Lively Case Discussion #524 9/15 - 9/19/2006

[Shell]

I never pondered around the island, but I have pondered how long to launch a boat and go out say, 3-5 miles.

[Hotshot]

Before I go to bed, I will leave you guys with a thought.  You can't go around the Island.  The N/E side where you'll find the Natural Bridge, and such is too trecherous for boats like that.  That is why there has never been a real water search with boats out there.  Waves will knock you over.  I was going to snorkle there prior to going, LOLOL, not after you take a look at it, it can't be done.  OK, I start school tomorrow.  Good night to all.

[Lala'sMom]

Thanks for all the answers. I will ponder this further.

[Lala'sMom]

Okay, what happened to my avatar?  I didn't touch it, honestly.

[Lala'sMom]

Okay, what happened to my avatar?  I didn't touch it, honestly.

I think I need a vacation. Good Grief!  

[klaasend]

Okay, what happened to my avatar?  I didn't touch it, honestly.

I think I need a vacation. Good Grief!  

Actually, I couldn't see it for a minute either, so you aren't going nuts..ha ha  

[San]

What are the odds the thread will change by tomorrow night

[SunFreak2]

Do you all remember this?

On 7-15 the “National Enquirer” reported:

HOW NATALEE WAS KILLED

Dutch teenager Joran van der Sloot confessed to his father that he dumped Natalee Holloway's body in shark-infested waters after she accidentally hit her head and drowned in a drug-induced stupor on an Aruban beach.

This stunning new theory from inside the Police investigation of the missing teen emerged as her grief-stricken relatives came to terms with the fact that Natalee was not going to be found alive — or possibly not found at all — because the man-eating sharks may have left nothing behind.

"Her family has come to believe that she's not with us anymore. That's just realistic," said Natalee's step-uncle Steve Parten, a Florida minister.

Natalee, from Birmingham, Ala., was last seen around 1 am on May 30 leaving Carlos 'n Charlies, a local nightclub, with 17-year-old Joran and his buddies Satish Kalpoe, 18, and his brother Deepak, 21. It was the last night of Natalee's high school graduation trip with her classmates.

For the first time, Police are investigating information from several sources that a panic-stricken Joran confessed to his father Paulus that Natalee died accidentally and that he fed her body to the sharks.

Two of those sources are Jim Dooley, a South Carolina job recruiter for the health care industry, and his wife, Bella.

In an exclusive interview, the Dooleys said they contacted the F.B.I. after learning of Joran's confession to his dad during a shopping trip to a clothing store in Charlotte, N.C. The date was June 11; just a few days after Aruba Police had arrested Joran and the Kalpoe brothers as "persons of interest" in the case.

Dooley said the clerk at the clothing store told him that she and her husband are very good friends with Joran's dad, Paulus van der Sloot, and his wife, Anita. Her own son had attended school with Joran on the island and was a close pal.

The clerk told Dooley: "Joran told his father that he and Natalee had all been drinking and taking drugs at the nightclub. The father specifically mentioned they took Ecstasy. Joran told his father that when they left the club, they went to a beach on the island. Natalee was very ill and threw up several times.

"Then she fell and hit her head on something. Joran checked her and realized she was dead.
"Joran and others discussed an appropriate place to dump Natalee's body, a specific place where someone would disappear forever... a spot on the island where the waters are shark-infested."

Arubans know the shark-feeding spot very well and directed a National Enquirer reporter to its location on the rugged north coast of the island, where the ocean pounds the rocks and few people live.

The water there is deep and murky and sits beneath a high cliff, far away from the beautiful beaches and posh hotel casinos on the island's southern side.

A meatpacking plant once occupied the site. Workers there would discard meat cuttings into the ocean. The sharks would quickly gather and go into a feeding frenzy. To this day, dead animals are dumped into the waters at the shark site for the sake of tourism.

The clerk continued: "Paulus van der Sloot is very worried. This was an accidental death but his son is likely to end up going to jail because it looks like he was covering up a murder.

"But Paulus admitted telling his son that if a body wasn't found, there could be a chance he'd get out of jail."

According to another source close to the case, Robert Werner, headmaster of the International School of Aruba, where Joran attended classes, also said that Paulus van der Sloot admitted to him his son confessed that Natalee died accidentally in a fall on a beach.

The source revealed: "Paulus told the headmaster that Joran and Natalee had been taking drugs and decided to go for a swim. As they played in and around the water, Natalee fell, hit her head on a rock and drowned. In a drug and alcohol-induced panic, Joran felt he had no other choice but to dispose of Natalee's body in the sea."

Paulus van der Sloot was arrested himself on June 23; a week after the Dooleys reported their conversation with the clerk to the FBI. He was later released but he could be rearrested, said Aruban authorities. He did admit talking to his son about Natalee's disappearance, saying he advised him in general terms that without a body there may be no way to prove a crime was committed.

