcement and Natalee's family had already been made aware of their find.
 
Approximately May 2008 Kyle began dodging questions for details (we had asked for names of Aruban police and divers to be included in our documentation of these events), hedging on moving forward with this, and then he completely disappeared from our board.
 
During that time, we learned Kyle had never contacted Beth, or Dave, or the FBI with this information.
 
We put our original plan into motion - that of presenting this information in a clear and concise manner, and we sent it to Beth Holloway.
 
Beth was disturbed, needed time to digest the information, and wanted to share it with someone she trusts.
 
When Tim Miller was returning to Aruba this past fall, Beth gave us permission to release this information publicly
.

At that point, we gave it to John Kelly, Carmen Adams with the FBI, and got it ready for public consumption.
 
The next step was to publish this information at our blog.
 
One of our members felt we were betraying Kyle in doing so, contacted him, and he re-surfaced at our site with threats of litigation against us - stating this was his "intellectual property" and we could not use it.
 
That of course concerned us greatly - as none of us could afford to be sued.
 
He also stated at that time, Luis Shaefer had just recently sold the rights of the video of these images to a broadcast company for the purposes of a documentary.
 
We contacted legal counsel and were advised to keep our distance from any Persistence crew member, in the face of potential obstruction/accessory charges.
 
At this point, one of our members decided to brace for the possibility of civil litigation, resigned from our membership to protect it from same, and posted what he knows to be factual at SM.
 
Kyle did tell us human remains were found in that fish cage.
 
Kyle did tell us about John Silvetti's intent to open an office on the island of Aruba, to enable him ease in conducting business in South America, and Aruba.
 
Kyle also told us of John's absolute refusal to give that fish cage and its contents any credence - before even it was inspected on Jan 7th.
 
Kyle told us in no uncertain terms that Tim Miller and Dateline were abruptly removed from the Persistence on Dec 30, resulting in only Persistence crew being aboard between that date and the Jan 7 dive of the Arubans.
 
Nothing that was posted at SM by kermit was incorrect, out of context, or in any way false.
 
Regards,
 
Former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator

Natalee and her family deserve justice - and we will not let up until they have it!

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4269.msg603349#msg603349

Hi gang. Good show.
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texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #597 on: November 23, 2010, 10:02:51 PM »

 
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
BooMonkey
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Nemo Me Impune Lacessit


« Reply #598 on: November 23, 2010, 10:06:25 PM »



Yeah I hear ya Texasmom. 
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"but before I can live with other folks I've got to live with myself.  The one thing that doesn't abide by majority rule is a person's conscience." -Atticus Finch
crazybabyborg
Guest
« Reply #599 on: November 23, 2010, 10:12:33 PM »


Um-hum.........   
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