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Author Topic: Natalee Holloway Case Discussion #853 11/23/10 - 11/26/10  (Read 327866 times)
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crazybabyborg
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« Reply #740 on: November 24, 2010, 04:07:43 PM »

Now I'll duck.............   
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« Reply #741 on: November 24, 2010, 04:07:45 PM »



Okay, this just hit me like a ton of bricks........... I know it sounds crazy (and probably is).

Ever since Beth went to Peru, Tim has been going nuts (along with Steph Watts). He was saying how Beth "messed up" the "plan". Tim and Steph were in Aruba at the time "searching" for Natalee.

Now, Tim is saying he can narrow his search and have Natalee "home by Christmas".
Maybe, just maybe Tim knows the "jig is up" with the Persistence and Natalee had actually been recovered in that crab trap. Could they possibly be trying ANOTHER way to return Natalee back to Brth and dave without getting Silvetti et al in trouble? Could they "re-plant" Natalee in one of the "other 141 targets"???

Discuss, while I'm ducking for cover............
[/quote]

 Tim was only saying  maybe this could be done if the jawbone belonged to Natalee,correct?I would imagine all bets are off now.
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« Reply #742 on: November 24, 2010, 04:16:20 PM »

Now I'll duck.............   

 

~JJ.....I am not sure it matters what is legal or not in Aruba, this case has been a 5 1/2 yr clusterf@ck in everything illegal, immoral and unethical from an Island that hopefully will have so few tourist it will fall of the map - figuratively speaking although literally would be nice too
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« Reply #743 on: November 24, 2010, 04:16:48 PM »

Lmao at wreck and CBB    "ducking for cover"  You all make me laugh and I need it after yesterday's news!
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crazybabyborg
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« Reply #744 on: November 24, 2010, 04:18:42 PM »

  OK, Wreck left and everybody's speechless.

There's a reason I hadn't posted the thought. It's really, really cynical about Tim, I know. Nevermind. I'm delusional for trying to get Thanksgiving pulled together! 
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crazybabyborg
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« Reply #745 on: November 24, 2010, 04:20:38 PM »

Lmao at wreck and CBB    "ducking for cover"  You all make me laugh and I need it after yesterday's news!


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« Reply #746 on: November 24, 2010, 04:27:50 PM »

Lmao at wreck and CBB    "ducking for cover"  You all make me laugh and I need it after yesterday's news!




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San
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« Reply #747 on: November 24, 2010, 04:28:26 PM »

When I heard the horrible comments from Tim about Beth's visit from Peru, I started asking myself if maybe Tim was supposed to "find Natalee" with a nod from Aruba. Aruba's motive? Joran had been arrested for killing Stephany and it doesn't help Aruba's image that they basically allowed that and it gave credibility to Beth's claims of corruption and cover up.

I thought that perhaps Tim's rant was because Beth was throwing a monkey wrench in the plan. She was, once again, putting the story back on the front page and garnering more sympathy.

Well if this was to be true it would have helped if Beth was in on the plan.

But what we have here are people who want justice for Natalee and they aren't on the same page as far as plans go.
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islandmonkey
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« Reply #748 on: November 24, 2010, 04:34:49 PM »

Tim Miller needs to put his ego aside and accepted what has happened had nothing to do with him.  What a desperate man.
He doesn't have many success stories. Natalee and Caylee Anthony are under his belt. What a shame. He has no experience in searching other than raising money and creating false hope. I'm so diasppointed in his services. I have respect for his efforts but I don't have faith in his actions.