The Kalpoe brothers were also released. But they, too, could be rearrested, Aruban authorities said. At the time of going to press, Joran remained behind bars. His family maintains his innocence.

~~~~~~~

I know it's the NE, but I bet there is SOME truth in this story.

[San]

Do you all remember this?

On 7-15 the “National Enquirer” reported:

HOW NATALEE WAS KILLED

Dutch teenager Joran van der Sloot confessed to his father that he dumped Natalee Holloway's body in shark-infested waters after she accidentally hit her head and drowned in a drug-induced stupor on an Aruban beach.

I remember this story.  Notice Paulus is the one telling the story.

- Accidentally hit her head = Someone hit her with something.

- Drug-induced stuper = Caused by Joran putting drugs in her drink.

- Aruban beach = Someone home or Hotel room.

- JVDS confessed = Paulus made up the story.

- Drowned = Dumped in the ocean.

[klaasend]

What are the odds the thread will change by tomorrow night

   

That's OK, I can use a couple slow days..haha  

[SunFreak2]

Here's another blast from the past:  

On 6-22 FOX News

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: You know, we were so pleased that he was transported (to KIA) because we thought it would be a little more mild on him and he could rest a little more. At least, he has a bed now. And I could bring a cushion and clean sheets for him and some clothes because he couldn't shave during the last 10 days, hardly shower — he could shower, but also not enough water to brush his teeth, et cetera, et cetera. He couldn't — the only thing he could read was the Bible he got from a very nice Police guy. He got a Bible to read.
And he was telling me, Mommy, look at me, I'm reading the Bible. Did you ever think about that? And I think it's great. It's difficult to read. So yesterday, I thought at least, you know, he can have some books. He can write things because I think that's very important for a 17-year-old boy to write down certain experiences, just to read it over again later and see if it helps him to come through a difficult time. But he cannot have access to anything.

VAN SUSTEREN: Any drug use or alcohol use by him?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT:  A hundred percent no. No. He is, like, Mom, I would not smoke or I would not use drugs because I am a sporter. I want to make something out of my future. If there would have been anything of that, I would have noticed. I'm a teacher. I work with kids between 12 and 18 years, the last 25 years. So you're used to so many things, problems that appear with your students. You're so alert. And I think you're even more alert with your own children.

VAN SUSTEREN: Any trouble from him at all? I mean, have you ever any trouble with him?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: No. A little fight with a friend that got solved by talking to the parents.

VAN SUSTEREN: Never arrested?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: Never arrested, no. No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Girlfriends?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, of course. I mean, there were two girlfriends in his life that he had a longer relationship with. One was an American girl, who left, who was part of the school, and she just sent an e-mail totally upset because she finished the relationship and she thought that Joran was too sweet, she needed a stronger man. And another girl was an Aruban girl and — a very sweet girl, came here at home. And that ended about — it was a year ago, and he was really serious. He said, Well, Mom, you know, I'm going off-island to study, so I need to focus more. And there was no really strong relationship.

VAN SUSTEREN: So how does he find himself in this? I mean, if this is a successful 17-year-old, soon to go to college on academic scholarship, why does he find himself sitting over in the jail?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT:  I'm sorry! Something he told me last night, that he still didn't believe it was true. And he said, Mom, don't worry, because I was crying and he was really hugging me. He said, The truth will come forward, and I know that I didn't do anything to the girl. And the truth will come forward. And he was so strong. And I believe in him. I believe so in him. And he's just, like, Well, Mom, it's not so bad in here, but if I'm not here, and I'm thinking about you all the time and I'm praying and I'm meditating, because that's something that he went to yoga classes for a while. Of course, he was 16 then, so for him, it was, like, Why do I have to go to yoga? But he liked it. So that keeps him positive. And he is repeating over and over in those few minutes that I see him, It will all be over.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Notice how Anita's story doesn't jive with Paulus's & Joran's story about the 5/31 Bubali police interview.

Also, notice how childish Anita makes her son out to be, when he is a 6'5" tall almost 18 yo young man who is out picking up young women & raping them.  She makes a big deal out of him reading the Bible.  Maybe if as parents they had stressed reading the Bible more, he wouldn't have turned into a lying, raping, murdering teenage scumbag.

[msmarple]

Hi Monkeys - just a reminder to check the Murder & Crime thread - page 6 has a SUMMARY. If you think or hear of anything we've missed, post it ...

I like to think of that thread as a room full of monkeys eventually writing Hamlet - another tragedy, come to think of it.

And Klaas - thanks again for color coding it.

[SunFreak2]

Oooops, this is the interview she talks about that Monday & Tuesday.  She was supposed to be in the NL.

On 7-12 MSNBC

