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Author Topic: Urine test for Welfare?  (Read 3168 times)
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Carnut
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« on: March 20, 2007, 06:36:25 PM »

Now a days most taxpaying workers are forced to take a urine test in order to maintain employment.

Why aren't folks on government assistence based on taxes, required to take the same type or urine test in order to get assistence?
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justinsmama
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« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2007, 07:36:41 PM »

Sounds good!
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LouiseVargas
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« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2007, 09:04:34 PM »

Carnut wrote: Why aren't folks on government assistence based on taxes, required to take the same type or urine test in order to get assistence?
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Interesting and intelligent question. First time I've ever thought about that. It would cost a fortune and in Los Angeles, there is no budget for testing. My cousin is a social worker in LA County and they laid off so many people that my cousin has triple her case load.
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mrs. red
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« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2007, 10:41:15 PM »

Actually if they tested with urine... there would in all likely hood be less people on the roles - I know that probably sounds heartless, but I fear it's the truth.  the system doesn't help those that are truly in need, but those htat know how to work the system -

Just my jaded opinion.
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Author: Anatole
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« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2007, 10:48:15 PM »

O/T

Mrs. Red

I'm trying to track you down to tell you to look in the Easter Thread for your avatar..... Wink

Sowwy for the O'T!
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mrs. red
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« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2007, 10:49:07 PM »

Quote from: "crazybabyborg"
O/T

Mrs. Red

I'm trying to track you down to tell you to look in the Easter Thread for your avatar..... Wink

Sowwy for the O'T!


headed to change clothes right now!
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LouiseVargas
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« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2007, 11:26:29 PM »

There is no funding for urine tests. My cousin (social worker for 40 years in LA County) has triple her regular work load. There is no money to provide crackers and milk for the kids.

As I said, Car, it's a very original idea and it could have worked years ago before things got out of hand.

Mrs. Red, you are so right when you say urine tests could eliminate many, but what are we gonna do with the ones that don't past the test? Throw them out on the street to be homeless?
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MsVada
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« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2007, 08:30:06 AM »

>snip<what are we gonna do with the ones that don't past the test? Throw them out on the street to be homeless?



Good  question.  Whatever we should do needs to be a stiff punishment or these people "workin' the system" will never get clean and sober and will continue to rob those of us that continually have contributed to financing their free ride.  

Where I am, you can only get welfare for 2 years, but I see that system has lots of loopholes too and people are on it for more than 2 years.
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justinsmama
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« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2007, 02:18:33 PM »

Enforced treatment instead of any benefits to live in the community and freely use?
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LouiseVargas
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« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2007, 10:48:38 PM »

THE HOMELESS

I still have not heard what we are going to do with the welfare people who don't pass the test, if there would be such a test, who could be thrown out on the street. The street is the worst place with no chance to get better. One only falls deeper into the gutter.

My Social Worker cousin told me when Regan was elected, his social program cuts were going to put a lot of people on the street homeless. I didn't believe it but it DID come to pass.

Over the years, the homeless population has grown. We are in a warm weather climate so they flock to CA. And not many homeless people are strong enough to survive. They beg and claw to survive. I used to see a woman in Santa Monica who was always hanging around a grocery store. Her face was lined, her skin was tan from living on the street but her mind was gone, yet she still had enough left to survive somehow.

There are a lot of things I could say. We send monetary aid to various countries but we don't take care of our own people when they fall on hard times.

Not everyone on welfare is trying to cheat the system. I will make a big confession here so that you learn that not all people on the welfare system are druggies and/or alcoholics.

I had mental illness problems that I didn't know I had. I worked for a bank for five years (divorced - single parent) and just could not function in the work environment anymore. My doctor got me on disability for 6 months, then it was extended a while longer. When my daughter was five, I applied for welfare benefits. The qualifications were 1) no support of the child from the father (Aid to families with dependent children, 2) I did not have any assets, 3) I lied and said I didn't have an old car, 4) I lied and said I didn't have a checking account. I suffered from undiagnosed depression from birth. I was on welfare for 13 years, from when my daughter was five until she was eighteen. AT NO TIME DID I DRINK OR TAKE DRUGS.

When my daughter was 18, the benefits were over. My cousin found a county program for me to learn word processing for free. Fortunately, this was one program that escaped Reagan's cutbacks. I studied five days a week for eight hours per day. Typing drills for four hours each day, transcription, grammar and writing skills. The most important part was theory. One had to pass the theory part before they could even lay their hands on a word processing machine. When I got to that level, I worked on a machine (IBM Mag Card) that had no screen. We learned the rules of computer "grammar." A sentence was followed by a period and two spaces. A paragraph was a carrier return and one blank line.