Anyway, since Tim did locate places I'm sure there have been scuba divers out there who have tampered with the crime scene.

jj-  I'm not going to turn this into a Tim Miller thing in this thread, but I want to make note that you are wrong here, and it's not just my opinion.  Tim Miller and Texas Equusearch actually DO have many success stories, and as far as your statement about him having no experience searching other than raising money and creating false hope?  Wrong.  Wrong.  He has helped many over the years and when I get some coffee in me, I can go find some links and statistics for you.  I believe in giving credit where credit is due.  In my opinion, what has people here (including me) so ticked off at Tim Miller is because he HAS been so good in the past helping find the lost, including Natalee, and supported Beth.  Then the problems seemed to start with the Persistence.  And then he turned on Beth, saying the awful things he said on the Steph Watts show.  Yep, I understand people's anger (and I'm mad too) at Tim Miller, but please keep the facts straight.  Tim Miller and Equusearch are very experienced in finding the lost and are still being asked by LE to assist, such as in case just this week (Joshua Wilkerson) and it's on Scared Monkeys Missing Forum.  I too would like to find out just why Tim Miller disparaged Beth Holloway and what went on with the Persistence.  I'm mad as he77 over that.  But as far as Tim having no experience searching and not having many success stories?  That's just not true.

Sorry~just catching up, am I in some alternative universe because even though Tim has evolved into someone who is in need of an intervention on many levels ASAP, he has brought home a significant number of the missing alive and for families who had no closure he found their loved one's passed one/murdered etc, so.....I am thinking that is a big stretch to say he has no experience (huge stretch), no doubt he has his demons and should have respected that so does Beth and I am behind Beth in everything she has does so far, frankly if I had been in that room with Urine it would have taken everything in me to not beat the crap out of him of shank him, but to take away every good thing Tim has done in the past is also a huge disservice. Now, if I am looking for a true media whore I think we can all look to the Caylee Anthony case and find several, the vast majority with no experience except in enoying hearing themselves on the news or Nancy Grace or causing scenes in Or-lawndo over beads most 4-8yr sold girls have in their bedroom. Also, my son's class dontated to TES a few yrs ago for his birthday instead of gift, they did get arm bands, a thnk you note from Tim and a letter to the kids about how the money helped find the 2 yr old Owen Castle (IIRC) in Llanos, Tx and his progression on how he went from near death to a child running and playing, with all kinds of pictures to show the kids. Now, every child in the class gives money on their birthdays to a charity of their choosing since they were acknowledged for their efforts and to me that is priceless and the best lesson my son or the other 25 in his class ever learned.

Ok, heading to buy a turkey.......is it too late to thaw one out ??
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« Reply #749 on: November 24, 2010, 04:35:58 PM »



Is it safe???? 
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« Reply #750 on: November 24, 2010, 04:36:00 PM »

I'm not believing I'm going to say this but would someone please give me the link to Tim spewing about Beth?What the Hay? I'm a monkey on the edge people!!! Now the so-called good guys have to be scrutinized?
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« Reply #751 on: November 24, 2010, 04:38:14 PM »



Is it safe???? 

Absolutly!!!!
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« Reply #752 on: November 24, 2010, 04:41:37 PM »

I'm not believing I'm going to say this but would someone please give me the link to Tim spewing about Beth?What the Hay? I'm a monkey on the edge people!!! Now the so-called good guys have to be scrutinized?

I believe this is the one.  Click on the photo below to listen to the recording:

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« Reply #753 on: November 24, 2010, 04:44:07 PM »

Hi ALL.

Just wanted to say - I'm with Anna on the service hat. I did a comparison a while back and can post it again, if anyone wants. But I think it is a cop's hat.

And that leads me to this - maybe this was a cop they found in that trap. They said it was MALE DNA but never said who they thought it could be. Could it be a dirty cop that was whacked by drug traffickers? Could it be a dirty cop that was whacked by other cops? Could it be a dirty cop that disappeared years and years ago? Seems like they have been wearing these caps and uniforms for decades. And couldn't this also be a good clean cop that didn't adhere to the Aruba Dirty Polis?

Aren't all those things possible too? I guess we could be so jaded by all the lies that when they tell the truth - we just don't believe it. I think the fact that they took off with the remains - leads everyone to think something went down and it was underhanded. But maybe they KNEW this cop was killed and maybe they didn't want that all coming out. Anyway - those are just some additional possibilities, but in the end - who knows.