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT, MOTHER OF SUSPECT: Joran is a 17-year-old teenager. He is a fantastic tall guy. He's a sporter. He plays tennis on the island, soccer, volley ball, softball. He is a boy who will come out of his bed and give his mom a hug. And, hi mom. How are you? Have a nice day. He is a very warm young boy.

SCARBOROUGH: What has he told you about Natalee?

VAN DER SLOOT: He hasn't told me anything, because, on the Monday, he went to school, like any normal boy. And he wasn't aware of—he was totally surprised when the Police asked him to come to the—or picked him up for interrogation. He was totally surprised. He really thought that the girl would be safe in the hotel and there was no reason to talk about her at all.

[San]

Here's another blast from the past:  

On 6-22 FOX News

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: You know, we were so pleased that he was transported (to KIA) because we thought it would be a little more mild on him and he could rest a little more. At least, he has a bed now. And I could bring a cushion and clean sheets for him and some clothes because he couldn't shave during the last 10 days, hardly shower — he could shower, but also not enough water to brush his teeth, et cetera, et cetera. He couldn't — the only thing he could read was the Bible he got from a very nice Police guy. He got a Bible to read.
And he was telling me, Mommy, look at me, I'm reading the Bible. Did you ever think about that? And I think it's great. It's difficult to read. So yesterday, I thought at least, you know, he can have some books. He can write things because I think that's very important for a 17-year-old boy to write down certain experiences, just to read it over again later and see if it helps him to come through a difficult time. But he cannot have access to anything.

VAN SUSTEREN: Any drug use or alcohol use by him?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT:  A hundred percent no. No. He is, like, Mom, I would not smoke or I would not use drugs because I am a sporter. I want to make something out of my future. If there would have been anything of that, I would have noticed. I'm a teacher. I work with kids between 12 and 18 years, the last 25 years. So you're used to so many things, problems that appear with your students. You're so alert. And I think you're even more alert with your own children.

VAN SUSTEREN: Any trouble from him at all? I mean, have you ever any trouble with him?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: No. A little fight with a friend that got solved by talking to the parents.

VAN SUSTEREN: Never arrested?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: Never arrested, no. No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Girlfriends?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, of course. I mean, there were two girlfriends in his life that he had a longer relationship with. One was an American girl, who left, who was part of the school, and she just sent an e-mail totally upset because she finished the relationship and she thought that Joran was too sweet, she needed a stronger man. And another girl was an Aruban girl and — a very sweet girl, came here at home. And that ended about — it was a year ago, and he was really serious. He said, Well, Mom, you know, I'm going off-island to study, so I need to focus more. And there was no really strong relationship.

VAN SUSTEREN: So how does he find himself in this? I mean, if this is a successful 17-year-old, soon to go to college on academic scholarship, why does he find himself sitting over in the jail?

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT:  I'm sorry! Something he told me last night, that he still didn't believe it was true. And he said, Mom, don't worry, because I was crying and he was really hugging me. He said, The truth will come forward, and I know that I didn't do anything to the girl. And the truth will come forward. And he was so strong. And I believe in him. I believe so in him. And he's just, like, Well, Mom, it's not so bad in here, but if I'm not here, and I'm thinking about you all the time and I'm praying and I'm meditating, because that's something that he went to yoga classes for a while. Of course, he was 16 then, so for him, it was, like, Why do I have to go to yoga? But he liked it. So that keeps him positive. And he is repeating over and over in those few minutes that I see him, It will all be over.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Notice how Anita's story doesn't jive with Paulus's & Joran's story about the 5/31 Bubali police interview.

Also, notice how childish Anita makes her son out to be, when he is a 6'5" tall almost 18 yo young man who is out picking up young women & raping them. She makes a big deal out of him reading the Bible.  Maybe if as parents they had stressed reading the Bible more, he wouldn't have turned into a lying, raping, murdering teenage scumbag.

I don't know who lies better Joran or Anita.

"The truth will come forward" yeah just go home and as Paulus what he did that night mommy.

I agree SunFreak she is portraying him like he is a 12 year old.

[SunFreak2]

I don't know who lies better Joran or Anita.

"The truth will come forward" yeah just go home and as Paulus what he did that night mommy.

I agree SunFreak she is portraying him like he is a 12 year old.

The van der Sloot legacy:
If their lips are moving - they're lying.

[LilPuma]

Do you all remember this?

On 7-15 the “National Enquirer” reported:

HOW NATALEE WAS KILLED

Dutch teenager Joran van der Sloot confessed to his father that he dumped Natalee Holloway's body in shark-infested waters after she accidentally hit her head and drowned in a drug-induced stupor on an Aruban beach.