We were taught how to present ourselves in an interview. They provided money for interview clothing. They stressed purchasing a business suit, a blouse, a purse and shoes. After eight months, I was ready to go to a job agency.

Let me back track for a moment. From when I started this program, every night in bed I visualized my perfect job. I did this for eight months. So the job agency sent me on an interview for a financial firm. When I walked in, it was the place I had been visualizing for eight months. The decor was grey and burgundy, with fine mahogany tables. It was what I had dreamed of.

I got that job. I worked there for 14 months. Then I made up a resume and sent it to every company I wanted to work for. Even the LA Dodgers who wrote they didn't need anyone with my skills. But I heard from Xerox, went on an interview and got hired. I worked there 10 years.

So, I want to say that not everyone on welfare is trying to cheat the system. There are many opportunities to learn job skills. I fell on hard times and came back from there to make a good living for many more years.

Yet, I still have a serious problem with being homeless. I have a roof over my head, a car, health insurance and car insurance, money to buy food and pay my bills, yet I still feel homeless. The bottom line is that I'm EMOTIONALLY homeless.
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justinsmama
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« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2007, 12:28:53 AM »

Louise~ You have brought up important issues. I agree that simply cutting off benefits is not the answer. The answer instead is treatment, education, training, etc. Years back, there was a news special of some type that identified that some individuals who were on welfare actually suffered from depression. Treat the depression and assist in gaining skills and there is then no need for welfare support. Addiction is a disease, as well.
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Anna
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« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2007, 11:01:44 PM »

The greatest growth in homeless happened as a result of JFK closing so many of the state facilities for the mentally ill, it was ruled during his administration that the mentally ill had civil rights.  This made it just about impossible to commit or hospitalize anybody against their will.

This was the time that it was established that a person could not be held against their will no matter how mentally ill they might be unless they posed a threat to themselves or others.

That released massive numbers of people who were poorly skilled and unable to function in society.  And it is not just those who were released at the time but those who come along afterward that would have previously received some sort of confinement for their own good.  There are no longer any facilities for this.

Much like the elimination of orphanages, nothing has ever been put in place to assist those in need of the services previously provided.  Instead we have a mish-mash of foster homes with little or no supervision.  And those unable to function in society are just on their own in many instances because they are not deemed dangerous.

.
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justinsmama
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« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2007, 07:40:41 AM »

Having worked in the mental health field for nearly 20 years, I've seen many changes. In Indiana, we have several State Hospitals that are open and have never closed. Bed allocation for each mental health center has been reduced over the years. There are programs that have been put in place to to transition individuals back into the community, as well as to support them while in the community. I have worked in three of those types of programs. In addition, an individual can be committed to treatment should he/she be gravely disabled. Having been responsible for all commitments for one agency, I have personally been involved in the successful legal process of obtaining and maintaining over 100 individuals on commitment to treatment. Our mental health system is far from ideal. Insufficient funding contributes to this. Because of that, we run short staffed and those of us here work our tails off on a regular basis. The bonus to that is that only those of us who are dedicated, see those with mental illness as people with inherent rights and dignity. Why else would we stay and fight the fight? The pay off for that is that our clients recognize that we genuinely care and are motivated to do what it takes to improve their own quality of life. More needs done. That more requires funding.
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Dihannah1
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« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2007, 11:19:08 PM »

Wow you all have started a very interesting and legitimate debate here.

I have seen both sides as I too was on welfare when I was 18 and a pregnant, single mother.  I had just graduated from high school working at Frische's with no benefits.  I had to choose welfare to cover the costs of the pregnancy and birth of my daughter.  I stayed on it for a little over 2 yrs. while I attended college and started my job 21 yrs. ago, where I am still at today.  So I can honestly agree, it is a great resource for those in need, as long as it is not taken advantage of.  I remember, I was sooo embarrased when I had to use my food stamps and I never told people I was on it, because I felt it degrading.  

On the flip side, I have distant cousins who lived on it for generation after generation with nothing wrong but laziness and to much partying.  There was nothing physically or mentally wrong, that they could not hold at least hold entry level positions.  Unfortunately, it becomes a viscious cycle.  However, that was ages ago and I haven't seen them in probably 20 yrs. so have no idea what they are doing now, since the laws were changed to only collect for 2 yrs. and all there kids are grown with some of there own.

So what you have all brought up is true.  I believe they should be tested (and unfortunely some fertalized as some continue to have more kids to collect more money).   However, LV has a good point too.  What happens to those who fall between the cracks because of the lack of money?   I also agree our government could be using alot of the money they send off to help other countries to help our own.  That is a sore spot for me.

I guess it's a catch 22.  If the government would supply the necessary money to start the program, then maybe in the long run, we would save money by helping those who need it and get them out of the system, but not on the street.  I believe it would be a good investment in the long run....

Great points all!
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