What we do know - it was a person. That's confirmed and they said so themselves and the DNA lasted between 3 and 10 years according to Kyle who said he thought the trap was in the water that long. There is also the trap was there and someone placed a body there years later - but in any event - it was a person.

Maybe, believe it or not - Natalee has not been found, yet. Or maybe is unable to be found - and that's the reason why Joran laughs. Maybe, San's correct and she is on land. MAYBE in a tomb and will never be found. I don't know. But I think there is also the possibility that Zandaam was right when he said - the body of Natalee was found in two days and a favor was done for the son of Paulus to exculpate him. Mayyybbbe.
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« Reply #754 on: November 24, 2010, 04:44:59 PM »

advocate de hoogd is tell cu apparently banco central owing to sleep during 17 year


http://www.diario.aw/2010/11/abogado-de-hoogd-ta-bisa-cu-aparentemente-banco-central-a-drumi-durante-17-ana/

publication: diaranson, 24 november 2010. categoria: general

in caso stanford international bank: *abogado of bc is indica cu is show because; if fuera de hoogd is ‘stroman’ for hendenan misterioso



oranjestad (aan): tuesday daily paper because; unique medio of prensa was present at corte, where cu did take lugar continuacion of one caso among ‘stichting stanford aruba’ y banco central of aruba. the proceso among the two partidonan owing to cuminza for of enough time end, where cu several documento owing to worde intercambia among the partidonan y huez of corte of husticia. tuesday was the day place for her caso worde deal. is so cu stichting stanford aruba is one fundacion arise for one are of alrededor of 25 person perhudica door of stanford international bank (sib).

at 1992 stanford owing to acerca banco central of aruba for her achieve one licencia because; banco, but this owing to worde deny. via one another caminda past owing to succeed become activo on market of aruba. the banco was ofrece interest high (9% y mas), for person deposita they coin.

much person owing to haci this y at 2009 hour cu sib owing to cay in another, much person mundialmente owing to lose sumanan big of coin. at aruba also this was the caso then y provided that overall hendenan on the island owing to lose alrededor of 35 miyon dollar.

advocate gabri de hoogd owing to representa stichting stanford aruba (ssa) in name of the alrededor of 25 person perhudica. past owing to trece fast cu all the organizacion of stanford is in estado of bancarota y do not cla still if esnan perhudica will ricibi compensacion for thing they owing to lose.

past owing to tell if cu thing is assure is cu they will not achieve 100% of the coin cu they owing to inverti. ssa owing to cuminza the caso contra banco central, because according ssa, one of the rolnan more important of banco central is for ehecuta supervision y control on actividadnan of banco y of another instancianan financiero, according the ltk, cu is landsverordening toezicht kredietwezen (Credit System Supervision Ordinance).

the advocate owing to trece fast cu because; such banco central have to can owing to actua at time during the 17 añanan cu stanford owing to opera at aruba, for so evita thing owing to sosode.

banco central then have to as one view on all instancianan monetario of cual the actividadnan will can have one influencia on the stabilidad monetario y reputacion financiero of aruba. de hoogd owing to splica cu banco central was at height cu algo not was good cu stanford international bank.

according the advocate, proof of this is cu in amigoe of aruba owing to leave one articulo on 19 of feburary 2009, in cual have stop cu banco central for añanan largo was preocupa on stanford. de hoogd owing to tell cu provided that vez of haci algo, banco central owing to sleep during of 17 year y door of this several person at aruba owing to worde perhudica financieramente.

pesey ssa is buscando one compensacion of part of banco central, but esey will have to come fast in another procedura. banco central owing to worde representa for advocate allart haasjes that owing to come for of the netherlands y past owing to worde asisti for mr. anthony carlo.

banco central his sharp of view principal is cu the peticion of stichting stanford aruba have to worde declara not admisible. according the advocate, banco central not can worde poni responsible for her actonan of stanford international bank.

banco central not owing to give stanford the permission of opera because; banco. haasjes owing to cuestiona also the mature cu de hoogd is tell of representa one cantidad of person cu is part of the stichting, but till still none person know is that is all the personanan in the stichting.