This stunning new theory from inside the Police investigation of the missing teen emerged as her grief-stricken relatives came to terms with the fact that Natalee was not going to be found alive — or possibly not found at all — because the man-eating sharks may have left nothing behind.

"Her family has come to believe that she's not with us anymore. That's just realistic," said Natalee's step-uncle Steve Parten, a Florida minister.

Natalee, from Birmingham, Ala., was last seen around 1 am on May 30 leaving Carlos 'n Charlies, a local nightclub, with 17-year-old Joran and his buddies Satish Kalpoe, 18, and his brother Deepak, 21. It was the last night of Natalee's high school graduation trip with her classmates.

For the first time, Police are investigating information from several sources that a panic-stricken Joran confessed to his father Paulus that Natalee died accidentally and that he fed her body to the sharks.
Meaning, Joran killed her and Papa Sloot helped dispose of the body.
Two of those sources are Jim Dooley, a South Carolina job recruiter for the health care industry, and his wife, Bella.

In an exclusive interview, the Dooleys said they contacted the F.B.I. after learning of Joran's confession to his dad during a shopping trip to a clothing store in Charlotte, N.C. The date was June 11; just a few days after Aruba Police had arrested Joran and the Kalpoe brothers as "persons of interest" in the case.

Dooley said the clerk at the clothing store told him that she and her husband are very good friends with Joran's dad, Paulus van der Sloot, and his wife, Anita. Her own son had attended school with Joran on the island and was a close pal.

The clerk told Dooley: "Joran told his father that he and Natalee had all been drinking and taking drugs at the nightclub. The father specifically mentioned they took Ecstasy. Meaning they drugged her drink. Joran told his father that when they left the club, they went to a beach on the island. Natalee was very ill and threw up several times.

"Then she fell and hit her head on something. Joran checked her and realized she was dead.
"Joran and others discussed an appropriate place to dump Natalee's body, a specific place where someone would disappear forever... a spot on the island where the waters are shark-infested."
So Joran hit her or otherwise killed her and her body is somewhere other than the shark infested waters.
Arubans know the shark-feeding spot very well and directed a National Enquirer reporter to its location on the rugged north coast of the island, where the ocean pounds the rocks and few people live.

The water there is deep and murky and sits beneath a high cliff, far away from the beautiful beaches and posh hotel casinos on the island's southern side.

A meatpacking plant once occupied the site. Workers there would discard meat cuttings into the ocean. The sharks would quickly gather and go into a feeding frenzy. To this day, dead animals are dumped into the waters at the shark site for the sake of tourism.

The clerk continued: "Paulus van der Sloot is very worried. This was an accidental death but his son is likely to end up going to jail because it looks like he was covering up a murder.
Meaning Paulus is covering up a murder because he's worried about Joran going to jail.
"But Paulus admitted telling his son that if a body wasn't found, there could be a chance he'd get out of jail." He did say it. No he didn't.  Did so.  Did not.  Did so. DID NOT.  

According to another source close to the case, Robert Werner, headmaster of the International School of Aruba, where Joran attended classes, also said that Paulus van der Sloot admitted to him his son confessed that Natalee died accidentally in a fall on a beach.

The source revealed: "Paulus told the headmaster that Joran and Natalee had been taking drugs and decided to go for a swim. As they played in and around the water, Natalee fell, hit her head on a rock and drowned. In a drug and alcohol-induced panic, Joran felt he had no other choice but to dispose of Natalee's body in the sea."

Paulus van der Sloot was arrested himself on June 23; a week after the Dooleys reported their conversation with the clerk to the FBI. He was later released but he could be rearrested, said Aruban authorities. He did admit talking to his son about Natalee's disappearance, saying he advised him in general terms that without a body there may be no way to prove a crime was committed.

The Kalpoe brothers were also released. But they, too, could be rearrested, Aruban authorities said. At the time of going to press, Joran remained behind bars. His family maintains his innocence.

~~~~~~~

I know it's the NE, but I bet there is SOME truth in this story.

Ha!  We're all learning to translate Dutch to English!  [/color]

[Lala'sMom]

Well, monksters, I am headed to bed. I still haven't seen CP405 on here.  I am getting worried again.  Hugs to Nemo, everyone tiptoe as not to wake him. Night all.

[San]

Well, monksters, I am headed to bed. I still haven't seen CP405 on here.  I am getting worried again.  Hugs to Nemo, everyone tiptoe as not to wake him. Night all.

Nite Lala's.  I saw CP405 signed on the other night.

[San]

Speaking of haven't seen did anyone hear from Sleuth?

[LilPuma]

Well, monksters, I am headed to bed. I still haven't seen CP405 on here.  I am getting worried again.  Hugs to Nemo, everyone tiptoe as not to wake him. Night all.

Nite Lala's.  I saw CP405 signed on the other night.

I can corroborate that sighting of CP405.  I saw her in the lounge a little over a week ago but I won't tell you what thread    I also saw her logged on in the last few days.