according the advocate dutch, is show as de hoogd is actua because; ‘stroman’, for one are of person cu will have cierto motibonan dark for not give informacion of they self, incluyendo informacion financiero.

the advocate owing to tell also cu is possible cu one procedura is worde take away at corte in name of person cu do not existi. haasjes owing to tell also cu ssa not owing to trece fast at one as cla, in what sense banco central will owing to abort y kico banco central can owing to haci.

past owing to trece fast also cu banco central not was have the autoridad of actua contra stanford international bank. huez at end owing to tell cu the is bay give his veredicto day 26 of january.


http://www.diario.aw/2010/11/abogado-de-hoogd-ta-bisa-cu-aparentemente-banco-central-a-drumi-durante-17-ana/


In Aruba, our Caribbean Mercantile Bank collected NAF 12 million in exchange tax, which it pays to the Central Bank of Aruba for the Aruba governmenthttp://www.mcb-bank.com/extra_pages/AnnualReport2005.pdf
page 16/50


Antonio Carlos worked for Johan Paul Sjiem Fat, Sjiem Fat & Sjiem Fat, Aruba
Johan Paul Sjiem Fat considers the impact of these three countries on the tax regime operating in Aruba. http://www.offshoreinvestment.com/magazine/issue?id=87


Antonio Carlo, Joran's attorney and Paulus' bossman, use to work at a firm, Sjiem Fat & Co. One of the owners of that firm is Standard Trust Co., who coincidentally is also the managing director of the company that owns C&Cs.

Contact Name: Johan Sjiem Fat/Antonio Carlo
 Email: legal@abc-trademarks.com Organization

Johan Sjiem Fat and Lincoln Gomez are on the board of directors of
Aruba Financial Center Association.

Also Gomez is in charge of litigation, corporate Finane and Telcom for AFCA
http://www.afca-aruba.com/news/new_fiscal_framework.html


Johan Paul Sjiem Fat is on the Board of Dreictors for Aruba Financial Center Association:
http://www.afca-aruba.com/board_directors.html
(offshore corps. etc. He is an Officer along with Lincoln D. Gomez who is the President)

________________________>

OFFSHORE BANKING FOLKS – THAT IS WHAT PAULUS VAN DER SLOOT WAS WORKING WITH THE CENTRAL BUREAU OF LEGAL AND GENERAL AFFAIRS ON ARUBA.
PROFESSIONAL OFFSHORE INCORPORATIONS AND OFFSHORE BANKING SERVICES SINCE 1995




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« Reply #755 on: November 24, 2010, 04:46:25 PM »

I'm not believing I'm going to say this but would someone please give me the link to Tim spewing about Beth?What the Hay? I'm a monkey on the edge people!!! Now the so-called good guys have to be scrutinized?


WATT'S UP WITH THIS? STEPH WATTS & TIM MILLER 9/19/2010 (PARTIAL) TRANSCRIPT
« on: September 24, 2010, 01:13:25 AM »

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=8625.0

Transcript: texasmom

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Loving Natalee - Beth Holloway
Page 219: I have to make difficult choices every day.  I have to make a conscious decision every morning when I wake up not to be bitter, not to live in resentment and let anger control me.  It's not easy.  I ask God to help me.
_____

“A person of integrity expects to be believed and when he’s not, he let’s time prove him right.” -unknown
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« Reply #756 on: November 24, 2010, 04:46:37 PM »

Antunym,  I do see your point.  One thing I keep reminding myself of, however - those morons continue to think they are smarter than anyone else.  I believe that in their arrogance, they never thought Persistence would find her, so no one worried about it.

And yes, you are correct - Paulus and Anita were seen on the beach directly in from where the cage was.  They were seen on either jan 5 or 6, IIRC.  After Persistence had found it, and just mere days before ALE dove on it.
Remember Tim was sent off to  Nicaragua

Video 3:  Jan 7th - ROV monitoring diver tactile inspection of the trap with sampling of items inside and outside of trap.  The trap was not recovered.  Recovered samples sent for forensic analysis.  Neither Tim Miller nor the media were on board.


Dave Holloway: He told me, he said, "Dave, we found her."

Chris Hansen: "We found her?"

Dave Holloway: Yeah. I said, "Are you sure?" and he said, "I’m 99.9 percent sure." He said, "We hadn't gone down and dove under or anything. But the photographs--" he said, "I tell you, Dave." I-- he said, "That's what we're looking for. And that's gotta-- that-- that's it."


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23301056/page/6/



January 2008
01/??/2008-Tim and Dave off boat
01/07/2008-Persistence lost Internet Connectivity for 2 days until 1/09

01/07/2008-Trap contents sampled
01/07/2008-Aruban Divers dive from Aruban boat
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« Reply #757 on: November 24, 2010, 04:48:28 PM »

JORAN: "I think I am incredibly lucky that she's never been found because if she had been found I would be in deep shit"
Source: Peter deVries secret recordings:
http://www.dumpert.nl/mediabase/40829/08150258/joran_loopt_volledig_leeg.html




Citizens of the world want justice.

America wants justice.

Extradite Joran van der Sloot to the United States to stand trial.

Gerard Spong, a prominent Dutch attorney, stated earlier today that there is a very real chance that van der Sloot may win the criminal case, but will be unable to win a civil suit brought by the surviving family members. Since there is an extradition treaty between the Netherlands and the United States, possible damages may be "..far more than he will ever be able to repay. The American system for awarding damages can have devastating results." http://equivocationnation.blogspot.com/


Natalee Holloway and her family deserve justice, and we will not let up until they have it!

Natalee's Freebirds
http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2582.680
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« Reply #758 on: November 24, 2010, 04:50:18 PM »

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« Reply #759 on: November 24, 2010, 04:54:32 PM »

Hi ALL.

Just wanted to say - I'm with Anna on the service hat. I did a comparison a while back and can post it again, if anyone wants. But I think it is a cop's hat.

And that leads me to this - maybe this was a cop they found in that trap. They said it was MALE DNA but never said who they thought it could be. Could it be a dirty cop that was whacked by drug traffickers? Could it be a dirty cop that was whacked by other cops? Could it be a dirty cop that disappeared years and years ago? Seems like they have been wearing these caps and uniforms for decades. And couldn't this also be a good clean cop that didn't adhere to the Aruba Dirty Polis?

Aren't all those things possible too? I guess we could be so jaded by all the lies that when they tell the truth - we just don't believe it. I think the fact that they took off with the remains - leads everyone to think something went down and it was underhanded. But maybe they KNEW this cop was killed and maybe they didn't want that all coming out. Anyway - those are just some additional possibilities, but in the end - who knows.

What we do know - it was a person. That's confirmed and they said so themselves and the DNA lasted between 3 and 10 years according to Kyle who said he thought the trap was in the water that long. There is also the trap was there and someone placed a body there years later - but in any event - it was a person.

Maybe, believe it or not - Natalee has not been found, yet. Or maybe is unable to be found - and that's the reason why Joran laughs. Maybe, San's correct and she is on land. MAYBE in a tomb and will never be found. I don't know. But I think there is also the possibility that Zandaam was right when he said - the body of Natalee was found in two days and a favor was done for the son of Paulus to exculpate him. Mayyybbbe.

Joran: "Things seem to be going even better than I hoped."




Joran: "Even if they find her dead, with my semen in her"



Joran: “I knew she wanted to f*** (talks about Natalee)”
Joran: “I then gave her a bacardi 151 (75% alcohol). She asked for a chaser, I see shes so drunk, but I thought: Im gonna f*** her.”
Joran: “So I said to S&D, drop us on the beach, Ill f*** her”
Joran: “Then she started shaking like crazy... The beach was empty, I walked to her, no reaction, she just kept shaking, NO foam around her mouth”
Joran: “I picked Nat up and put her near the mangrove trees at the mariott.


Source: Peter deVries secret recordings
http://www.dumpert.nl/mediabase/40829/08150258/joran_loopt_volledig_leeg.html




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